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2021 Comprehensive Draft Thread


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33 minutes ago, RWJ said:

Truth be told I ignored you not blocked you.  Could have sent in a message but am letting you know.  All is well, KD.  Sometimes I get my fill.  I apologize.  Can't wait till the draft starts and see what happens nights 1 and 2.  That will tell us what they plan.  :)

One thing we can do.  If Fitz plays well for us this year and we don't draft a QB (I am hoping like you we get our future guy this year) we can sign Fitz for another year to groom next year's QB if we draft one next year.

And if Fitz isn’t good? We’re screwed as a franchise.

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1 minute ago, JoggingGod said:

And if Fitz isn’t good? We’re screwed as a franchise.

Dude, let it play out.  Your already judging the guy before he's taken his first snap.  

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1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

I hope somebody knows what they are doing. If I wanted someone who had no idea what they were doing, one could just hire Vinny Cerrato :P

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25 minutes ago, RWJ said:

Dude, let it play out.  Your already judging the guy before he's taken his first snap.  

He’s played 16 years in the league. We already know what he is.

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2 hours ago, JoggingGod said:

What makes you think anybody that has a breakout is going to be in reach for us? If we finish 7-10/6-11 even we’ll be settling for scraps.

Your point was "everybody next year sux", now (?) it's "how do we get one?".  The same way we do this year - trade current and future picks and/or players (or if we still had the only Allen worth a damn (George), picks we don't have, j/k).  It may even be easier given how many of the teams projected to have high picks next year will have already drafted QBs in the last few years.  This is assuming Fitzheineckallen doesn't lead us to the Promised Land.

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25 minutes ago, Jericho said:

 

I hope somebody knows what they are doing. If I wanted someone who had no idea what they were doing, one could just hire Vinny Cerrato :P

 

Always love seeing a Vinny Cerrato reference. 

 

Willem Dafoe Smile GIF

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1 hour ago, RWJ said:

That's one QB

It’s a big unknown for sure, but there were only two at this point last year - Lawrence and Fields.

1 hour ago, JoggingGod said:

All I care about is QB because that’s the biggest gaping hole we have right now. If we don’t draft one this year we have to be desperate in getting one of the top guys next year because we can’t waste this core on Kyle Allen.

Yeah, I think there’s some urgency to getting a qb this year, and that urgency will likely ramp up next year (though I’d guess Fitz re-signs if we don’t land a rookie... and maybe even if we do).  We’ll see how it plays out.

 

Curious what people think about WFT meeting with Felipe Franks?

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3 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

It’s a big unknown for sure, but there were only two at this point last year - Lawrence and Fields.

Yeah, I think there’s some urgency to getting a qb this year, and that urgency will likely ramp up next year (though I’d guess Fitz re-signs if we don’t land a rookie... and maybe even if we do).  We’ll see how it plays out.

 

Curious what people think about WFT meeting with Felipe Franks?

Franks is a camp body. Doesn’t mean much.

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2 hours ago, KDawg said:


There’s a ton of talent in this upcoming draft class as it stands right now. I don’t get this thought process. Every year there is always significant talent entering the league. 

Kayvon Thibadeaux Edge Oregon

Derek Stingley CB LSU

John Metchie WR Alabama

Bubba Bolden S Miami

Evan Neal OT Alabama

Christian Harris LB Alabama

Sam Howell QB UNC

JT Daniels QB Georgia

Dillon Gabriel QB UCF

Spencer Rattler QB Oklahoma

Rasheed Walker OT Penn State

Charles Cross OT Miss State

Chris Olave WR Ohio State

Sevyn Banks CB Ohio State

Jalen Wydermyer TE Texas A&M

Zion Nelson OT Miami

Cade Mays OG Tennessee

Isaiah Spiller RB Texas A&M

Justyn Ross WR Clemson


That’s just off the top of my head. There will be risers and fallers and new guys entering the fray. But the class being bad is silly. The top two safeties are Moehrig level of good if not better. The top TE would be better than any TE in this draft as an in-line guy (isn’t a pass catcher like Pitts though). The top receivers aren’t as good as the top of this year’s class but they are damn good. The QBs may wind up being more heralded as a whole than this year’s crop. 
 

And, not to mention... the overall defensive talent in the 2022 draft class is MUCH better at the top than this season.

 

 

 

 

The poster you quoted was referring to qbs (and WFT being in the same position as this year - needing to trade up big time to land a top guy).  With that said, and as you’re maybe eluding to - the more talent there is overall, the better chance a good qb falls.

