TMK9973

24 minutes ago, Riggodrill44 said:

Wentz didn’t design those plays. Turner is the opposite of his dad.

Norv was the best I’ve seen designing 3rd down plays, his son was definitely sleeping when class was in.

The play calling absolutely sucked. 

But on 2nd he could have ran into the end zone (and I'd he didn't there was enough time to spike and have a 1st down play)

3rd down he had plenty of time and no need to rush. He could have waited to see if anything opened up.

Rivera has gotten worse. The Defense is good, except when playing with a lead. So that tells me its Del Rio. And Wentz is terrible. Just God awful. 

Has some talent so can make some good plays but overall is only hurts us.

You win and you can be .500 by the weekend. 

Now it's over.

3 plays to go 2 yards and you can't do it?? 

Wentz needs to be gone. 3 plays from the 2 and all 3 could have been int

2 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I didn’t just blame the Oline for sacks.  I just don’t have audacity to make a statement like “The O line hasn’t been bad”.  It’s honestly the worst post I’ve seen today and that’s saying a lot.  

Cool.

When you start with a wrong premise I can understand why you think that.

When eventually Wentz gets hurts remember this post as you will suddenly shocked the Oline doesn't look bad anymore

1 minute ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I’m curious what he’s supposed to step up into exactly?  
 

I honestly can’t think of a more embarrassing post than to say “The a Oline hasn’t been bad”.

 

I don’t care an iota about Wentz.  I’d be fine at this point if they let Heineke start and lose out.  But to suggest the line hasn’t been bad indicates you may be blind.  To cite some phantom stat with no context  as proof you are right, phew.

Watch. His first big sack was against a 3 man rush where he kept going back vs stepping up In plenty of space.

I cant think of a more embarrassing way to say "I don't understand the trenches" then to blame just the Oline on sacks 

Btw. The idea that this is on the Online is ridiculous.

The O line hasn't been bad. In fact i saw a stat that showed Wentz actually had the 4th most time in the pocket.

He doesnt step up, he doest recognize blitzes, he doesn't do hot reads, he hold the ball forever.

The issue is not the line. It's wentz

I'm done with Wentz. I thought we would have been better off going with TH and upgrading elsewhere but that Wentz was a upgrade.

But he's getting worse every game.

Wentz needs to be benched

11 minutes ago, Jbird7 said:

Yeah but you gave us 2.5 wins with Flowers, Settle and Collins.....

I figured if we were getting out on the deep end we might as well get out there.....

 

 

 

 

I give them 2.5 COMBINED.  I think there is more then a vacuum. For instance- Yes _ Settle was a back up. But a good one that because he could give other players a rest at time, made them better.  

I agree with your other takes. I like Wentz as a stop gap as well, but he cost us a LOT for a stop gap.  

26 minutes ago, Franklin60 said:

I don’t think an upgrade can be measured solely in wins. It’s more a combination of things, like yards per game, points scored, turnovers. Things like that.

I think for THIS year -It 100% is. Because Even if Wentz lights it up and sets all sorts of records, The cost of bringing him was cutting other players and not signing FA's.  So how many more games did we win with Wentz vs if we had kept Henicke and spent that money elswhere?

You play to win right?  We can't talk Wentz and NOT discuss how much it cost us.  The goal is to win games and EVERY player we sign should be with the focus us does having this player on our team increase the numbers of wins we have. 

I keep going back - What games did we lose last year that we would have won if Wentz was the QB?

Is our record any different right now if we didnt trade for Wentz?

38 minutes ago, Jbird7 said:

But I would argue that by these arbitrary standards, Wentz a WAR of 8 over Heineken. and I like Heineken.

So you are saying last year we win 15 games if Wentz was QB over Henicke?

Come on. We were having a good discussion.

17 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

That's like one scandal, though, at a time when frankly they were transitioning to desegregation in the NFL and we were just the last one.

 

We traded for Bobby Mitchell in what, 1961?  What comparable scandals did we have from then until the 70s?

