2021 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Going Commando]

What's our consensus on Asante Samuel Jr here?  IIRC, we talked about him at the beginning of the college season and we all seemed to like him, but we haven't really talked about him since.  We should form a consensus on him since he is one of our most likely day two targets.

 

I was going back over his highlights and FSU defensive cut ups and he looks pretty good to me.  Looks like a cover three guy mainly but there is a lot of off man too.  Might be a bit of a confusing fit after signing William Jackson seemed to signal we wanted to run Denver style man coverages.  But man... it would be cool to have such a physical and aggressive downhill corner lurking around in the secondary for a pressure front like the one we have.  He can play some press too, but that feels like asking for trouble if you have him do it a lot.

 

Such a dog.  If we're talking about adding tone setters at every level of our D, he certainly qualifies as one.  In his highlights he's chopping down AJ Dillon and tight ends and body slamming receivers.

 

I really want us to get him now.  God damn.  He's the defensive side of the coin to Rondale Moore.  I am hoping for a class where we trade down, get Cosmi, get Rondale, get Samuel, and get Trask.

[seantaylor=god]

It’s kind of funny that so many of the top CBs this year are from recent NFL bloodlines-

Horn (Joe Horn’s kid)

Surtain

Samuel 

 

All big time players.

[Burgundy Yoda]

23 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

What's our consensus on Asante Samuel Jr here?  IIRC, we talked about him at the beginning of the college season and we all seemed to like him, but we haven't really talked about him since.  We should form a consensus on him since he is one of our most likely day two targets.

 

I was going back over his highlights and FSU defensive cut ups and he looks pretty good to me.  Looks like a cover three guy mainly but there is a lot of off man too.  Might be a bit of a confusing fit after signing William Jackson seemed to signal we wanted to run Denver style man coverages.  But man... it would be cool to have such a physical and aggressive downhill corner lurking around in the secondary for a pressure front like the one we have.  He can play some press too, but that feels like asking for trouble if you have him do it a lot.

 

Such a dog.  If we're talking about adding tone setters at every level of our D, he certainly qualifies as one.  In his highlights he's chopping down AJ Dillon and tight ends and body slamming receivers.

 

I really want us to get him now.  God damn.  He's the defensive side of the coin to Rondale Moore.  I am hoping for a class where we trade down, get Cosmi, get Rondale, get Samuel, and get Trask.

I'm not really a fan of having 3 of our top 4 CBs being undersized. 5'10" 184 pounds scares me as a CB on the outside if he doesn't have elite speed. I don't want Kendall Fuller on the outside either, he's an average #2 but a great nickel CB, we all witnessed that in 2017. Samuel will probably be a fantastic nickel CB, but more than any other position if you're an outside CB playing in a defense that is playing a lot of man coverages, size/speed combo matters immensely.

 

Look at L'Jarius Sneed, who was arguably the best rookie CB last year. 6'1", long arms, 4.37 40 time. Those are prototypical measurements and time at the position, it gave him an edge at the NFL level, while Okudah was pedestrian and looked like he didn't trust his speed. 

 

CB is a very tricky position to draft, but the template for them has to be size/speed IMO, then you work from there to see who stands out. If the team views Fuller as an outside guy that can do well in man coverage, then I'd be down with Asante Samuel Jr. because I'd be willing to be he'll be a good to great nickel CB. 

 

I'd say for our team and how it's constructed, he should be a 3rd rounder. 

Edited April 14, 2021 by Burgundy Yoda

[RabidFan]

Could always add Sherman on outside post draft. His numbers were good and would give us a year to find another guy

[Skinsinparadise]

9 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

 

My biggest concern with Owusu-Koromoah isn't his size actually.  It's his recklessness.  @KDawg and I have discussed the worrisome sloppiness in his play, and I think it should be taken into account in his draft stock.  He's going to give up big plays when he hunts for the big play.  The cost of this was minimized at ND because their offense was pretty explosive and very dominant on the ground and he had a superstar like Kyle Hamilton behind him cleaning up some of his mistakes too.  I felt like he had a tremendous amount of freedom in ND's defense and I don't know if I could give him that as an NFL D Coordinator.  The talent discrepancies just won't be there.

