goldenster95 Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 This last line in an article in today's Post provides a germ of a hope that Vinny may have finally been put in place, at least for now. Said Vinny Cerrato, the Redskins' vice president of football operations, "Whatever the coach wants, that's what we'll go get." http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A4802-2004Jan9.html Let's also hope that the converse is true: whatever the coach doesn't want, that's what we'll not go get. This almost seems more important given Vinny's track record than what he said above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenster95 Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 This last line in an article in today's Post provides a germ of a hope that Vinny may have finally been put in place, at least for now. Said Vinny Cerrato, the Redskins' vice president of football operations, "Whatever the coach wants, that's what we'll go get." http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A4802-2004Jan9.html Let's also hope that the converse is true: whatever the coach doesn't want, that's what we'll not go get. This almost seems more important given Vinny's track record than what he said above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 This is no different at all from exactly what he did for Spurrier. Same exact job. Same exact authority. This is just how it ran under Spurrier. Spurrier said what he wanted and Vinny went out and got it along with Snyder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 This is no different at all from exactly what he did for Spurrier. Same exact job. Same exact authority. This is just how it ran under Spurrier. Spurrier said what he wanted and Vinny went out and got it along with Snyder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor The Invincible Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Agreed with Art. This is what Cerrato does. Whatever the coach wants, he goes and gets. He talks about it with the coach, and with Snyder, and what they recommend, he goes and gets. That's his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor The Invincible Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Agreed with Art. This is what Cerrato does. Whatever the coach wants, he goes and gets. He talks about it with the coach, and with Snyder, and what they recommend, he goes and gets. That's his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Vinny is not the Prince of Darkness. I think he's a better-than-average judge of talent, who's scored some major hits both high in the draft (LaVar, Samuels) and at the bottom (Cartwright). He executed a pin-point plan to get great offseason talent in the offseason, a plan devised to fill the needs identified by Spurrier. It's not his fault that Spurrier didn't prioritize the DL or that Daryl Gardener held out for $5 million a year. The biggest problem with Vinny, besides his spooky looks, is that he has a tendency to magnify Snyder's worst instincts -- or at least not check them sufficiently. And since Snyder has a tendency to undermine the coach, that can be a real problem. Also, it can be argued that Vinny did not sufficiently challenge Spurrier to shore up his staff (Helton?) -- in short, he deferred in some ways too much to the coach. A strong GM would have taken the rookie coach out back and explained how the NFL really works. With Gibbs, a lot of these deficiencies in Vinny are irrelevant. What we're left with is a very strong head of college and pro scouting who will respond to Gibbs's priorities. And that's a very good solution, because Gibbs isn't so hot as a college scout -- and he doesn't have the time to be one, anyway. Lest we forget, Gibbs traded two #1s to move up and take Desmond Howard -- and that was at the late peak of the first Gibbs era. There's no reason to think Gibbs has gotten better as a college scout since. My only concern about Vinny is that he seems exceptionally unhappy at the moment. So I'm unhappy with him for that. His influence may be reduced, but the team just jumped from being a laughingstock to the Next Big Thing in the NFL. If that doesn't make him happy, he doesn't have his head on straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Vinny is not the Prince of Darkness. I think he's a better-than-average judge of talent, who's scored some major hits both high in the draft (LaVar, Samuels) and at the bottom (Cartwright). He executed a pin-point plan to get great offseason talent in the offseason, a plan devised to fill the needs identified by Spurrier. It's not his fault that Spurrier didn't prioritize the DL or that Daryl Gardener held out for $5 million a year. The biggest problem with Vinny, besides his spooky looks, is that he has a tendency to magnify Snyder's worst instincts -- or at least not check them sufficiently. And since Snyder has a tendency to undermine the coach, that can be a real problem. Also, it can be argued that Vinny did not sufficiently challenge Spurrier to shore up his staff (Helton?) -- in short, he deferred in some ways too much to the coach. A strong GM would have taken the rookie coach out back and explained how the NFL really works. With Gibbs, a lot of these deficiencies in Vinny are irrelevant. What we're left with is a very strong head of college and pro scouting who will respond to Gibbs's priorities. And that's a very good solution, because Gibbs isn't so hot as a college scout -- and he doesn't have the time to be one, anyway. Lest we forget, Gibbs traded two #1s to move up and take Desmond Howard -- and that was at the late peak of the first Gibbs era. There's no reason to think Gibbs has gotten better as a college scout since. My only concern about Vinny is that he seems exceptionally unhappy at the moment. So I'm unhappy with him for that. His influence may be reduced, but the team just jumped from being a laughingstock to the Next Big Thing in the NFL. If that doesn't make him happy, he doesn't have his head on straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Why does Vinny seem exceptionally unhappy at the moment? He's said nothing but the most positive of statements. I saw him before the press conference glad handling people with the best of them. He seems to be perfectly content to me. His authority is the same as it was. His job hasn't changed at all. His influence is probably diminished some, but, he's already shown repeatedly that he can build influence back through solid work. As an example, he HAS to be more happy now than he did when he was brought back essentially UNDER Mendes. What did he do when that happened? Sulk and not work? Or work extra hard to gain the trust of the owner and more authority? I think Vinny will work VERY hard for a simple reason. He knows with Gibbs as the coach he has a chance to emerge from history as the next Beathard. If Gibbs succeeds, Vinny is a rising star in the league. If he doesn't, he'll never work another day in the league because HE'LL shoulder the blame for Gibbs failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Why does Vinny seem exceptionally unhappy at the moment? He's said nothing but the most positive of statements. I saw him before the press conference glad handling people with the best of them. He seems to be