Koala

The U.N. was heavily influenced by Europe and America.  Not the Arabs, who as you pointed out, voted against the partitition.  So Europeans, through the U.N, and over Arab objections, voted to partition the land.  The partition itself was mostly due to a double game the Brits had been playing, promising both sides less than they could deliver.  They eventually pleaded innocent and threw the mess into the U.Ns lap. 

Much of this support from Europe was due to sympathy for Jews post 911, not because of any recognition of some sort of historical claim to Palestine or Israel or whatever you wanna call it.  They also calculated that, 20 years post fall of the Ottomans, the Arabs were too weal and divided to really do anything but object vociferously.  Arabia and its oil had already been secured, and it was established the Saudis could care less about Palestine.  That left Egypt and Syria.

Yes Immigrstion existed well before 1940s, but Zionism didnt really take hold and become a popular alternative until the rise of Nazism.  

Its important to note that Zionism was the brainchild of European Jews.  Sephardic or Arab Jews never really supported the creation the state of Israel, and to this day those divisions are noticeable in Israeli society and politics.

So, please continue your Orwellian revisions of history...

And to TWA, what on earth does that have to do with anything?  The Arab states were non-players in WWIi, they were inconsequential and remain so since the decline of the Ottomans.  Their role in WW2 and the holocaust is minimal, and it is laughable to try to compare their involvement to European involvement.

Seriously, you aint pinning the Holocaust on muslims or arabs.  People aint that dumb....yet...

On 3/14/2019 at 4:24 PM, Kurd Cudins said:

It was given to the Jewish people by diplomatic order as reparations for the atrocities committed during WW2, but that's not in any way related to my previous comment. The point is the Arabs didn't use diplomacy, they used violence.

Europeans gave away Arab land as reparations for crimes Europeans committed...How was ever gonna work, except by violent subjugation and oppression ofat  Arabs?  

And, if you think that Israel was founded on a basis of peace, and respect of international law...then I dont even know where to begin with you...

On 3/16/2019 at 2:01 AM, visionary said:

 

8 years, huh?  That sounds nice Ms. Omar, but how do you plan to do that, exactly?  Who do we support?  How do we support them?  I love Ms. Omar, in fact I have a crazy crush on her, but if she's on the foreign relations committee, she has a responsibility to tackle the insanely complex Syria problem more seriously than to suggest we be cheerleaders for a dead revolution.

6 minutes ago, twa said:

The FBI has been infiltrating and monitoring white supremacists here for ages.

 

 

Good.  But not enough.  We're gonna need to shutdown all immigration from New Zealand, Australia, Sweden, Norway, the U.K, Germany, and Switzerland.  Just temporarily for like 90 days or something, until we figure out whats going on or I start to feel safe again.  Thats just smart policy.  

42 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Only reason I agree with this is because of the refusal to classify white nationalist inspired mass shootings as terrorism.  A system better designed for finding red flags will help with this, regardless of how people want to classify it.

It doesnt fit it with the agenda behind classifying terrorists.  The agenda there is to vilify and de-humanize a particular group of people (usually for political gain or justification of oppression and violence), there is no overwhelming political appetite to demonize and vilify the white right.  Mollify, maybe, but not vilify.

I, for one, think the time is due to begin approaching white supremacists and the alternative right, the same we approached jihadists and radical islamists.  I want all their organizations infiltrated, I want all their finances frozen on freeze-first-ask-questions-later basis, I want people who publicly support them arrested for incitement of violence (not called "fine people").  I want the FBI questioning every known white supremacist, and questioning anybody who has any interactions with white supremacists.  I want them searched thoroughly at airports, I want a special agent assigned to every one of them that attempts to buy a weapon, and I want to see more of the billions of dollars spent on Homeland Security shifted away from the largely non-existent threat of Islamic terrorism and shifted towards the growing threat of supremacist terrorism. 

And I want this to continue until the day the FBI comes out and says that the alt-right has been extremely cooperative with law enforcement, and deserves the majority of the credit for dealing with the threat within themselves, by turning over suspected radicals to authorities while making large strides to renounce violence and violent ideology.   You know, the way the FBI says the Muslim community has since 911  

39 minutes ago, Simmsy said:

I've found one where a guy killed a mass shooter after he killed everyone and was trying to escape. He didn't save anyone. I find it funny that you would rather take the chance of a good Samaritan with a gun than actually pass some legislation to keep these highly powerful guns out of the hands of whackjob terrorists.