I don't know.

But I will say it's more then we were the last one.

The second to last team desegregated 6 years earlier.

But I was pre my time. So I honestly don't know if there were scandals or not.

I care as in I still watch every game, I still get excited before the game and my son and I will still discuss and dissect every game.

But as other have said when we lost I use to not be able to watch football at all. Now I do.

I now longer focus on it the night before or after and I haven't been to a game in 8 years

43 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

How is this even comparable given all the scandals that have surrounded this franchise the last 20 years alone?

 

Can't have this conversation based on field play alone, not with all the crap us fans have gotten over the year for off the field stuff.

 

Was the fan base on pace for extinction between the 40s and 70s?

Yes 

I mean I don't know all the scandals then vs now but the NFL literally was on the verge of removing the owner due to his on going refusals to sign a black player.

1 hour ago, gbear said:

I would add one what if to the current generation.  What if Sean Taylor doesn't die? Our D has never been the same since, and our record might be far different if we had a D.

 

Of course feels like I should be singing that to the tune of "If I only had a brain..."

 

I love Sean Taylor. He was a beast.  But he wasn't a QB or a coach, which are the only 2 individuals I think could change the course of a entire team for a long period of time. 

He was a monster for us in 2004, 2005, 2006, and 2007 (When healthy).

But we went 6-10 in 2004 and 5-11 in 2006 and was 5-4 when he got injured in 2007.

Sean Taylor doesnt get shot and the world is a better place and he goes on and has a great career. But the course of Redskins history doesn't really change EXCEPT for the fact that maybe Gibbs stays one more year and 2008 was better.    

Dup Post  

41 minutes ago, Jbird7 said:

 

No flipping way.

We won the first 2 games cause Wentz threw for 600+ and 7 tds.

 

Now had we kept Settle, & Flowers, and maybe Ion, we would be in worlds better position, and more importantly if we had brought some flipping NFL caliber LB'rs and CB's into camp to compete with our dumpster fire of a depth chart, we might now be in this mess. 

Oh wait, we would have needed to have brought in a non-gimpy non-panther O linemen or 2 to shore up the revolving turnstile that is an OL as well.

 

I love Henikie, the person, the story, the gritty determination.

To compare his arm with Wentz is dishonest. 

 

Wentz took cap space, but we dont win the first game or have any hope of competing long term with his arm.

 

Howell is the only realistic option, but if this OL cannot stablize, you cannot put him in to get shellacked behind it.

 

You are thinking of it wrong. What games would we have won with Wentz and Dotson and a healthy Samuels.

We didnt win the first two games.

We are 1-2

Again -I have no doubt the Wentz is better then Henicike.

But if We don't sign Wentz and kept Flowers, Settle and collins I think we are at LEAST 1-2 as well, if not 2-1.   

26 minutes ago, Jbird7 said:

It is so frustrating that you people think that Wentz is the issue on this team right now.

 

There are 99 issues on this roster, but Carson Wentz is not one of them.

Now the eagles game exposed what happens if you dont have the RB's running to the flats to counter the blitz. 

But that is poor game adjustments/planning. 

 

That line looked like they were on the Philly payroll.

 

And to run Gibson 12 times for a whooping 38 yards is criminal. 

I encourage you to read again what I wrote.

I dont think Wentz is the issue. 

I think the issues is we did nothing to improve our defense, we didn't even take steps to keep it at least the same as last year.

And we didn't do that because we couldn't afford to after we traded for Wentz.

Who I don't think has played well enough to overcome what we lost.

If this was Baseball -I would be discussing WAR.

(Wins over replacement).

In my head - Henicke would have a WAR off about 0 (Doesnt win us additional games vs a avg QB, didnt cost us games vs a AVG QB).

I would say Wentz has a WAR of about 2.5

I would say Settle, Collins and Flower combined has a WAR of 2.5

Sooo - Trading for  Wentz at the expensive of the other guys we had to cut to afford him gives us no additional wins.  

That's a good what if. 

