Heinicke Hive: The LEGEND of Taylor Heinicke Thread

[Malapropismic Depository]

By the way, there is a twitter profile claiming to be Heinicke, and appears legit from overall glance, and a lot of people seem to think it's him, but it is NOT

Edited January 11, 2021 by Malapropismic Depository

[CapsSkins]

2 minutes ago, fwo40 said:

There were at least 2 in the in the Carolina game that should've been picked - one in the end zone - and a few others. My main point is that I think we just have had such bad QB performances that we get spoiled by an above average game here and there. I don't know that's he not going to be great -but I do know the majority of pro ready QB's coming out of college and half the backups in the league coming up are capable of replicating in a short span what Heinicke has done over 5 qtrs. I hope he gets a chance to compete for the job next year - but I'm not sold in any way that's he's markedly above average right now.

 

There were two bad balls in the Caroline game, when he came in literally cold and was playing from way behind w/ 10 minutes to go in the game.

 

Sorry, but I'm going to just use your post as an example of something I'm seeing from a lot more posters than just you, and that is moving the goalposts and throwing out these vague broad statements. You started off by saying: "But I think he's probably closer to a "c" player."

 

I asked what about the film made you think that, and you said he threw a "bunch of prayers" last night. I asked which ones specifically, and then you said well he threw 2 bad balls against Carolina. Already moved the goalposts.

 

Then you go on to say we've had a low bar at QB and get fooled by above average performances. But you didn't explain why the performance was only above average. You just threw out the statement like it was a fact. I disagree with that assessment considering the game situation. Facing a heavy blitz defense from Todd Bowles with serious playmakers in a Wild card playoff game while he got zero run game support and receivers were constantly dropping balls. We basically started every series w/ a bad run play that put Taylor in 2nd and 11, basically every series.

 

Okay, now you're saying majority of pro ready QB's and backups can replicate Heinicke's performance. Again, no evidence or proof. And then at the end you say you're not sold that he's above average - well nobody said they were "sold" on anything. Everyone has acknowledged the small sample size and durability concerns. But you originally threw out an assessment that you think he's "probably a C player". When I asked why specifically you thought that, you just moved the goalposts about the Carolina game (which I can also argue againstt) and then tossed out a bunch of vague unarguable statements like how we haven't had a good QB in years. This is my frustration. There's no real meat behind a lot of this criticism. 

[fwo40]

2 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

There were two bad balls in the Caroline game, when he came in literally cold and was playing from way behind w/ 10 minutes to go in the game. Etc

In my mind a "C" player is one that factors in lack of experience and durability concerns. If you think last night's game was more than a B+ so be it. Subjective of course.  Maybe we have different own grading curves. I mean TB's pass defense was 22nd overall in the league in 2020 - not a world beater despite your assertion of "playmakers".  In the Tampa Bay game there was one to Steve SImms I remember which he threw a bit off his back foot in pressure, the ball up the field to Cam Simms around midfield was behind him and he short armed it a bit, and there were some others that stuck out in my mind - but I'd have to admittedly rewatch to pin down. 

 

You want to be optimistic - ok, but there's a reason Heinicke spent time in the XFL and on a bunch of practice squads. As a prospect to this point a "c" grade is generous in the NFL parlance. You want to believe he's had some great breakthrough? Fine. I'm not ready to say that. I'm not ready to say he's a must have. He had a good Tampa game in my mind and an average Carolina game - and I believe he's naturally less talented than a lot of QB's that are young andof simiar experience. I would wager most of the NFL feels this way - given again that his career status to this point. 

 

I wouldn't imagine putting a "c" on Heinicke at this point is controversial. But to each their own.

 

 

[JSSkinz]

1 hour ago, Vanguard said:

It was one game.  Why has it taken him so long to get to this point?

Definitely a fair question but if you dig into the backstory he's an undrafted guy who made the Vikes as a rookie and played for 3 teams who had veteran QB's in MN, NE, and Houston.

 

When Cam got hurt that was his chance to play and he got injured and that was the end.

 

It's possible he has talent but can't stay healthy long enough for people to notice.