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7 minutes ago, GothSkinsFan said:

The same way we do this year - trade current and future picks and/or players

So why not do that now when we already know there are good prospects? Why wait until there’s possibly only 1 or 2 first round talents and they will go too high?

3 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

The poster you quoted was referring to qbs (and WFT being in the same position as this year - needing to trade up big time to land a top guy).  With that said, and as you’re maybe eluding to - the more talent there is overall, the better chance a good qb falls.

A good QB doesn’t fall to you. That’s not how it works anymore. You have to be ultra aggressive in getting your guy, which half of this fanbase thinks is the worst thing ever and we can still win with game managers.

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2 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

So why not do that now when we already know there are good prospects? Why wait until there’s possibly only 1 or 2 first round talents and they will go too high?

Depends on who is available of course, but I think they’ll try to.  The problem is the other teams ahead of us and the price we’d have to pay to leapfrog them.  So unless you’re advocating for ‘outbid them at all costs’ position, there’s a very good chance we’ll have to wait and try again next year.

And, as I started with - it depends who the 49ers take and who the WFT FO loves.  My assumption is they’d trade up for Lance and Fields, but not Jones, but that might not be the case.  Perhaps they only think Fields is worth trading for, and if he goes #3, it’s on to Mills/Trask/etc or waiting until 2022.

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18 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

It’s a big unknown for sure, but there were only two at this point last year - Lawrence and Fields.

Yeah, I think there’s some urgency to getting a qb this year, and that urgency will likely ramp up next year (though I’d guess Fitz re-signs if we don’t land a rookie... and maybe even if we do).  We’ll see how it plays out.

 

Curious what people think about WFT meeting with Felipe Franks?

Maybe doing their due diligence.  I don't think much of it myself. 

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23 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

Curious what people think about WFT meeting with Felipe Franks?

 

I've read that teams will meet with candidates that have flags, and the meetings are more to say whether or not to keep them on the draft board.  I heard a rumor somewhere (maybe here), that Franks is an asshole who wasn't well liked in either of the college locker rooms he's been in.

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3 minutes ago, Alcoholic Zebra said:

 

I've read that teams will meet with candidates that have flags, and the meetings are more to say whether or not to keep them on the draft board.  I heard a rumor somewhere (maybe here), that Franks is an asshole who wasn't well liked in either of the college locker rooms he's been in.

He got beat out by Trask.  Whether it was his attitude or whatever that makes a statement.

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26 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

The poster you quoted was referring to qbs (and WFT being in the same position as this year - needing to trade up big time to land a top guy).  With that said, and as you’re maybe eluding to - the more talent there is overall, the better chance a good qb falls.

I also posted a list of four QBs in there. Would help if people looked through it. But yes. You’re absolutely right.

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We have other -- and frankly, more pressing -- needs this year than QB and we have an opportunity to fill them in this draft:  LB, OT, FS, TE2, WR2/3 (dep. on how you view Samuel in relation to McLaurin), and RB1.5/2 (dep. on how badly you want to chew through Gibson).  With smart drafting, we can fill them all this year.  When was the last time the B&G (which should be the team nickname) was in a position to stock the team at every position except QB, and as to that, had a QB who was motivated and respected by his entire team?  Hint:  1991.  30 friggin' years ago a team like this one could be dominated the NFL and then destroyed the 2nd-best team in the Super Bowl.  Mark "blase' haircut" Rypien went to Disneyland on Disney's dime.  Let's give Fitzpatrick a chance to do the same.

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3. SAN FRANCISCO. Today’s the last day of substance in fact-finding for the Niners, with GM John Lynch and coach Kyle Shanahan expected in Fargo at North Dakota State quarterback Trey Lance’s second workout. The leader in the clubhouse is still Alabama’s Mac Jones, but that’s all Jones is. Credit to Lynch and Shanahan for keeping a tight lid on their preference. I keep coming back to Jones’ accuracy (his 77.4-percent season in 2020 is the most accurate in major-college history) and his touch downfield, with the best accuracy of the top five quarterbacks on passes thrown 20 yards or more downfield.

I think Shanahan will value accuracy and presence over athleticism and prefer Jones, but that’s not inside info—just my gut feeling.

4. ATLANTA. Pivot point of the draft. Falcons are doing a great job of disguising their intentions and, per Tom Pelissero of NFL Network, will have three reps at the Lance workout today.

