joeken24

Ooooweee Dunbar wants to be traded!

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6 minutes ago, joeken24 said:

I understand many of you that are on the side of the team. Personally, I am hoping for a win/win because I like Dunbar and how he plays the game. I can't help but to think that there was a conversation between someone in the organization and QD and/or his agent before he went rogue. Regardless, I want every player in the league to be able to play the game they love and take care of their family at the salary level conducive to their play on the field. Right now, Dunbar is going into the new season with probably less money than some of us in this thread. God forbid he get's injured in OTA's or even during the season. The game checks stop. No money coming into the household. I also can't get too much on Dunbar because this was some Bruce ****. As much as we said we were impressed with how we had stopped overspending on players and all the Vinny ****, we probably have no idea how ****ed up the books and the contracts are moving forward. Dunbar's contract is ****ed up IMO. It needs fixin. A part of fixing this team's culture is to ensure players are paid. That's rule number one in the military. Have soldiers in the field with a no pay due and see what happens.


I assure you... he’s not going into this season with less money than I am.

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2 hours ago, goskins10 said:

 

I get what you are saying but if he does ball out, is the team paying him? If so, you will pay a lot more than giving him and extension now. To me this pretty much guarantees he is a one year rental.

 

Yep. If he is not extended before the start of the season here and plays out his current deal is almost certain he will be leaving as a free agent after the season.

 

Quote

 

. So in the end all you got out of him was 1 yrs play and maybe, maybe a comp pick. But that comp pick will be another year later and is unlikely to much more than a 4th which is really a 5th. 

 

Dunbar is a good to very good corner. Unless he falls off a cliff or gets injured again he's likely to get starting CB money in a new deal. and good starting CB money at that. That will likely net us a 3rd in compensation. If someone wants to trade for him now that is where the conversation would start for me and I would ask for a 2nd to start.  If I am on the other side of that conversation I say that the 3rd next year is really a 4th this year and hold out my hand to shake ... 

 

I would say thanks but no it's going to take the 3rd. I would be OK holding Dunbar to his deal and getting a year of good corner play from him and then letting him hit the free agent market and taking the comp pick. We already need to find one quality corner to replace Norman and finding and signing two in the same year is tough - plus a new regime don't want to send the message that of you are unhappy with your deal you can ask for a trade and get your wish.

 

I also would not discount that after Rivera and his staff finish the film review they decide Dunbar is someone they want to retain and work out an extension.

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Doc Walker talked to Dunbar.

 

Key points:

 

1.)Isn't asking to be traded or released.

 

2.)Basically hasn't heard from anyone and doesn't know where he stands.

 

3.)Will meet with Rivera tomorrow (Thursday)

Edited by BRAVEONAWARPATH
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22 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

Yep. If he is not extended before the start of the season here and plays out his current deal is almost certain he will be leaving as a free agent after the season.

 

 

Dunbar is a good to very good corner. Unless he falls off a cliff or gets injured again he's likely to get starting CB money in a new deal. and good starting CB money at that. That will likely net us a 3rd in compensation. If someone wants to trade for him now that is where the conversation would start for me and I would ask for a 2nd to start.  If I am on the other side of that conversation I say that the 3rd next year is really a 4th this year and hold out my hand to shake ... 

 

I would say thanks but no it's going to take the 3rd. I would be OK holding Dunbar to his deal and getting a year of good corner play from him and then letting him hit the free agent market and taking the comp pick. We already need to find one quality corner to replace Norman and finding and signing two in the same year is tough - plus a new regime don't want to send the message that of you are unhappy with your deal you can ask for a trade and get your wish.

 

I also would not discount that after Rivera and his staff finish the film review they decide Dunbar is someone they want to retain and work out an extension.

 

I think the only place we really differ is the comp pick due to his value. Not sure we can be assured of the comp pick as we don't know who we will sign. That could easily offset what he is signed for. And his injury history is still going to play in - especially if he misses any time at all next season. And a 3rd rd comp pick after next year is already a 4th since it starts after the true 3rd rd and it's a yr later making the value difference between that and say a 3rd right now. 

 

I agree that Ron and team may decide they want to keep him - which i am fine with BTW. I am not anxious to get Dunbar out of here unless he keeps on with him wanting out. But let's say they either don't see him in the long term plans or want him but he's too expensive, i would prefer to deal him now, especially if you can get someones actual 3rd rd pick this year for him. 

 

We will see. This a good early test for this new FO. It will be interesting to see how they handle it. 

 

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29 minutes ago, BRAVEONAWARPATH said:

Doc Walker talked to Dunbar.

 

Key points:

 

1.)Isn't asking to be traded or released.

 

2.)Basically hasn't heard from anyone and doesn't know where he stands.

 

3.)Will meet with Rivera tomorrow (Thursday)

 

 

 

 

 

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Hmmmm, this is an interesting turn.  Wonder what will happen.