 

 

 

 

[CapsSkins]

3 minutes ago, fwo40 said:

In my mind a "C" player is one that factors in lack of experience and durability concerns. If you think last night's game was more than a B+ so be it. Subjective of course.  Maybe we have different own grading curves. I mean TB's pass defense was 22nd overall in the league in 2020 - not a world beater despite your assertion of "playmakers".  In the Tampa Bay game there was one to Steve SImms I remember which he threw a bit off his back foot in pressure, the ball up the field to Cam Simms around midfield was behind him and he short armed it a bit, and there were some others that stuck out in my mind - but I'd have to admittedly rewatch to pin down. 

 

You want to be optimistic - ok, but there's a reason Heinicke spent time in the XFL and on a bunch of practice squads. As a prospect to this point a "c" grade is generous in the NFL parlance. You want to believe he's had some great breakthrough? Fine. I'm not ready to say that. I'm not ready to say he's a must have. He had a good Tampa game in my mind and an average Carolina game - and I believe he's naturally less talented than a lot of QB's that are young andof simiar experience. I would wager most of the NFL feels this way - given again that his career status to this point. 

 

I wouldn't imagine putting a "c" on Heinicke at this point is controversial. But to each their own.

 

 

 

Okay, if you're factoring in uncertainty then sure, I can see that. I think he had a Very Good to Great game against Tampa and a Good to Very Good game against Carolina.

 

Durability is the biggest concern and it could sink him. That aside, I'm not concerned w/ sustainability. 

[Tedskins 21]

38 minutes ago, fwo40 said:

There were at least 2 in the in the Carolina game that should've been picked - one in the end zone - and a few others. My main point is that I think we just have had such bad QB performances that we get spoiled by an above average game here and there. I don't know that's he not going to be great -but I do know the majority of pro ready QB's coming out of college and half the backups in the league coming up are capable of replicating in a short span what Heinicke has done over 5 qtrs. I hope he gets a chance to compete for the job next year - but I'm not sold in any way that's he's markedly above average right now.

Above average? That was the best redskin qb performance in almost a decade and a half.

Edited January 11, 2021 by Tedskins 21

[fwo40]

2 minutes ago, Tedskins 21 said:

Above average? That was the best redskin qb performance in almost a decade and a half.

Even if I agree with you. It doesn't exactly say much

[Tedskins 21]

39 minutes ago, fwo40 said:

Even if I agree with you. It doesn't exactly say much

Agreed, but its something to definitely get excited about. Jump in, the water’s nice 😬

Edited January 11, 2021 by Tedskins 21

[Commander -JB-]

Fans are so worried what if he isn’t that good what if he isn’t really halfway decent LOL get out of your own head and just watch the guy perform smh

[ToaCommander]

Thank you Taylor Heinicke, you made us all proud yesterday. Haven't felt that way in a long time. Gutsy performance and some great throws. Should be in the mix for our starting QB next year.

[petey hodge]

and to add...  with the way some of the other teams pathetically lost this weekend (eg. SEA, CHI, PIT), Taylor brought some national respectability back to the WFT/Skins after that terrible Eagles/Sudafed game.  As the lone Redskins fan out here in Seattle, I got a lot of texts throughout the game from other NFL fans watching.  TH brought the pride back!

 

 

Edited January 11, 2021 by petey hodge

[Berggy9598]

5 hours ago, Tedskins 21 said:

Above average? That was the best redskin qb performance in almost a decade and a half.

If you count the regular season and just look at the performance in a vacuum it was not the best QB performance. RG3 on thanksgiving, Kirk Cousins on SNF against the Packers, RG3 vs Philly off the top of my head were better. 

[Commander -JB-]

I’m all in on Taylor Heinicke.  His performance was outstanding.  He showed so much heart & grit that I’d be fool to double think that performance.  He showed who he is on a national stage.  Ducking defenders and scrambling for first downs, throwing perfect darts into the corner of the end zone for TD’s, playing from behind all game and still keeping us alive, the scramble & dive!  

