Joeythetapeworm Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 I know people have said again and again that Gibbs can't go back to his old ways of stashing players on IR because of the cap, but what stops him from using his title as "redskins president" to sign them as employees of the team but not players? Why can't Pita Elisara officially be the highest paid janitor on the Redskins payroll for example? If we give them contracts in this way, we can keep him from other teams and have them practice with the regular squad without their contracts hitting the cap, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny_Blaze Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 i dont know man.... that probably wouldnt work so well. First its not that moral and eventually someone would notice and it would be a big issue. Second I dont really many players would go to that level, its sort of embarrassing i would imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I2eDsKiNs Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Pita Elisara would be the worst janitor of all time, he'd make a bigger mess than the cleaning that he would be supposed to be doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Westbrook36 Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 :laugh: :doh: :laugh: :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Originally posted by Joeythetapeworm I know people have said again and again that Gibbs can't go back to his old ways of stashing players on IR because of the cap, but what stops him from using his title as "redskins president" to sign them as employees of the team but not players? Why can't Pita Elisara officially be the highest paid janitor on the Redskins payroll for example? If we give them contracts in this way, we can keep him from other teams and have them practice with the regular squad without their contracts hitting the cap, no? Joeythetapeworm, You have to start getting out of the house more. :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joeythetapeworm Posted September 16, 2004 Author Share Posted September 16, 2004 Lol, yeah, I guess I do think too much about these kinds of things, but still, I think it's a valid point. Some of you may have misunderstood me. I'm not saying we actually make them janitors and such, I'm just saying that I dont' see why lying about their job description(saying "janitor" or "secretary" or even "quality control" when it's really essentially just practice squad) wouldn't work as well as lying about nonexistant illnessess(rare blood disorder). I know it's borderline unethical but Gibbs has done somethign similar before, so I doubt he would object to it. It seems like a good way to get them to not count against the final roster number and also not count against the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Happy Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 If you do that, the players can still be signed to another team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joeythetapeworm Posted September 16, 2004 Author Share Posted September 16, 2004 It seems like #1, that would be an unlikely incident-the people you'd be doing this with would be mostly unknown. I mean, how many other teams would really be willing to pursue someone like Pita Elisara that seriosuly? and, #2, if any of them do jump ship, so what? You've only lost a project and if he chose to leave then you can likely assume he didn't buy into the system and wasn't worth keeping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Originally posted by Joeythetapeworm Lol, yeah, I guess I do think too much about these kinds of things, but still, I think it's a valid point. Some of you may have misunderstood me. I'm not saying we actually make them janitors and such, I'm just saying that I dont' see why lying about their job description(saying "janitor" or "secretary" or even "quality control" when it's really essentially just practice squad) wouldn't work as well as lying about nonexistant illnessess(rare blood disorder). I know it's borderline unethical but Gibbs has done somethign similar before, so I doubt he would object to it. It seems like a good way to get them to not count against the final roster number and also not count against the cap. Gibbs has been accused of stashing players in the past, but it was rampant in the league among the winning franchises, like Oakland, Dallas, Pittsburgh, etc. Gibbs wasn't doing anything the other winning teams weren't doing. All the coaches were aware of this, because coaching is nothing but a big fraternity for the most part anyway. A coach gets fired from team A and then winds up next year on team B. So there are few secrets. The teams that complained about it to the league office were the cheap teams like Arizona and New Orleans then, which were not going to pay out extra money and thought they were being taken advantage of. The penalties now have been changed and are severe if you get caught -- heavy fines and draft pick forfeitures, so you have to be real careful. Your suggestion is not a good idea because disgruntled players or employees talk after they leave an organization. Say you release a player and he thinks it was unfair, and then he blows the whistle on your team. It happens even in the outside business world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Joeythetapeworm, As a long time Redskin fan, I'll give you an example. Wide receiver Charley "downtown" Brown was stashed by the Redskins under Gibbs. This is well known. The reason being that they saw tremendous promise in him, but he was not going to make the team his first year, without personal coaching. He came from a small school -- South Carolina State -- and it was a big jump to the NFL. As I recall he was put on IR his first year; came back