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2021 Comprehensive Draft Thread

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1 hour ago, PartyPosse said:

Surprised Walker Little didn’t make that list 

I full expected his name in the middle of the pack. He was a projected as a top 20 guy last year before he went back to school. Most projections for this year I've seen show him mid first round to top of the second round. I do however recall talk of his pass protection being suspect.

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20 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

He was awesome last season.  Not as good as Okudah, but better than Arnette.

More physical than both of those BY FAR.

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53 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

More physical than both of those BY FAR.

 

I'm not sure about that.  Okudah is a dog who laid a lot of wood in 2019.  That back seven had a lot of big hitters, wish they had beat Clemson and matched up with LSU in the Final.  Okudah vs Chase and Wade vs Jefferson would have been one for the books.

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Okudah's physicality while playing contain was fantastic.  Just throwing receivers to the ground and stoning powerful, aggressive runners like Etienne.

 

Watching Okudah's cut ups again, his backpedal and transition footwork is almost unbelievable.  It is the absolute height of technique.  You're not going to see those kind of feet on a 6'1 blue chip DB like once every ten years.  That plus his run support and contact window aggression, his length, his ability to match patterns with good route runners, his click and close speed...

 

He really has it all.  He's one of the four best DB prospects to come out of college in the last ten drafts IMO: 1 - Patrick Peterson, 2 - Jamal Adams, 3 - Okudah/Jalen Ramsey.  Delpit winning the Thorpe over him is a pretty bad look, and if it weren't for Chase Young and Derek Stingley stealing some of his shine, I think more people would have recognized Okudah as one of the best defensive prospects of the decade.

 

This was a phenomenal year to have a top five pick.  Very unusual to have a class with two authentic blue chip QBs in it along with a DE, CB, and LT prospect that are like top three prospects at their position for the decade.  Two stud receivers, an All Pro type IDL, and a defensive player who is the new prototype of positionless style of football too.  The cream of this class was way better than 2019's class.  It was a good year to be horrible.

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16 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Okudah's physicality while playing contain was fantastic.  Just throwing receivers to the ground and stoning powerful, aggressive runners like Etienne.

 

Watching Okudah's cut ups again, his backpedal and transition footwork is almost unbelievable.  It is the absolute height of technique.  You're not going to see those kind of feet on a 6'1 blue chip DB like once every ten years.  That plus his run support and contact window aggression, his length, his ability to match patterns with good route runners, his click and close speed...

 

He really has it all.  He's one of the four best DB prospects to come out of college in the last ten drafts IMO: 1 - Patrick Peterson, 2 - Jamal Adams, 3 - Okudah/Jalen Ramsey.  Delpit winning the Thorpe over him is a pretty bad look, and if it weren't for Chase Young and Derek Stingley stealing some of his shine, I think more people would have recognized Okudah as one of the best defensive prospects of the decade.

 

This was a phenomenal year to have a top five pick.  Very unusual to have a class with two authentic blue chip QBs in it along with a DE, CB, and LT prospect that are like top three prospects at their position for the decade.  Two stud receivers, an All Pro type IDL, and a defensive player who is the new prototype of positionless style of football too.  The cream of this class was way better than 2019's class.  It was a good year to be horrible.

 

I agree with every ounce of this. I'm hoping next year also looks good. Chase, Lawrence and Sewell are a very good top 3, but I don't know if the top 10 will be as good as this draft. 

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So, he’s going to miss the season. Does he declare, and how high would he go? This is so bad for his draft stock.

 

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1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

So, he’s going to miss the season. Does he declare, and how high would he go? This is so bad for his draft stock.

 

That is a nerve injury in the neck/spine, there's a very good chance Justyn Ross never plays football again. 

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On 4/29/2020 at 6:40 PM, stevemcqueen1 said:

Hubbard could be the best outside zone running back prospect in a while. Years at least.  He's better than Dobbins was.  As good as Ezekiel Elliot most likely.  He compares very favorably to him.

 

He's quite the fit for what we're trying to build...  If Guice doesn't pan out, he makes sense for us.

 

By my count there are already three first round caliber running backs in next year's class.  And I still think Max Borghi could blow up too as he's got some McCaffrey in him.  So could Keontay Ingrahm, who is now the best player in Texas's offense.

 

You are better at RB's, but all I see in Hubbard is speed. Educate me! Hubbard clearly has speed to burn. He looks like a CJ Spiller in that regard maybe. I don't think he's in the same league as Ezekiel Elliot. Hubbard is listed at 6'1" and 207. He looks tiiiiny compared to Antonio Gibson. I don't see power or contact balance here. Also not a big time receiver. I'd way rather have an OT or TE here if we are going offense. 