[Thinking Skins]

I will take a step back from my praise of Heinicke and say that one concern I have of him is that he's 27. This is his 4th or 5th team including XFL. As much as I love the Rocky Balboa stories I have to caution myself because at soem point you are what you are. That's not to say that my theories about him never being given the chance he should have been given aren't true (and he played well for a guy in 2018 for Carolina against Atlanta but was intercepted 3 times). But I do research and one thing I have to caution myself about is to look for my own mistakes - like, if there's a problem that people have been trying to solve for 50+ years and I think I've solved it in 2 weeks, I probably have a mistake. So the key question becomes where is the mistake. That's the thing about Heinicke. Did everybody miss out on this guy for this long, not even being willing to give him a chance on a roster this year, not even giving him a starting job in the XFL? 

 

The saying goes that cream rises to the top and mayhe this year and his relationship with Scott Turner provided him with that opportunity to rise. But there's also a saying that you are what you are. And maybe we have a guy who played lights out for a game (a game and a quarter) but will eventually come back down to earth. 

 

Whichever situation is true, I will hold that this game got me excited in a way I haven't been since the RG3 days. Kirk got stats but never had me hype about a win. Smith got wins but never made the plays. Haskins didn't get stats or wins. Colt got hurt. Even Kyle Allen got some good plays (I think about his TD run against the Rams) but it wasn't the same type of a feeling as this game (partially because he got hurt that game and partially because we got beat so badly that game and it wasn't as nice of a run). 

[Commander -JB-]

7 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

I will take a step back from my praise of Heinicke and say that one concern I have of him is that he's 27. This is his 4th or 5th team including XFL. As much as I love the Rocky Balboa stories I have to caution myself because at soem point you are what you are. That's not to say that my theories about him never being given the chance he should have been given aren't true (and he played well for a guy in 2018 for Carolina against Atlanta but was intercepted 3 times). But I do research and one thing I have to caution myself about is to look for my own mistakes - like, if there's a problem that people have been trying to solve for 50+ years and I think I've solved it in 2 weeks, I probably have a mistake. So the key question becomes where is the mistake. That's the thing about Heinicke. Did everybody miss out on this guy for this long, not even being willing to give him a chance on a roster this year, not even giving him a starting job in the XFL? 

 

The saying goes that cream rises to the top and mayhe this year and his relationship with Scott Turner provided him with that opportunity to rise. But there's also a saying that you are what you are. And maybe we have a guy who played lights out for a game (a game and a quarter) but will eventually come back down to earth. 

 

Whichever situation is true, I will hold that this game got me excited in a way I haven't been since the RG3 days. Kirk got stats but never had me hype about a win. Smith got wins but never made the plays. Haskins didn't get stats or wins. Colt got hurt. Even Kyle Allen got some good plays (I think about his TD run against the Rams) but it wasn't the same type of a feeling as this game (partially because he got hurt that game and partially because we got beat so badly that game and it wasn't as nice of a run). 

Let’s be honest.  He was blocked by Tom Brady, Deshaun Watson & Cam Newton.  Them’s the breaks.

Edited January 11, 2021 by -JB-

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

I will take a step back from my praise of Heinicke and say that one concern I have of him is that he's 27. This is his 4th or 5th team including XFL. As much as I love the Rocky Balboa stories I have to caution myself because at soem point you are what you are. That's not to say that my theories about him never being given the chance he should have been given aren't true (and he played well for a guy in 2018 for Carolina against Atlanta but was intercepted 3 times). But I do research and one thing I have to caution myself about is to look for my own mistakes - like, if there's a problem that people have been trying to solve for 50+ years and I think I've solved it in 2 weeks, I probably have a mistake. So the key question becomes where is the mistake. That's the thing about Heinicke. Did everybody miss out on this guy for this long, not even being willing to give him a chance on a roster this year, not even giving him a starting job in the XFL? 

 

The saying goes that cream rises to the top and mayhe this year and his relationship with Scott Turner provided him with that opportunity to rise. But there's also a saying that you are what you are. And maybe we have a guy who played lights out for a game (a game and a quarter) but will eventually come back down to earth. 

