BMagic

You can sense the aura/it factor in how he moves. That type of confidence can spread throughout the team.

I'll trust GMAP for sure on fifth round defenders. Dre Greenlaw and Deommodore Lenoir.

Some good on Daniels

I want to find this person's house and egg it immediately!!!

2 hours ago, Dah-Dee said:

Wait, who's that kid scambling to extend and throw, and throwing over the middle?

 

 

One of my main gripes was not seeing him extend plays to pass rather than running terribly often. If he does this consistently in the NFL, then he'd be a total nightmare to defend and I'd totally understand picking him!

1 minute ago, Dah-Dee said:

Todd McShay has an announcement:

 

 

The Maye archetype is the one that scouts seem to miss on often. Sometimes it's Drew Lock, Paxton Lynch, Sam Darnold. Other times it's Josh Allen, Justin Herbert. Most of these guys would have easily placed Tua ahead of Herbert. None of them would in a redraft today. Maye played multiple sports growing up and is a natural athlete. Just need to coach him on some mechanical issues, but there are enough flashes to see he can get there if he's truly dedicated to the craft. The arm talent is undeniable and he rarely looked to the sidelines for pre-snap adjustments, showing he was responsible for most of the operation. That UNC team had no business winning 8 games.

If we take Daniels and pass on Maye, I can live with it. However, it we pass up on Maye and he ends up on the Giants then that's the worst possible scenario imo, especially with Daboll being there and him being the one to help unlock Josh Allen. Maye's flaws are ones we've seen be corrected with time and coaching. The upside is easily apparent. I'd much rather he end up on the Vikings or Patriots if he isn't here.

19 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

He was projected to go inside the top 5 before his final season. 

Lamar was 27th in QBR as an 18 year old. I don't think you want to be reminded what Daniels was.

Lamar was 4th in QBR as a 19 year old.

Lamar was 4th in QBR as a 20 year old.

 

The reason for why he dropped eludes me. I had thought he'd fallen off his final year, but now looking at the #'s, he did not (though the traditional rating system shows him dropping from 148 to 146 from '16 to '17).

 

Daniels simply wasn't in his universe as a prospect except in terms of accuracy which of course matters but even there, Daniels in complete college seasons in '19, and '21 and '22 was nowhere remotely close to Lamar. Lamar was uniformly far better with far less talent, at a far younger age: see Daniels QBR with better talent at age 18 was 55th compared to Lamar at 27th, Lamar at 19 and 20 finished 4th both seasons, compare that to Daniels at age 20 and 21 finishing 41st and 18th.  I think the reasons Lamar didn't go high in '18 are probably connected to accuracy (#'s were low for a modern QB), connected to RGIII paranoia, and the reality that since RGIII, only Wilson had thrived as a dual threat QB, we only see the league fall in love with dual threat guys after Mahomes, Josh Allen and Lamar all do what they did in '18, and then are followed by Kyler succeeding as well in '19...you get Danny Nickels in the same class in '19, then more dual threat attraction in '21, and '23. The WR nonsense also makes me wonder about lingering racial stupidity as they did the same thing w/Terrell Pryor, and let Wilson fall behind guys like Brock Lobster, Foles, Weeden etc....I don't know if its race, or just the lack of hit rates with dual threat guys unless they were God Mode Vick etc. Not sure what it was, but the NFL clearly was clueless with him, and there was little justifiable reason other than the lack of successful comps at the time, and perhaps that his accuracy wasn't ideal (but again, Josh Allen's accuracy was far worse and in a much worse conference so that doesn't pass the smell test).

 

Daniels profile as a prospect is worse, period, than Lamar's, I think the key component in why Daniels is going where he'll go is in the trailblazing that was done by Mahomes, Allen, Lamar, and Kyler a half decade ago, otherwise, Daniels is probably projected exactly where he was throughout '21-'23 (until say October of last fall), late day 2 to day 3. 

People are making up a guy when discussing Daniels in comparison to Lamar Jackson. Jayden has some similar traits, but the NFL whiffed completely on Lamar as a prospect. Lamar was more even more eletric as a runner and had a higher ADOT as a passer.

19 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I was on the fence, now I know what to do...

 

 

 

Parody thread but funny

 

 

 

Says the known Giants stan 😂

Getting slight flashbacks of the Ben Johnson situation with how Jayden's agent is going about this.

3 minutes ago, Dah-Dee said:

 

 

Or.....

 

Last man standing has the chops to help ressurect this franchise!

I'd like to know how they define BTT%. He's already doing special things with shoddy mechanics. They really need to assess what parts of his game he's been tweaking during his visit to Ashburn.

Maye's wins above replacement is something they should consider as well. It's about not only having a solid QB on a rookie deal, but doing the best they can to ensure they guy they draft is worth his second contact when he will have to shoulder more of the load on his shoulders. UNC likely wins 2-3 games all season with a lesser talent at QB.

8 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

But if Maye isn't the pick.  Studying Harris, Peters, Quinn, i think zero shot that they would take the inferior prospect in their minds to win this season.