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3 minutes ago, Redd said:

Hmmmm, this is an interesting turn.  Wonder what will happen.

I get the feeling Dunbar just spoke from emotion and overreacted.

 

(Still think Rivera could have made the effort to reach out)

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1 hour ago, KDawg said:


I assure you... he’s not going into this season with less money than I am.

 

You mean you don't make more than $3.5M a year? 😀

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Hmmm, yeah, looks like Dunbar is walking his original comments back.  Would not be stunned if in his new role, that Doug Williams talked to Dunbar behind the scenes abt not airing your business to the public.  And in any event, it is good that Ron will meet with him directly.

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So let me get this straight.  An undrafted free agent converted from WR to CB who has injury issues and is under contract for another year thinks that one of the highest priorities of a completely new coaching staff with all of the restructuring of the coaching staff and front office (within the first 6 weeks of all that) was to contact him to see how he felt about his contract.  Give me a break.  Sounds like in his journey from undrafted free agent to starting CB also included becoming a diva.  

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7 minutes ago, glongest said:

So let me get this straight.  An undrafted free agent converted from WR to CB who has injury issues and is under contract for another year thinks that one of the highest priorities of a completely new coaching staff with all of the restructuring of the coaching staff and front office (within the first 6 weeks of all that) was to contact him to see how he felt about his contract.  Give me a break.  Sounds like in his journey from undrafted free agent to starting CB also included becoming a diva.  

No offense to Redskins (or NFL) players but by the time they make it to the NFL don't most have at least some diva in them?

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Dunny tried an ill-advised tactic and as expected it backfired horribly. Now he’s in damage control mode. 

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So just curious ... if the Skins do decide they want to try to bring/retain Dunbar what type of deal would be acceptable to those here. Sounds like he may want $8-12m APY ... I can't see the team going that route and having 2 high-priced CBs on the roster. They desperately need to have a CB1/2 come in from FA. Draft assets just aren't there to get one.

 

I also know the draft assets aren't there to replace Dunbar either (even if we get a 4th for him). But at least in that case you're bringing in an elite/near elite CB to play CB1 and can find a CB2 between a couple mid-round rookies and Moreauy.

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2 hours ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

So just curious ... if the Skins do decide they want to try to bring/retain Dunbar what type of deal would be acceptable to those here. Sounds like he may want $8-12m APY ... I can't see the team going that route and having 2 high-priced CBs on the roster. They desperately need to have a CB1/2 come in from FA. Draft assets just aren't there to get one.

 

I also know the draft assets aren't there to replace Dunbar either (even if we get a 4th for him). But at least in that case you're bringing in an elite/near elite CB to play CB1 and can find a CB2 between a couple mid-round rookies and Moreauy.

 

The average of the top 10 CB contracts on a per year basis is around $13M. If you go top 20 its still over $10M. Josh Norman averages $15m (holds head in hands and crys)

 

Averages are not everything of course, signing bonus and amount guaranteed is probably more important. But if we are not prepared (or able) to Pay Dunbar something with a $10M average over say 4 years with say a $30M guarantee we should be trading him.

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I'd be fine giving Dunbar a 4-5 year deal at 32-40 with 20 guaranteed. By then he'll be 33 and i assume he'll be cut long before then. That's the MAX i'd go if it were me.

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Surprise surprise Dunny came to his senses. This is great news, the people ready to throw him out over 1 report should also walk it back a little, lol. 
This sets up nice to again get Great value relative to his quality of play. 

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On 2/11/2020 at 3:39 PM, JamesMadisonSkins said:

 

In the 2022 draft though. You're 1 year removed from the comp when you lose the player and we are a year away from losing the player on the current deal. The equivalent of the 2022 3rd round comp pick would be a 5th rounder in 2020. Also, not to mention you would not get that comp pick if you chose to sign a big FA acquisition next year. Comp picks are only guaranteed if you have talent leaving greater than what you are bringing in off the market.

 

We aren't getting a 3rd round comp pick for Preston Smith because we signed Landon Collins. We are getting a 4th round comp pick because of Crowder.

I think its short sighted thinking to go "A pick this year is worth more than a pick next year".

 

Yes, having a pick this year helps you in 2022.  Guess what?  It doesnt help you in 2025 when the cheap contract is over.  The 2022 pick does.  Thats why the Patriots make a killing by deferring their picks every year, and picking up massive comp picks.  Because they dont panic every year, they build a better team than everyone else.

 

And thats why I said be smart.  Since this is Rivera's first year, we should be going heavy in FA this year, not in 2022.  I get this every year and I just cant figure out my fellow skins fans.  Why is it that Skins fans are so obsessed with being good THIS year at the cost of ever building anything meaningful?  I could care less about being good this year, I want to build a DYNASTY.  To do that, as with every good business, you have to take short term hits to get long term sustained success. Our impatience is why we have not had it.

