Springfield

I'm going to go ahead and assume you're averaging the number of hours they turn and that's not their actual take per hour turned because if it is, where do I sign up? I've NEVER heard of a dealership, let alone an independent shop, paying a tech $50 an hour. That's unheard of.

They get paid for every hour turned... I can't say it's exactly $50 per hour, but some of them I'm sure are damn close.

My gripe is that you want to ensure workmanship is first class, but you have yet to answer how much those carrying out this first class workmanship are getting paid.

What do you pay your mechanics per hour? Can you justify your labour charges as to what you pay your mechanics?

The mechanics at my shop are paid approx. $35-$50 per hour based on skill level and accrediation. They are paid based on commission, more precisely how many hours of labor they actually perform. If they finish a job that pays 5 hours (according to the labor guide, which we have three different sources) in 3 hours, they get paid for 5 hours worth of labor. So, for every hour of labor performed, the shop gets $55-40 and the technician gets the rest.

What does that other $55-40 go towards? It goes to paying people like me, the service advisor, paying the light service techs (oil changes and tire rotations hardly pay their hourly salary), paying the accountants, maintaining the shop, etc. Last but not least, the ownership has to make a pretty penny too.

Out of the technicians at our shop, at least half of them made over $100K last year. A couple made close to $200K. It's safe to say that none made less than I did and a few made double or triple what I made. It's safe to say that the technicians (at my shop at least) are handsomely rewarded for the work that they do and I feel completely that they diserve it.

On top of their handsome pay. The technicians are guranteed a "base" pay, meaning that if they do not perform enough hours of labor to make a "base", they are guranteed a certain amount of pay. This is also based on skill level and accredation. This is very helpfull to them in a couple of ways. First, the summer and winter are ALWAYS more busy. Vehicles break down more often in extreme weather conditions, that's a simple truth. Second, even with all of their knowledge and skill, technicians can still get "stuck" on a hard problem. They can waste hours or days of their time diagnosing a problem that only pays 1 hour. It's good to know that if they have an off week, they can still bring home enough money to pay the bills and take care of their families.

So, to sum it up... Our technicians are paid well for the services they perform. They perform outstanding work for me and my fellow service advisors, so we (as management) must take outstanding care of them. It is still a back breaking line of work, but I hope that helps clarify things a little for you.

To me, our charges are justified. If, even after all of that explanation, you still think that our charges aren't fair than I am sorry. We work very hard day in and day out and we strive to be at the top of our game. I think we diserve every penny that we earn.

Lastly... I didn't really start this thread to bicker about the costs of auto repairs. I do appreciate your question though and I'm happy to offer any information I can to show you how things work. The cost of auto repairs, labor especially, depends highly on location and the cost of living in that location. While we may charge $90 an hour for labor in the Northern Virginia suburbs, shops in southwestern Virginia may only charge $40 and hour. It's a plain and simple fact.

I'm not going to bash you for anything, I just wanted to know if this seemed like a reasonable price. The way you described it sounds fine, I just wanted to make sure. Thanks for the response.

I forgot to mention. I assume you meant clean and adjust rear brakes as opposed to rear brake alignment. There is no such thing as a rear brake alignment and there is only such a thing as clean and adjust if you have rear drum brakes. If you have a Corolla, it's likely you have rear drum brakes (as opposed to disc).

Also I wanted to point out that you may be able to bring your extended warranty to where ever you want, unless that extended warranty says "Must go to Toyota dealer" somewhere on it. You could also save some money that way. Just an FYI.

Didn't think you were going to bash me, just wanted to throw that out there for anyone reading the thread. Glad I could help Phoward.

I've already got the differential fluid from the honda dealership....I planned on putting it in soon anyway....I hope you are right and a differential fluid change solves the problem.

I don't know if the S2000 has a cover on the differential you can pull off to inspect the gears or if it just has a drain and fill hole. If it has a cover, it would be worthwhile to look at the gears and fluid and see if there is scarring on the gears or metal shavings in the fluid.