I remember one when a black security officer stopped a mass-shooter to be after he had killed only a couple people.  Only to be almost immediately killed by police officers, who incorrectly assumed he was the bad guy...So definitely that nice guy with a gun narrative doesnt work for black people.   

2 hours ago, tshile said:

 

I've just given up. I cannot find a good-faith actor in the situation...

It feels like a situation where there's no adults in the room, and in those situations I usually just walk away. 

Ok fine fair enough.  So why dont we suggest that the US govt do the same and stop all aid to both sides? Walk away with fistfuls of much needed American taxpayer money, and tell them either make nice or make do.  Seems like a reasonable suggestion.  So why is it impossible to sell to our government?

On 3/12/2019 at 1:02 PM, grego said:

ok, i'll try this- @skinsgoldpants posted that he was not happy with Netanyahu, while saying how tough it is for Israel, being surrounded by countries that wish for your destruction (I agree with those points). you mentioned that "Palestinians are painted as a dangerous, anti semitic monolith". between those two posts, it brought to mind the charter of hamas, the elected governing party of the Palestinian people, where, up until almost two years ago, it called for the destruction of Israel. 

so, in my quest to determine who's the baddie, I am faced with your statement that calls for people to not be thought of as a monolith (one I endorse wholeheartedly), while weighing the reality of what Israel has been facing in hamas. 

Ok Hamas called for the destruction of Israel.  Oooh scary.  In reality what Israel has faced in Hamas is a group who is more interested in gaining control of Palestinian territory than regaining long lost territory.

Meanwhile Israel, having already destroyed much of historic Palestine, is busy eating up what little remains while convincing the world that, in fact, Palestine never existed at all.   

And about your "quest to determine who's the baddie", can I suggest that you try to evolve your worldview?  Instead of seeing good guys and bad guys, why dont you try just seeing people, and then look for justice and injustice?  

I just wanted to add:  **** spiders.  By far the creepiest things ever  created.  I dont blame those people who burned down their hourse trying to kill a spider.  Have you ever noticed bug spray doesnt do anything to spiders but make them angry?  I discovered this after empyting about two cans of bug spray one time, my eyes are foaming, Im drooling and feeling weezy, slurring my words, and Im all like "**** it Illll geeet a thiriird caaan, one oof ussss gooot to gooooo got to gooo." - but the spider is perfecly fine, like "Bring it biotch, bug spray is just a refreshing spritzer for me."

Have you ever noticed that every time you see a spider in your house, it looks its been there...watching you....for a while?

Spiders are the serial killers of the insect world?  What other creature, besides the Iceman and maybe Hannibal Lecter, store their victims bodies for months at a time????

I dont trust anything that has more foresight and planning skills than I do.  Like Im lucky if I manage to remember to take the meat out of the freezing in the morning to defrost it for dinner.  If I ever managed to be able to excrete silk out of my ass, I miiiight be smart enough to roll into a ball and try to sell it.    But weave a complex web in order to catch food for the winter?   Nope, nope, that would never occur to me -- thats some higher level **** right there.

On 1/2/2019 at 10:57 AM, mcsluggo said:

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-46735263

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

in related news... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

LMAO. reminds me of the greatest ever cold open in Malcolm in the Middle...I died at "Take the keys and go, just go"

7 hours ago, mistertim said:

It seems like they're almost trying to out-do Trump in the "absolutely ludicrous explanations that make no sense but people want us to believe" category of a TV game show. "Died in a fistfight"? Seriously?

Oh this one wins the cake, for all time b.s. stories. This even beats the," I tripped and landed in her ****" defense that one Saudi millionaire used to get off of rape charges in the U.K.  

The main reason it's so unbelievable, is that I've seen Saudis fight (lived there for 10 years).  They take off their flipflops and use them to attempt to slap each other down...They dont even know how to make a fist....

You dont have to believe that all 32 NFL owners get together and plot out the results of every game to believe that games can be fixed or influenced.  For the NFL, I think it would be stupid from a business-wise perspective to fix games.  For example, for a league with revenue sharing, what exactly is in it for the NFL to keep the Redskins down? The Redskins mediocrity is eating away at what used to be one of the NFL's larger and most affluent fanbases, but now they cant even sell out home games. 

