Jump to content
Washington Football Team Logo
Extremeskins

WFT Branding Study (Part 2)


Recommended Posts

I know it's The Replacements but I actually really like Sentinels. Local link to the area, cool name, we could keep b&g. What's not to like? We could play the Judas Priest song when they run out too.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
46 minutes ago, UK Skins said:

I know it's The Replacements but I actually really like Sentinels. Local link to the area, cool name, we could keep b&g. What's not to like? We could play the Judas Priest song when they run out too.

I do actually like that for the team. I'd probably be detached because I don't feel a link to it, but I'm from the nation's first capital. Love wolves though.

 

Would have been perfect if it was 87 :ols:

Edited by Koolblue13
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, UK Skins said:

I know it's The Replacements but I actually really like Sentinels. Local link to the area, cool name, we could keep b&g. What's not to like? We could play the Judas Priest song when they run out too.

 

 

Just go with Sentries (a very close synonym) instead.  It has ties to our area (guards of the tomb of the unknown soldier) as well to George Washington himself (when he was the General of the Revolution).  

Link to post
Share on other sites

I know the name Bravehearts was trademarked several years ago by Snyder's neighbor, so I'm not sure if it's even an option. But if it is, this is the name that fits a team that represents the nations capital perfectly.

 

It honors:

The Military

Law enforcement

First Responders

Dr's and nurses

Civil Rights leaders, such as MLK and Rosa Parks

Native Americans in a respectful way 

Cancer survivors- which our owners wife happens to be, as is our HC

It's your mother, father, grandparents etc.

Football players

 

I can keep going who classifies as a Braveheart, but you get the idea. It is anyone who has pride, courage, strength and integrity.  It is a man, woman, adult and child. It is essentially a patriot and a warrior. 

 

No other professional American sports team has this name and as far as I know, nor do any major college teams. This would be our name only and personally, I think it's badass. It keeps our mascot as a human- as it's always been and doesn't change it to an animal...like a redwolf.  

 

I can see it now, Chase Young gesturing as if he's ripping open his shirt and pounding his heart with a quick fist strike after a sack. Guys do this in all sports anyway, but when your team name is actually named the Bravehearts, that celebratory act takes on bigger significance. 

 

Now, I have no idea what a logo might look like- smart, talented people get paid a lot of money to do that stuff, so that's not a concern as long as the colors remain burgundy and gold.

 

We are the nations capital and represent the entire nation. Bravehearts not only recognizes all the great Americans who are a huge part of this great country's history, but it also recognizes every American who gets up everyday and takes on the daily grind of everyday life head on. 

 

Lastly, the last four words of our national anthem are "home of the brave" for a reason. I can't think of a name that fits a football team from the great city of Washington DC and our nations capital better than the Washington Bravehearts!  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

 

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, fearlessNelms said:

I know the name Bravehearts was trademarked several years ago by Snyder's neighbor, so I'm not sure if it's even an option. But if it is, this is the name that fits a team that represents the nations capital perfectly.

 

It honors:

The Military

Law enforcement

First Responders

Dr's and nurses

Civil Rights leaders, such as MLK and Rosa Parks

Native Americans in a respectful way 

Cancer survivors- which our owners wife happens to be, as is our HC

It's your mother, father, grandparents etc.

Football players

 

I can keep going who classifies as a Braveheart, but you get the idea. It is anyone who has pride, courage, strength and integrity.  It is a man, woman, adult and child. It is essentially a patriot and a warrior. 

 

No other professional American sports team has this name and as far as I know, nor do any major college teams. This would be our name only and personally, I think it's badass. It keeps our mascot as a human- as it's always been and doesn't change it to an animal...like a redwolf.  

 

I can see it now, Chase Young gesturing as if he's ripping open his shirt and pounding his heart with a quick fist strike after a sack. Guys do this in all sports anyway, but when your team name is actually named the Bravehearts, that celebratory act takes on bigger significance. 

 

Now, I have no idea what a logo might look like- smart, talented people get paid a lot of money to do that stuff, so that's not a concern as long as the colors remain burgundy and gold.

 

We are the nations capital and represent the entire nation. Bravehearts not only recognizes all the great Americans who are a huge part of this great country's history, but it also recognizes every American who gets up everyday and takes on the daily grind of everyday life head on. 

