Joe Sick Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 This is pretty scary. As drudge says, developing... -------- http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=578&e=4&u=/nm/20040827/ts_nm/security_usa_spy_dc FBI Suspects Israel Has Spy in Pentagon -- CBS News WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The FBI (news - web sites) believes there is an Israeli spy at the very highest level of the Pentagon (news - web sites), CBS News reported on Friday. The network said federal agents believed the spy may have been in a position to influence Bush administration policy on Iran and Iraq (news - web sites). "The FBI has a full-fledged espionage investigation under way and is about to ... roll up someone agents believe has been spying for ... Israel," the network reported. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Sick Posted August 27, 2004 Author Share Posted August 27, 2004 FBI Probes Pentagon Spy Case http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/27/eveningnews/main639143.shtml (CBS) CBS News has learned that the FBI has a full-fledged espionage investigation under way and is about to -- in FBI terminology -- "roll up" someone agents believe has been spying not for an enemy, but for Israel from within the office of the Secretary of Defense at the Pentagon. 60 Minutes Correspondent Lesley Stahl reports the FBI believes it has "solid" evidence that the suspected mole supplied Israel with classified materials that include secret White House policy deliberations on Iran. At the heart of the investigation are two people who work at The American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), a powerful pro-Israel lobby in Washington. The FBI investigation, headed up by Dave Szady, has involved wiretaps, undercover surveillance and photography that CBS News was told document the passing of classified information from the mole, to the men at AIPAC, and on to the Israelis. CBS sources say that last year the suspected spy, described as a trusted analyst at the Pentagon, turned over a presidential directive on U.S. policy toward Iran while it was, "in the draft phase when U.S. policy-makers were still debating the policy." This put the Israelis, according to one source, "inside the decision-making loop" so they could "try to influence the outcome." The case raises another concern among investigators: Did Israel also use the analyst to try to influence U.S. policy on the war in Iraq? With ties to top Pentagon officials Paul Wolfowitz and Douglas Feith, the analyst was assigned to a unit within the Defense Department tasked with helping develop the Pentagon's Iraq policy. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has been made aware of the case. The government notified AIPAC today that it wants information about the two employees and their contacts with a person at the Pentagon. AIPAC told CBS News it is cooperating with the government and has hired outside counsel. It denies any wrongdoing by the organization or any of its employees. An Israeli spokesman said, "We categorically deny these allegations. They are completely false and outrageous." The suspected spy has not returned repeated phone calls from CBS News. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SkinsHokie Fan Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 They have been spying on us for decades. But like Social Security is the 3rd rail in domestic politics, Isreal is just that in international politics. We are never too sure what to do about it. I am curious if this guy is convicted will he be executed or just extradited? This will show if we are evenhanded in how we deal with spies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 Originally posted by SkinsHokie Fan They have been spying on us for decades. But like Social Security is the 3rd rail in domestic politics, Isreal is just that in international politics. We are never too sure what to do about it. I am curious if this guy is convicted will he be executed or just extradited? This will show if we are evenhanded in how we deal with spies. I don't think we would execute a spy in this day and age anyway. As much as I support Israel, I would respond very harshly to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afparent Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 wow, this is serious. Do you guys remember that movie with Kevin Coster (No Way Out) where he worked at the Pentagon as the Secretary of Defense aid and he turned out to be a Russian Spy. Damn, same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenaa Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 If he is an american citizen he should be executed. We need to have a no tolerance policy here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yank Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 There was the Pollard thing in the 80s. Geez, lets get real tough on this make sure it never happens again. Their agenda is NOT ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miragv Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 We give that country a blank check everyyear and we take a lot of crap for our support for them, and they spy on us? I dont see how anyone could possibly defend this. Weird how you help someone out then they basically cheat you in a way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted August 27, 2004 Share Posted August 27, 2004 Its like having Briton or France or Germany or Australia spying on you.. It's a big deal, but its not really THAT big.. If it was China, N. Korea, IRAN, Syria its a BIG deal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Originally posted by Thiebear Its like having Briton or France or Germany or Australia spying on you.. It's a big deal, but its not really THAT big.. If it was China, N. Korea, IRAN, Syria its a BIG deal... I see your point but given all we have done for them (while I will admit they have done a lot for us) I would expect more. We have already caught them once doing this so I think a second offense requires some form of punishment. But perhaps on that we actually agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 I wonder how many spies we have in Israel.... not saying that we should not punish the person severely though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntotoro Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 They have been spying on us for decades. They bombed a ship of ours, they spy on us, we have over 3,000 innocent lives killed because of our relationship with them.... they're supposed to be an ally of ours, right... ? They scream to us when they need help or money and screamed when Clinton threatened to hold out on them, but when do they ever come to our aid? Seems like a rather one-sided relationship, if you ask me. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpillian Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Not a big fan of Israel in general, even less a fan of our support for them -- however, espionage between allied countries, from my understanding, is very common. Even with such close allies as Britain. Regardless, this should be dealt with in a manner which sends a clear message. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckydevil Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Nothing new Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miragv Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 i have never been a big fan of isreal either, i just think the way they operate is shady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 I doubt the intent is malcious as one may think. We are close allies. THey just happen to have one of the more sophisticated intelligence networks. As of late, they've had their share of blunders, as have we, but would we want to go on record saying that we are consulting with the Mossad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 979guy Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Originally posted by SkinsHokie Fan I am curious if this guy is convicted will he be executed or just extradited? This will show if we are evenhanded in how we deal with spies. This because Isael is interested in the anihiliation of the US and all things Western?... Originally posted by ntotoro [bwe have over 3,000 innocent lives killed because of our relationship with them.... [/b] You really believe that, don't you. Say Isarel is wiped away tomorrow (nuclear strike, huge tidal wave, overwhelming grief for US loss to Argentina - take your pick), do you really think that the day after, fundumental Islam will suddenly stop wanting to harm your way of life and take over the West? Sweet dreams. Lighten up, guys. There's only so much hate one can harbor, but so many better targerts to aim it at. Like IAMBG said, Israel, as any country (and ally, for that matter), has its share of blunders. Pollard was a HUGE one, I agree (even internally, as he was acting on behalf of an agency that isn't even responsible for intelligence in that manner, let alone authorized to actually spy). I too believe this case is less of a malicious one as some try to pose it. Indeed, I also hope it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aREDSKIN Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Originally posted by 979guy Lighten up, guys. There's only so much hate one can harbor, but so many better targerts to aim it at. Like IAMBG said, Israel, as any country (and ally, for that matter), has its share of blunders. Pollard was a HUGE one, I agree (even internally, as he was acting on behalf of an agency that isn't even responsible for intelligence in that manner, let alone authorized to actually spy). I too believe this case is less of a malicious one as some try to pose it. Indeed, I also hope it is. BS Pollard was and still is an asset the Isaraeli governmtent is trying to extract from the confines of jail. Trying to dismiss Pollard as a rouge spy without governmental approval is beyond the pale. Israel needs to realize where her bread is plentifully buttered and it's really hard for me to reconcile her behavoir vis a vis the US. (CBS) CBS News has learned that the FBI has a full-fledged espionage investigation under way and is about to -- in FBI terminology -- "roll up" someone agents believe has been spying not for an enemy, but for Israel from within the office of the Secretary of Defense at the Pentagon. 60 Minutes Correspondent Lesley Stahl reports the FBI believes it has "solid" evidence that the suspected mole supplied Israel with classified materials that include secret White House policy deliberations on Iran. At the heart of the investigation are two people who work at The American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), a powerful pro-Israel lobby in Washington. The FBI investigation, headed up by Dave Szady, has involved wiretaps, undercover surveillance and photography that CBS News was told document the passing of classified information from the mole, to the men at AIPAC, and on to the Israelis. CBS sources say that last year the suspected spy, described as a trusted analyst at the Pentagon, turned over a presidential directive on U.S. policy toward Iran while it was, "in the draft phase when U.S. policy-makers were still debating the policy." This put the Israelis, according to one source, "inside the decision-making loop" so they could "try to influence the outcome." The case raises another concern among investigators: Did Israel also use the analyst to try to influence U.S. policy on the war in Iraq? With ties to top Pentagon officials Paul Wolfowitz and Douglas Feith, the analyst was assigned to a unit within the Defense Department tasked with helping develop the Pentagon's Iraq policy. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has been made aware of the case. The government notified AIPAC today that it wants information about the two employees and their contacts with a person at the Pentagon. AIPAC told CBS News it is cooperating with the government and has hired outside counsel. It denies any wrongdoing by the organization or any of its employees. An Israeli spokesman said, "We categorically deny these allegations. They are completely false and outrageous." The suspected spy has not returned repeated phone calls from CBS News. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/27/eveningnews/main639143.shtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 979guy Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Originally posted by aREDSKIN BS Pollard was and still is an asset the Isaraeli governmtent is trying to extract from the confines of jail. Trying to dismiss Pollard as a rouge spy without governmental approval is beyond the pale. Pollard was operated by a department in the Israeli Ministry of Defense, in charge of specific internal security. When the chance came upon one of its chief officers to operate Pollard, he wrongfully took it. It was neither his prerogative, nor his department's. The whole department has since been dispersed, the fiasco being a huge embarrassment to Israel. Israel's then giving Pollard citizenship and lobbying for his release doesn't make Israel spying on the US as some formal target. It was an act of responsibility. Yes, some countries would have left him alone to rot. In the government's eyes, even if Pollard was not spying on behalf