Burgold

Watching the Playoffs makes me wonder if rushing is back in vogue

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Tennessee, Baltimore, Minnesota, and San Francisco were all running dominant teams yesterday. In fact, I don't think I saw a wide open offense in the playoffs other than perhaps the Patriots (and even they run more than they used to) Makes me wonder if rushing is making a come back.  Recently, the run game has really been looked down on with the general logic that you can get a runner anywhere and you shouldn't invest big draft or cap capital into a running back, but yesterday's playoff games looked like they were all coordinated by Callahan.... and it wasn't even dynamic home runs, it was practically three yards and a cloud of dust.

 

Is the pendulum turning? If so, are the Redskins ahead or behind on the curve?

 

We had been moving towards being a running team even when Gruden was here until he checked out. With Peterson, Guice (if he can ever be healthy) and unkowns like Love,  I think we can do what we witnessed Saturday in the playoffs. We have the horses. I don't know that we have the o-line. I think that's the big challenge. Can we find or develop an o-line capable of imposing its will on a D. Right now, and in recent years, we've been a team that likes to run with a line that was much better at pass blocking.

 

At any rate, it looks like there is room in the modern NFL for three yards, a cloud of dust, and a dominant defense.

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It certainly seems that way.

The rules may have tightened up a little over the years in regards to defensive backs but the game hasn't really changed.

 

The nfl goes through wild trend swings all the time due to huge success from one or two teams and it takes a while for defenses to catch up and force re-correction.

It looks like that is happening now.

But no matter what, one consistent over the years is that if you play, sound fundamental football with very strong play from your trenches your gonna be real tough to beat.

That's who the titans are right now, and that'll never change.

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Good teams play to their strengths cause good coaches utilize and retain their STRONG players. Timmy Smith became a SuperBowl Sunday legend because Gibbs knew the Hogs would dominate the Denver d line. We don't retain talent and rarely play to our strengths, Look at what Gruden did week one with A.P. , set a sour tone for the entire season

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I think all you have to do is take a look at previous Super Bowl winners and see that the team that stands alone is the team that's playing the best defense and ball control.  Look at the Patriots last year,  yes they had a elite HOF QB, but we can all agree they won the big game with that defense.  The Eagles two years ago had that dominant defensive line,  the Giants two wins over the Patriots were because of excellent ball control and defense.  The list goes on and on,  proving the point that defense wins championships.  

 

I agree that the way our team is built to this point we are heading in that direction.  We have two well respected defensive minded coaches and some young pieces in place.  If we grab Young at #2 or trade down and take Simmons I'm happy either way.  We have a ton of cap space and theres promise that we can really improve the roster in one offseason.  If our young RBs can STAY healthy and shore up our oline, plus develop Haskins then we are on track.  The 49ers did it,  why can't we? 

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You need an offense that can be modern to carry you through the regular season. For those games you fall behind. Or for those horse races...

 

But having a great running game is what wins in the playoffs.

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Our new O-line coach, John Matsko's, team rushing rank going back to 2004:

 

2004- 26th- Rams

2005- 23rd- Rams

2006- 9th- Chiefs

2007- 32nd- Chiefs

2008- 4th- Ravens

2009- 5th- Ravens

2010- 14th- Ravens

2011- 3rd- Panthers

2012- 9th- Panthers

2013- 11th- Panthers

2014- 7th- Panthers

2015- 2nd- Panthers

2016- 10th- Panthers

2017- 4th- Panthers

2018- 4th- Panthers

2019- 14th - Panthers

 

Other than the Ram years and the one bad Chiefs year, his O-lines rush rank has always been in the upper half of the league. And more importantly, his years with Rivera from 2011 through most of 2019, were his best years, as they were consistently ranked highly. I realize in Carolina they had Cam Newton and he definitely helps the overall ranking. But Newton was only the leading rusher in 2 of those years ( 2012 & 2017) with the other leading team rushers in those years being Deangelo Williams, Jonathan Stewart and Christian McCaffrey. 

 

The other thing is that none were 1,000 yard rushers until Norv Turner came aboard as OC and they drafted McCaffrey two years ago. McCaffrey has gone over 1,000 yds. in his first 2 seasons and I like the fact that we will have a Turner influenced O paired with a Matsko coached O-line here. Not sure exactly what our O-line is going to look like, but assuming it shouldn't be awful, if Guice can stay on the field, the ageless Peterson still having a lot in the tank and the unknown potential that Love could bring, we could have a very strong run game in 2020.

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6 minutes ago, KDawg said:

But having a great running game is what wins in the playoffs.

 

True enough.

 

The Vikings have one of the better running games with Dalvin Cook.

 

They gave him the ball only nine times yesterday.

 

They lost.

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9 minutes ago, SkinsGuy said:

 

True enough.

 

The Vikings have one of the better running games with Dalvin Cook.

 

They gave him the ball only nine times yesterday.

