On a little rant...

[Aikmans Killer No.56]

I was discussing offseason moves with one of my friends tonight and a few things occurred to us.

First being...weren't there a lot of people in the preseason on this site (and in general) saying we were stacked at wide receiver? and now all of a sudden i see a bunch of posts where people are saying they want to draft mike williams or go after a receiver in free agency.

Coles is a Pro bowl receiver...he's got 87 catches going into the last game of the season. Awesome receiver. 50/50 is decent...yeah, he drops the easy catches, but that can be worked on. Look at what he did for us in the Dallas game. Remember when TO was coming up? he was the same way. It just takes work ethic. McCants is alright, so is Thrash, and Jacobs is decent too, they jut need more reps in practice and more game time. We're deep at receiver...we might not be Clark, Monk, and Sanders, but we're deep.

I also hear a lot on this website about Ramsey being the man, and a lot of people are concerned about his maturation. I also hear a lot of people saying that the reason Portis' yard per carry is down because of a weak offensive line. Yeah, Jansen will be back next year, but don't you think we could upgrade the line further? We're not as deep there as we could be. With a bolstered offensive line we'd give Ramsey more time to throw, resulting in more confidence, which is what he needs. We'd open up more gaps for Portis, give him more yards per carry, stretch the defense and give Ramsey a good environment to grow.

Our defense is awesome. I hear a lot of people saying we need a pass rushing DE, and I couldn't agree more. We'd wreck havoc in the backfield, and our defense would be complete.

I dunno, I know i'm going to get lambasted for saying this, but whatever. Point blank, I think we're spoiled fans. We're always looking to make the big splash every offseason, and look where it's gotten us. I think this year instead of doing that we need to give a fair assesment of what we really need. A DE and shoring up the O-line might not be the most glamourous moves, but I think its the right one. We don't need names anymore, we just need players.

[Aikmans Killer No.56]

Oh yeah.... :rant:

[Canadian Hog]

Look back at past Super Bowl winners. Practically all of them were strong up front on both sides of the line. Games are won and lost in the trenches and you are quite right when you say that both lines should be our top priority in the offseason.

[Aikmans Killer No.56]

Originally posted by Rejuvenated Canadian Hog

Look back at past Super Bowl winners. Practically all of them were strong up front on both sides of the line. Games are won and lost in the trenches and you are quite right when you say that both lines should be our top priority in the offseason.

Exactly my point. I'll be the first to admit, I loved the Sean Taylor pick this year, and watching him grow this season has been a blast. I'm going to get his jersey.

But as much as i like him...I'd take two Jon Jansens for one Sean Taylor....a second round pick with modest expectations who blossoms and turns into a great player.

[Taylor 36]

I agree. I think we do need to sure up the lines, and we would be in pretty good shape. We do have some free agents to sign, or we'll have to look for replacements there. But, over all, I think our lines are what should be upgraded this offseason.

[Skins4SB]

That's what Norv did this year in Oakland. He got Jake Grove and Rob Gallery via the draft and Ron Stone from FA. Then he got Ted Washington and Warren Sapp for the defensive front. I guess they are missing skill players..

[Fighting for old D.C.]

originally posted by Aikman's Killer No. 56

First being...weren't there a lot of people in the preseason on this site (and in general) saying we were stacked at wide receiver? and now all of a sudden i see a bunch of posts where people are saying they want to draft mike williams or go after a receiver in free agency.

I couldn't disagree more about our wide receiver situation. I think Laverneus is a good receiver but nothing great. I don't think you can describe him as a "Pro Bowl Receiver." Rod Gardner is just horrible. Another wasted draft pick. I sure hope we don't re-sign him. I think Darnerian McCants is great, but Joe Gibbs refuses to play him. Taylor Jacobs is a scrub, and James Thrash is washed up.

That leaves us with one good receiver for next year (assuming Gardner is not re-signed). I think Gibbs ought to consider acquiring a top-notch receiver that can replace Coles as the No. 1. This team desperately needs a playmaker and someone that can catch the ball downfield. Coles is too small to make plays downfield, he seems to only be good for routes over the middle where he can use his speed.

However, I think the best option would be to draft Mike Williams. He is huge for a WR and one of the best playmakers college football had seen in recent years. That would leave Coles as the No. 1 for next year, but just think about how good a combination of Williams and Coles could be in a few years if Williams fulfills his potential.

[TK]

Winning cures all.

[Aikmans Killer No.56]

Originally posted by FiercePierce

I couldn't disagree more about our wide receiver situation. I think Laverneus is a good receiver but nothing great. I don't think you can describe him as a "Pro Bowl Receiver." Rod Gardner is just horrible. Another wasted draft pick. I sure hope we don't re-sign him. I think Darnerian McCants is great, but Joe Gibbs refuses to play him. Taylor Jacobs is a scrub, and James Thrash is washed up.