 

 

I can deal with it with Koramoah.  It comes with the turf when your draft players that fly around the field like missles like Koramoah they tend overshoot plays at times because part of that is they go full steam to try to stop the play in its tracks and in order to do so they shoot at it fast.  I made the same comment about Jeremy Chinn before last draft, another player I loved but I had the same concern.  Some say Chinn was the best rookie defender in the league last year aside from Chase.  

 

Koramoah's average depth of tackle against the run I believe was the lowest of any of the highly touted LBs coming out in this draft -- meaning he's stopping plays closer to the line of scrimmage than other LBs.  Some of that could be that they creep him up closer to the line.  

 

Zaven as far as stopping the run is also IMO better playing closer to the line of scrimmage where he makes some highlight type stops.   Like Koramoah, he is also a dude with more missed tackles compared to his peers.  Zaven had some fun stops where he leveled runners before they got going.  Stops them in their tracks.  My issue with him is when he plays back more and he needs to chase the play laterally, there are better LBs than Zaven at catching RBs on the move ala Jamin Davis.  But both Koramoah and Zaven are IMO among the better LBs at leveling runners before they get started.

 

I do think Koramaoh is still more of a safety/hybrid player than pure LB.  That's my one pause about him.  Can you just stick him at weakside LB?  Maybe.  I don't know.  I do think what makes him special is he can do it all.  The one thing I'd give him actually over Derwin James is he is better at coverage.  Koramoah for these hybrid type players is as sticky in coverage as I've ever seen.  I think he'd put to rest our longish history of struggiling to stop TEs who kill us up the seam. 

Edited April 14, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

7 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

What's our consensus on Asante Samuel Jr here?  IIRC, we talked about him at the beginning of the college season and we all seemed to like him, but we haven't really talked about him since.  We should form a consensus on him since he is one of our most likely day two targets.

 

I was going back over his highlights and FSU defensive cut ups and he looks pretty good to me.  Looks like a cover three guy mainly but there is a lot of off man too.  Might be a bit of a confusing fit after signing William Jackson seemed to signal we wanted to run Denver style man coverages.  But man... it would be cool to have such a physical and aggressive downhill corner lurking around in the secondary for a pressure front like the one we have.  He can play some press too, but that feels like asking for trouble if you have him do it a lot.

 

Such a dog.  If we're talking about adding tone setters at every level of our D, he certainly qualifies as one.  In his highlights he's chopping down AJ Dillon and tight ends and body slamming receivers.

 

I really want us to get him now.  God damn.  He's the defensive side of the coin to Rondale Moore.  I am hoping for a class where we trade down, get Cosmi, get Rondale, get Samuel, and get Trask.

 

Asante Samuel Jr. would be a nice get.  I think though it would have to be either in the late first in a trade down or earlier in the 2nd in a trade up but it could happen in the 2nd at 51.  Will see.   Corners with talent like his tend to go off the board faster than expected.    He's a playmaker like his dad.   Feisty.  Fast.   He seems like a natural instinctive player -- read and react.   Played outside and slot.  With his size might be better playing in the slot but probably could play the outside, too.  Like his dad, he gambles a bit -- maybe a little Deangelo Hall in him?  For someone his size, he's still good against the run.  Plays like dog.  Scrappy player.

 

 

Edited April 14, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[DWinzit]

7 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Might be a bit of a confusing fit after signing William Jackson seemed to signal we wanted to run Denver style man coverages.  But man... it would be cool to have such a physical and aggressive downhill corner lurking around in the secondary

I like the Jackson signing a lot but have confusion as well. Are they thinking of changing things up in general or just with him. He and how they will use L Collins are the two questions in figuring which style LB, S and CB are best.  One thing is for sure, at least one mobile tone setter is needed.