I DO think that fixing of games can occur involving individual referees or players.  The more gambling/betting that surrounds the sport, the more likely it is that some referee is on the take.  And with the NFL's thinly disguised draft champions b.s., I think they are inviting more betting and gambling, which will inevitably result in cheating and fixing.

To me there is are some possible solutions to minimize the affect cheating referees might have:.  More transparency in the performance review of referees, with more immediate disciplinary actions for blown calls.  Also, the two worst calls to me that affect too many games are holding and PI.  I think PI should be review-able or challengable, with a dedicated guy in the booth that automatically reviews any PI Call.  I also think that they should hire an extra referee, and require that two referees call holding in order for a holding call to stand, in order to ensure that only the most egregious holding calls are made.       

On 9/14/2018 at 2:58 PM, TheGreatBuzz said:

 

How was that stupid?  I refuse to believe that the majority of a group of people are bad based on the highlighted actions of a few.  The same logic used to paint all police with this broad brush is also who idiot trumpers believe all immigrants are bad because a few committed crimes. 

 

Why do I get the feeling your answer would change if i were to ask you about salafist or conservative muslims?

1 hour ago, visionary said:

 

Yes.  Next question.

5 hours ago, PleaseBlitz said:

Wow, i figured they locked him up, but murdered him?  How sure are we that Turkey is right?

Almost 100%.  Cctv shows him walking in, but never walks.out.  It also shows a 15 man team of Saudis who had just arrived from Riyadh enter the consulate, and then leave carrying 15 bags, and immediately flee the country.  MBS then announces that the Turks are free to search the embassy cuz the guy is not there. 

Guven the fundamental laws of physics, which the Saudis apparently are unaware of, its impossible he just walked into the embassy and disappeared into thin air.

This assasination was done in the most Saudi possible way -- the idiots forgot that you need a coverup, no matter how unbelievable it is, you still need a story where your explanation as the what happened isnt, "Magic."

1 hour ago, visionary said:

NSFW

lool.

Well heres CNBC.replay of the committee hearing.  Im not sure why the link says its an SNL skit...

2 hours ago, DogofWar1 said:

Man, I wish Obama had limited the FBI's investigation into Hillary to a week and no questions on emails the same way Trump is limiting this investigation to a week and no questions about youthful alcohol.

 

I bet Obama is just kicking himself over that.

I cant get over how ridiculously weak the Democrats are.  I cant believe they as re gonna just let this sham one week investigation. 

They need.to raise hell about this.  Squeeze the FBI politically, say this kinda thing bring into question serious reservations about the FBIs background check process, which appears to have failed.to.pick up potentially important information, tell the American people that this a serious lapse that.must be resolved before going forward, and until then demand a temporary one month suspension of all federal background checks pending a senate investigation into the entire.process.  

Go nuclear man, do not let this.come to.vote.at all costs.  If need be, boycott the vote, no democrats showup for the vote in solidarity of women and victims of abuse.  The republicans are.playing for keeps you idiots, this is the checkmate play --  not the Midterm elections, which become almost meaningless if Trump gets the SCOTUS in his pocket cause he will have the ultimate ...wait for it.. TRUMP CARD

10 hours ago, Chachie said:

 

 

 

IMO this is all Trump needs to "justify" Rosenstein's firing. Bad move by McCabe.

 

I'd say bad move by NYT and that the story can't be true but after believing all their Trump stories for 2 years, I can't bash this one because it doesn't suit my narrative. 

nah, too little to late for firing Rosenstein.  But, he will use this to get his base to turn out in the elections and defend him.against the.conspiracy against him...

1 hour ago, twa said:

 

I certainly agree with reducing guns in the wrong hands and reducing peoples perceived need for them.

 

You are doing the slippery slope thing? 

Schools are very controlled environments  and if you have sufficient security it is easy to limit any expansion.

Things would have to be off the rails before I would agree to a 18 yr old.(though we do arm and send them to war)

 

The number needed is determined by the size and structure AND police response time....and of course if there is a need at all.

If schools all over are being shot up(they are not now) then I'd certainly endorse allowing self defense, closing them down and doing online or calling in the damn National Guard.

 

College kids over 21 I have no issue with carrying concealed with proper vetting and licensing(though I do admit to some fear there and would prefer 25+)

 

added

If school security is generally perceived as insufficient you will see lawsuits to force better(you will see them after this shooting) just as police depts have been successfully sued to upgrade weapons training and businesses sued for insufficient security.