On 2/11/2020 at 2:54 PM, goskins10 said:

 

Not following this logic - serious question - 

 

You propose to keep someone here that has already said they would stay away from OTAs and TC. Then play them and when (not really IF, when) they play like crap you believe that will lead to someone signing him for enough money against whatever players we sign to be assured of a 3rd comp pick - which BTW is really a 4th rd pick if we are being honest since they start at the end of the 4rd. 

 

Why keep a guy here that does not want to be here - you let him be a cancer in your locker room. If you think making him play out his contract is going to make him play hard - i guess you could be right. But I doubt it. Not to mention his big problem is injury - your plan would require he stay healthy, something that has not happened so far in his career. 

 

He is a decent player - probably the best CB when healthy - but he is never healthy all 16 and being the CB on this team is not really a very high bar. Full disclosure I have very little faith in PFF. SO maybe he is the ****. I just do not see him top 5 in the league - Maybe to 15. 

 

If you can get a 3rd right now, you take it and run. I am afraid you would be lucky to get a 4th as a comp pick - which is really closer to mid 5th. 

 

Fundamentally I am not in favor of keeping guys that don't want to be around. Ron needs to set the tone - you want out, GTFO and don't let the door hit your ass on the way out! 

So, you think that Dunbar, after two injury ridden seasons, is about to play poorly this year and cost himself 10-20 million dollars?

 

I mean, take a second to think about that and maybe take a step back from that hill, it aint worth dying on.  Theres a reason they call it a "contract" year.  Because its the one year players go all out to get a pay day, and you get their very, very, very best work.  If you truly believe that we dont have massive leverage over Dunbar, then leave the negotiating for the true professionals.  Anyone with even the most basic experience in negotiating(or, ya know, even as a parent of whiny kids) knows Dunbar way overplayed his hand, and has to run the season out as the good hardworking soldier to get anything close to what he wants.

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8 minutes ago, Peregrine said:

I think its short sighted thinking to go "A pick this year is worth more than a pick next year".

 

Yes, having a pick this year helps you in 2022.  Guess what?  It doesnt help you in 2025 when the cheap contract is over.  The 2022 pick does.  Thats why the Patriots make a killing by deferring their picks every year, and picking up massive comp picks.  Because they dont panic every year, they build a better team than everyone else.

 

And thats why I said be smart.  Since this is Rivera's first year, we should be going heavy in FA this year, not in 2022.  I get this every year and I just cant figure out my fellow skins fans.  Why is it that Skins fans are so obsessed with being good THIS year at the cost of ever building anything meaningful?  I could care less about being good this year, I want to build a DYNASTY.  To do that, as with every good business, you have to take short term hits to get long term sustained success. Our impatience is why we have not had it.

So, you think that Dunbar, after two injury ridden seasons, is about to play poorly this year and cost himself 10-20 million dollars?

 

I mean, take a second to think about that and maybe take a step back from that hill, it aint worth dying on.  Theres a reason they call it a "contract" year.  Because its the one year players go all out to get a pay day, and you get their very, very, very best work.  If you truly believe that we dont have massive leverage over Dunbar, then leave the negotiating for the true professionals.  Anyone with even the most basic experience in negotiating(or, ya know, even as a parent of whiny kids) knows Dunbar way overplayed his hand, and has to run the season out as the good hardworking soldier to get anything close to what he wants.

 

You of course missed anything of relevance to my comment - hence your unnecessary snark. And let's keep this to things I actually said - I never said I thought he had any kind of leverage. Never was in the conversation. You added that. It should actually be clear i believe the Redskins have leverage. 

 

Not all people in a contract year play great. In fairness maybe saying he might play like crap was more descriptive than I wanted but it would not be the first time someone pouted. Or he could very well get injured since he has yet to play a full season - or since he knows he has injury issues play to keep from getting injured.

 

But let's put that all aside. Let's just for argument say he wants to play his ass off, I still do not want to keep someone who does not want to be there. 

 

 

Now this seems to be moot since it looks like he has either walked it back or was misquoted. I ignored one of my own rules of not making any proclamations until I see all the information. So if it's true he was not demanding a trade or new contract, my hope is he and Ron can come to agreement. But if he is really in a trade me or give me some kind of huge contract then I want him gone - contract year or not. 

 

It is a good early test for this FO. It will be interesting to see what they do. 

 

 

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Hopefully the same people that are pissed at Dunbar for “not wanting to fulfill his contract” also aren’t the same folks who are imploring the team to cut Norman or Reed before their contract is up.

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1 hour ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

So, what's his purpose and passion ?

 

 

 

 

tenor.gif

Edited by SkinsGuy
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With the regime change I envision they're not going to make the same mistake as the previous regime by letting young talent leave the team.  He's a starting CB in the league with some skill and should be paid that way and I'm sure they'll work it out.

 

 

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18 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN 74 said:

Dunbar quickly trying to clean up after ****ting in his own nest.

 

"Backspace! Backspace! Backspace!"

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