It's a relatively easy first step though. Like to know how this one goes. My friend has an S2000. He has a similar problem I believe, but he's more of a do-it-yourselfer gearhead.

Keep me up to date if you don't mind.

I've learned a lot already. Are you sure you aren't one of the Car Guys from CarTalk on NPR?

And yes... that's me in the SWEEET jean jacket!!

So...is this ES's version of Car Talk?

Banned for compairing me to Car Talk.

****, wrong thread. :laugh:

Like I said before...I think the 950.00 to change brakes and rotors was a little ridiculous, I don't care how much knowledge or sore backs it takes. You don't have to know a lot to change brakes and rotors. I ordered everything and did it for 230.00. 720.00 for "all that knowledge".. I don't think so...I do think that quote was ridiculous.

OK. You're right.

Is that what you wanted to hear?

Since you were just answering questions about brakes, I'll ask this one. My wife and I just got her car back from the dealership in Springfield where we bought the car.(where do you work again?) We went there because we have an extended warranty.

Of course, shocker, the extended warranty doesn't cover wear and tear. We had to get new front brake pads, new rotors for the front, then they did a break alignment on the rear and a break flush. Plus state and emissions inspections. Plus labor. All this came to something like $641.

Did we get taken, or was this a decent price? I ask only because had it not been for the extended warranty, we probably would have just gone to a local shop in Woodbridge.

Edit* 2006 Toyota Corolla

I'll answer this in 2 parts. I'm doing this because there are two things I'd like to comment on.

First... Extended warranties. A lot of the extended warranties that are bought when buying a car are not warranties from the manufacturer. It is important that I point this out because it means, you don't need to take your car back to the dealer for it. I deal with extended warranty companies quite a bit myself and I am in no way related to any dealership. You probably could have just gone to your local shop in Woodbridge in the first place.

When you buy an extended warranty, you should read the fine print. First to find out where you need to go to have your car serviced under this extended warranty. Second to see what is covered... Things like electric motors, switches, relays. Gaskets like oil pan, intake, cylinder head. Hydraulic things like brake lines and hydraulic clutch lines. Bearings whether it be wheel, differential, transmission. Those are all good to see in the paperwork. And of course, the more expensive (most have silver, gold and platinum or something of the like for levels of coverage) the better. Getting the lowest level of coverage will probably not pay off in the long run, where as getting the best level of coverage may actually do some benefit for you. That's just speaking of my own personal experience with extended warranties. I just bought a car myself and opted to not get an extended warranty (but that's just an obvious choice for me).

Second... The price you paid. I will only go into this because this is a shop close to my area (I'm in direct competition with them). Otherwise, I don't know what is a fair price. I will say, you would have likely got a better deal in Woodbridge... their prices are lower (everything's less expensive there, houses, gas, food, etc.)

I will tell you exactly how I would have estimated this at my shop. The labor is in regular font, parts are in italics.

Front brake job: $107.98

Toyota (OEM) front brake pad set: $105.00

Front brake rotors: $85.00 x 2

Clean and adjust rear brakes: $44.66

Brake fluid flush: $89.32

Brake fluid: $25.00

Safety inspection: $16.00

Emission inspection: $28.00

Total of parts and labor: $585.96

Estimate of tax, shop supplies, etc.: $64.46

Estimate of services: $650.42

Now... Before you go bashing me on my price. I guessed on the price of parts, it is certainly possible (and very likely) that the parts actually cost less than my guess. Also, I overestimate. That $650 that I told you what it would be over the phone would actually be something closer to $630-640 when you came to pick up the car later that day. Also, if price is a huge issue, I could opt for less expensive (read: lower quality) brake parts. I'd rather have my customer pay a little more to ensure they feel that the workmanship was first class, hence the OEM brake pads and expensive rotors. I could percivably save the customer $100 by using lesser quality, and thus, less expensive parts but I'd rather have a happy customer that doesn't return 3 times because of brake noise that is "normal" given the quality of parts.