 

 

 

Okay, so would you support legislation banning gun for anyone under the age of 25, exceptions for hunting permits and concealed carry between 18-25?  That would be a step in the right direction.  A big step.  

33 minutes ago, twa said:

 

I fear guns all the time, in school or not.

I do not let fear affect my reasoning though,which is what I see from people that object to any guns in screened and trained hands.

 

Of course if you don't fear a shooter or such at the school then it could be reasonable.

What threat level is below your fear level is the question you must ask yourself.
The same is true for anyone having a gun for self defense.....is the need there

I think your initial instinct is correct.  That's the instinct we should work with -- how do we reduce the proliferation of guns, period?

The problem with the whole self-defense thing, is inevitably, you will arrive at the conclusion that the best result will be to allow everyone, who is willing to undergo safety and de-escalation  training to have a gun for self-defense.  Including high school kids.  Would you support letting 18 year old HS's with a permit and gun training to bring weapons to school, for self defense?  As you mentioned, having a few SRO's in hand or a one or two trained guards with guns might not solve the problem either, eliminate the guard first, take your time with the kids, as you said.  So that leaves only the ... everybody be allowed to carry for self-defense solution.  Which, I trust you to realize, is not a solution.  I may be placing too much trust in you.

2 hours ago, twa said:

 

we need more incidences of gun violence directed at stopping school shooters.

If a foundation provided the guns and equipment would ya'll drop the sell more guns nonsense ?

 

Or will it be like your fear of guns in school period?

Unless Im reading it wrong, the way you word this is as if you have a problem with someone having an automatic "fear of guns in school".  You realize, all sane adults have an automatic fear of guns in school, right?

3 minutes ago, bearrock said:

 

But if we criminalize private sales, wouldn't that stop you from selling your gun to someone in private?

 

You're right, our goal is to stop the killing.  And one proposed way of stopping the killing is to prevent these psychopaths from getting their hands on these destructive weapons.  There are two groups right?  Group 1 is psychos who already has the weapon.  Group 2 is psychos who has not yet been able to obtain it.  Your point about genie being out of the bottle is right for Group 1.  But if we ban private sale (assuming that people will obey the law) and if we make purchase of these weapons from a licensed dealers a lot harder, doesn't that lower the number in Group 2?  And if people disobey the ban on private sale and a few are prosecuted, at some point, wouldn't private sales eventually stop?  It may not thwart group 1, but it seems to me that it will help thwart group 2.  

 

The alt-right has framed the debate so that only solutions that completely eradicate the problem will be considered for legislation.  Partially thwarting or lowering the number of a subgroup of undesirable actions is not enough of a benefit to touch the holy 2nd amendment

2 minutes ago, No Excuses said:

So this ****head trained with white power militias.

 

 

Young, white males are increasingly becoming radicalized in this country. When will we take it seriously?

AND still, people wont use the "T" word to describe this action.  Hmmm, lets see how this works

1. Wanted to inflict as much terror as possible on innocent and unsuspecting people?  Check.
2. Trained with an armed group readying for a war against a perceived enemy?  Check
3. Subscribes to a radical belief system?  Check
4. Is White or Caucasian?  Uncheck, uncheck, uncheck!

23 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

I'm not sure if you are being serious here - sometimes sarcasm does not transmit well in words.

 

But I really think there is a section of the population who believe that kids being shot at school is a price worth paying so they can have 'freedom'. It baffles me.

Definitely sarcastic.  Anybody who uses that argument seriously would probably not be able to honestly answer the question, "do you love your kids or your guns more."

17 minutes ago, Springfield said:

Well, looks like we are well on our way to doing nothing yet again.  

 

Doesn’t it make you guys mad to repeatedly type the same meaningless **** over and over again?

The fact that this shooting doesnt even warrant a new thread and has been added to the Vegas Mega thread, tells you everything you need to know, and is a microcosm of the societal response to this shooting.

Everything that needs to be said has already been said.
 

I dunno what the big deal is.  This is just the price we have to pay for our freedom.  I mean it sucks, but what are we gonna do, ban assualt riffles?  Overall crime is down, and even the number of people killed by assault rifle  has decreased over the past 20 years,  even though the number of assault riffles sold has increased over that time period.  Banning them wont completely eradicate the problem, so why bother?  Besides, if we banned assault rifles, then these crazies will just use bombs to kill people, I dunno why they dont already do that.   Wait, what?