 

BTW I do like Samuel but feel they may not hit DB until the 3rd or 4th round as they are making the appearance of OL, TE and QB taking center stage

[Skinsinparadise]

Another reason why I think #7 is the pivot point for any team trading up for QB.  I think that's the spot where the last of the 5 QBs go.  If you go purely by rumors.  The #5 QB is likely Fields.  And the team most likely to go chase him would be NE.  But will see. 

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Brugler's current predictions.  the first three picks are electric for me

 

 

[Rolo Tomasie]

10 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Brugler's current predictions.  the first three picks are electric for me

 

 

I like this because I am a Spencer Brown fan (and JOK fan as long as they have a clear plan for how to use him) but did Brugler forget we have pick #51?

[Skinsinparadise]

17 minutes ago, Rolo Tomasie said:

I like this because I am a Spencer Brown fan (and JOK fan as long as they have a clear plan for how to use him) but did Brugler forget we have pick #51?

 

My bad, the first three picks included Toney forgot to attach

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Chump Bailey]

https://riggosrag.com/2021/04/14/washington-football-team-prospect-meetings-pro-days-attended/2/

Washington Football Team Senior Bowl meetings: Offense

Quarterbacks

• Sam Ehlinger, Texas
• Kellen Mond, Texas A&M
• Mac Jones, Alabama
• Ian Book, Notre Dame
• Feleipe Franks, Arkansas
• Jamie Newman, Georgi

 

Running Backs

• Rhamondre Stevenson, Oklahoma
• Chris Evans, Michigan
• Najee Harris, Alabama
• Elijah Mitchell, Louisiana-Lafayette
• Trey Sermon, Ohio State
• Kylin Hill, Mississippi St.
• Khalil Herbert, Virginia Tech
• Ben Mason, Michigan (Fullback)
• Larry Rountree, Missouri
• Michael Carter, North Carolina

 

Wide Receivers

• Tylan Wallace, Oklahoma St.
• Frank Darby, Arizona St.
• Desmond Fitzpatrick, Louisville
• Nico Collins, Michigan
• Sage Surratt, Wake Forest
• Ben Skowronek, Notre Dame
• Cade Johnson, South Dakota St.
• DeVonta Smith, Alabama
• D’Wayne Eskridge, Westerrn Michigan
• Trevon Grimes, Florida
• Kadarius Toney, Florida
• Marquez  Stevenson, Houston
• Amari Rodgers, Clemson
• Cornell Powell, Clemson
• Josh Palmer, Tennessee
• Racey McMath, LSU
• Shi Smith, South Carolina
• Austin Watkins, Alabama-Birmingham

Tight Ends

• Quintin Morris, Bowling Green
• Kenny Yeboah, Mississippi
• Noah Gray, Duke
• Kylen Granson, Southern Methodist
• Tony Poljan, Virginia
• John Bates, Boise St.
• Hunter Long, Boston College
• Trey McKitty, Georgia

 

Offensive Tackles

• Brenden Jaimes, Nebraska
• Alaric Jackson, Iowa
• Adrian Ealy, Oklahoma
• Robert Hainsey, Notre Dame
• Alex Leatherwood, Alabama
• Spencer Brown, Northern Iowa
• Carson Green, Texas A&M
• Dillon Radunz, North Dakota St.
• James Hudson, Cincinnati
• D’Ante Smith, East Carolina
• Jaylon Moore, Western Michigan
• Royce Newman, Mississippi

Offensive Guards/Inside Offensive Linemen

• Creed Humphrey, Oklahoma
• Robert Jones, Middle Tennessee St.
• Quinn Meinerz, Wisconsin-Whitewater
• Jack Anderson, Texas Tech
• Trey Smith, Tennessee
• Deonte Brown, Alabama
• David Moore, Grambling St.
• Dan Moore, Texas A&M
• Ben Cleveland, Georgia
• Jake Curhan, California
• Drake Jackson, Kentucky
• Aaron Banks, Notre Dame
• Landon Dickerson, Alabama

 

[Going Commando]

1 hour ago, DWinzit said:

 

BTW I do like Samuel but feel they may not hit DB until the 3rd or 4th round as they are making the appearance of OL, TE and QB taking center stage

 

I wouldn't discount WR or CB either since we seem to have interviewed a bunch of them.  Of the virtual interviewees we know about, more of them were WRs than any other position.