 

They lost.


yup. I’m not sure what they were doing.

 

Relying on their investment? Lots of mistakes there.

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I think what we are seeing is the "market" forces in action....  With amount of attention given to passing and wide open offenses, the talent to execute those schemes is getting diluted significantly due to the number of teams looking for those type of players...  If a team were to look talent for run heavy offenses, there is not much competition for those type of players anymore as there was about 10-15 years ago.  As result, I think teams that stuck with the running game as a focal point of their offense have amassed significant level of talent for the running game at discounted market value that now those offenses are a force in the league...

 

I think the same can be said about 4-3 defense versus 3-4 defenses...  Back 15 years ago, the 3-4 defensive teams would get such great talent at a bargain in the draft because not many teams were looking for those type of players...  Now with so many teams in the league moved to 3-4 defensive schemes or at minimum have parts defenses that utilize the 3-4 concepts that the talent required to run 3-4 is getting diluted.   One of the many reasons why Redskins never got the right talent for the 3-4 scheme...  Also I would guess why teams like Steelers are starting to struggle...  Before it seemed every year Steelers would find good to great level defensive started in later rounds in the draft but if you look like how they did last 4-5 years... looks like that well has dried up...

 

We know Del Rio is moving us back to 4-3.  I am not sure which was Turner wants to go... If you look at his father's schemes which is actually has very strong focus on the running game or his recent expereience with the Panthers, you would think we might be focusing on the running game this off season and draft...  We will find out in few months...

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5 hours ago, Burgold said:

Is the pendulum turning? If so, are the Redskins ahead or behind on the curve?

 

If it is, you can bet your ass that the Redskins will be behind the curve.

 

Running the ball is boring and all of the teams listed have strong defenses.  This is due to be one of the most boring playoff years to date.  If this is the identity that the Redskins try to conform to, it'll be a long boring season next year.

 

This has been your moment of positivity for Sunday.

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I get the sense this is exactly what Ron and Del Rio have in mind. We have the makings of being excellent in both areas. I'd add another back for insurance purposes, but if Guice and Love are and can stay healthy, our ground game is going to be top-tier. I'd like to see us take Vanderbilt RB Ke'Shawn Vaugn personally but likely won't spend much draft capital on the position.

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When did rushing ever go out of vogue? I know you have analysts who say it's a passing league, but you can never be one dimensional on the field. Your team needs to be able to run and pass the ball in my opinion.

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Guice runs very similarly to Henry. If he can stay healthy he’s gonna lead the league in rushing one year.

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Guys are getting faster but they are soft.  As with everything, things take turns.  Big Backs and powerful offensive maulers are back.  

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So many overreactions this morning (not necessarily calling out this thread). Henry had less than 30 yards rushing on nearly 10 attempts when the Titans had a 14-0 lead. They ran to run the clock out, but teams need a great defense and/or a great passing attack to get that lead in the first place. 
 

 

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6 hours ago, JoeJacobyHOForRIOT said:

Look at what Gruden did week one with A.P. , set a sour tone for the entire season

 

Chase Young

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Somewhere in the Smithsonian, I think there's an exhibit with a football, a replica of the Lombardi trophy, and a wax caricature of Trent Dilfer. Its aim is to teach an important history lesson: a stout D and killer rushing attack can take you to the promised land, even if you ain't got a quarterback.

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Good thread...ultimately I think if you have a good run game along with a reckoning type defense you should be able to win games. D Henry is a freak of nature, not many guys who are 230 with his size and speed. I don’t think you need Henry as long as you have multiple guys who can run and catch the ball. Can we really count on Guice? I think/hope Bryce Love is our X factor. 
 

As far as our defense someone mentioned we never had the right players fo4 a 3-4 and I agree. Thats why I’m hoping switching back to a 4-3 hybrid will be helpful. We need opportunistic type players at all positions. Too bad Josh never turned into that type for us but I put that on coaching. Riverboat Rons background is defense and from what I remember Rio is also very aggressive so hopefully our defense will become significantly better. 
 

Im still on the fence about drafting Young when we have guys who can play end when we have holes at lb, corner and safety. I rather trade down and pick up more picks. 

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With a great defense and a dominant offensive line, and you can win with whatever kind of offense you prefer so long as it produces 24+ points.  

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8 hours ago, Burgold said:

Tennessee, Baltimore, Minnesota, and San Francisco were all running dominant teams yesterday

 

 

And half of those teams lost, so I'm not sure that's the best way to support your theory 😛

But I get your point though

Edited by Malapropismic Depository

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Unless you have an HoF QB, play in the NFC East or have an historically good defense you ain’t winning the SB.

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1 hour ago, TheShredSkinz said:

Chase Young

 

We really should be thanking Jay. His expert stewardship for our 0-5 start led to us perhaps drafting this insanely talented DE. Our very own JJ Watt even. If I ever see Jay in person, I'm going to personally give him a nipple twist as a thank you.

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