What I’m hearing: Owner Arthur Blank is fascinated by the quarterbacks atop the draft, thinking the franchise might not be in such an advantageous position to take one for years. But Blank will not force a decision—of that I am sure. He hired GM Terry Fontenot and coach Arthur Smith and won’t big-foot them on their first big call. Smith likes the quarterbacks too, but also likes Matt Ryan, who will play at 36 this fall and likely has four or five solid years left. Fontenot may—and I emphasized may, because I’ve heard varying things here—prefer to trade out of the pick for a ransom, if one is there. But Smith and Fontenot are also value shoppers too. The value here is to take the best non-quarterback in the draft, tight end Kyle Pitts.

5. CINCINNATI. How the Bengals don’t take Oregon tackle Penei Sewell is beyond me, especially because this draft is filthy-rich in receivers—as with every recent draft. But I also hear the drumbeat is loud for Ja’Marr Chase, who made such beautiful music with Joe Burrow in 2019 at LSU (average game: 127 receiving yards, 21.2 yards per catch). Clearly, I’d vote for the Joe Burrow Preservation Plan, and start this draft tackle at 5, guard at 38. Burrow’s good enough, if he has time, to win with Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd and a lesser third option (Rondale Moore?).

6. MIAMI. The football world is sure GM Chris Grier wants to come out of round one with a major weapon (Pitts or Chase, perhaps). Grier’s an aggressive man, but I doubt he’d use part of his stash of picks (overall picks 6, 18, 36, 50 this year) to move up to four to get the weapon of Miami’s dreams. He knows he can stay at six and get one of the four electric pass-catchers in the draft. Grier’s maneuvering over the past two years has left him in the power position to do what he and coach Brian Flores really want to do—no question about that. My gut is they stay at six and get the BAW—best available weapon.

8. CAROLINA. The Panthers are in an intriguing spot. Smart money says one of the five quarterbacks will still be on the board at eight, so new Panthers GM Scott Fitterer could be in the luxurious position of having three options: Picking the quarterback and giving him a comfy redshirt year behind Sam Darnold, or trading to a team desperate for, say, Justin Fields here, or taking a very solid player to continue the Carolina rebuild.

One thing I do know (and not just because Matt Rhule just spent a learning day with Jimmy Johnson, who always had a trove of picks to work with) is Carolina wants to come out of this draft with more picks than the seven it currently holds. The average team has 8.1 picks in an NFL draft, including Compensatory Picks. Over the last eight drafts, Carolina has averaged 6.3 picks per year. Knowing Rhule and Fitterer, that’s got to burn them. Particularly after trading three picks for Darnold, look for them to work to gain more April 29-May 1.

9. DENVER. Maybe one of those future picks for Carolina could come from Denver. Connecting dots here: What if new GM and Vikings transplant George Paton (in the room when Teddy Bridgewater was Minnesota’s first-round pick in 2014) passes on a quarterback in, say, the first three rounds and Bridgewater needs a home? Maybe Paton wouldn’t mind putting some veteran heat on Drew Lock. This was not my idea, but I think it makes a lot of sense, particularly if Carolina softens the cap blow by helping with the cash owed Bridgewater.

10. DALLAS. Another trade-up spot for a QB-seeking team if one’s still available. Said one NFC coach: “I can’t see how the Cowboys pass up [Northwestern tackle] Rashawn Slater if he’s there. That offensive line is declining fast.”

15. NEW ENGLAND. Bill Belichick has run or been a chief honcho in 26 drafts—five in Cleveland, 21 in New England. Never has he picked a quarterback in the first round. Once has he picked a quarterback in the second round (Jimmy Garoppolo, 2014). Never has he picked a quarterback in the top 60 of a draft. So you might look at all that history and eliminate the Pats from moving up to 10 or nine or eight to pick a passer. I wouldn’t eliminate that chance, because Belichick is proving this year that there’s no book on roster-building for him, particularly in the post-Brady era. Now, I doubt the Pats will trade next year’s first-round pick, the likely cost to move up into QB-acquisition position, but nothing’s certain with the Patriots now.

As we learned from the un-Belichickian spending spree in free agency, Belichick will do what is best for his franchise in a given year. Now, if they don’t pick a passer in round one, Florida’s Kyle Trask at 46 or 96 (their picks in rounds two and three) wouldn’t surprise me.

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Dillon Gabriel has a lot of Tua Tagavailoa in him.  He'll be one to watch during the 2021 season.

 

UCF had three NFL prospects at WR/TE and the least regarded of them but also the best one is my guy Marlon Williams:

 

 

He's going to be a seventh round pick or UDFA I think because he is not a good track athlete and is not a body beautiful prospect.  But he was the leading receiver in the country before he opted out for a reason.  He comes from the AJ Brown/JuJu school of big slots where he's super physical through the contact window and at the catch point, and his catch and runs often turn into fist fights.