[JoggingGod]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Another reason why I think #7 is the pivot point for any team trading up for QB.  I think that's the spot where the last of the 5 QBs go.  If you go purely by rumors.  The #5 QB is likely Fields.  And the team most likely to go chase him would be NE.  But will see. 

 

 

 

 

That's definitely Carolina begging for someone to trade with them. They already invsted a good amount in Darnold.

[Wyndorf25]

19 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

My bad, the first three picks included Toney forgot to attach

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I like the idea of a player like Toney in this offense, but I'm kinda down on his selection with the 2nd round pick, tbh. Nothing against the player, I just don't see a clear path to playing time with other slot WRs (Samuel and Humphries) now in the fold. I'm not even against taking a WR, I just would prefer a hight/speed guy rather than another slot type.

[Warhead36]

JOK/Toney/Jordan would be a good haul. JOK's size(or lack thereof) worries me though. He'll be good in coverage and in our nickel packages but can he get up there and take on blocks and stuff the run against grown men?

[Wyndorf25]

Just trying to get a pulse of where my fellow fans are with regards to going LB at 19...

 

Say, Collins and Kormamoah are there, who do people prefer? I prefer Collins simply because he is a bit bigger, but that's me.

[Skinsinparadise]

50 minutes ago, Wyndorf25 said:

 

I like the idea of a player like Toney in this offense, but I'm kinda down on his selection with the 2nd round pick, tbh. Nothing against the player, I just don't see a clear path to playing time with other slot WRs (Samuel and Humphries) now in the fold. I'm not even against taking a WR, I just would prefer a hight/speed guy rather than another slot type.

 

I doubt Humphries is a long term solution.  He's solid but not explosive.  Toney isn't my favorite slot receiver in this draft but he'd be an upgrade IMO over Humphries.

2 minutes ago, Wyndorf25 said:

Just trying to get a pulse of where my fellow fans are with regards to going LB at 19...

 

Say, Collins and Kormamoah are there, who do people prefer? I prefer Collins simply because he is a bit bigger, but that's me.

 

I'd go Koramoah over Collins.  But I think I am in the minority here. 

Edited April 14, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Warhead36]

Collins probably makes our run defense better. JOK would be better in coverage but is more of a hybrid type.

[Skinsinparadise]

30 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

JOK/Toney/Jordan would be a good haul. JOK's size(or lack thereof) worries me though. He'll be good in coverage and in our nickel packages but can he get up there and take on blocks and stuff the run against grown men?

 

I don't really see a blow up blocker run stuffer among the top linebacker prospects in the draft.  Some would say Collins because he's a big dude but IMO that's not his niche -- he plays better if kept clean. 

 

Koramoah would play likely play off side of blocks and in the slot.  He IMO isn't a traditional LB.  It's more like adding a nickle backer-Derwin James type.

4 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Collins probably makes our run defense better. JOK would be better in coverage but is more of a hybrid type.

 

IMO if its run defense Jamin Davis is the best bet. 

[UK Skins]

I've never been a fan of under-sized, small, short players. There are notable exceptions but generally they don't work out. We seem to be being linked to under sized LBs AND WRs and it's freaking me out!

[Skinsinparadise]

32 minutes ago, UK Skins said:

I've never been a fan of under-sized, small, short players. There are notable exceptions but generally they don't work out. We seem to be being linked to under sized LBs AND WRs and it's freaking me out!

