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2021 Draft Order / Tracker: Current Pick #19


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17 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

Yeah I was never big  on Jones, he seemed to have a low ceiling and would never be more than an adequate starters. Now it's pretty clear he may never even get to that level.  

 

I wouldn't go that far.  I think Jones can still be a solid starter.  The Giants should have won that game.   If Engram does drop that third down pass, they ice the game.  Jones still has to improve a lot, but it sounds like he is a hard worker, so it could happen.  Jones like Haskins was a project--people don't seem to understand projects take time.

 

That said if NYG are in position to draft either Lawrence or Fields I think they will because they are looking at a probable talent upgrade.  But if they are drafting 4th they don't have to take a Trey Lance (another project), they can take BPA.

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1 hour ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

Well the Giants somehow found a way to stay ahead of us. Why are people saying Daniel Jones tripped when he obviously ran out of gas and his legs gave out?  Oh yeah, 2 more turnover for Jones, Gman have to be thinking QB in the draft. 

 

Imagine if we pick 3rd and both QB's are off the board. First, I hope we would take Sewell and not Ja'Marr Chase. Second, we would still suck. We HAVE to figure out our QB situation. 


Sewell, Sweat, Chase Young, McLaurin are a pretty good 4 person core, but you need a QB and a team behind that. 

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42 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

Imagine if we pick 3rd and both QB's are off the board. First, I hope we would take Sewell and not Ja'Marr Chase. Second, we would still suck. We HAVE to figure out our QB situation. 


Sewell, Sweat, Chase Young, McLaurin are a pretty good 4 person core, but you need a QB and a team behind that. 

 

If both Lawrence and Fields are off the board you could go Lance or veteran, but a third choice would be to go after a Sam Darnold or Daniel Jones (assuming their team picked Lawrence or Fields) and see if a change of setting helped them.   A fourth, albeit, unlikely scenario is giving Haskins another shot.

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I'm not sure if the Giants go QB. They are historically a pretty patient franchise and turnovers aside, Jones has shown flashes and that's without Barkley. They might be thinking: we get a top 3 pick and Barkley back, draft someone like Jamar Chase to give Jones another weapon going into year 3 and lets go.

 

They may try to trade down though, but it'll depend on if anyone is desperate enough to give up a mother lode for Justin Fields.

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18 hours ago, Number 44 said:

There was no overtime.

The NFL didn't institute overtime for non-playoff games until 1974.  That's hardly ancient history -- some of us were alive back then.  In fact, it's within the Super Bowl Era.

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7 minutes ago, GothSkinsFan said:

The NFL didn't institute overtime for non-playoff games until 1974.  That's hardly ancient history -- some of us were alive back then.  In fact, it's within the Super Bowl Era.

That's what I'm saying.

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18 hours ago, ConnSKINS26 said:


You: “it’s not *that* unheard of.”

 

Also you: cites a statistic from one hundred and one years ago. 101! 

Wrong!  The oldest statistic I cited was from 1922 -- that's ninety-eight years ago.  98!  There wasn't an NFL 101 years ago.  (It started in 1922.)  There wasn't even an APFA, the NFL's precursor, which started in 1920 -- still not 101 years ago.  Also, the Bears 6 ties was in 1932 -- thirty-two -- dude!  (They went 7-1-6 and won the NFL championship.)  1932 would be, hmmm, doing the math, 88 years ago.

 

You know what?  Let's take this to the MLB forum, because I can't wait for you to tell me that Murderers' Row is too illegit not to quit.

 

BTW:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NFL_tied_games

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/

(You can seriously get lost, in a good way, in the profootball reference site.)

 

All that aside,it was a lot of fun to go back through the ancient records of the NFL.  Has anyone here ever researched why NFL positions such as DT, DE, OT, OG, and the various backs (1/4, 1/2, 4/4 - there is no 3/4 back coz there's no waltzing in football) ?  Comes from rugby and makes no sense today.

Edited by GothSkinsFan
Left out a close-paren
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I think Jones shows the touch and the poise to make some really nice plays and his biggest issue seems to be turnovers. I can very easily see a correction in that and I can see him becoming a very good starter in this league. Again he’s got very little to work with with Barkley out. Andrew Thomas looks like a massive bust, he’s got a bunch of number 3 receivers out there and his TE has drop issues. While the fumble was dumb there were 30 seconds left and he was trying to make a play.

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27 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

I think Jones shows the touch and the poise to make some really nice plays and his biggest issue seems to be turnovers. I can very easily see a correction in that and I can see him becoming a very good starter in this league. Again he’s got very little to work with with Barkley out. Andrew Thomas looks like a massive bust, he’s got a bunch of number 3 receivers out there and his TE has drop issues. While the fumble was dumb there were 30 seconds left and he was trying to make a play.