 

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/chuba-hubbard-1.html

 

 

 

I'm interested in the 1st round TE's, but I'd have to feel really good about one to take him in the 1st. Jalen Wydermyer looks huge and has good hands, but his movement skills look middling. Which is to say, he looks plodding to my eye. 

 

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/jalen-wydermyer-1.html

 

 

Kyle Pitts on the other hand can MOVE. But he makes me nervous. He's 6'6" and loooong, great hands, great getting in and out of breaks. He just looks like a WR. Why isn't he a WR? Does he block? You don't see a lot of guys with his build at TE. Imagine him blocking a Chase Young, for instance. But, maybe I'm being ridiculous. Maybe we'd be super lucky to draft another Jordan Reed, a game changing receiver that doesn't block gives away whether you are running or passing, but more than makes up for that with his production. If we are moving more towards a zone blocking scheme, it may matter less anyway. 

 

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/kyle-pitts-1.html

 


In any case, I'm finally hoping we don't suck. I don't want to be in a position to take Sewell, because if we are, it means our defense underperformed and Haskins underperformed. Picking 10-12 would be perfect for us. Lose a bunch of close games because we don't have an OL, a TE, or enough weapons, but stay in a bunch of games because Haskins looks better than expected and the defense keeps things close. Grab a few more impact players and have a big FA period and make the playoffs in 2021. And honestly, if everything broke right and we go 8-8 or 9-7, even better. 

 

I've been mulling our recent history, and Kyle Smith continues to grow on me. Can't believe we got Steven Sims as an undrafted FA. McLaurin in the 3rd. Love Charles in the 4th this year. If Haskins develops, we are going to be good. 

 

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2 hours ago, Anselmheifer said:

You are better at RB's, but all I see in Hubbard is speed. Educate me! Hubbard clearly has speed to burn. He looks like a CJ Spiller in that regard maybe. I don't think he's in the same league as Ezekiel Elliot. Hubbard is listed at 6'1" and 207. He looks tiiiiny compared to Antonio Gibson. I don't see power or contact balance here. Also not a big time receiver. I'd way rather have an OT or TE here if we are going offense.  

 

Speed is not nothing.  It changes the defensive approach when he's able to reach the edge at will on outside zone or split your safeties even in two deep shell before they can properly react on inside zone runs.  But I think he's also got more balance and power behind his pads than you're giving him credit for.  He's got wiggle and can change directions at or near top gear.  The big difference between him and CJ Spiller is the vision.  Spiller ran into tackles and blocks with frequency and was a really lacking runner between the tackles.  Just couldn't find inside space or time his runs consistently.  He was almost purely an outside runner.  Hubbard has vision and weaves through traffic well, and gears up and down so fluidly.  His inside zone runs are terrifying for safeties because of how quickly they can turn into 60 yard foot races.

 

He's got similar strengths as Dalvin Cook IMO, not as much power, but more speed.  Hubbard ran a 22.07 200 M in H.S. whereas Cook's best time was a 22.10 according to his wikipedia page.  Hubbard also ran a 10.55 100 meter in competition at 17 years old, whereas Cook's 100 M was 10.92.  I think Hubbard has a real shot at running low 4.3 at his combine.  He's the kind of player who could put up huge rushing yardage totals for a Shanahan/Kubiak style run game.

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Uncle Kevin hired by the Browns today, adjust your nfl props accordingly.

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4 hours ago, volsmet said:

 

How collaborative is this entire process? How much are the different facets working together in terms of evaluating prospects and building the board?

 

Rogers: "It's hard to imagine a draft process being more collaborative than the one we have here. Obviously all the college guys have had their say in February; now the coaches, they've been given their cross-checks, so they're going to get the chance to have their say (and) they're meeting the players. You know, the numbers come into play, so we'll get our analytics crew, they'll be involved, and then, again, we'll go through the tape two more times — one time in March, one time in April — as a group, with @volsmet leading the charge, and we all get a chance to speak our peace."

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Regarding Shaun Wade, I like the video below even more than the previous I posted. Shows a lot of his strengths and some of the things that worry me. He's just so physical. Looks great blitzing. He looks a little bit like the ideal modern DB that McQueen has talked about. If he's good outside this year, he has so much positional versatility. Someone that you could line up inside, outside, at S in the nickel package etc. I could see him having a lot of success in a system that employs some CB blitzes. 