Definitely agree here. The NBA forced Harris to get rid of Sam Hinkie during "The Process" even though Hinkie cracked the code. Stack up draft picks to get multiple bites at the apple. He was just too brazen in how he went about the strategy. Sam Presti has done the same thing for years and no one came for his head. Now, OKC has a young contender again after losing the KD/Harden/Westbrook core.

Bottom line is Harris has shown he will sacrifice short term fools gold for a sustainable contender.

12 minutes ago, WashingtonRedWolves said:

Having an infrastructure like the bengals or eagles sounds good to me 🤷🏻‍♂️

It can work great when the QB is in their Rookie deal. When it comes time to pay them, they end up losing a Tyreek Hill or a Tee Higgins and other valuable pieces. Then, more of the load is on that QB's plate. Mahomes could handle it since he still had Kelce. I'm interested to see how Josh Allen does without Diggs and at least Burrow will still have Chase. 

40 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

 

The whole reason to draft Jayden over Maye is to try and reproduce his offense from last season.  You want the guy who can gash teams for playing man coverage against him.  But in order to do that, you need speed and elite outside weapons.  You need guys who torch zone and force super soft man coverage carried deep.  You want weapons that will force a DB to cover with his back turned to the LoS for 8 seconds on the play clock.  You want to run vertical offense and you do not want your flats to constantly be occupied because you want them cleared out for Jayden to run through.  Guys like Corley are not a good fit with a Jayden Daniels offense.

 

You also definitely need to load up your pass pro in order for him to even opt to throw shallow crossers.  He waits forever to pull the trigger on these things.

 

This is why I don't think people are acknowledging just how limited a Jayden Daniels offense really is.  It's high maintenance, there are big parts of the field you're barely going to use in the passing game, and it's going to get easy to defend come playoff time.

I've said the same. Daniels can throw the slot fade all day long. They'd have to build an infrastructure like the Bengals and Eagles for it to work. Brown/Smith and Chase/Higgins type big bodies who can destroy man coverage. To be fair, both of those teams have been in recent SuperBowls even though they both came a tad short of winning it.

Kingsbury doesn't run an anticipatory passing system and his offenses always tailed off after blazing starts. I also wouldn't draft to fit a coordinator's scheme. Different story if it's a head coach who'd be around for the long haul.

Gets into the difficulty of projecting Maye in the NFL, the Josh Allen comparisons and Daniels field processing progress using virtual reality.

I see Maye as more in the Allen/Herbert/Big Ben vein more than I do the Drew Lock/Paxton Lynch/Mac Jones vein since he can throw so much better off-platform than those guys.

I'm a big basketball guy. LOVED the Wizards picking Bilal Coulibaly because the metrics/tools and defensive tape were just off the charts, even though he didn't have great experience. Will Dawkins said he was a "99th percentile athlete" and I knew right then and there the Wizards finally had the correct brain-trust in the building. 

Hated the Johnny Davis pick and was super high on Jalen Williams for the same reason as I was Bilal when looking at his metrics/tape. Presti in OKC felt the same and snagged him. He went to Santa Clara, so I doubt Tommy Sheppard scouted him at all. Johnny Davis went to a Big Ten school (Wisconsin) and averaged 20 a game, but when I watched him, he scored on a steady diet of contested mid-range 2s which is hard to come by in the NBA with his lack of size and athleticism. Tommy whiffed on that pick hard.

I really wanted to know Daniels' 40 time at a new weight because running is a huge part of his game. Right now, I'm comparing his throwing style to Johnny Davis shooting contested mid-range 2s in basketball. A diet of throws outside the numbers is supremely hard to live by in the NFL. IMO, this is why Justin Fields' career has been so inconsistent. When I see Daniels throwing in the middle of the field, his target is wide open.

Not saying he doesn't have the ability to throw in those tight MOF windows. The interviews are very important here because Kelly may have told him that if Nabers/Thomas Jr. didn't have the DB beat, then his next thought should be to look for a running lane to get us some yards. He's just going to have to throw to the MOF more often to be a prominent starter in the league.

55 minutes ago, illone said:

 

Makes me wish I had access to the “ncaa all-22”. It’s very tough to obtain. 
 

QB school gets some clicks but you’re exactly right especially when it comes to main stream media. 

Caddy's Cutups is a great resource, but it's on Patreon and full game tapes aren't free.

https://www.patreon.com/CaddysCutups

11 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Rosen sucked and sucked hard. It was obvious to move on from him when they ended up with the #1 pick with Murray being available. He gets no real credit for that.

I agree. The Commanders had the chance to move on from Haskins to take Tua/Herbert and didn’t pull the trigger. Few understand the law of diminishing returns. The Bears should have gotten out of the Justin Fields business in the Stroud/Young/Richardson class, if not earlier, and are very and I mean very fortunate to be in the position to pick Caleb Williams. For Kliff to walk into a new situation and convince them to move on from the dude they just took in the very last draft still took some stones.

1 hour ago, Blanka said:

Interesting that the basketball analogy was brought up because through this whole cycle the Maye pre draft talk reminds me so much of Anthony Edwards coming out. For AE the percentages from the field were nothing special 40% & 29% from three but you pick any game and at least a couple times a game he’d do something that only a handful of guys in decades could do. You’d see that every shot was super contested due to teams playing off the others giving him all the attention. Drake gets knocked for completion percentage but then you watch and see drops and poor separation from pass catchers, poor line play.
 