perfectly content to me. His authority is the same as it was. His job hasn't changed at all. His influence is probably diminished some, but, he's already shown repeatedly that he can build influence back through solid work. As an example, he HAS to be more happy now than he did when he was brought back essentially UNDER Mendes. What did he do when that happened? Sulk and not work? Or work extra hard to gain the trust of the owner and more authority? I think Vinny will work VERY hard for a simple reason. He knows with Gibbs as the coach he has a chance to emerge from history as the next Beathard. If Gibbs succeeds, Vinny is a rising star in the league. If he doesn't, he'll never work another day in the league because HE'LL shoulder the blame for Gibbs failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenster95 Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 Ah, good to know. So who takes the credit for drafting Ramsey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenster95 Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 Ah, good to know. So who takes the credit for drafting Ramsey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Originally posted by goldenster95 Ah, good to know. So who takes the credit for drafting Ramsey? Supposedly that was a Cerrato/Snyder pick, with Spurrier saying, "Sure, whatever, dudes" -- still planning to ride Wuerffel to glory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Originally posted by goldenster95 Ah, good to know. So who takes the credit for drafting Ramsey? Supposedly that was a Cerrato/Snyder pick, with Spurrier saying, "Sure, whatever, dudes" -- still planning to ride Wuerffel to glory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor The Invincible Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 It sure had nothing to do with Spurrier. I remember the post draft interview of Spurrier, and he didn't really know anything about Ramsey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor The Invincible Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 It sure had nothing to do with Spurrier. I remember the post draft interview of Spurrier, and he didn't really know anything about Ramsey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romberjo Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 In an interview a couple of years ago, Ron Nay (one of our top scouts at the time) said that we traded down hoping/intending to take Kendall Simmons, not Ramsey (which I sense was a Cerrato/Snyder backup pick they were happy enough to make). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romberjo Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 In an interview a couple of years ago, Ron Nay (one of our top scouts at the time) said that we traded down hoping/intending to take Kendall Simmons, not Ramsey (which I sense was a Cerrato/Snyder backup pick they were happy enough to make). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Originally posted by Romberjo In an interview a couple of years ago, Ron Nay (one of our top scouts at the time) said that we traded down hoping/intending to take Kendall Simmons, not Ramsey (which I sense was a Cerrato/Snyder backup pick they were happy enough to make). Maybe Simmons was Nay's choice. Who knows -- we weren't in the room. There was a story planted in the media about Snyder trading down, hoping to get Ramsey and hoping he wouldn't fall off the board before we picked him. It was an "in the war room" perspective, showing the tension as they waited to pick. Now, the Snyder Redskins have certainly planted false or misleading stories in the past. They just did so recently, I think, with the patently misleading chronology of the Gibbs hiring, published recently in the Post and based on unnamed inside sources (clearly including Snyder). But the emotional reactions of Snyder and Spurrier at the time of the draft made it clear that Snyder was thrilled with Ramsey and Spurrier looked out of the loop. Maybe Spurrier was told during the first round that we were trading down for Simmons (a guard). That would be the first time Snyder cold-clocked the Ol' Ball Coach with a sucker punch . . . :laugh: Pick your history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Originally posted by Romberjo In an interview a couple of years ago, Ron Nay (one of our top scouts at the time) said that we traded down hoping/intending to take Kendall Simmons, not Ramsey (which I sense was a Cerrato/Snyder backup pick they were happy enough to make). Maybe Simmons was Nay's choice. Who knows -- we weren't in the room. There was a story planted in the media about Snyder trading down, hoping to get Ramsey and hoping he wouldn't fall off the board before we picked him. It was an "in the war room" perspective, showing the tension as they waited to pick. Now, the Snyder Redskins have certainly planted false or misleading stories in the past. They just did so recently, I think, with the patently misleading chronology of the Gibbs hiring, published recently in the Post and based on unnamed inside sources (clearly including Snyder). But the emotional reactions of Snyder and Spurrier at the time of the draft made it clear that Snyder was thrilled with Ramsey and Spurrier looked out of the loop. Maybe Spurrier was told during the first round that we were trading down for Simmons (a guard). That would be the first time Snyder cold-clocked the Ol' Ball Coach with a sucker punch . . . :laugh: Pick your history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DraftNik Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Considering that Snyder has been in charge of the cap work for a year, do you think he's learned everything he needed to from Mendes before he was ousted? Based on the fact that last year's overhaul was so expensive (yet very well-executed, having passed the one-season test IMO), yet everything points to major spending again this offseason, it seems like Snyder has quickly become just as cap-crafty as the best of them. Seems to me like this is one area where Snyder's really helped, with his business savvy enabling him to master the cap. I guess we can't be sure how well it's going until the cap explodes or doesn't in the next couple years. Are there any other owners in the league who are their teams' primary contract negotiator like Snyder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DraftNik Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Considering that Snyder has been in charge of the cap work for a year, do you think he's learned everything he needed to from Mendes before he was ousted? Based on the fact that last year's overhaul was so expensive (yet very well-executed, having passed the one-season test IMO), yet everything points to major spending again this offseason, it seems like Snyder has quickly become just as cap-crafty as the best of them. Seems to me like this is one area where Snyder's really helped, with his business savvy enabling him to master the cap. I guess we can't be sure how well it's going until the cap explodes or doesn't in the next couple years. Are there any other owners in the league who are their teams' primary contract negotiator like Snyder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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