of the Mossad (which is supposedly the only official non-military organization authorized to operate "spies"), doing what he did FOR Israel, he shouldn't have been left alone and held solely accountable for the internal muck-ups leading to the affair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntotoro Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Israel's then giving Pollard citizenship and lobbying for his release doesn't make Israel spying on the US as some formal target. It was an act of responsibility. Then why didn't they take this sort of "responsibility" with the Southern Lebanese Army? Those people were promised Israeli citizenship if they fought for them against Hezb'allah, but got left swinging in the breeze once Israel finally pulled out. So sorry... thank you for playing, killing and dying for us, but we no longer need you. We know you're basically traitors and will be tried as such, but you'll forgive us if we go back on the promise of citizenship we offerred you, right? If they hadn't done something like this, it would make it easier to believe that Pollard wasn't receiving any type of support at all. Otherwise, no way I'll believe he wasn't. They wouldn't even extradite the kid from Maryland who murdered a friend of his a few years ago and fled to Israel because his Father was a citizen. How can one country take so much from us and give next to nothing? You'd think they had naked, drunken orgy pics of George Washington or something. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntotoro Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 You really believe that, don't you. Say Isarel is wiped away tomorrow (nuclear strike, huge tidal wave, overwhelming grief for US loss to Argentina - take your pick), do you really think that the day after, fundumental Islam will suddenly stop wanting to harm your way of life and take over the West? Sweet dreams. No, I don't believe that at all. I don't believe it because it's far too late for that. The proverbial horse has already left the barn, in other words. I do believe our policy and staunch allegiance to/support of them has gotten us into more trouble than they have been worth, though. I know I keep repeating the same mantra, but they get an awful lot from us for giving so little. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aREDSKIN Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Originally posted by 979guy Pollard was operated by a department in the Israeli Ministry of Defense, in charge of specific internal security. When the chance came upon one of its chief officers to operate Pollard, he wrongfully took it. It was neither his prerogative, nor his department's. The whole department has since been dispersed, the fiasco being a huge embarrassment to Israel. Israel's then giving Pollard citizenship and lobbying for his release doesn't make Israel spying on the US as some formal target. It was an act of responsibility. Yes, some countries would have left him alone to rot. In the government's eyes, even if Pollard was not spying on behalf of the Mossad (which is supposedly the only official non-military organization authorized to operate "spies"), doing what he did FOR Israel, he shouldn't have been left alone and held solely accountable for the internal muck-ups leading to the affair. Regardless of where Pollard falls on your offered Israeli org chart he's was one of the most damaging spy cases in our country's history. For anyone to try and obscure the Israeli gov't involvement in this is pretty silly. It's well doucmented and IMO an open & shut case. Just admit it and go on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosperity Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 If the guy is caught he has to be sent to prison for life or executed, extradition seems like a terrible option. Just because it is common does not mean he or she can get away with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 979guy Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Originally posted by aREDSKIN ...he's was one of the most damaging spy cases in our country's history. For anyone to try and obscure the Israeli gov't involvement in this is pretty silly. I don't see how these two arguments are connected. It may have been damaging (although it would have been quite a lot more damaging had it been an enemy's spy). The Israeli government was involved, yes, but not with any accordance to its policy. To say that it was involved is like saying that the US government was invovled in the Abu Ghraib prisoners' abuse. It was involved, because they were American soldiers. But was it warranted, sanctioned US policy? I think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 979guy Posted August 28, 2004 Share Posted August 28, 2004 Originally posted by ntotoro Then why didn't they take this sort of "responsibility" with the Southern Lebanese Army? Those people were promised Israeli citizenship if they fought for them against Hezb'allah, but got left swinging in the breeze once Israel finally pulled out. You are making a false claim. No Southern Lebanese soldier was promised citizenship. The fact that quite a few were left none the merrier when Israel pulled out is true. The fact that quite a few others DID recieve assylum in Israel is true as well. Originally posted by ntotoro So sorry... thank you for playing, killing and dying for us, but we no longer need you. We know you're basically traitors and will be tried as such, but you'll forgive us if we go back on the promise of citizenship we offerred you, right? I wonder, what is your stance on Iraqi soldiers, fighting other Iraqis, on behalf of hte Ameican "occupation" in Iraq? Please don't plant naivete where it does not belong. Southern Lebanese soldiers were not fighting out of some Zionist idealism. I do think they had different agendas other than protecting the Israeli northern borders... and again, they were not promised or even offered citizenship. Some of their families were allowed to work in Israel, some wanted to fight Hizballah for moving into their lands, some fought for religious reasons and some for political ones. Oh, and ALL received salaries. Originally posted by ntotoro They wouldn't even extradite the kid from Maryland who murdered a friend of his a few years ago and fled to Israel Personally, I think that was a mistake. Jews protecting their own and BS like that... And I went to school with the kid :doh: Originally posted by ntotoro You'd think they had naked, drunken orgy pics of George Washington or something.[/b] We do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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