 

Lastly, the last four words of our national anthem are "home of the brave" for a reason. I can't think of a name that fits a football team from the great city of Washington DC and our nations capital better than the Washington Bravehearts!  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

 

Works for me 👍👏

Link to post
Share on other sites

I really just want to make sure I understand you. When you use the word " overt " here ... Do you actually mean " subtle " ?

 

 

12 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

A: (in the case of something that has Native American association) Can't be on the nose and has to be overt and something the team will never recognize in any official capacity unless their desire is to invite ruin

 

 

12 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

Redwolves/Wolves would be an example of an overt one that no one can reasonably call you out on and as long as the team itself does not come out and say "We chose this b/c of its deep connection to NAs!"

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, fearlessNelms said:

I know the name Bravehearts was trademarked several years ago by Snyder's neighbor, so I'm not sure if it's even an option. But if it is, this is the name that fits a team that represents the nations capital perfectly.

 

It honors:

The Military

Law enforcement

First Responders

Dr's and nurses

Civil Rights leaders, such as MLK and Rosa Parks

Native Americans in a respectful way 

Cancer survivors- which our owners wife happens to be, as is our HC

It's your mother, father, grandparents etc.

Football players

 

I can keep going who classifies as a Braveheart, but you get the idea. It is anyone who has pride, courage, strength and integrity.  It is a man, woman, adult and child. It is essentially a patriot and a warrior. 

 

No other professional American sports team has this name and as far as I know, nor do any major college teams. This would be our name only and personally, I think it's badass. It keeps our mascot as a human- as it's always been and doesn't change it to an animal...like a redwolf.  

 

I can see it now, Chase Young gesturing as if he's ripping open his shirt and pounding his heart with a quick fist strike after a sack. Guys do this in all sports anyway, but when your team name is actually named the Bravehearts, that celebratory act takes on bigger significance. 

 

Now, I have no idea what a logo might look like- smart, talented people get paid a lot of money to do that stuff, so that's not a concern as long as the colors remain burgundy and gold.

 

We are the nations capital and represent the entire nation. Bravehearts not only recognizes all the great Americans who are a huge part of this great country's history, but it also recognizes every American who gets up everyday and takes on the daily grind of everyday life head on. 

 

Lastly, the last four words of our national anthem are "home of the brave" for a reason. I can't think of a name that fits a football team from the great city of Washington DC and our nations capital better than the Washington Bravehearts!  

 

 

 

Shares a similar issue with "Warriors": What's the logo?

Shares another similar issue with "Warriors": Too close of a tie to NA references, maybe even moreso with "Brave." 

That said, this could allow us to finally retire the fight song and just all yell "FREEEEDOOOOMMMMMMM" whenever there's a touchdown. 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Dissident2 said:

 

Shares a similar issue with "Warriors": What's the logo?

Shares another similar issue with "Warriors": Too close of a tie to NA references, maybe even moreso with "Brave."


Earlier today I posted two examples of “Warriors” logos that have no connection whatsoever to Native Americans.  I’d be thrilled with either one.  Switch out Warriors with “Bravehearts” and you can still use at least the first one with the sword and shield.  Whether you want to admit it or not it can be done and there are plenty of cool Warriors logos out there that do not use Native American imagery whatsoever.  

Also, unless you have had a talk with reps from Golden State you have no idea what they are willing to do.  They may be more willing to share than you realize.  Especially since they are the Golden State Warriors and we would be the Washington Warriors, playing in two different leagues on opposite ends of the country.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/7/2021 at 12:47 PM, Cavspider said:

La Plata Warriors is a high school mascot name where I live in Southern Maryland.  My son played on a travel baseball team here called the Warriors.  Warriors is such a generic name to me it is one of my least favorite of the possibles.


I know La Plata, in fact I know the guy who originally drew their mascot back in the 80’s, at least the big painted one in their gym anyway.  I went to Thomas Stone in Waldorf, and La Plata was our biggest rival at the time.  I still think their mascot is probably the coolest in the area.  (Would never admit that to any of my friends that went there, lol)

 

Warriors as Knights works for me.  Heck, even Washington Knights works for me.

9B5643E3-35A7-441E-B075-CAE6D70B8D5B.gif

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Spearfeather said:

I really just want to make sure I understand you. When you use the word " overt " here ... Do you actually mean " subtle " ?

 

Good catch. Covert is the word i was looking for

 

Something not apparent, not openly acknowledged or displayed.

Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, fearlessNelms said:

Bravehearts

 

I don't think we can use it given the two obvious shorthand nicknames of Braves and Hearts

 

Since we have to drop NA connections, we can not use a name that has a shorthand of Braves, even if our imagery is completely unrelated. We are under too big a microscope to get away with it.

 

Tribe, Warpath, Braves... all off limits for us in our current predicament, even if it is just the shorthand of the name.

 

Shame tho, Washington Warpath would have been cool if it would not get us knocked back into the stone age.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

 

3 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

 

I don't think we can use it given the two obvious shorthand nicknames of Braves and Hearts

 

Since we have to drop NA connections, we can not use a name that has a shorthand of Braves, even if our imagery is completely unrelated. We are under too big a microscope to get away with it.

 

Tribe, Warpath, Braves... all off limits for us in our current predicament, even if it is just the shorthand of the name.

 

Shame tho, Washington Warpath would have been cool if it would not get us knocked back into the stone age.

I hear what you're saying, but Bravehearts is not the Braves. The word brave in Bravehearts is the word brave- meaning strength and courage. As long as the logo didn't have any Native American imagery, I don't know why a name like Bravehearts would be offensive. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Painkiller said:


I know La Plata, in fact I know the guy who originally drew their mascot back in the 80’s, at least the big painted one in their gym anyway.  I went to Thomas Stone in Waldorf, and La Plata was our biggest rival at the time.  I still think their mascot is probably the coolest in the area.  (Would never admit that to any of my friends that went there, lol)

 

Warriors as Knights works for me.  Heck, even Washington Knights works for me.

9B5643E3-35A7-441E-B075-CAE6D70B8D5B.gif

That's about the same color scheme I'd imagine if we were wolves instead of Redwolves. 

 

Knights? Might as well call ourselves the crusaders and that brings up some religious based cultural sensitivities. 

 

:ols::ols: bravehearts :ols::ols: seals and rhinos are better than that. Wow. I'd rather be the warriors and change it in another 10 years. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I've said before that I love the Warriors name and I've also started to get used the the Football Team name, but even though I didn't like any form of Wolves/Redwolves/Red Wolves, it makes the most sense from a marketing point of view.

 

Instead of thinking about it from a fan perspective, think about it as if you were the owner. The marketing opportunities of many of the proposed names seem fairly limited, while a Wolf based theme could be marketing gold.

 

The design options for toys, clothes, accessories, etc, could range from cute & cuddly to vicious & scary, which would appeal to a wide range of people. You could set up a Wolf Cub club/scheme to bring in young fans. You could endear yourself to animal rights/conservationists by supporting Wolf sanctuaries, etc. There could be a Wolf equivalent of Cleveland's Dog Pound. You could have Wolf howls played in the stadium the same as Jacksonville does with the Jaguar roar.

 

These are just a few off the top of my head. I'm sure that a professional marketing team could come up with many more. From an owner's point of view, a Wolf theme seems to make the most financial sense.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I kinda wish they would just go with the Washington Burgundy and Gold. No mascot. No made up names. 

  • Sad 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

The only two options for me:

 

1. Keeping football team 

2. Slight change to Football Club. Washington Football Club or DC Football Club both being acceptable.

 

All other names are trash and sounds like a powder puff/college team.

 

 

 

 

 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
  • Sad 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, fearlessNelms said:

 I don't know why a name like Bravehearts would be offensive. 

 

Well think of it like this.

 

Lets say after decades of Native American branding, we choose our new name to be the Indian Oceans, with a tidal wave as a logo.

 

The Indian Ocean is on the other side of the planet and has nothing to do with Native Americans. Our imagery would have nothing to do with Native Americans. The team name of Indian's will still be unacceptable due to the decades long association.

 

There are certain words that are well connected to Native Americans, and we will be unable to use those words, even if referencing something else. Tribe, Braves, Indians, stuff like that.

An Indian is not always a Native American, it could be some guy from India, but for us that does not matter.

A brave is not only associated with Native Americans, but for us that again does not matter.

 

An expansion team/new team can do those things, but not one under history's greatest forensic microscope and bringing years of association with it.

 

Bravehearts in and of itself is not offensive, but If we name our team the Bravehearts, which naturally shortens to Braves, it would be a giant slap in the face to the people and sponsors who forced you to change your name in the first place, and it will not be acceptable. Our merch will be de-listed all over again and your back to square one. Associated imagery does not matter in this case.

