pcbothwel

Dont worry guys. Ignore all the precedent about his frame and age. He's just a late bloomer like Hendon Hooker, Pickett, Stetson Bennett, Weeden, Weinke, Joey Harrington, Jason Campbell, Akili Smith, and Ryan Tannehill...

HTTR

4 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Seattle after Penix says a lot. 
 

Teams think these ‘lower tier/mediocre’ prospects are worth a shot. 

I think the age variable is huge. We have two 21 y/o (Maye & JJ) and three 23/24 y/o (JD, Penix, Daniels).

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

He has some Josh Allen in him thats for sure. But  a lot of that is he has to heroball because his team was trash and the only chance they had was him being super aggressive. Hes also a killer competitor(family of athletes) which I love but that attitude can get you in trouble.

 

Honestly that and his at times sloppy footwork are his only real red flags and both are easily correctable. remember hes only 21! 

 

Kid will be an all pro caliber QB no later than 2026. And hell still only be 23.

Couldn’t agree more.

The only glaring issue with him on tape is the sloppy/inconsistent footwork. 
He has the processing, arm, anticipation, size, athleticism, and personality to be a great QB.

7 minutes ago, Command The 414 said:

I saw this on FB, as Commanders fan would you be good w/this deal or a similar deal which would  involve trading up to get Williams? 
 

Personally I’m not for trading up, I’m sure throughout the league rumor mill and GM talk that the pulse of the Bears is widely known what their plans are, to trade Fields or stick with him

This is getting ridiculous. After what just happened last year with the Panthers, no team in their right mind in the top 5 can trade their pick this year, plus a 1st, plus more. #2, #36, 2025 conditional 3rd. If the Bears want Daniels/Maye, we are their only chance...If they want to go with Fields, then we should bow out because another team in the 4-10 range can give them a haul.

17 minutes ago, alaroche04 said:

Hmmmmms sounds familiar....

Dont care what platitudes people use.

Im sure people thought McVay or Mike McDaniel could be another Josh McDaniels or Kliff Kingsbury because of them being "Young, offensive geniuses." 

Quinn is not Rivera. You are hearing from local and national reporters that coaches, player, and FO personnel from around the league texted them with how highly they think of Quinn as a smart, driven football coach that can communicate a vision and execute on Sundays.

These responses are laughable with no self-awareness.

Quinn is known as a team/culture builder for a team looking to rebuild. MAYBE he has a ceiling once you get in the playoffs.

But where do you think this team is at right now?!? Hint F'n Hint... we have the 2nd pick in the draft for a reason. 

20 hours ago, CapsSkins said:

 

Listen I think that stuff is cringe, too, but the league is now majority Gen Z. Players these days are a different breed... they've grown up watching ESPN cover player outfits walking into the stadium. All they know is the free agency era, or as Gen Z would say, "standing on business". I don't think these behaviors will put off contemporary locker rooms the way it might come off to old heads like us as odd lol. 

Im not "Old". I just turned 37, and many of my friends are 31-36. And if a player wants to paint his nails and say cringy slang, fine...BUT NOT THE F'n QB. Save it for a WR/CB...

Stroud, Richardson, Howell, Lawrence, Burrow, Herbert... All of these guys are Calebs peers and dont act like that.

I see much more Cam Newton in Caleb, and we've seen how that worked out. Won 12 games twice over 11 years and had a losing record in 8/11 years.

Again, I am not saying he will completely wash out, but if Caleb has a Newton type career (And please dont pin your hopes on one miraculous 15-1 year), then that would be a bust for how highly he is being touted.

I would probably rank Maye as QB1, but I dont LOVE him as a prospect. Daniels is great, but when you look deeper there are some concerns about the parts being greater than the Sum.

I.e. Daniels has a good arm, quick release, and amazing deep ball accuracy, but only with a clean pocket. His accuracy falls off pretty bad and he really doesnt drive the ball well.

His running ability is 2nd to only Lamar, but his frame is TERRIBLE, and he takes big hits. Also, his ability to throw on the run is very underwhelming.

Im not saying Caleb WILL bust, but there are a couple things that are highly concerning to me:

- His flashes on the field are phenomenal, but he his performance against top teams is awful

- He sits out the Bowl game, and his backup lights up the favored Louisville with 330 yards, 6 TDs, and only 1 pick. Hmmmm

- He seems a bit causal/too cool in his interviews and does weird Gen Z stuff like paints his nails a bunch of colors. Sorry, but your franchise guy/leader should be a bit more professional.