My Son (21) sent me a text during the game that said "I HATE when you tell me you have no answers for this team. YOU made me a fan and doomed me to this life".  It made my analytical mind wonder.

So i started comparing the 30 years we had since our last SB season with the 30 years the Redskins had from 1946 to 1975.  (We reached the NFL championship 4 times in 5 years from 1940 to 1945. So 1946 seemed to be the right time to start).

So Greatest Generation and Boomers vs Millennials and  Gen Z.  Who had it worst?

1946 to 1975, Redskins were 167-206-20.  A .441 winning %.

9 winning seasons

only 1 Division Championship

1 SB appearance 

Playoffs were very different then so Its hard to compare.  BUt 1972 was the only year they had a post season victory.

1992 - 2021

201-278-2

a .418 Winning %

9 Winnings seasons

4 Division titles

3 post seasons wins

The current generation had 2 major "What if" moments.  

1 -What if RG3 doesn't get hurt

2 -What if Alex Smith doesn't get hurt.  

The older Generation had at least 1 major "What if" moment

What if Vince Lombardi doesn't get cancer (They had 14 straight losing seasons before his 1 year coaching, and had them a winning season).

Prob more but it was before my time -So i don't really know.

the older generation had some good years at that end with 4 straight playoff appearances and a SB appearance.  

The newer Generation was more spread out. 

The Redskins really went 36 seasons before they were considered a great team again with the older generation

Will the newer generation have to wait longer? (Season 31 currently).

Which generation had it worst?

So overall i think Wentz is a good QB and a upgrade.  HOWEVER -IT was dumb to sign.

Here is my question - What game last year did we lose that we would have won with Wentz vs Henickie?

I cant think of any.  MAYBE the dallas game at home? 

So basically we upgrade the QB position but to do that we cut our 2nd best OL (flowers), our best LB (Collins. He was Terrible at Safety but great once he took on the hybrid, mostly LB role), and Tim Settle and added nothing to our Defense. 

We did add some weapons on Offense - but we spent all our money to slightly improve a position that didn't really cost us games last year.

Right now - If we had kept Flowers, Collins, Settle, and Henickie as starting, and brought in 1 FA on Defense (Either LB or DB) would we win more games, less games, or the same amount of games this year?

Its only been 3 games but as of right now -I would think we would have been at LEAST the same, if not better.  

I can't get over the gates to handle the "lines".

DID THEY REALLY THINK HUNDARDS WOULD LINE UP??

I would LOVE to see how the team store looked this morning when they opened.

Based on them getting ready last night, announcing extending hours this week, and them convincing themselves this was gonna be a big thing - I picture all the staff they could muster saying "HERE WE GO" and opening up the door and seeing one security guard walking in.

Wow. The hype video they did below is pretty good. They could have just played that.

Instead they have DW just say it (we all knew anyway) and they have Wright gaslight us on how much it resonates with the fan base.

https://twitter.com/Commanders/status/1488862704983068673?s=20&t=c7HnNihumptl6y5fZGSEgQ

On 1/30/2022 at 1:07 AM, hail2skins said:

Moseley did miss a FG in the season opener against the Cowboys, but I don't think it was a last second one that would've won it, as was the case in the Packers game. The Cowboys stormed back from 23-3 down to lead 31-23 and I think we scored at the very end to make it 31-30 (no two-point conversion in the pros back then).

My Memory served me well!

Mosley missed a 39 yarder with 2 seconds left against green bay

https://www.forbes.com/sites/robreischel/2019/12/07/game-to-remember-green-bay-packers-48-washington-redskins-47/?sh=220d66556a41

As for opener - you were right. But he did miss a 31 yarder with 9 mins left.  

On 1/27/2022 at 5:54 PM, tomwvr said:

1983 Super Bowl ruined my 16th birthday.

that in my opinion was the best redskins team ever. If they had won the super bowl they would be considered the greatest team in nfl history

Both losses during the season were by 1 point .

And both games included a missed fg late in game