Jds0912

15 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

 

Just about everything in that last post of yours is demonstrably what I labeled it in my edit.

 

I'm gonna point this out one last time. You're such a fan of this team you didn't join the site until heinie was starting after years of his being a barely used backup on several other teams. You listed then you've been a fan of this team ONLY since that year and you listed your favorite player as th.

 

Now since I first pointed this out you've EDITED your user page to claim you were a fan since 97 and your fave player is suddenly Kirk cousins 

 

So you are not just a fanboy, you're a proven disingenuous lying numbnuts and essentially a form of troll. You may be banned at any time for all that and how stupid of you  thinking you could pass this kind of dumbass bull**** off.

That’s not at all true. When I created my account I said I’ve been a fan since 1997 and Kirk was my favorite player, which is the truth. I’ve followed this website for years but only read posts. Now you’re lying by saying that I listed TH as my favorite player. You suspended me for doing things that many others do, including you. Since my suspension lifted I’ve been respectful and just talking Washington football. I fully expect to be banned by you and it’s totally unfair. I’ve done nothing wrong. 

1 minute ago, mistertim said:

 

Defenses absolutely did seem to figure him out. They started crowding the box, sending extra guys to pressure, sitting on the short passes, and basically daring Heinicke to try and beat them with his arm. Which he can't. I think defenses now will apply the same strategy, though this year it will be even easier since our OL is horrible so they may not even need to send extra guys, which means they can also completely lock down the short and intermediate throws if they have decent LBs and DBs.

From what I saw, yes they were crowding the box and making th beat them through the air. To me it looked like our receivers couldn’t get open against man coverage bc they just weren’t very good. If we had a healthy Samuel, Thomas, Mckissick, and Dotson last year I don’t think defenses play us that way. The same thing is happening to Rodgers this year with no Devonte Adams. Time will tell though. If I’m wrong then I’ll say I’m wrong. 

17 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

 

Despite your recent attempts to equivocate on your formerly lofty impressions of th, you are the definition of a fanboy. Your user page demonstrated that from the get go and that's not against any rule here nor does it preclude you from being able to make solid points on football when your boy is not a central feature.

 

But I prefer you not to quote me and use my post as a vehicle for you to make a vapid fanboy reply, no matter how you try to "soften" it.🙂

I’m not “softening” anything. I’ve been very consistent in my opinion from get go, which is we shouldn’t have traded for Wentz and th is a better qb who we could’ve went with this year while continuing to build the roster. Then we could’ve made a splash for our franchise qb next year. Idk how anyone can say in hindsight that we were still better off trading for Wentz than just sticking with th this year. The normal response is “well we couldn’t go into this season  with th, we had to try something. It was the right move at the time.” Clearly it wasn’t the right move  at any time. If I were a th fanboy I’d be saying he’s our franchise qb and we’re gonna win the super bowl if we continue building around him. 

6 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

TH also played some god awful football once teams figured him out. We had a pretty good OL last season, and we have a horrible one this season, so that's going to be a huge step backwards.

 

It wasn't his rookie year. We need to stop that stuff.

 

Jimmy G (even though I think he's utterly mediocre) is a much better QB than Heinicke.

 

Heinicke is who he is. Below average starter with a weak arm, some good scrambling ability (which he didn't use much last season) and some familiarity with the system. The idea that he's suddenly going "blossom" or something is silly.

I guess the biggest argument I have is that I disagree that defenses figured him out. I believe it’s because he didn’t have key weapons during that stretch. He has better weapons this year than last year. 
 

I would say Jimmy G is a slightly better qb than th but not much. Both are average and better than Wentz. 
 

I don’t think he’s going to “blossom” as much as I believe he’s in a better situation this year than last. He’s probably hit his peak but that can be good enough to have a successful season if he has good players around him, which I believe he does. 

5 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

They always hedge the bold proclamations with “I know he’s not a franchise QB, but…” and then go on to explain his play in ways that make him sound like he could be a franchise QB.  

I explain his play as average. I consider Wentz below average. That’s why I think our offense will be better with th. I’m not promoting th as a franchise qb, I just think Wentz is that bad. 

6 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

 

Gotta love your optimism.  LOL

I’m just going off what I saw last year. He played some solid football when he had a semi healthy skill player group and we won some games. It was also pretty much his rookie year. So if you add a year of experience+ better weapons+ an easier schedule then I think it equals better results. The 49ers went to the super bowl with Jimmy G, who I consider an average qb. I’m not saying we’re gonna have those results but yeah I could see our offense improve a lot and be in playoff contention in December with th or Howell if we stay somewhat healthy. 