the next year; and subsequently made all-pro. But the Redskins may or may not feel the same way about everyone. They may not hold the current 8 players on the practice squad in the same high esteem. Consequently, if another team wants to sign them away, it may be no big deal with the Redskin FO. On the other hand it is negotiable. I recall a RB that Dallas tried to sign off the Redskins practice squad years ago -- I cant recall his name at the moment -- but the Redskin FO told him he had a future with the Skins -- who knows, possibly promising him a bigger contract under the table -- and he refused to sign with Dallas and stayed on the practice squad. So it depends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocono Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Joey...Even if he did do it it wouldn't be stashing in the old sense because once a player is cut his contract passes through waivers and any team that wants him can claim him. Stashing players used to be putting them on IR with some fake or exaggerated injury so they would never reach waivers. Once a Pita Elisara passes through waivers giving him a janitorial job with the team would only be keeping him from getting a similar job outside of football and certainly wouldn't be worth the risk of getting caught and giving up draft picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afparent Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Sounds like he hasn't lost his touch. He stashed McCants and Cartwright last week. What's the difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Originally posted by afparent Sounds like he hasn't lost his touch. He stashed McCants and Cartwright last week. What's the difference? McCants and Cartwright are legal and are not stashed in the true sense of the word. They take up 2 of 53 roster spots. A stashed player is a player who is not ready to play now, doesn't take up a roster spot, and is put on Christmas-layaway. :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocono Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Originally posted by afparent Sounds like he hasn't lost his touch. He stashed McCants and Cartwright last week. What's the difference? Every team has 53 players on the roster but can only dress 45 plus an emergency QB on game days. Rock and McCants were among the 7 players who didn't dress for the game but still occupy a spot on the 53 man roster and are paid their full salary. They gave McCants a nice contract extension during the off season so you have to wonder if perhaps they regret doing it if he can't even warrant being dressed on a game day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullbackIsKey Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Originally posted by inmate running the asylum Gibbs has been accused of stashing players in the past, but it was rampant in the league among the winning franchises, like Oakland, Dallas, Pittsburgh, etc. Gibbs wasn't doing anything the other winning teams weren't doing. exactly, he was just the best at it. It wasn't the most ethical thing to do, and I believe in purity in football, but there were probably some guys there getting paid that wouldn't have been playing anywhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Originally posted by Pocono They gave McCants a nice contract extension during the off season so you have to wonder if perhaps they regret doing it if he can't even warrant being dressed on a game day. [/b] Except you are forgetting one thing which occurs every year with every team. And that is injuries. McCants and Cartwright will be playing in games sooner or later due to injuries or a dropoff in performance by another player. No Redskin player under Gibbs is going to sit on the bench for 16 games, without showing Gibbs what he can do during the course of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Strangely, after final cuts, the Redskins added 25 quality control coaches each of them are reportedly getting the NFL minimum salary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullbackIsKey Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Originally posted by Burgold Strangely, after final cuts, the Redskins added 25 quality control coaches each of them are reportedly getting the NFL minimum salary. is that true or sarcasm? if true, do you know if ther's a list of them anywhere? i'm interested now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocono Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Originally posted by inmate running the asylum Except you are forgetting one thing which occurs every year with every team. And that is injuries. McCants and Cartwright will be playing in games sooner or later due to injuries or a dropoff in performance by another player. No Redskin player under Gibbs is going to sit on the bench for 16 games, without showing Gibbs what he can do during the course of the season. Injuries are a certainty in football but injuries at a particular position are not a certainty. As the 5th WR McCants is 2 injuries away from seeing playing time so given the realities of the cap one has to wonder if the Skins might be better off using 800K fewer cap $$$ on say Gari Scott as their 5th WR and using that 800K to upgrade another position. McCants was a RFA so even if he wasn't given the 2M SB it's likely they could have him sitting in the stands on gamedays for about half of the cap space he now occupies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red zone Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 NFL Europe and the practice squad allow teams to stash more players than Gibbs ever did. More to the point is the caliber of player he stashed. Would anyone else really have been that enamored of Mark Rypien? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.