 

Whichever situation is true, I will hold that this game got me excited in a way I haven't been since the RG3 days. Kirk got stats but never had me hype about a win. Smith got wins but never made the plays. Haskins didn't get stats or wins. Colt got hurt. Even Kyle Allen got some good plays (I think about his TD run against the Rams) but it wasn't the same type of a feeling as this game (partially because he got hurt that game and partially because we got beat so badly that game and it wasn't as nice of a run). 

Ta’amu was the starting QB with the Battlehawks. He is a guy that has excellent athleticism and physical traits. Live arm. Fast. Good size. 
 

For every physical ability Heinicke has, Ta’amu has it... and has it better than Heinicke. Arm, size, athleticism, speed. They all favor Ta’amu.

 

Where Heinicke has the edge is his football IQ. He is extremely football intelligent. He is a five read player and can and will read an entire field and understand the coverage the defense is in. He is far ahead of Ta’amu in that regard (or at least the last we saw Ta’amu). 
 

But coaches love the physical. Look no further than Dwayne Haskins. The physical traits make coaches think, “If this guy can get it together... He’s going to be nasty!”

 

And they are right. But the problem is that this doesn’t come easily. 
 

Developing that is hard. Human psychology shows that when a guy struggles he presses and gets frustrated. And then as the struggles don’t go away, despite your best efforts, you struggle more and more. 
 

Heinicke was undrafted because while he has adequate skills and traits, they aren’t as mesmerizing as the higher trait guys. 
 

We don’t know if he’s the answer, but we have to stop guilty thinking ourselves. “Well, gee, everyone has missed so there’s no way we got it right” is a common refrain. Who knows if we did or didn’t. But he has the football IQ that more than makes up from some of his lesser physical traits. 
 

Let’s see what happens before we naysay him just because he wasn’t an immediate NFL star. 
 

Keep in mind it takes some NFL QBs time to be comfortable and come into their own as well. 
 

He had moved on. Being given a chance while taking finals means you are playing with house money.

 

So instead of “why us?” instead think “why not us?”

[CjSuAvE22]

9 hours ago, Tedskins 21 said:

Above average? That was the best redskin qb performance in almost a decade and a half.

Lets be real Cousins def had performances like that....not saying hes Brady Brees or Mahomes but you cant delete key Kirk when hes stat wise been a top ten qb in the league for most of the time hes been a starter...which is why i think we need to sign TH4 early because hes shown some flash of being a capable qb, you cant let that just walk away otherwise you end up vomiting all over yourself like we have so much in the past.

[Thinking Skins]

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

Ta’amu was the starting QB with the Battlehawks. He is a guy that has excellent athleticism and physical traits. Live arm. Fast. Good size. 
 

For every physical ability Heinicke has, Ta’amu has it... and has it better than Heinicke. Arm, size, athleticism, speed. They all favor Ta’amu.

 

Where Heinicke has the edge is his football IQ. He is extremely football intelligent. He is a five read player and can and will read an entire field and understand the coverage the defense is in. He is far ahead of Ta’amu in that regard (or at least the last we saw Ta’amu). 
 

But coaches love the physical. Look no further than Dwayne Haskins. The physical traits make coaches think, “If this guy can get it together... He’s going to be nasty!”

 

And they are right. But the problem is that this doesn’t come easily. 
 

Developing that is hard. Human psychology shows that when a guy struggles he presses and gets frustrated. And then as the struggles don’t go away, despite your best efforts, you struggle more and more. 
 

Heinicke was undrafted because while he has adequate skills and traits, they aren’t as mesmerizing as the higher trait guys. 
 

We don’t know if he’s the answer, but we have to stop guilty thinking ourselves. “Well, gee, everyone has missed so there’s no way we got it right” is a common refrain. Who knows if we did or didn’t. But he has the football IQ that more than makes up from some of his lesser physical traits. 
 

Let’s see what happens before we naysay him just because he wasn’t an immediate NFL star. 
 

Keep in mind it takes some NFL QBs time to be comfortable and come into their own as well. 
 

He had moved on. Being given a chance while taking finals means you are playing with house money.

 

So instead of “why us?” instead think “why not us?”

Thanks for that because I was legit wondering why he couldn't get a role in the XFL.