- Along with the above, He seems very RG3/brand centric type guy. Other players "going to war" on the field will resent that attitude and loose play style.

- His dad floating ideas about getting equity in the franchise also goes with the previous points.

Again, there are on the field stuff (playing within structure, accuracy/consistency, etc.)... But I try to find the obscure details, especially with QB's, as this alludes to future success/failure.

Dont be shocked if this happens...

The Wizards were very much viewed as a bottom rung franchise.

They then proceeded to get the brightest "Big Picture" Ops guy in Winger, AND the brightest young GM in Dawkins, AND one of the best scout/personnel guys in Travis Schlenk...

We could see a trio here of Ops (Peters: Big picture/Org/Stadium/etc), GM (Cunningham: Team structure/contracts/trades/etc), and Scout/Personnel (Mayhew?).

Harris is going to go big and set up a REAL organization here...watch.

4 hours ago, KDawg said:

Now this brings me to my next point (I think Maye and Williams have a few very negative traits, but mostly really good prospects... Maye disappears in big moments, Williams accuracy can be erratic at times and throws a lot of high percentage passes).

 

But that's not the point. Assuming those two aren't on the board, and they are actually who I believe the two best prospects are at this juncture... Jayden Daniels is the next hurdle. Is he the next guy? Is he a franchise caliber guy? And why?

 

 

He has been just okay throughout his collegiate career. His low turnover numbers are high quality and consistent aside from one season. I think that is something that translates a bit so that's a major positive. He has a good arm and he is a hell of an athlete. Good height. He is 205, despite the rail thin lean look, so he's not small. 

 

He has a ton of time in the pocket at LSU and his running style will not translate. He takes too many hits and his build doesn't suggest that is a great strategy for him moving forward. But that escapability will be used and coveted at the next level. 

 

He has certainly improved his ability to read a defense and get the ball out. But again, his frame isn't a great frame for NFL purposes. But it's not awful. He needs to change the way he plays a bit. He needs to get the ball out faster.

 

He is a + athlete, + arm, + escapability, - time to throw, - run decisions and a middle of the road field reader.

 

Sounds a lot like Sam Howell, though I think Daniels has the athleticism edge and the "size" edge RE: height.

 

I think Howell has a better arm and NFL frame.

 

So then, in my eyes, the question is: Is Daniels a big enough upgrade over Howell to take at 4/5/6?

 

I'd say no.

 

Is Daniels a big enough upgrade to take over Howell in the second round? I'd say probably at that point. 

 

If we were picking in the 10-15 slot I'd certainly have more to think about as well.

 

But as it stands, I don't think he is a good enough prospect to take over Harrison Jr, Alt, Fashanu, Verse, Kool Aid, etc.

 

And I wouldn't take the latter two over Fashanu or Alt and I'd have to think long and hard about taking Harrison over them, though I think I would.

 

That's where I am. 

Thanks for bringing up the Daniels vs Howell Comp... While I agree about projecting tools, can we all step back for a second.

Daniels is 3 months younger than Howell. 

Can you imagine the production Sam Howell today would put up at his age today with the LSU supporting cast?!?

I think the FO is setting up a number of moves that require upfront cash (SB) and need to hold off until a new owner is in place. 
Fuller and Samuel are two guys that we should restructure, but will require up front cash to do so.

1) Cut Norwell

2) Restructure guys in their prime (26-28) by giving them signing bonus and extending 1-2 years. Fuller, Samuel. 
3) Keep needed expiring Vets with injury history. Roullier, Thomas. 
4) Extend guys on rookie contracts. Curl, Sweat. 

Simms had him as the #1 safety in the draft and 2nd beat nickel. 

4 minutes ago, RWJ said:

Big mistake to let Sweat go.  I'd let Young go before Sweat.  Look at the stats.  Just me though. 

Dont disagee. But we sometimes forget how young Chase is. He is 2.5 years younger than Sweat. Its the same difference as Daron Payne and Jahan Dotson.

LOLOL... that last question about what he is prioritizing next. I.E. Money, location, team, etc.

His answer: "I cant say too much right now. I'm just trying to get my stuff and get gone."