I have a 00 honda s2000 with 65k miles:

several weeks ago I started hearing a clicking noise coming from my rear passenger side wheel. The sound mainly came when I would make a left turn or if I was near a wall (sound would reflect off the wall) One of my buddies and I jacked it up one day and took a look....we checked the wheel weights (which were all secure) checked the shield cover (that sits behind the rotor) and that seemed to be fine. We couldn't hear the noise in the garage while it was jacked (even when we revved up the engine and let the wheels turn) so we ended up dropping it down. After that the sound went away for a good two weeks or so (granted I only drive the car on the weekends).

The sound came back a few days ago....only this time it is coming from the rear driver side when I make right hand turns (weird huh) Any Idea what it may be?

I have a couple of thoughts on this one.

I would assume it is not wheel or brake related, usually something in that area would show scarring, either on the wheel or the brake rotor. I will rule out the wheels and brakes.

It sounds as if this is a bearing noise. Apparently the noise only occurs when that side is loaded up. When you turn the wheel to the right and you are at speed, this forces the weight of the car onto the left (and vice versa). It seems unplausable to me that both of the bearings are making noise at different times though, and after you have unsprung (lifted the car) the weight on them.

My personal thought is that it is coming from the rear differential or the axles going from the differential to the rear wheels. It is possible that there is enough play in the differential or axles that when that side of the vehicle is loaded up during turns it makes a clicking noise.

Noise from the rear end of Honda CR-V's are very common and only require a change of the fluid (in most cases) to fix. I am almost certain Honda doesn't use CR-V differentials in the S2000, but that may be a good place to start. Be sure you use the correct fluid in the differential though, this could cause major problems if you don't.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

It's so bad it's funny. Brought tears to my eyes.

Ah a modern twist on the age ole bench diagnosis...the cyber diagnosis. lol

Springfield....from reading your posts I gotta say you must be a top notch service writer. Would love to have someone like you on our desk.

I'll admit... I'm much better over the computer with a couple of drinks than I am in person completely sober.

All joking aside, I pride myself on being good at what I do. If I was a professional shoe shiner, you'd have some damn shiny shoes. Thanks for the kind words, it's a boost to hear something like that from somebody in the industry.

This is true, I was just pointing out that if you have the means you can save drastic amounts of money by avoiding the ridiculous prices dealers and private shops charge for doing relatively simple repairs.

Agreed, however I wouldn't consider our prices ridiculous. Most people nowadays just plain old don't know about cars. There is a price for all of that knowlege, as well as the amount of back breaking work it takes to do it day in and day out.

I'm a parts manager at a Subaru dealer. Sounds like the compresser may be kicking on and drawing the idle down. You may have an idle air control valve issue. Have someone check out the IAC valve.

Those both certainly sound like possible causes. I'd like to know how that one turned out.

That goes for the rest of you. If you asked questions and then had your car repaired, I'd like to know how it went. You know, a little feedback. I'd like to know how my educated guesses over the internet turned out against a hands on diagnostic.

Does a light screeching noise that goes away when braking means its time for new pads?

Most likely yes. On most brake pads there is a "wear sensor". This wear sensor is a metal bracket that hangs off of the backing of the brake pad. This metal bracket will touch the brake rotor and make an annoying screeching noise when the pads wear thin enough. The wear sensor will make that noise untill you hit the brakes when the wear sensor digs in deep enough that the noise goes away.

However, if you read my post last page (a few before yours), I said some brakes make noise because they are cheap. Cheaper brakes are made of a semi-metallic compound which can contain enough metal to squeak. It is possible this noise is not an indication your brakes are worn out.

Best advise would be to have your brakes checked. Any time your brakes make noise, you should have them checked at least. This should be obvious, but I know there are plenty of people out there who wouldn't think twice about driving with their brakes making all kinds of terrible noises.

half-axle and wheel bearing in my son's piece o'crap mobile tomorrow.

wish me luck......

Good luck. Remember, line up the splines on the axle to the splines on the transmission. You may have to tap the end of the axle to get it in, just don't tap too hard. Wheel bearings are a pain in the ass, love the cars that are designed with bearings built into the hubs. Bearing in hub design is a bit more expensive on the part side, but they are a hell of a lot easier to replace.