 

In the same way we will not be able to roll out Native American imagery, think spears, bows, feathers, there are simply certain words that we have to take care to avoid as well. 

 

Whatever our new team is, we will not be officially "Hail"-ing them anymore for example. Even though it is a term rooted in many applications, most notably the Presidency and its theme, it has strong ties to NAs as well. The team will have to find another word to replace it.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/8/2021 at 7:44 AM, UK Skins said:

I know it's The Replacements but I actually really like Sentinels. Local link to the area, cool name, we could keep b&g. What's not to like? We could play the Judas Priest song when they run out too.

Breaking the law, Breaking the law!

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

In the same way we will not be able to roll out Native American imagery, think spears, bows, feathers, there are simply certain words that we have to take care to avoid as well. 

 

I asked this question once before, but the only person that responded to it didn't actually answer it.

 

In this submission below, never mind the name and the logo  ( which some might say looks like a weathervane, and others might say it's charm lies in it's simplicity. Either way, subconsciously at least, fans would be comparing it to the logo in my signature, and that ones tough to beat. But I digress. 🙂 )

 

The pattern on the right ...

 

Screen-Shot-2021-04-19-at-10.54.52-AM.png

 

 

I understand the team is probably posting quite a few submissions that have absolutely no chance of being chosen, but all things considered, if there can be no NA references at all; why would the team post on their website new ideas containing precisely that ?

 

 

Edited by Spearfeather
Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, Spearfeather said:

 

I understand the team is probably posting quite a few submissions that have absolutely no chance of being chosen, but all things considered, if there can be no NA references at all; why would the team post on their website new ideas containing precisely that.

 

 

 

Simple answer? Money

 

How many hits and eyeballs do they get when they put out stories about staying WFT?

How many more people get energized when their favorite idea (even if unusable) is still "in the running"

How many videos and articles were spawned when the team put out ideas like the Demon Cats or Rubies

 

This whole re-brand is being run by a digital marketing firm. They know the value of fanning flames and keeping people invested. It is in their best interest for people to believe every name could be valid at this point.

 

 

Just look at how they are seeding the Redwolves community. For a team called WFT, don't you think its weird how there were so many HTTR banners in their making the brand video? Or how they go out of their way to ask people if there should be animal mascots. Its all intentional. They want that hype, and they are actively taking steps to build it.

 

They know exactly what they are doing, and what buttons they can press to keep people both invested and motivated. As a result here we are a year later still talking about it. That is some serious sustained energy.

 

Now Code and Theory can go to their next potential client and say "look at the buzz we generated for Washington! Don't you want that for your re-branding effort!"

Now WFT might have people buying tickets to games and going to sponsored events for reasons other than the on the field product, possibly opening wallets they didn't have access to before. You have waves of people bombarding them with letters, emails, submissions and comments as well in a time where a lot of fans are usually more invested in the Wizards/Nats/Caps

 

They are attacking hearts, minds, wallets and absorbing peoples time. all that equals $$$

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

Simple answer? Money

 

2 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

For a team called WFT, don't you think its weird how there were so many HTTR banners in their making the brand video? Or how they go out of their way to ask people if there should be animal mascots. Its all intentional. They want that hype, and they are actively taking steps to build it.

 

Yeah, I have to respectfully say, I don't think I buy that. In that entire five minute video, I counted one " HTTR " flag, and it was obscured.

Another video I remember was the one put out by the team showing them painting over all the HTTR's and logo's throughout the stadium.

 

I don't think they're posting ideas containing NA imagery in an attempt to ultimately get someone excited about buying that Warriors or Wolves T-shirt that contains nothing of the sort.

 

Edited by Spearfeather
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, Painkiller said:


Earlier today I posted two examples of “Warriors” logos that have no connection whatsoever to Native Americans.  I’d be thrilled with either one.  Switch out Warriors with “Bravehearts” and you can still use at least the first one with the sword and shield.  Whether you want to admit it or not it can be done and there are plenty of cool Warriors logos out there that do not use Native American imagery whatsoever.  

Also, unless you have had a talk with reps from Golden State you have no idea what they are willing to do.  They may be more willing to share than you realize.  Especially since they are the Golden State Warriors and we would be the Washington Warriors, playing in two different leagues on opposite ends of the country.  

 

And I'll say again, it's not going to be "Warriors," and none of your arguments would make any difference as to why.

