PatFischer37 Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 There is no doubt that Champ is a top flight cb HOWEVER 1) Just exactly when during the time he was here was he a "shutdown corner" 2) Maybe if you compare rankings of these two players, Champ is either 1st or 2nd on the top flight cb list and Portis is 4th or 5th best rb HOWEVER, Portis is going to be touching the ball 30-35 times a game as opposed to Champ that was possibly involved in 10-15 plays a game. 3) When was the last time the skins used a 2nd round pick to select a meaningful player to the roster....answer is Chip Lohmiller in '88 This was a trade that was beneficial to BOTH sides, but with a coach like Gibbs, I'll have to take Portis Thoughts? :2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broohaha Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 wasnt jansen a second rounder? edit: just checked... yeah, he was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatFischer37 Posted February 28, 2004 Author Share Posted February 28, 2004 I stand corrected..janson was a 2nd rounder...so every 10 years we draft well at that position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bofluid Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Smoot was a 2nd rounder as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYC Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 When a CB is only involved in 10 or 15 plays that's a good sign, means no one is thowing at him. Deion Sanders in his prime was maybe involved in 1 or 2 plays a game on defense, again that's a good sign of great CB. Bailey is a shut down corner, how quickly the spendskins fan base has turned on Champ, I distinctly remember last year he was the best CB in the league according to 99% on this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWB Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Well patfisher 2 out of 3 isn't bad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen-like Todd Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by NYC When a CB is only involved in 10 or 15 plays that's a good sign, means no one is thowing at him. Deion Sanders in his prime was maybe involved in 1 or 2 plays a game on defense, again that's a good sign of great CB. Bailey is a shut down corner, how quickly the spendskins fan base has turned on Champ, I distinctly remember last year he was the best CB in the league according to 99% on this board. Meanwhile, half of the people on this board spent all of last season arguing that Champ wasn't the best corner on the team, let alone in the league. Pay more attention if you are going to try to talk smack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWB Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 No way CBailey is #1 or #2 CB in the NFL. Maybe your'e thinking CFL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarb Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by PatFisher 3) When was the last time the skins used a 2nd round pick to select a meaningful player to the roster....answer is Chip Lohmiller in '88 Wasn't Lohmiller a 1st rounder? I thought we took him with the last pick in the first round after we won Super Bowl XXII? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by PatFisher 3) When was the last time the skins used a 2nd round pick to select a meaningful player to the roster....answer is Chip Lohmiller in '88 :2cents: Smoot (the guy everyone is convised can take over for Champ this off season, but wanted traded last off season) Janson (our best lineman) Stephen Alexander (Pro Bowler) Tre' Johnson (Pro Bowler) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Hard Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by Zen-like Todd Meanwhile, half of the people on this board spent all of last season arguing that Champ wasn't the best corner on the team, let alone in the league. Pay more attention if you are going to try to talk smack. Right Todd. And the other half of the people are still crying about the trade because they'd rather keep Bailey. NYC's agenda is transparent. He's going to troll the boards every day.. and point out how every transaction the Skins perform is the worst in the NFL. Grow up. Over 230+ posts... and he's still not ready to talk intelligently. What a waste of time and a life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Redskin Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by TheDarb Wasn't Lohmiller a 1st rounder? I thought we took him with the last pick in the first round after we won Super Bowl XXII? Actually we had no first rounder in 1988. The last pick in 88 was by the bears 27th overall wendell davis, a wide reciever out of LSU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Andre Collins and Cory Ramer were also 2nd round picks, and Ramsey was one pick away from being a 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 You'd think the Jets would want to do anything to keep the Redskins from even glancing in their direction this offseason. You'd think they'd have had enough of us bending their "general manager' over the cheap army cot in the storage closet. How on earth an opinion of any of them or their fans is valid, i'll never know. It's like asking a blind man what his favorite color is. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen-like Todd Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by Die Hard Right Todd. And the other half of the people are still crying about the trade because they'd rather keep Bailey. NYC's agenda is transparent. He's going to troll the boards every day.. and point out how every transaction the Skins perform is the worst in the NFL. Grow up. Over 230+ posts... and he's still not ready to talk intelligently. What a waste of time and a life. The spendskins comment, which I didnt even bother to mention before is equally pathetic. Apparently he doesnt realize that the Broncos are offering him a full 50% increase over what most Redskins fans agree was a more than sufficient contract offer. This from the team that also wasted millions of dollars on Daryl Gardener last offseason when the Redskins astutely realized that offering him such a large contract was too risky. But of course the Redskins are the overspenders. Uh huh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Redskin Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by TheDarb Wasn't Lohmiller a 1st rounder? I thought we took him with the last pick in the first round after we won Super Bowl XXII? interestingly enough in 83 we picked darrell green an in 91 we picked bobby wilson (DT) and we had a total of zero first rounders in between those two (7 years). So I guess we should be happy to have the #5 overall. Gibbs really likes those vets huh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarb Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by lookoutforlavar Actually we had no first rounder in 1988. The last pick in 88 was by the bears 27th overall wendell davis, a wide reciever out of LSU. OK. I just looked it up. Lohmiller was the last pick in the 2nd round. Why were there only 27 picks in some rounds? Was that a Plan-B free agency thing? I can't remember! I must've killed those brain cells! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by PatFisher There is no doubt that Champ is a top flight cb HOWEVER 3) When was the last time the skins used a 2nd round pick to select a meaningful player to the roster....answer is Chip Lohmiller in '88 Skins 2nd rd picks last ten years 94 - Tre' Johnson - good pick 95 - Cory Ramer - good pick 96 - traded pick to Dallas 97 - Greg Jones - medicore 98 - Stephen Alexander - good pick 99 - Jon Jansen - 'nuff said 00 - no 2nd rd pick 01 - SMOOOOOTTTTT!! - 'nuff said 02 - Ladell Betts - jury is still out 03 - Taylor Jacobs - we will have to wait on this one SO...the 2nd round has produced some decent players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Redskin Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by TheDarb OK. I just looked it up. Lohmiller was the last pick in the 2nd round. Why were there only 27 picks in some rounds? Was that a Plan-B free agency thing? I can't remember! I must've killed those brain cells! I don't really Know why. I just have a list of the first rounders from 1970 to last year. they always print stuff like that in the back of football digest. Its a good read, comes 8 times a year now used to be 10. you should check it out if you have not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Hard Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by RonJeremy Originally posted by PatFisher There is no doubt that Champ is a top flight cb HOWEVER 3) When was the last time the skins used a 2nd round pick to select a meaningful player to the roster....answer is Chip Lohmiller in '88 Skins 2nd rd picks last ten years 94 - Tre' Johnson - good pick 95 - Cory Ramer - good pick 96 - traded pick to Dallas 97 - Greg Jones - medicore 98 - Stephen Alexander - good pick 99 - Jon Jansen - 'nuff said 00 - no 2nd rd pick 01 - SMOOOOOTTTTT!! - 'nuff said 02 - Ladell Betts - jury is still out 03 - Taylor Jacobs - we will have to wait on this one SO...the 2nd round has produced some decent players. Tell me you used the draft database for that. Appease me 1981 2 36 Choice to San Francisco 49ers 1982 2 41 Choice to New England Patriots from Washington Redskins through San Francisco 49ers 1982 2 49 Dean, Vernon CB San Diego State from San Diego Chargers through LA Rams 1983 2 56 Williams, Richard RB Memphis State 1984 2 31 Slater, Bob DT Oklahoma from NY Giants 1984 2 55 Hamilton, Steve DE East Carolina 1985 2 33 Nixon, Tory DB San Diego State from Atlanta Falcons 1985 2 51 Choice to St. Louis Cardinals from Washington