 

I don't think he'll ever fully iron out his turnover issues. They've been a problem since college and it has continued in the league. He might be able to cut back on the INTs a bit if he schools himself to be more careful and learns to read defenses better, but the fumbles IMO are a product of the dude simply having no sense for pressure. He just never seems to have that "second sense" radar that lets him know when guys are closing in on him. And I don't think that's something that's easy to really "develop". 

 

I think Jones will be pretty much what I and others figured he'd be coming out: a decent floor / somewhat low ceiling guy who could become a solid starter but nothing special and will continue to have turnover issues. So far that seems to be pretty on point. 

 

That said, I sorta doubt they'll move on from him this coming draft. As others noted, the Giants do tend to have some modicum of patience with their QBs. And as long as Jones has a good supporting cast, he can be decent. He's shown some flashes which is probably enough to give them the hope that he'll improve and become that franchise QB. 

 

That might change if they had the #1 pick though. Might be tough for them to pass on someone who is such an obvious talent upgrade as Lawrence. Especially if they could move Jones for a 2nd rounder or something as well.

Edited by mistertim
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1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

I'm not sure if the Giants go QB. They are historically a pretty patient franchise and turnovers aside, Jones has shown flashes and that's without Barkley. They might be thinking: we get a top 3 pick and Barkley back, draft someone like Jamar Chase to give Jones another weapon going into year 3 and lets go.

 

They may try to trade down though, but it'll depend on if anyone is desperate enough to give up a mother lode for Justin Fields.


As the Giants GM in ES Mock Draft I already know who I plan on drafting!

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10 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I don't think he'll ever fully iron out his turnover issues. They've been a problem since college and it has continued in the league. He might be able to cut back on the INTs a bit if he schools himself to be more careful and learns to read defenses better, but the fumbles IMO are a product of the dude simply having no sense for pressure. He just never seems to have that "second sense" radar that lets him know when guys are closing in on him. And I don't think that's something that's easy to really "develop". 

 

I think Jones will be pretty much what I and others figured he'd be coming out: a decent floor / somewhat low ceiling guy who could become a solid starter but nothing special and will continue to have turnover issues. So far that seems to be pretty on point. 

 

That said, I sorta doubt they'll move on from him this coming draft. As others noted, the Giants do tend to have some modicum of patience with their QBs. And as long as Jones has a good supporting cast, he can be decent. He's shown some flashes which is probably enough to give them the hope that he'll improve and become that franchise QB. 

 

That might change if they had the #1 pick though. Might be tough for them to pass on someone who is such an obvious talent upgrade as Lawrence. Especially if they could move Jones for a 2nd rounder or something as well.

If they end up -#1 or 2 then yes. However if they correct that line and make it a priority it’ll minimize the amount of pressure Jones has to face. He seems to make some absolutely amazing throws when he’s flushed out of the pocket and rolling but it’s when he’s standing there almost flat footed does he seem to fumble. Prevent the pressure coming from his blind side (easier said than done) and I think he’s smart enough to scramble out when he can at least see the pressure. Sewell is the absolute most logical pick for them even with Thomas at LT and just drafted. Move him to RT or even LG and that’s strong.

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I do think Jones will cut down on the turnovers, yes that is part of the maturation process of a young QB.  But he will probably still have that problem and to over come that you have to be special in other areas and nothing about him says he's special in any way.

 

Oh a big no on Darnalds   As I keep asking how many first round busts go to a new team and become franchise QBs?  Like none.  You can find out most of what you know about a QB by his second season these days.  

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5 minutes ago, Barry.Randolphe said:

 

 

Any chance Mac Jones would be available with our 2nd rounder?

 

 

If Mara gets his way that second rounder is likely to be forfeit as part of the punishment package for Snyder’s cheerleader fiasco. I just hope they don’t go after our first round pick too.

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2 hours ago, TrancesWithWolves said:

 

 

If Mara gets his way that second rounder is likely to be forfeit as part of the punishment package for Snyder’s cheerleader fiasco. I just hope they don’t go after our first round pick too.

Source: dude trust me

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4 hours ago, JoggingGod said:

Source: dude trust me

 

I didn’t think this was anything close to a revelation.

 

I heard the loss of a high draft pick or picks and/or a fine speculated as a likely punishment on sports talk radio as recently as last week. Others have mentioned this on the forum as well.

 

At this point no one knows what the result of the “independent” investigation will be but it’s an open secret that the Mara’s have significant influence in the corporate office in New York and they have no love for Snyder. It would be in their interest and in line with their past behavior to push for the most draconian solution.

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1 hour ago, TrancesWithWolves said:

 

I didn’t think this was anything close to a revelation.

 

I heard the loss of a high draft pick or picks and/or a fine speculated as a likely punishment on sports talk radio as recently as last week. Others have mentioned this on the forum as well.

 

At this point no one knows what the result of the “independent” investigation will be but it’s an open secret that the Mara’s have significant influence in the corporate office in New York and they have no love for Snyder. It would be in their interest and in line with their past behavior to push for the most draconian solution.

Source: dude trust me

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