 

The thing I like best about him is how smart he is.  He has fabulous football instincts and constantly makes quick adjustments to routes, throws, and blocks and plays great situational football.  He crushes zone coverage.  And he's got good hands.  He's not going to get a lot of separation against quality man coverage, but he is a tough competitor who knows how to use his body to win leverage and wall off the coverage so he is still highly productive down the field.  Bailed out a lot of off target throws with superior anticipation and hand-work.

 

I think he's way more than the sum of his parts.  I wonder how his interviews are.  If he interviewed well I'd be willing to draft him, maybe even a little higher than the consensus to make sure I got him in my locker room.  He's going to be a day 3 pick or a UDFA, so the risk is low for a guy with the kind of skill/competitive make up of an NFL starter.

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2 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Dillon Gabriel has a lot of Tua Tagavailoa in him.  He'll be one to watch during the 2021 season.

 

UCF had three NFL prospects at WR/TE and the least regarded of them but also the best one is my guy Marlon Williams:

 

 

He's going to be a seventh round pick or UDFA I think because he is not a good track athlete and is not a body beautiful prospect.  But he was the leading receiver in the country before he opted out for a reason.  He comes from the AJ Brown/JuJu school of big slots where he's super physical through the contact window and at the catch point, and his catch and runs often turn into fist fights.

 

The thing I like best about him is how smart he is.  He has fabulous football instincts and constantly makes quick adjustments to routes, throws, and blocks and plays great situational football.  He crushes zone coverage.  And he's got good hands.  He's not going to get a lot of separation against quality man coverage, but he is a tough competitor who knows how to use his body to win leverage and wall off the coverage so he is still highly productive down the field.  Bailed out a lot of off target throws with superior anticipation and hand-work.

 

I think he's way more than the sum of his parts.  I wonder how his interviews are.  If he interviewed well I'd be willing to draft him, maybe even a little higher than the consensus to make sure I got him in my locker room.  He's going to be a day 3 pick or a UDFA, so the risk is low for a guy with the kind of skill/competitive make up of an NFL starter.

Gabriel is who my eye is on. For sure.

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2 hours ago, JoggingGod said:

And if Fitz isn’t good? We’re screwed as a franchise.

It is more likely that anybody we draft at QB will be a bust. If we trade up, we are much more likely to be screwed as a franchise. You need to wait until you are a perinial playoff contender and trade up then like KC (playoffs 3 out of 4 years, 4 straight winning seasons and 3 11 or more win regular seasons BEFORE the trade), hope you get lucky (UDFA like Dallas, later pick like Seattle, someone good somehow hits FA like Tampa, another teams trash like Tennessee or someone slides to your natural pick like happened for Green Bay) or or have a bad season at the right time when you are actually decent like Pittsburgh.

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44 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Gabriel is who my eye is on. For sure.

 

Gabriel is definitely fun to watch and I also see some Tua in him. But man, he needs to put some meat on his bones if he's wants to play in the NFL. At 6'0 185 he's a full 30lbs lighter than Tua. Definite durability concerns there IMO.

 

32 minutes ago, Darth Tater said:

It is more likely that anybody we draft at QB will be a bust. If we trade up, we are much more likely to be screwed as a franchise. You need to wait until you are a perinial playoff contender and trade up then like KC (playoffs 3 out of 4 years, 4 straight winning seasons and 3 11 or more win regular seasons BEFORE the trade), hope you get lucky (UDFA like Dallas, later pick like Seattle, someone good somehow hits FA like Tampa, another teams trash like Tennessee or someone slides to your natural pick like happened for Green Bay) or or have a bad season at the right time when you are actually decent like Pittsburgh.

 

So a team isn't allowed to trade up until they've been to the playoffs for multiple years in a row first? If we go to the playoffs again this season will you allow it next draft? Or does it have to be the full 4 years with 75% playoff appearances?

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1 minute ago, mistertim said:

 

Gabriel is definitely fun to watch and I also see some Tua in him. But man, he needs to put some meat on his bones if he's wants to play in the NFL. At 6'0 185 he's a full 30lbs lighter than Tua. Definite durability concerns there IMO.

 

 

So a team isn't allowed to trade up until they've been to the playoffs for multiple years in a row first? If we go to the playoffs again this season will you allow it next draft? Or does it have to be the full 4 years with 75% playoff appearances?

He’s young. 

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