Well seeing that an alternator costs at most 200.00 (ordered online) and a battery can be had for 50.00-70.00 I would say you could have saved a bunch if you and/or a friend made the repairs...it ain't that hard to do.

I got a quote from a shop for replacing brakes and rotors on my Jeep Liberty. 950.00 parts and labor. I went online and ordered everything I need and did the whole job for 300.00...took maybe 2 hours.

I won't deny that people can do work for cheaper than at a repair station. You can do anything cheaper when you buy things online. The problem I see here is this. If you have 1 car and only 1 car, you can't affort to wait 2 days (at best) for this part to come in. If you have a job, you need to be at work. It's not a viable excuse to miss work because you have to wait a week for your part to arrive. That is where repair stations come into play. We (as an industry) provide speedy and professional service, of course there is a cost to that.

If you are a good do it yourselfer, don't have an immediate need for the car you are repairing, and don't mind performing the repair again if you make a mistake or get a defective part, it's a good idea to fix your cars yourselves. You will end up saving a bunch of money. Otherwise, you should take your car to the professionals.

As far as brakes. I wouldn't skimp on the price. I would buy original equipment (if Japanese or European) or top quality ceramic (if American). You'll save yourself a lot of embarrasment when your brakes start squeaking for no apparent reason.

I meant the plugs just loosen up on occasion. I hear tapping and then pop, plugs out. It happened on my old Ford as well.

I've never seen this happen. I'll ask around up at work, but as I recall, I don't remember this ever happening. Has to be damn annoying though.

UPDATE:

I haven't seen this happen, or so I can recall. I asked one of my technicians about this yesterday. This has been known to happen on the Ford F Series trucks with the 4.6L (I believe). The plugs blow out, taking the threads with them. Apparently this happens so much, they make a repair kit for it. Basically at heli coil kit, just as you described.

Just figured I'd give you an update since I had asked around.

Alright so I just noticed one of the front "side" lights is out in my Jeep. How do I go about replacing that? I didn't see any screws and if I got a mechanic to replace the bulb for me how much would it cost? I have to take my Jeep in soon to get the hood cable fixed anyway, but I'm thinking I can do the side light by myself. How much does a light cost?

What year and model of Jeep is it? I don't you recall you ever saying. Knowing you have a hood release cable problem, I would figure it's a Cherokee or Grand Cherokee. If so, what year is it?

Sometimes you have to access the bulb from under the vehicle. Sometimes there is a "torx" screw holding the lense in in between the headlight and side marker light. Elaborate a little more and I may be able to help you. Bulbs are usually very simple to replace.

At my shop, we don't charge to replace bulbs... unless you own the notorious New Beetle. Those headlight bulbs are the hugest pain in the ass to replace. Only in Germany could they design a car so hard to replace a headlight bulb.

It worked from the start. I think I remember it being a little bumpy the first few insertions so you may be onto something. WD-40 didn't work so I guess I start investigating a replacement. :mad:

Ignition locks aren't terribly expensive or too hard to replace either. I would imagine it would cost you somewhere between $200-300 depending on what kind of car you own.

Sometimes you'll have to use a different key for the ignition than the one for the doors if they can't get the ignition key to match the door key.

Good luck though, it shouldn't be super painfull.

How do you define quality? The Germans have known for years, "quality" is in the eye of the beholder. That explains how they can export pieces of **** that American consumers fawn over because they're stylish and the fit and finish is nice... and they handle well and have great drivetrains. Only a German Car owner will rant and rave about how great their car is even though it is constantly in the shop.

Now that is something I can agree with.

There is nothing wrong with the new Fords guys.

Now your opinion might not be high of them, but don't pretend like they're inferior quality.

I've said it before on the boards, and feel free to take it with a grain of salt, but my Father in law manages a large automation consulting firm - they basically design the equipment that makes things. Most of their business is within the automotive industry. Nobody in the company will touch a GM, fwiw. Of course, most of them drive imports, including my father in law :laugh: :doh:

I drive a GM for my company car. Quite frankly, it's a big piece of ****. It doesn't even have 60k on it yet and I can't wait to get rid of it. So opinions are like *******s, we all have them

...

