Beaudry Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 RedskinsNation, somebody doesn't have to be a Redskins fan to know the players or the team. Wilbon and Tony K. are no Redskins haters. On the flipside, just because somebody is a Redskins fan doesn't mean they have any idea of what's going on. See "RedskinsNation" for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted September 20, 2004 Author Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by ramseyskins This makes his opinion even more irrelevant. All of a sudden, after ONE bad game, he thinks Ramsey sucks? Let's throw out everything else. Talk about a revisionist. So if one bad game dictates your career, how about Tim 0.0 Hassebleck - Wilbon wants him instead??? can you read, he said if ramsey doesn't change he will be gone, and all of us should agree with that it isn't also one bad game, remember this is Gibbs now, he hates stupid turnovers and throwing a pic in the endzone is the dumbest turnover, you know Gibbs told him after that to not look at the WR you are going to throw to and then throw in double coverage, then he does it 2 more times, Gibbs won't stand for that. Spurrier would have been okay and say we will get the ball back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins11 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma can you read, he said if ramsey doesn't change he will be gone, and all of us should agree with that Now you're backtracking. We all know he had a bad game. EVERYONE knows if he throws 3 INTs a game, he will not be starting. Wilbon said "He doesn't see the field, and every coach and scout who has seen him on film knows it and says it. " He doesn't see the field? Either this is a trait he always had, or a trait he only exhibited in the last game. If it is a trait he always had, why was he liking Ramsey before? And if it is a trait only shown yesterday, then he is just pointing out the obvious. You posted the quote as an attempt to show that Ramsey is worthless, when just now you admitted that's not the case. So really, Wilbon was either a) pointing out the obvious or being spineless. Both are pretty worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted September 20, 2004 Author Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by ramseyskins You posted the quote as an attempt to show that Ramsey is worthless, when just now you admitted that's not the case. So really, Wilbon was either a) pointing out the obvious or being spineless. Both are pretty worthless. please go back anywhere in this thread to where i said he was worthless :doh: you might be searching for sometime Wilbon was either a) pointing out the obvious or being spineless. Both are pretty worthless. I think Wilbon didn't want to believe it and now may see that those people were right. It is pretty bad when one of the defensive players on the team we are playing said the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panthro Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma You do know he played Ramsey because Tim was not dressed, it will be interesting to see what happens. I'm almost positive that I saw Tim standing with Brunnell and PR on the sidelines during the game yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins11 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma please go back anywhere in this thread to where i said he was worthless :doh: you might be searching for sometime You didn't say it. I was inferring it.. I mean you did create a whole thread about a guy dissing Ramsey. Maybe I inferred wrong. OK? That aside... what have you to say to my comments about Wilbon just now? You must admit now that these comments he just made are worthless? Any guy on the street could have had said that 3 INTs a day on any football team will not cut it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted September 20, 2004 Author Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by ramseyskins That aside... what have you to say to my comments about Wilbon just now? You must admit now that these comments he just made are worthless? Any guy on the street could have had said that 3 INTs a day on any football team will not cut it. I already answered it that. I said what everyone was telling Mike about Ramsey that he might have listened to what they said for once instead of defending him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scowan Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 I have to chime in on all this Ramsey stuff. There is really only one game I can think of where Ramsey started and threw more INTs than TDs and that was the New Orleans game from back in 02. He has had some games where he came in during the game and threw up some INTs like he did yesterday, but I really think other players cause him to have what I will call "bad stats" yesterday. If Garner makes a catch at the 1 yard line and scores, we never see the corner INT. Somewhere he and Coles were not on the same page on the second INT. The last one was ill advised, yes, underthrown and a bad decision into double coverage. But even with all of that the Skins had a chance to win late. One game and he was a little jumpy yes, but he will recover and play better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins11 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma I already answered it that. I said what everyone was telling Mike about Ramsey that he might have listened to what they said for once instead of defending him. OK. So Wilbon is a sham, and his opinion is useless. Any football knowledge he has is useless since he is just reiterating what