Redskins through Atlanta Falcons 1986 2 30 Koch, Markus DE Boise State from Atlanta Falcons 1986 2 45 Murray, Walter WR Hawaii from San Francisco 49ers 1986 2 48 Choice to Philadelphia Eagles from Washington Redskins through LA Raiders 1987 2 30 Davis, Brian CB Nebraska from Indianapolis Colts 1987 2 48 Kleine, Wally OT Notre Dame from NY Jets through LA Raiders 1987 2 52 Choice to LA Raiders 1988 2 55 Lohmiller, Chip K Minnesota 1989 2 39 Choice to Dallas Cowboys from Washington Redskins through LA Raiders 1990 2 46 Collins, Andre LB Penn State 1991 2 47 Choice to San Diego Chargers 1992 2 47 Collins, Shane DE Arizona State from Kansas City Chiefs through Dallas Cowboys 1992 2 56 Choice to Detroit Lions from Washington Redskins through Dallas Cowboys 1993 2 45 Brooks, Reggie RB Notre Dame 1994 2 31 Johnson, Tre OG Temple 1995 2 37 Raymer, Cory C Wisconsin 1996 2 37 Choice to Dallas Cowboys 1997 2 51 Jones, Greg LB Colorado 1998 2 48 Alexander, Stephen TE Oklahoma 1999 2 37 Jansen, Jon OT Michigan from Chicago Bears 1999 2 40 Choice to Oakland Raiders from Washington Redskins through Chicago Bears 2000 2 56 Choice to Minnesota Vikings 2001 2 45 Smoot, Fred CB Mississippi State 2002 2 52 Choice to Baltimore Ravens 2002 2 56 Betts, Ladell TB Iowa from Baltimore Ravens 2003 2 44 Jacobs, Taylor WR Florida 2004 2 42 Choice to Denver Broncos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WM_Marylander Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Yeah, the 2nd rounders have been decent. But at the same point... I second the Portis will touch the ball 30 times or so a game. That's the main reason a deal like this is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helluvaskinsfan Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 i agree with nyc.champ doesnt make many plays on the ball because the ball doesnt come his way for a reason.his man is rarely open,and they are scared to throw at him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by Die Hard Tell me you used the draft database for that. Appease me 1981 2 36 Choice to San Francisco 49ers 1982 2 41 Choice to New England Patriots from Washington Redskins through San Francisco 49ers 1982 2 49 Dean, Vernon CB San Diego State from San Diego Chargers through LA Rams 1983 2 56 Williams, Richard RB Memphis State 1984 2 31 Slater, Bob DT Oklahoma from NY Giants 1984 2 55 Hamilton, Steve DE East Carolina 1985 2 33 Nixon, Tory DB San Diego State from Atlanta Falcons 1985 2 51 Choice to St. Louis Cardinals from Washington Redskins through Atlanta Falcons 1986 2 30 Koch, Markus DE Boise State from Atlanta Falcons 1986 2 45 Murray, Walter WR Hawaii from San Francisco 49ers 1986 2 48 Choice to Philadelphia Eagles from Washington Redskins through LA Raiders 1987 2 30 Davis, Brian CB Nebraska from Indianapolis Colts 1987 2 48 Kleine, Wally OT Notre Dame from NY Jets through LA Raiders 1987 2 52 Choice to LA Raiders 1988 2 55 Lohmiller, Chip K Minnesota 1989 2 39 Choice to Dallas Cowboys from Washington Redskins through LA Raiders 1990 2 46 Collins, Andre LB Penn State 1991 2 47 Choice to San Diego Chargers 1992 2 47 Collins, Shane DE Arizona State from Kansas City Chiefs through Dallas Cowboys 1992 2 56 Choice to Detroit Lions from Washington Redskins through Dallas Cowboys 1993 2 45 Brooks, Reggie RB Notre Dame 1994 2 31 Johnson, Tre OG Temple 1995 2 37 Raymer, Cory C Wisconsin 1996 2 37 Choice to Dallas Cowboys 1997 2 51 Jones, Greg LB Colorado 1998 2 48 Alexander, Stephen TE Oklahoma 1999 2 37 Jansen, Jon OT Michigan from Chicago Bears 1999 2 40 Choice to Oakland Raiders from Washington Redskins through Chicago Bears 2000 2 56 Choice to Minnesota Vikings 2001 2 45 Smoot, Fred CB Mississippi State 2002 2 52 Choice to Baltimore Ravens 2002 2 56 Betts, Ladell TB Iowa from Baltimore Ravens 2003 2 44 Jacobs, Taylor WR Florida 2004 2 42 Choice to Denver Broncos I should have used the data base....I did it the hard way with the 2003 Media Guide. I have learned my lesson. I am new and learning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helluvaskinsfan Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 besides a 2nd rounder is damn near a first rounder.especially when we pick 6th.stephen davis,brian mitchell,etc came well after the second round .they were both great,mitchell is a lock for the hall of fame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Originally posted by WM_Marylander Yeah, the 2nd rounders have been decent. But at the same point... I second the Portis will touch the ball 30 times or so a game. That's the main reason a deal like this is done. I love Portis...his style of running is awesome...I watched him last year and never thought it would be possible to get him...Denver will regret this move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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