That leaves us with one good receiver for next year (assuming Gardner is not re-signed). I think Gibbs ought to consider acquiring a top-notch receiver that can replace Coles as the No. 1. This team desperately needs a playmaker and someone that can catch the ball downfield. Coles is too small to make plays downfield, he seems to only be good for routes over the middle where he can use his speed.

However, I think the best option would be to draft Mike Williams. He is huge for a WR and one of the best playmakers college football had seen in recent years. That would leave Coles as the No. 1 for next year, but just think about how good a combination of Williams and Coles could be in a few years if Williams fulfills his potential.

How can i not describe Coles a Pro Bowl receiver when he's been to the Pro Bowl? :doh:

Gardner has the size, he just needs to concentrate better. He can get it done...remember the Dallas game and the catch of Ramseys bomb in the Giants game? He's made big plays for us, he just needs to work his ass off in the offseason and the preaseason.

[jtyler42]

Originally posted by FiercePierce

I couldn't disagree more about our wide receiver situation. I think Laverneus is a good receiver but nothing great. I don't think you can describe him as a "Pro Bowl Receiver." Rod Gardner is just horrible. Another wasted draft pick. I sure hope we don't re-sign him. I think Darnerian McCants is great, but Joe Gibbs refuses to play him. Taylor Jacobs is a scrub, and James Thrash is washed up.

That leaves us with one good receiver for next year (assuming Gardner is not re-signed). I think Gibbs ought to consider acquiring a top-notch receiver that can replace Coles as the No. 1. This team desperately needs a playmaker and someone that can catch the ball downfield. Coles is too small to make plays downfield, he seems to only be good for routes over the middle where he can use his speed.

However, I think the best option would be to draft Mike Williams. He is huge for a WR and one of the best playmakers college football had seen in recent years. That would leave Coles as the No. 1 for next year, but just think about how good a combination of Williams and Coles could be in a few years if Williams fulfills his potential.

This is my point exactly, we arent as deep as people think at WR to me all we have is Coles as far as a reliable Wr goes....Gardner is too inconsistent, McCants doesnt work hard enough in practice to get on the field, Jacobs I'm not sold on, and Thrash is solid but isnt the answer....

So I say draft Mike Williams and address the O-line in the draft and FA...

[BG]

I don't think that's a rant at all. You are right to be concerned about all of this. It's our team right dude?

Anyways, I thought that we'd be great at WR, but we are obviously not. We tried to fix it before SOS's year 2 by getting Coles and picking up Jacobs. Seemed to make a difference, but not much.

The Oline was supposed to have been fixed by the acquisition of Fiore, Thomas, Friedman and Dockery. We picked up Raymer, Jones and Brown and haven't gotten any better. I know Jansen is great, but I don't think he would have made enough of a difference to get us in the playoffs.

We were supposed to have been upgraded in the RB situations two years in a row now. I am 100% positive Portis has the tools to be a great back in this system, but the system will have to be changed for him. A guy like Duckett would have helped more to get the 3rd and shorts and punch it in at the goaline.

Our defense has just pulled a metamorphosis. I have no idea how to explain it other than great pick ups in the offseason, great coaching and great execution by the players.

So what I am getting at, and it looks like the same old offseason blame game, is much of this teams fault should lay on the scouting/personnell staff.

We aren't finding the right guys to match up with the coaches we bring in here.

[Aikmans Killer No.56]

I think if the Eagles were getting to NFC championship games with Thrash, Freddie Mitchell and Pinky, we could do just as good in our passing game with Coles, Gardner, McCants/Thrash/Jacobs

[jtyler42]

Originally posted by Aikmans Killer No.56

I think if the Eagles were getting to NFC championship games with Thrash, Freddie Mitchell and Pinky, we could do just as good in our passing game with Coles, Gardner, McCants/Thrash/Jacobs

They run a different type of offense and look at the QB running it....I mean it is safe to say he is waaaaaay better than Ramsey...

[Skins4SB]

Not to mention he is a duel threat which has to be accounted for by the defense..

[Montilar]

The Oline was supposed to have been fixed by the acquisition of Fiore, Thomas, Friedman and Dockery. We picked up Raymer, Jones and Brown and haven't gotten any better.

Yea, and look at who you mentioned.

Consigliera (from the san fran area) flat out said Fiore was a bum pick-up when he was signed. He had an injury history BEFORE he came here. It was optimistic to expect it to go away....but they hoped it would and signed him.

Friedman was nothing but a cheaper "depth" signing. and proved to be just that a "depth" player. Heck G was his natural spot, not C, even being undersized like he is. Unfortunately no one was much better.

Raymer was used up and injury prone. He was a cheap signing.... One of those "hope and pray signings".

Kenyatta Jones and Brown were discards.... Jones proved he should of been left on the junk pile, and Brown was an decent emergency pick-up. But not good when playing out of position....

Of your list, only Thomas and Dockery had any true upside. Thomas went to the pro bowl last year, but with Raymer on one side and Brown on the other, he's going to look bad....