other people said after PR had ONE BAD GAME in which he was a backup. Thanks for clearing that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzlightbeer81 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 scowan, yes if gardner makes that catch on the high throw into the endzone, its a TD, but if gardner doesnt make that great diving catch on the overthrown long ball, they probably dont get down to the redzone anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlantaskin Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Question: how long did it take Pennington to start seeing the field? Ramsey's still a young player with just over one season's worth of games under his belt. He'll develop, unless of course the posters here run him out of town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted September 20, 2004 Author Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by ramseyskins OK. So Wilbon is a sham, and his opinion is useless. Any football knowledge he has is useless since he is just reiterating what other people said after PR had ONE BAD GAME in which he was a backup. Thanks for clearing that up. PR has had more then one bad game. Don't you see it odd one of his defenders is now changing his opinion?? Wilbon is not a sham, he is sports writer and someone that covers the game unlike yourself. You do remember he even broadcasted the games on NBC 4 right :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzlightbeer81 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 didnt pennington sit a year, then get injured for a year, and know he and the jets r 2-0? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins11 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma PR has had more then one bad game. Don't you see it odd one of his defenders is now changing his opinion?? Well, Ramsey has only played 1 regular season game under Gibbs. Pretty quick change of opinion, based on limited information. It is not odd, the opinion just is pointless - We all know PR will not play if he makes stupid mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzlightbeer81 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 He has never broken a 55% completion percentage for a season, and his best rating for a year is under 80, i think 78 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins26 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 I may be late coming to this but I just got home. So I will state my view. First off in my opinion Wilbon sucks, I have never once listened to Wilbon on anything and I have found that for the most part he is usually wrong. Him saying that he talked to scouts and things doesnt prove anything to me, and some Giants player. First off the scouting reports and the Giants player are all from basically last year, where he played in the fun n gun, so OF COURSE HE WASNT GOOD WHEN THE DEEP WR'S WERENT OPEN, WE HAD NOBODY BUT GUYS GOING DEEP!!!! There were no hot routes and very few checkdowns, Spurrier taught him to look deep all the time, it is going to take time to unteach him some of the things Spurrier did. Last year was also his first year starting, of COURSE HE HELD ONTO THE BALL TOO LONG, SO DID PEYTON MANNING!!! Of course he doesnt see the whole field yet, no first year starters do. He was taught a lot of bad habits and now we have to unteach those. If you ask me, AND I HAVE WATCHED THE GAME OVER! He looked much improved yesterday, I thought he looked more comfortable, and made quicker decisions. This is his third year, it takes a while for QB's to grow. He is coming from a school with a shotgun based offense, therefore he has a lot more to get used to then some of these other guys that have come in like Palmer or Harrington. Carr and Harrington still dont have their **** straightened out either. They are still tossin out picks right and left. And whoever asked "What did Ramsey ever do to get people to like him" well I have an answer for that. Ramsey works his ass off, his rookie year he needed to work on his footwork, he came in during the offseason very early and worked with Spurrier EVERYDAY on footwork and everything he needed to know. He got pounded in that offense and never once did he complain or say it was the coaches fault, he also always took the blame for everything even though it wasnt always his fault. He doesnt go out and party every night like some of these guys, he is a very religious guy. He at first wanted a trade b/c of that fire he has to play, but once he sat down and talked to Gibbs he realized that he had a lot to learn and the best thing to do was stay here. And I hope he comes out and smokes the Cowboys and then I will flood Wilbon with e-mails about how wrong he was and always is. One bad game, thats what he just had. Our young QB, whos coming into a new system, had a bad game. Does he really deserve all of this because of that?? A game in which wasnt just bad for him, but the entire team played poorly. A problem that he didnt create and that he got put in to fix, so he couldnt do it, he came close. And I just think, if Rod Gardner catches one pass on the goal line, how much this site would be hailing Ramsey, and how Wilbon wouldnt have wrote anything about that. He would be hailed as the comeback kid. It's amazing how 1 drop can make people go crazy and blame 1 guy for everything. A guy who doesnt deserve the blame. But Joe Gibbs sat down and talked to Ramsey about how he was the future of the team, and told him how good he was, and how much they think of him, and how they want him to be the future QB of this team. And I know that Joe Gibbs is not