 

But I'm the king of the unheralded guy fan club so you don't have to worry about me not being on board the wagon. I'm all in for him (even ahead of Allen) but its going to be 8 months (at least) until we see him play again so I'm going to have a lot of thoughts between now and then. 

 

That said I was posting in another thread about how to scout a QB and outside of the physical things, it was a question of how to know you have a smart guy and a hard working guy. You described Heinicke as a 5 read guy (I've heard it elsewhere as well) and that's what I like most about him (and his guts). I was looking at some scouting reports over the weekend and I was thinking about possible QBs in the draft with this type of intelligence because its not normally what's talked about in scouting reports. And I don't think intelligence tests or post game interviews can tell us this (I was really believing Haskins in part because of his ability to recall a play and go into detail describing what happened. But seeing how Heinicke played Saturday is what I really have been looking for and I am so excited about his potential next year. 

[bowhunter]

5 days ago there were multiple posters talkin about our urgent need to sell the farm and move up a dozen spots in the draft for a second tier QB. We now have enough optimism to sit back and allow the draft to come to us. How fun will that be?

 

[justice98]

51 minutes ago, -JB- said:

Let’s be honest.  He was blocked by Tom Brady, Deshaun Watson & Cam Newton.  Them’s the breaks.

 

Blocked from being the starting QB.  We're gonna blame those guys for him bouncing around to 4 teams and backing up in the XFL?  He got beaten out by the likes of TJ Yates and Tom Savage.  But Brady, Watson, Bd Newton were blocking him?  lol

 

Maybe he finally found his footing.  But I'm not gonna delude myself into thinking we've found our guy without more evidence, and we won't get it before decisions have to be made.

Edited January 11, 2021 by justice98

[DJHJR86]

Thank you Heinicke for not only that gutsy performance against one of the better defenses (as well as a good defensive coordinator who I thought would make Heinicke look totally lost) but also for silencing the inevitable "we would have won with Alex!" talk that I thought was going to permeate social media.  

[Commander -JB-]

36 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

Blocked from being the starting QB.  We're gonna blame those guys for him bouncing around to 4 teams and backing up in the XFL?  He got beaten out by the likes of TJ Yates and Tom Savage.  But Brady, Watson, Bd Newton were blocking him?  lol

You must do a hell of a job talking yourself out of everything in life LOL. What more evidence do you need?  There aren’t any more games to be played before he needs to be either signed or let out to pasture.  What’s your decision???

Edited January 11, 2021 by -JB-

[KDawg]

Just now, justice98 said:

 

Blocked from being the starting QB.  We're gonna blame those guys for him bouncing around to 4 teams and backing up in the XFL?  He got beaten out by the likes of TJ Yates and Tom Savage.  But Brady, Watson, Bd Newton were blocking him?  lol

This is a casualty of the NFL system. A new crop of rookies comes in every year. And seemingly every year teams cycle through the guy they had the year before for the new shiny toy hoping he is lightning in a bottle.

 

Guys fall through the cracks every year. Even talented guys. Reps are hard to get. Starters and backups, which are either highly drafted, incumbent, or got a chance to show they could play on another roster, take the majority of the reps. 
 

That’s not to say that Heinicke is going to wind up being a pro bowler. Doesn’t mean he’s going to even wind up as our starter. He may not. It’s realistic that he doesn’t live up to the new expectations. 
 

But disqualifying a guy because he couldn’t find his footing when he didn’t have the pedigree is a tough look. 
 

He’s not Dwayne Haskins where he had a big time shot to prove it and failed. 

[Darrell Green Fan]

21 hours ago, -JB- said:

There is no such thing as an overreaction to balling out in a playoff game.  He wasn’t so great that he carried us to a win.  However, he looked extremely good in spots.  He was good in a playoff game.  You can’t overreact to a playoff game! Not a regular season game but Playoffs!  Playoffs?  Playoffs!

 

I'm not downplaying the performance on the bigger stage. I'm obviously referring to posters who believe he can actually do that week after week for 10 years.  I think that's unrealistic.

[HigSkin]

For anyone able to listen or watch.  TH is coming on the Junkies at 8:20.