2 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

This is what it's like to be a true bottom feeder of a team and as a fanbase: that people create reasons to look forward to watching th under center. It should make you want to cry, instead. 😓

 

That is not to ignore how the wentz gamble has gone so far, or how Howell might develop.

 

The team is going nowhere meaningful with even a repeat of last seasons heinie performance, the "upsides" of which I don't think is likely to repeat at all.  

 

Worse, IF "fortunate" under th and/or a returning, healed wentz, it all may lead us to another year of just enough wins to cost a higher drafting position.

 

I don't hate th, but I do weary of people who can actually be fans of players who neither have sufficient playing ability or "personality" to merit the level of (I'll be kind here) "enthused support" th gets from a handful here.

 

I think even the oft posted attraction to his persona is born of very questionable, and even fantasy, reactions more made up than being a solid take on his actual personality.

 

Signed, the Grinch.🙂

 

 

 

 

 

 

I’m very confident in Terry, Samuel, and Dotson. I think an offense can succeed with an average qb when you have weapons like that. Th is just average. Howell is probably average right now but could become a franchise qb, who knows. Both are better qbs than Wentz at this point in his career. 

8 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

I have a feeling Samuel is going to feast with Taylor. Whats the deal with our TD machine Dotson. I remember his very first target - Carson sailed it way over his year. Maybe he can thrive on a wet noodle arm since he seems to adjust to the underthrown ball well.  I think. I do think DBs in tight coverage are so ripe for PI's on underthrown balls but will Turner shelf all the deep calls because he cant throw that far?

They’ll all feast with th. And if he gets hurt they’ll feast with Howell. We’re in a good situation right now. 

9 minutes ago, redskinss said:

Oh I could definitely see it happening, it happens frequently and I'm in no way immune to it.

If, and that's a big if, we win this week there is absolutely no doubt people will be talking about the possibility of a turnaround.

It's too early for the normal crazy playoff math but there will definitely be people with hope.

The truth is, the eagles are off and the giants and cowboys are facing the lions and Jaguars so the likely combined record of our division foes is going to be 17 and 3.

Even if we turn a corner and start playing good football (which I don't see happening) that hill is way too steep to climb.

 

It definitely doesn’t look good right now. The Eagles and Cowboys are locks to make the playoffs imo. I’m not sold on the Giants though. If we were to miraculously be in the playoff hunt later this season I could see the Giants being a team we could beat out for a wild card spot. My optimistic view is that TH leads us to the playoffs, th looks bad and Howell comes in and shows he’s franchise qb material, or Howell also looks like trash and we end up with a top 5 pick and get our franchise qb. We can’t lose in my mind 😂. So yeah, we win this week 27-23. 

5 minutes ago, redskinss said:

This year is unlike any other we've faced in a long time.

No winning the division at 7 and 9 and hosting a playoff game.

This division is looking like the best in football now and it's gonna take a massive turnaround to change the fortune of this team, not just a 4 game win streak to slip in around .500

 

Even at 3 and 4 I will have no illusions of playoff grandeur.

 

 

 

If we win this game I can see people saying “okay, if we win next week we’re back to .500 and it’s a new season.” Fans will get excited with a 3 game win streak. 4-4 with an offense that actually looks good is best case scenario obviously. We could also get stomped the next two games and then play Howell the rest of the season. I’m fine with that scenario too. 

38 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

I am willing to give Heinicke a shot, as a fan, who just wants to see this team win, I just don't see that it is likely we are going to be getting the rose-colored glasses version of Heinicke we got for about 7-8 games before the league figured out how to scheme against what he does well.  I don't see how all that goes away, but I hope I am wrong. 

Two of those games in that final stretch were against Dallas, who had an insane pass rush and Trevon Diggs covering Terry. His other options got locked down as well bc they just weren’t very good. Not many qb’s can do anything with that. Dallas won’t be able to do that against us this year IF we are healthy. They don’t have players good enough to man up on Samuel, Dotson, Thomas, and Mckissick all game long. I would be begging for teams to play man coverage against us like they did last year. 

Commies win 27-23. Everyone starts talking playoffs. 

Scot Turner is not a good OC but I think he’s better than he seems right now. Wentz has hurt the whole team. He makes everyone else looks worse. With a different qb playing everyone will think he finally figured out how to call plays this season but in reality it’ll be because Wentz is on the sideline. 

We’re gonna get to 7+ wins with th and/or howell. The tank for a top 5 pick idea ended when Wentz got hurt. 

8 minutes ago, CommanderCarson said:

Who the hell is the hive? I don’t see hardly any posts in here proclaiming Heineke to be some god send. It’s like a group arguing against themselves it’s so friggin confusing to me!