a liar, and he's not stupid. So if you people right now are saying Ramsey sucks then your either saying Gibbs lied to him, or Gibbs is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlantaskin Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Pennington didn't start a game in either of his first two years in the league. Here are his starts and QB rating since: 2002: 12 starts, 104.2 2003: 9 starts, 82.9 2004: 2 starts, 124.3 I think we have consistently seen that it takes a long time to develop a QB in the NFL. Harrington and Carr are also good examples. I'm in favor of a bit more patience with Ramsey. But I wouldn't mind seeing him playing more and gaining the experience in Gibbs' system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cskin Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 scowan, yes if gardner makes that catch on the high throw into the endzone, its a TD, but if gardner doesnt make that great diving catch on the overthrown long ball, they probably dont get down to the redzone anyway High? The ball was eye level and hit Gardner in both of his hands. He simply tried to run into the endzone before he looked the ball in.... a typical mental lapse from the "blockhead". On Ramsey, guys... the guy has been in the worst NFL offense his first two years and taught to look downfield before looking short. That's two years of being coached to look downfield and chuck it. One MC, TC, and 5 preseason games isn't going to change that.... nor is he going to be comfortable in the Gibbs offense. Brunell isn't even comfortable in the offense, how can Patrick be? Ramsey was the victim of trying to do way to much.... and not taking what was given to him. It's human nature... especially when you're annointed the "golden boy" from the outset and toyed with by S2. He came into the game trying to make something happen... to get the fans "ooohing and awwing" over him and leading the skins to victory. He wanted to prove he was the gunslinger everyone has written he is... prove he should have been starting from day one. He failed... the pressure to succeed and become the Gibbs & Media darling was to much. Give the guy a year of coaching from Breaux, Burns, and Gibbs before we run the kid out of town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzlightbeer81 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 maybe its too early to write him off, not saying i like him now, i still think hes a flop, just wondering what he has done to make you think hes gonna be such a star Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins26 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Pennington didn't start a game in either of his first two years in the league. Here are his starts and QB rating since:2002: 12 starts, 104.2 2003: 9 starts, 82.9 2004: 2 starts, 124.3 I think we have consistently seen that it takes a long time to develop a QB in the NFL. Harrington and Carr are also good examples. I'm in favor of a bit more patience with Ramsey. But I wouldn't mind seeing him playing more and gaining the experience in Gibbs' system. And here is a smart post. With proof to back it up. And to add, Ramsey pretty much lost a year b/c apparently what Spurrier was teaching him was completely the wrong things to do. Ramsey is not only just coming into his 3rd year but he is also learning a new system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlantaskin Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 Originally posted by buzzlightbeer81 maybe its too early to write him off, not saying i like him now, i still think hes a flop, just wondering what he has done to make you think hes gonna be such a star What I like about him is that he has a cannon and, as we learned last year, he's tough. Tough in the Brett Favre way. Yea, maybe I am overly optimistic, but you can't teach a strong arm and guts, so I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt that he can learn how to read a defense and take what is given to him. I think he finally has a pretty good teacher. I could clearly be wrong. But, boy, let's hope not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzlightbeer81 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 the ball was eye level but gardner was jumping to get it at eye level, it should have been an easy throw into his chest without gardner needing to go up for it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aspkikn Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 The sun was in his eyes ... :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins26 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 the ball was eye level but gardner was jumping to get it at eye level, it should have been an easy throw into his chest without gardner needing to go up for it I dont really remember Gardner jumping at all, maybe alittle hop. Doesnt matter though, eye level or not, the ball hit both of his hands, nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzlightbeer81 Posted September 20, 2004 Share Posted September 20, 2004 yes he has a cannon, but he is missing so many more importan things. He has no accuracy outside the pocket, So much for the Favre comparison, doesnt seem to be able to make reads, he still holds the ball too long, but thats partly due to his inabilty to read the field, hopefully thats something he picks up, but so far i see no improvment. Id rather have someone who can hit a wide open reciever 8 yards away then someone who just chucks it 50 yards and it may land wherever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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