Translation: Get me the hell out of here. 

I know people referenced Chris Collinsworth with PFF stating that Dotson "Will catch 100 balls in this league"... but I actually think the full quote is more telling.

Skip to 19:00 ....

"I think jahan dotson is one of the smartest receivers that i've seen in a while...He gets what the quarterback is seeing and how they get into the holes and and make easy throws hot reads he gets his head around"

So lets recap a bit from 30k feet.

If you give me a player in any professional league that has a bunch of good, but not elite traits across the board. But the thing he is elite at are

1) The most important/fundamental skill for that position/sport (For WR its Hands)

2) In game IQ/play speed/spatial awareness.

I have to bet on him. We will desperately need a do-it-all WR in 2023 when Terrys extension kicks in and Samuels is undoubtedly cut with his cap hit.

Quite frankly, I dont care how Haden "Views" himself. Here are a list of FA CB's over the last 2-3 years.

2022:

Casey Hayward (33) - 2/11M

Patrick Peterson (32) - 1/4M

2021:

Janoris Jenkins (32) - 2/15M

Xavier Rhodes (31) - 1/5M

Patrick Peterson (32) - 1/8M

Haden is very much in the 1-2 year at 5-6M range, so he may jeopardize our Comp pick for Settle (~7th?), but dont really care so long as we keep the 3rd.

2 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

McLaurin will be extended sometime in July.

Love Terry, but to play devils advocate, what is the contractual precedent for him?

I.E. If we go the Cousins route and elect to just let him play out 2022 & then 2023 under the Franchise tag, what contract can a 29 y/o WR without a single 1200 season expect?

Even if he puts up ~2400-2500 yards & ~12 TDs over the next two years... I still dont see the big money contract that has EVER worked out for the team.

I see people pointing to DJ Moore, but he is entering his 5th year at age 25, where Terry is entering year 4 at age 27 with almost identical stats and poor QB play. Allen Robinson as well.

To me, If Terry wants anything more than 4/80M, then Im having serious discussions about moving him for a 1st + mid round picks.

6 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Yeah. I like Hamilton A LOT. He is probably the safest player in this draft. But he isnt Sean Taylor. He doesnt hit like Sean did. But I dont know how much of that is due to changes in the game itself as far as hitting goes. Their pre draft workout stats are pretty damn similar though. And Hamilton is bigger than Sean was as well. 

ST was 1 of 1. The size, speed, and physicality are generational and come around every decade... However, Sean's IQ/Spatial awareness were also elite and that's what put him over the top.

The guy went from best hybrid/box safety in the league in year 2/3, to the best Centerfielder in the league (Though Ed Reed could be argued) by year 4. It would be like Lamar Jackson deciding to play like Joe Burrow and being the best QB in the league. Almost unimaginable.

5 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

If Mathieu was still under contract with KC, would you happily trade away a 2023 third rounder to get him.

 

Thank you. Throwing away a 3rd plus a huge contract to a safety that isnt generational is pure idiocy. In fact, at least if we traded a 3rd for him we would expect the Chiefs to eat the Signing bonus and therefore get him a reduced rate in terms of cap hit.

8 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

PFF cap guy just on.   He said of course you can create cap room by basically borrowing from the future.

 

But also said this isn't how Rivera's staff have liked to roll.  They typically have a pay as you go approach -- meaning they don't adopt the Cerrato future is now approach with the cap so he implied this could be interesting to see what they do. 

Agreed. I dont know why people think contracts dont really matter and their is no such thing as "Cap Hell". The truth is the salary cap has increased 8-10% YoY for the last 20+ years and so you can borrow a $1.00 today in exchange for $1.10 tomorrow because of this certitude. This doesn't mean that these contracts and guarantees are not real, but that the future value/penalty DOES NOT outpace the growth in Revenue/Salary Cap.

2 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

This used to be us.  For a decade.  It hasn't really been true for a decade, but people still think it's true.

 

It's nice to see another team draw this fire for once.

True, but I think Jax is doing the right thing, at least in theory. If you are going to sign a big FA, then go all in an sign a couple. If you have a big FA leaving (I.E. Scherff), then dont cancel out your comp pick by signing a FA.

1 minute ago, FLSkinz83 said:

I think signing Settle and trading Payne or Iaonnidis might make sense.