 

@zCommander is the one poster I can think of that legitimately thought Heineke and the resources would have been a good strategy. And he honestly doesn’t look all that wrong in hindsight…

 

You don’t score 10 point in the first half in 5 straight contests if you are a good QB. You just dont. How does Heineke do worse than that? It’s almost statistically impossible. 

I was also saying we’d be better off going with TH + rookie this year instead of getting Wentz or someone like him. I stand by that. Doesn’t mean we think he’s our franchise qb though. 

1 minute ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

They’ve been jamming guys at the LOS and stacking the box against Wentz and it’s worked  - why would they stop doing that now for a guy who poses zero threat to hit the deep ball, or even intermediate routes near the sidelines?

 

This is why I’ve never bought into the idea of adding weapons for TH, it’s just a waste of resources.

 

The way you tell it, we should expect immediate and dramatic improvement when Heineke starts on Sunday.

I’m not saying teams haven’t been doing that to Wentz also but it’s not like an every down thing like it was in that final stretch last year with TH. From what I saw, Taylor was having a decent season until Thomas and Mckissick got hurt. Those two guys were mismatches against man coverage, which forced defenses to mix it up and play a little more zone. Once they went down defenses knew they could play man across the field and nothing could be done about it. I love Terry but he’s not even that great at beating man coverage. It’s showed at times this year that our receivers can beat man coverage. Carson’s made some great throws, but TH could make those throws too. Carson just doesn’t read the defense as quick as th and he’s more inaccurate. Yes I do believe it will be a huge difference with Taylor in there. I think it could possibly be an even bigger difference with Howell. 

11 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I’d have to go back and look at those games to determine that.  My guess is the unknown factor played a role and teams weren’t loading up the box like they did late in the season.  As the season went on, particularly after the first Dallas game, every teams defensive game plan was to bring the entire defense closer to the LOS, jam the receivers after the snap and attack.  It worked like a charm and Heineke/Turner had no answers.  I’m not sure if you recall but Heine was gushing on and on about the Cowboys defense like they were the 85 Bears, but all they really did is what I described above.  
 

I have zero confidence that Turner can draw anything up to counter that.

It worked like a charm bc we had no talent at wr, that has nothing to do with qb. If you’re playing a team who’s receivers can’t beat press coverage and man coverage then the obvious gameplan is to stack the box with 8 players and not have to worry about getting beat through the air. I wouldn’t personally stack the box if I have to account for Terry, Samuel, and Dotson. You’re asking to get beat off the los. And you don’t have to be able to throw the ball 65+ yards to complete “deep” passes. I don’t buy the theory that teams figured him out by stacking the box. They just figured out that we had terrible receivers. 

8 minutes ago, mistertim said:

The Heinicke Hive's revisionist history is friggin' weird. Talking about him like he's prime Russell Wilson or something.

 

Heinicke didn't scramble much last season...to the point where the coaches were literally calling him out publicly on it. He was completely swarmed in the latter part of the season when defenses figured him out and knew they could stack the box and bring pressure without having to worry about him making them pay for it with his arm.

 

And that was with a pretty decent OL.

 

With this OL I think a more apropos gif is

 

I just don’t see defenses putting 8 guys in the box consistently against TH with Terry, Samuel, and Dotson out wide. It’s easy to do that and play man coverage when the #2 receiving threat is Cam Sims. I doubt it’ll play out like that this year unless we have injuries. 

2 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I feel like the “let Heini play” until there’s 4 or 5 games left crew are going to change their tune after a game or two.  It’s easy to want a switch when the offense has been as abysmal as it’s been.  But per usual, we always find out it could be worse.

If he loses 2 in a row and doesn’t look significantly better than Wentz then put Howell in. He might win two in a row and get us into playoff contention. 

Howell or TH, it doesn’t matter. Our team is going to look so much better with Wentz not under center. Howell looked incredible in preseason and I believe TH will be better with a whole year of experience and better weapons. I would give TH 4 games to get us back to .500. If he fails then give Howell the rest of the season. I just have a feeling the team and coaching staff aren’t as bad as they look right now. This is the most excited I’ve felt all season. 

19 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Thanks for speaking out.....the Wentz supporters would rather go down being wrong than admit that the TH folks may have been right. All we are saying is that TH isn't bad and that we can win with him....he's not a franchise QB but he'll win you games. Wentz is flat out brutal....intangibles matter with QB's and TH has the edge over CW there. I think Howell may too. Wentz is done in the NFL....Ron better see that real soon, the experiment is over. 

 

Exactly. None of us are saying th is a franchise qb but it’s becoming very clear that his skill and low salary would’ve been better than Wentz and his 28 mil salary. These guys are actually very much Dan like. They belittle those who give good analysis while promoting others who give bad analysis and feed their ego. The man they loath is the same man they strive to be. It’s very confusing. 