 

On the other hand, he's only played 55 snaps outside in his career. He has good top end speed, but he definitely doesn't have the loose hips/feet/change of direction of Okudah. Next year could be a funny year for CB. If Wade is great outside, and Surtain has a great year, it could be a solid draft. On the other hand, I could see a scenario where Wade isn't overwhelmingly impressive and Surtain is just a little better than Diggs was, and there really isn't a CB that would have been top 10 worthy in 2020. It's possible that there won't be a CB as good in 2021 as CJ Henderson. 

 

 

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1h25IdH85A&t=325s

 

Also, I find it interesting that Ohio State measures which players are fastest by top mph and not 40 time. I agree with this approach. 

 

https://247sports.com/college/ohio-state/ContentGallery/Who-are-the-fastest-players-on-the-Ohio-State-Buckeyes-2017-football-roster-52032323/

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Posted (edited)
On 6/8/2020 at 1:19 PM, volsmet said:

Lock at 15 🤨
 

 

 

 

I'd take Deshaun Watson over Russell Wilson at 2. IMO he can be just as good and is 7 years younger than Wilson. 

 

And yeah...Lock at 15 is...an interesting take. 

Edited by mistertim
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Posted (edited)
On 6/8/2020 at 1:19 PM, volsmet said:

Lock at 15 🤨

 

 

 

Was just listening to Chris Sims rave about Lock, he thinks he's likely the 2nd best QB from that draft post Murray.  I agree with that.  Lock I think ends up a stud.  I liked him slightly less than you in that draft.  But I was impressed with what I saw from him in a short sample last season.  He's got a gun.  He can throw off platform well.  He can run.  He has moxie.

 

Cooley I recall was another dude who was really high on Lock before that draft.

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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18 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Was just listening to Chris Sims rave about Lock, he thinks he's likely the 2nd best QB from that draft post Murray.  I agree with that.  Lock I think ends up a stud.  I liked him slightly less than you in that draft.  But I was impressed with what I saw from him in a short sample last season.  He's got a gun.  He can throw off platform well.  He can run.  He has moxie.

 

Cooley I recall was another dude who was really high on Lock before that draft.


I love Lock but it’s hilarious to see him at 15 in that revisionist mock, though Bridgewater at 18 is even worse.

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5 hours ago, volsmet said:


I love Lock but it’s hilarious to see him at 15 in that revisionist mock, though Bridgewater at 18 is even worse.

 

Agree, Lock is as unproven as any of the young QBs.  

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5 hours ago, volsmet said:


I love Lock but it’s hilarious to see him at 15 in that revisionist mock, though Bridgewater at 18 is even worse.

 

That list is Awful. Carson Wentz, Dak Prescott, Drew Lock, Ryan Tannehill, Teddy Bridgewater, Jimmy Garappolo, Baker Mayfield. Ronnie Stanley at number six?!?!? The defenders mostly belong, but Myles Garrett is better than the Bosa brothers. Where are Jalen Ramsey, Jamal Adams, Minkah, etc? Also, Kirk Cousins is better than half the QB's on that list. And, the NFL has a huge upcoming QB problem unless some of these young guys pan out. That list looks a mile worse without Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, etc. 

 

 

 

Anyway, I have a new man prospect crush for the 2021 draft. Rondale Moore. How is this guy not getting more hype? Watch the highlights below to see him as a true freshman tearing through an Ohio State secondary filled with future 1st round draft picks. They can't cover/tackle him. He had 12 receptions for 170 yards and 2 TD's in that game. As a true freshman. That year, he caught 103 balls for 1164 yards and 12 TD's. He had 5 games with 11 or more receptions. 

 

 

He's only 5'8" and 180, but is a Tyreek Hill level athlete. At the collegiate scouting combine he was the fastest receiver, posting a 4.33 40. He had a 42.7 inch vertical and the top SPARQ rating of any WR in his recruiting class. He squats more than 600 pounds, and he plays like a guy that's 5'8" and 180lb with a 600lb squat. He's low and powerful and a load for DB's to tackle. He runs through tacklers with impressive frequency. 

 

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/combine/_/id/226893/rondale-moore

https://saturdaytradition.com/purdue-football/rondale-moore-5-things-know-purdues-breakout-star/

 

 

Watching Moore do an effortless standing back flip, as seen below, very much reminds me very much of watching Tyreek Hill do the same. 

 

 

He missed much of last year with a hamstring, but is supposedly back at 100%. I look for him to explode again and be the 2nd or 3rd WR taken. I think he can be an NFL star. I'm not sure what his fit is here. I think he's probably a better fit in the slot, where we already have Steven Sims. We could really use a guy outside. But, I wouldn't pass on a potential star for a receiver with size. That would be like passing on Santana Moss for Rod Gardner again....

 

 

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