Easy. Sign/extend both Settle and Payne. Move Iaonnidis for a pick and call it a day.

I have a funny feeling that we are going to screw ourselves out of the Scherff Comp pick. I know we need to compete now with a QB, but throwing away 3rd/4th round picks are NOT how you do it.

Wow. So wentz, nor anyone affiliated with the NFL, can come out and speak about this, or other trades, until Wednesday. So Wentz tries to give a 30k ft answer to stay above the details.... He speaks about his life journey shifting extremely fast and coming to grips with it. Seems honest and vulnerable. @pcbothwel (mod edit religious content--no ban but read rule 6---report inappropriate content per rule, do not extend the original rule violation by adding to it---no ban)

16 minutes ago, 50yrSKINSfan said:

Hi all. Can someone please explain to me what cutting Collins will cost us? Thanks.

It doesnt 'cost' us anything. He we due to be paid 16M and still had 9.6M of his initial SB outstanding to be accounted for. So as a matter of cash flow, Snyder will save the 16M. For cap purposes, we have the outstanding bonus of 9.6M to account for. So We save a net 6.4M against the cap vs paying him 16M.

2 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Wentz at the minute is on a borderline top 10 QB contract. Behind him you have a couple of players due big money deals this offseason plus half a dozen excellent QBs still on rookie deals. 
 

To me, it’s a wash. He’s effectively on a mid tier veteran QB deal. The best will all soon be on 40mi plus per year and the Trubiskys of this world will soon be on 10-12mil per year.

 

We have an out after one season. To get a true starting quality QB, which he is, the contract is reasonable enough to me.

Well said.

A couple things about Wentz/trade that people need to realize in the financials/draft picks:

1) Because of the drastic difference in compensation compared to other positions, overpaying on a 1 year deal for a FA QB would offset the potential 3rd we will receive for losing Scherff. That needs to be included in any trade calculation. 

2) While Wentz is paid a salary commensurate with his productivity (10-15th ranked QB in production and salary), his contract structure allows us to the ability to A) Retain him if he delivers; and/or B.) restructure his deal with a signing bonus to lower his cap hit. Flexibility has to have a premium.

In regards to his ability/production/etc. I have seen a few things that give better context to his Indy stint / Jim Irsay that give me hope:

1) Broken Foot: In his first few minutes of his first training camp practice, Wentz felt discomfort in his (Left) foot. The Indy Docs looked at it afterwards and found a small break that appears to be traced back to HS. Initially they estimated that he would miss the first month of the season and supposedly Irsay was PISSED. Thought this was something that should of been found/dealt with earlier.

Wentz did not miss ANY games last year, but Irsay was already a little pissed.

2) Vaccine: I dont want to turn this into a COVID discussion, but Wentz was hesitant to get the vaccine which obviously caused issues with the team. Say what you will, but with the benefit of hindsight it appears him, and many others, were right in their hesitancy to get a Vaccine without approval that did not appear to provide the protection many spouted off.

Once again, Irsay was pissed.

3) Sprained Ankles: In week 2 against the Rams, Wentz sprained both his ankles in the 4th when down by 3. While replay showed the sprains to be legit and violent (one ankle looked like it completely snapped/dislocated), it was said some people upstairs *Cough* Irsay.. were upset that Wentz didnt come back in to try and win the game on a final drive.

To me, much of the issue with Wentz appears to be hyperbolic, childish, spoiled, drug addict owner. Jim Irsay's father bought the Colts and provided his spoiled brat son anything he wanted. Jim Irsay was named VP and GM just 2 years after graduating SMU with a broadcast degree. Please re-read that sentence and try not to be sick about the nepotism.

Irsay was AWFUL a ran the team into the ground, resulting in the number 1 pick in the 1998 draft. Irsay, 37, became the youngest owner in football when his father had a stroke and his 1st year was given a 15 year run with Manning. At the end of that run he was gifted Luck until he got sick of it and just retired.

Again, I know there is plenty of smoke about Wentz, but if there is more petulant, unqualified owner in the entire league than Snyder... Its Irsay.

He was gifted Manning and Luck and thought he was 'Owed' success simply by sending a few picks to the Eagles. When that slipped away in week 17, he threw a fit and Ballard/Reich threw Wentz under the Bus to save their own jobs.