1 hour ago, zCommander said:

 

You have your way of seeing things and I have mine. To you it might be over the top but to me it seemed a realistic view on how I see things. Are we going to agree on that. Probably not. I never said I liked Wentz. I said I was on the fence and would wait and see how that fairs out for us. I was not big on Wentz like some of you guys were - strong arm and all. If that doesn't translate to wins then it is useless. Not having an effect OL is also useless. You can call me out as much as you like I have no problem with that. Trust me it won't hurt my feelings...lol

 

I joined this board to learn more about football as I used to watch football games for entertainment and would have the TV on all day - which I still do - 1pm to 11:30 pm. Who does that? Me. I like watching football. It is my day off and I want to watch me some football no matter who is playing. This is how I also learn about other teams and how their QBs/team is playing. I didn't become a Redskins fan until 24 years ago when my son was born. I knew I had to pick a team to take my son to a game when he is old enough to understand. He probably hates me for making him a Redskins fan though...lol

 

Please don't blow the 12-14 out of proportions since you don't actually remember why I said that. My reasoning was based on how many games we won last year and how many games we should win this year. Maybe 12-14 maybe being too optimistic or as some have pointed out not realistic. To me it was a fair amount of wins. But please don't burn a guy for being too optimistic or having a different view and instead calling him stupid instead.

 

You don't need to read between the lines. Just ask me "hey z, what the hell do you even mean? Are you on drugs or something." But you don't need to belittle me though to do so. 

 

I don't get pissed off that easily but do reserve the right to fight for my stance though....lol

 

The only agenda I have is for this team to have a ****ing wining season while I am still alive! I will be 52 this year. 

 

I have been pretty honest about my opinions. Maybe not popular for some but I am not going sit there and just pretend everything is rosy. Okay I lie. I do pretend we are going to win every week in the insomniac thread. I know sometimes it is false hope. In life you have to have some hope and smile so you don't go over the edge over a football team. Life is too short to for that. 

 

I don't mind you guys beating me up for my stance or my way of thinking as long as we don't all go overboard. I don't mind the healthy bickering back and forth. I would appreciate the common courtesy for allowing me to do the same to you as well. Beating you up that is. 

 

What I don't like is when people start calling you an idiot because they feel they know more about football than you and has to put you down for it. You really don't know how much the other person knows. Everyone has strengths and weakness. I will clear up what mine are: I don't get too deep into the x's and the o's. I have learned a lot though ever since joining ES. Since ES had some super smart people that the other boards were lacking. I don't watch college football. Busy on Saturdays. I do read up on draft prospect and will watch some highlights if I have the time. Just like in the IT world you have to stay up with current tech/events so you don't fall too far behind. 

 

If there is anything else you would like to know about me please don't hesitate to ask.

 

Dude you don’t have to explain yourself to any of these clueless f**** lol. You along with several of us were right by saying we should’ve stuck with TH this year and built the rest of the roster. It’s obvious. They’re so caught up in group think that they cant/refuse to admit they were wrong, then they try to belittle others who disagree with their cult. You were right and they were wrong. The end. 

9 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said:

 Where else could we have gone for a Qb ? I don't think they really could have run it back with Henike? I guess we could have taken Pickett? I get the impression they did not like him.

 

I still think this was the best move at the time to make?

Rolling with TH and drafting Pickett would’ve been the right move. I was screaming at the tv when we passed on him twice. I didn’t see Trubisky, Mariota, Wentz, or whoever as a clear upgrade when you weigh skill vs salary. I think Pickett will be a top 10 qb in this league for years to come but if not then we could’ve moved on quickly since rookie contracts aren’t that expensive. Plus we could’ve kept some players we had to let go bc of Wentz. 

If Ron and our FO believes TH isn’t capable of being a bridge qb then he’s probably capable of being a bridge qb. We can watch Wentz play like crap for another several weeks and get benched or we could just bench him now and get it over with. TH and Howell will give us better qb play. 

3 hours ago, Thinking Skins said:

QBs struggle their first years and first games in new systems. It's not unheard of. Heck, it happened to Wentz last year. I'm nowhere near a bail on him. TH struggled last year, especially after teams figured him out. I'm optimistic about tomorrow but even if we look bad, I know it's not the end of the season because Ron has showed us his hand and he has teams that play well late. So I expect a run late as our chemistry gets back on track and injuries settle and young players start looking good. 

TH struggled when his best receiving options (other than Terry) were Cam Sims and John Bates. I’d like to see what he would do with Samuel and Dotson. Not saying he’s our future but he’s a better option than Wentz right now.