Both were big time recruits who stayed home at lesser schools. Drake was originally an Alabama commit that flipped to UNC. Edwards was thought to be Kentucky’s to lose before staying home to play for UGA. UGA in basketball is worse than UNC in football but Drake’s 23 season and Ant’s one and done season were one and the same. The supporting cast just made everything tougher. Even the pre draft process he alongside LaMelo was seen as the most risky to be a bust. This was head scratching to me because AE was SO easy to see coming when taking everything into context. Like Maye is to me.

 

AE developed somewhat of a hitch in his jumpshot as the one and done season progressed which clearly came from poor coaching on UGA staff. Early in that season there was no hitch and by midseason of his rookie season the hitch was gone. Similar to Drake’s footwork becoming more sloppy under Lindsey’s tutelage.
 

AE was said to not be a winner because they didn’t make the tourney and it’s like the team he played on didn’t matter to pundits. As is the talk with Drake with this year’s team. Now the Wolves are one of the best teams in the tough Western Conference with him leading the way at 22. This feels like football deja vu. If the downtrodden Wolves didn’t overthink it hopefully we don’t either. 

I remember that draft! I had both LaMelo and AE rated as star players after they developed. AE was a freak athlete and I remember people questioning his love for basketball, but dude is as intense a competitor as it gets. Projecting is really hard even for the best of the best GMs. I still think about what if Josh Harris' very own 76ers had drafted Jayson Tatum instead of Markelle Fultz to pair with Embiid.

I'm more calm in this situation because Kingsbury had the eye to convince Mahomes to come to Texas Tech and to quickly jettison Josh Rosen in favor of Kyler Murray. Kyler hasn't been a slam dunk, but the traits were there and it seems to be because of his work ethic regarding studying his playbook more than him just outright not having "IT" Kingsbury seems to have an eye for the traits to look for in a prospect and will help Peters, whom I sure has an eye for the traits as well since the 49ers ended up taking Purdy. He even admits in a redraft, he'd take Purdy a lot earlier of course.

At first I dismissed the Cowherd report that they'd pick Daniels, but now that I think about it, I vaguely remember him saying Kingsbury to DC a few days before the national circuit got it. If that's the case, he may be plugged in to folks around Kingsbury.

22 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

 

What gets me is they're just wrong about Daniels's processing.  They push that bull**** narrative about some magic VR machine teaching him how to read a defense and that's why he could finally make plays in his fifth year as a starter, and nevermind the fact that he's playing for a great coach now and had clean pockets to throw to a bunch of elite receivers where the reads were easy and he had all day to make them.

 

One of the scouts even recognizes the parallel to Fields, but doesn't seem to recognize that Fields was a bust, and that building an NFL offense around his running ability didn't work.

 

And then the big justification for Daniels over Maye is because he'll be ready to play year one?  The kid who took five years of college ball for the lightbulb to come on is a better bet to play well in year one than the kid who was one of the best players in the country his first year as a starter?

 

It's so dumb that it literally makes me angry that these morons have the jobs that they do.

Projection is the toughest part of it all. Some focus on where the prospect is today when scouting is really about gauging the ceiling of the player and how likely the player is to reach it if you can surround him with the proper infrastructure.

I'm glad both guys are coming to the facility next week, so the staff can pick their brains to see how they analyze film and gauge their habits in relation to the mental aspect of the craft. Take them to dinner and see what type of food they prefer. That's a small factor, but all the nuances matter. Brady famously ate a super clean diet especially later in his career, yet it's hard to expect a 21-25 year old to be that advanced in that area.

Some super toolsy guys bust because they don't put in the time to hone their craft once they get the money and lifestyle. NIL is actually great for seeing how players respond to having endorsements and cash flowing in. That said, I don't have those types of concerns with either Maye or Daniels.

16 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

No doubt, but there is something sneaky about that twitter. They reported Maye's Pats top 30 visit before anyone else too. I think they have some kind of connect with a UNC insider.

I wonder that as well because they also reported GMAP had been to UNC on multiple occasions in his AGM capacity with the 49ers. No way they were sending an Assistant GM to UNC to gather intel on the LB core there. If they end up being right and GMAP ends up selecting Maye, then that could mean he took this job knowing what he was going to do at 2 all along. I'd be surprised if he didn't have a preference when he took the job regardless, but the scouts and Eugene Shen have surely presented new data points in the interim.

A new Daniels breakdown:

17 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

 

Arizona is fun because they've got the capital and are not too far back to miss a QB, but there's no reason for them to go from #4 to #2 because they're likely to have their pick of WR regardless by just staying at #4.

That's why I was relieved when Arizona upset the Eagles. If they were in the 2 or 3 slot and the Commanders were at 4, the Commanders would have had to outbid other teams who want Maye/Daniels because Arizona would likely be happy with MHJr., Nabers, or Odunze and extra draft capital. They are now likely to stay at 4 and take MHJr.