 

It DOES NOT MATTER what non-NA logo you want to come up with for "Warriors." It's not going to be chosen because THE NAME ITSELF has baggage of the sort they don't want to deal with at this point in any capacity, and whether those reasons are "right" or "wrong" also doesn't matter. It's like arguing with an annoying relative over politics. Even when you know you're right and think their beliefs are ridiculous and stupid, sometimes you just decide you don't want to deal with the fight, so you talk about the weather. That's where this team is at in relation to a new name. They will court as close to zero controversy as they can when making their decision. "Warriors" will not allow them to do that.

 

I know, I know: "But NAs don't have exclusive rights to that word! But if it's a knight and shield or a roman spear, that obviously has nothing to do with NAs. How could they complain at that point?"

 

And I'm telling you many WOULD complain, especially if the team chose "Warriors" and kept a simple, generic W. If they did that, a LOT would complain, because then it would be far more easy to accuse the team of trying to preserve its ties to NA PEOPLE as part of its imagery ("People" is the important word there), no matter what the team may say publicly. 

 

So if they did go the "Warriors" route, they would HAVE to pick a very distinct image/logo that is totally set apart from NA heritage. That's probably where your knight and shield or "Spartan warrior" come in. (And for the record, there is NO WAY the team is going to use a spear in any capacity in a new logo. Absolutely none. I mean, come on.)

 

I don't believe the team wants to go that route. I don't think they have any interest in creating something that would remove us so far from our history and tradition, especially for something that has no ties at all to our area like a knight or some other generic, overdone, cliched image of a "warrior." 

 

I think what the team wants is to cut as few ties to our past and our heritage as possible. They don't want to do a full-scale, total reinvention. The fact that they're not changing the color scheme shows that. That's where something like "Redwolves" fits the bill perfectly. Obviously that's my far and away number one choice, so let's just say they went with "Wolves" instead. I don't love it, but I could deal with it. It still has subtle NA ties, in that it represents an animal very important to NA culture, but it's also pretty much protest-proof.

 

"But if you can tie 'Redwolves' back into NA culture, why is that OK but 'Warriors' isn't?"

 

Simple. Because what NAs were mad about was that our name and imagery reflected on THEIR PEOPLE, both in the name and the logo. They're not going to complain about a wolf being chosen just because wolves are spiritually important in many NA cultures.

 

The name "Warriors" just has SO MUCH going against it. It would be a headache for them in so many ways if they went that route. And why would they want to cause unnecessary headaches if they don't have to, especially for a cliched, already-used name like that? (Why anyone would want to share a name with another pro team versus having something unique and all our own is utterly beyond me.) Further, most fans who've selected it don't seem to be very passionate about it. It's more like, "That's the best choice I see" vs. "THIS IS WHAT WE MUST CHOOSE!" You'll find far more of the latter in the "Redwolves" camp. 

 

You've argued the point passionately, but do you feel real passion for that name? If so, you'd be the first I encountered. I don't see anyone getting emotional over wanting "Warriors" because of what the name truly means to them on some deeper level, but I see that with "Redwolves" all over the place. That's not saying it's going to be "Redwolves." But whatever they pick, it needs to have that sort of reaction in as many people as possible. 

 

 

 

Edited by Dissident2
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Spearfeather said:

 

 

Yeah, I have to respectively say, I don't think I buy that. In that entire five minute video, I counted one " HTTR " flag, and it was obscured.

Another video I remember was the one put out by the team showing them painting over all the HTTR's and logo's throughout the stadium.

 

I don't think they're posting ideas containing NA imagery in an attempt to ultimately get someone excited about buying that Warriors or Wolves T-shirt that contains nothing of the sort.

 

 

There was definitely more than one. And I remember the first one early in the video being amazingly prominent, like a single guy with a towel taking up half the screen.

There was also stock footage of past large crowds with people holding up HTTR scrolls. Off the top of my head that makes at least two, with multiple scrolls being in sight on the crowd scene.

 

It was a short video, so allotting multiple shots to the HTTR, which was not even available to use last season meaning they had to deliberately go back and select old footage to do so, seems pretty intentional. 

 

 

The idea is not to sell t-shirts. They don't make money off of unofficial merch after all. The idea is to keep as many people engaged as possible. That increases the amount of awareness and eyeballs on the team which leads to greater commitment to team movement/activity which in turn leads to money. More people on their websites. More people at their draft party and more people at their games when they start.

 

and it absolutely has been working. Rando's selling T-shirts is just a side effect of that.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...