There is certainly something wrong with Fords. There is also something wrong with GM, Chrysler, Toyota and every other brand of car ever made. Every car has it's problems. From my prespective, Ford has a fairly high failure rate when compaired with other manufacturers. I see my fair share of failures on GM's, Hondas and Toyotas as well but I think Ford ekes them out slightly.

As far as GM, their cars (and by that I mean just that, "cars") are junk. They are about as good of quality as a Ford car or Chrysler car. Their trucks are very well made though, and by trucks I mean full size pickup trucks. I hold a Chevy pickup truck in much higher regard than a Ford or a Dodge.

In reality though, cars are only as reliable as the people who drive and maintain them. That's the god honest truth. You can get a Kia to last to 200K if you take care of it properly and you can run down a Honda in under 100K if you treat it like your red-headed step child.

And that, my friend is my *******... I mean opinion.

Also, your father in law is a good man. I drive a Honda myself. Sorry I don't support the US economy with my choice in car. If the US automakers could produce what, in my *******, is a good car, then I would feel compelled to stimulate the US economy. I've owned 2 Chevys and a Dodge so far in my lifetime, those were enough for me to say Japanese is the way to go.

But alas, this is a digression of the intended purpose of this thread. I shouldn't be here to give opinions, just the facts.

I agree with you on the Chevy thing.

I always carry a spare coil and the tools to fix it. All but 2 of them take less than 5 minutes and the other two are under the fuel rail.

Thanks for the tips SS.

You're welcome.

I find it histerically funny that you carry a spare coil and the tools to replace it, with you at all times. You know what it truly means to be a Ford owner.:laugh:

Boy do I feel like an ass. Not loc tight, anti seize. I wouldn't loc tight my plugs in.:doh:

I kinda figured that's what you meant.

I only had to do one Heli Coil and Snappy makes a tool for $600 that makes it a breeze. I then sold it to my old boss for $400 and can use it when needed.

I meant the plugs just loosen up on occasion. I hear tapping and then pop, plugs out. It happened on my old Ford as well.

I've never seen this happen. I'll ask around up at work, but as I recall, I don't remember this ever happening. Has to be damn annoying though.

As far as the advice on the coils. I knew it. That is what everybody says, I was just hoping there might be a way around it to prevent it from happening again.

I can't stand the new Fords.

As I understand it, it's not the moisture that causes the coils to fail, it's the heat from the coils internally. That's why the coils always look a little bit burnt if you look at the silocone (or whatever that material is on the tops of them). I haven't had any problems when replacing them with aftermarket ones, so that would be my suggestion.

I can't stand new Fords either, but that goes for many makes of cars. They all have their problems, some makes are much more problematic than others though. Ford seems to be in that "much more problematic" category. As far as trucks go, I think GM is heads and shoulders above everyone else when it comes to quality of trucks.

Yeah the cable isn't working so I do believe I have to take it in to get it completely fixed now.

Most likely. Good luck too you.

Appreciate it. Damn that sucks, I thought it would be around 100 at the most. Oh well. What if I wanted just an oil change, could they somehow find a way to get it open without charging me?

Is the handle for the hood release broken?

If that is the case, you can usually use a pair of pliers to pull the cable and release the hood. Doing that, you shouldn't have too much problems accessing the hood.

If there is some other problem with the cable, where you pull the release and the hood doesn't open at all, you'll probably have no other choice. It can be a huge pain in the neck to open the hood if the release in the interior isn't working. A little more than a light service technician can handle and certainly something that takes a deal of time.

Hope that helps you a little.

I ended up taking mine to Ford. I couldn't even get the ****ing wires off. them :mad:

Never seen anything like it before. Seriously, pulling as hard as you can, the wire wouldn't even budge

I've certainly seen stuff like that before. Busted up my hands real nice getting wires off too. Sometimes wires will break when replacing the spark plugs as you pull the wires off.