 

Koramoah would be undersized if you planted him at LB versus using him in the Derwin James hybrid safety role.  His size is ironically about identical to Derwin James, with Koramoah currently being a little heavier than him.

 

But other than Koramoah who are the other undersized links to the team?

[illone]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

But other than Koramoah who are the other undersized links to the team?

 

 

Just saw a mock that linked us to this guy:

 

[UK Skins]

I'm just going into a meeting but, off the top of my head, there's about three WRs, at least one corner, and at least JOK at LB. And that's just in the first two rounds. I rely on all the great work you guys put in so don't know the players personally so I'm afraid the names rather wash past me.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Brugler's current predictions.  the first three picks are electric for me

 

 

 

I'm intrigued, but for different reasons.  Pick 1, 2, and 4 make sense together.  Pick 3 is the odd duck.

 

1st round:

3 OT's (4 OL) and 2 LB's go before #19 in Brugler's mock.  A BPA candidate like Horn doesn't even fall either.  The Alabama WR's are gone before.  Not a lot of options there, not even sure we could get much if any decent trade offers.  So JOK it is then (or Teven Jenkins).

 

How do we fit JOK's desire against the run to guess what the play is before reading the action?  In coverage he seems much more by the book.  JOK adds some interesting aspects with Landon Collins.  Creep Collins up near the line and have JOK man on TE's.  I'd love a Dime defense of Everett/Curl/Collins/JOK/Jackson/Fuller/Moreland plus 4 DL.  I don't know who has the helmet that lets him call plays.  The goal is get Bostic off the field in coverage situations.  Both Bostic and Collins is no bueno.  One or the other.

 

JOK could be really fun on this defense.

 

2nd round:

Variety of OL talent available.  Such as Liam Eichenberg (OT) and Quinn Meinerz (IOL).  But we go with a raw slot WR with loads of talent, but who also kind of can't run routes yet.  Choice routes against 1 defender?  Kind of.  Probably best as the 2nd read on those plays.  Running routes out of a bunch or stack?  Nope.  More likely to run into his own teammates than do something positive.  He must be a nightmare to defend against even if they know the playcall.  Defenders can't know how Toney will run a route if even Toney doesn't know how he'll run that route!  That said, Toney, Samuel, Gibson, McKissic is Misdirection Central if all are on the field.  And if (on the slim chance) Toney develops to his fullest potential then this pick is a steal.  But the coaches have to feel like Florida's coaching had no idea what they were doing if they're expecting Toney to get good production as a rookie, or that he'll reach even most of his potential.

 

3rd round:

Uggghhh, Tommy Tremble goes 1 pick before us in the 3rd, so we're stuck with Brevin Jordan.  Our offense would be full of slot guys or hybrid slot guys plus McLaurin at X.  Samuel is slot/wideout, Humphries is slot, Steve Sims is slot.  Brevin would be slot/2nd-inline.  Kadarius Toney is slot.  The only guys who can line up at Z are Cam Sims and Samuel...on occasion, but he should really be splitting half his reps in the slot to make best use of him vs the defense.

 

If Brevin Jordan could do more than speed outs against man coverage, I'd be excited.  But his other routes kind of suck.  He's got ability against zone though, so there's that.  He can threaten the Seam in zone.  Just wish he was either 3 inches taller, or blocked better, or could plant and change direction without having his whole body give it away, or something.

 

Spencer Brown.  I kind of love this pick.  If we're talking about OL potential, this guy is up there.  He does not look like an OL.  He looks like someone zapped an athletic TE with a growth ray and made them 6'8.25 and 311.  He moves shockingly well.

 

Draft Theme for Days 1 and 2:

We grab 3 super athletes that have flashed potential...and then Brevin Jordan.

 

P.S.  JOK would shut Brevin Jordan down all day long in coverage.  JOK thrives in thinking he knows what the opponent is doing and then using his athleticism to crush it.  Jordan brings nothing to the table that would make JOK unsure of what Jordan is doing.  JOK would smother him.