And Dockery is a 2cd year guy.... 2cd year, 2cd head coach, 2cd, line coach, 2cd offensive scheme..... he's improved as the years gone... the jury is still out. I'm not saying don't go get a guard to provide competition, but he's not a bust so far. fix the C and maybe he'll look better....

[Aikmans Killer No.56]

This is true, you are right (something a lot of people on this site don't know how to do...fess up when they've been proven wrong).

Gardner IS inconsistant, he just needs to work harder. He can get it done. He's had a 1000 yard season, gotten close to 80 catches. He's big, he's physical, he'll block downfield....He's made big catches.

Earlier this season I was listening to the radio when the Skins receivers were dropping balls all over the place. They had some old school coach in and he said something that stuck with me....Back in the day Lombardi would have a bunch of footballs with numbers on them, and he'd have the receivers shout the numbers back to him after catching the balls...they'd have to focus hard on the rotation, look the ball all the way in, etc...it sounds like JV football stuff, but its the basics and its what Gardner needs to do.

You can't argue with Lombardi's results.

[Skins4SB]

I agree that center is our first prioriety on the line. BTW, it's 2nd not 2cd..:doh:

[Aikmans Killer No.56]

Originally posted by Montilar

Yea, and look at who you mentioned.

Consigliera (from the san fran area) flat out said Fiore was a bum pick-up when he was signed. He had an injury history BEFORE he came here. It was optimistic to expect it to go away....but they hoped it would and signed him.

Friedman was nothing but a cheaper "depth" signing. and proved to be just that a "depth" player. Heck G was his natural spot, not C, even being undersized like he is. Unfortunately no one was much better.

Raymer was used up and injury prone. He was a cheap signing.... One of those "hope and pray signings".

Kenyatta Jones and Brown were discards.... Jones proved he should of been left on the junk pile, and Brown was an decent emergency pick-up. But not good when playing out of position....

Of your list, only Thomas and Dockery had any true upside. Thomas went to the pro bowl last year, but with Raymer on one side and Brown on the other, he's going to look bad....

And Dockery is a 2cd year guy.... 2cd year, 2cd head coach, 2cd, line coach, 2cd offensive scheme..... he's improved as the years gone... the jury is still out. I'm not saying don't go get a guard to provide competition, but he's not a bust so far. fix the C and maybe he'll look better....

If D-dock gets one more false start penalty this Sunday, I'll go insane.

[BG]

Originally posted by Montilar

Yea, and look at who you mentioned.

Consigliera (from the san fran area) flat out said Fiore was a bum pick-up when he was signed. He had an injury history BEFORE he came here. It was optimistic to expect it to go away....but they hoped it would and signed him.

Friedman was nothing but a cheaper "depth" signing. and proved to be just that a "depth" player. Heck G was his natural spot, not C, even being undersized like he is. Unfortunately no one was much better.

Raymer was used up and injury prone. He was a cheap signing.... One of those "hope and pray signings".

Kenyatta Jones and Brown were discards.... Jones proved he should of been left on the junk pile, and Brown was an decent emergency pick-up. But not good when playing out of position....

Of your list, only Thomas and Dockery had any true upside. Thomas went to the pro bowl last year, but with Raymer on one side and Brown on the other, he's going to look bad....

And Dockery is a 2cd year guy.... 2cd year, 2cd head coach, 2cd, line coach, 2cd offensive scheme..... he's improved as the years gone... the jury is still out. I'm not saying don't go get a guard to provide competition, but he's not a bust so far. fix the C and maybe he'll look better....

So I am confused. You agree that Vinny and co. take the blame?

Or that I brought bad examples into the equation which also proves my point to an extent.

I see a trend now that Vinny has been forcing guys onto a list that would be better suited for other offenses.

I didn't expect this team to be firing on all cylinders and I always thought that chemistry would be a problem, (not this bad though) but I think all of us found it strange that we went for Portis (even though most thought it would add to a new-style Gibbs ground attack- as I STILL do) and Brunell.

We then followed up with some rather lackluster pick-ups at TE and the HB position.

Now on the defensive side, all of the pick-ups looked mediocre except for Washington and Taylor. Most of us (well I will admit) never expected anything huge from Springs and Griffin. They both proved us wrong by miles. But is that coaching, is that defensive coaches dictating what players they wanted or was this defense that close to being great again? Going from #5 in the leage to #28 then to #2 suggests alot of things, but to deny that good scouting didn't play a role in that would be wrong.

The bright spots over the years of Vinny's reign have been Thomas, Coles, Hall and Cooley. Three guys that came from one good team. Sounds like some pick ups that my extemeskin brethren would make. :laugh: Jury is still out on Dockery and Jacobs, yes, and I guess according to some (not me) Ramsey as well.

I'm a little all over the place here, but you get my drift.

If you stack up the good pick ups alongside the busts, you obviously see some glaring failures by the scouting dept. here.