Press Release: #REDSKINS ANNOUNCE ROB ROGERS AS SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT OF FOOTBALL ADMINISTRATION

[wilco_holland]

2 hours ago, goskins10 said:

 

I would like to have seen at least a few more on off from other staffs - especially the OC. Again, I stated in the first comment I get that many will come from Carolina. And that's fine. I do find in hilarious that so many complained about the "Tampa" connection but are OK with the Carolina connection - which again on D I get it. Their D was consistently good outside a season here and there.

 

I would have preferred an experienced OC come in and bring most of their own people or some mix. It didn't happen so I will root for Scott to be the best - I totally hope he is amazing. But I have my concerns.

 

I do agree that would be fun to bring in an OC from the outside and consult with him on his staff (he doesn't pick then but can make recommendations and is allowed to give his opinion. Get a bit more diverse. Because was that Carolina team so good then? No improvement possible? 

 

But on the other side. Why would Ron Burgundy take a shot at somebody he doesn't know? And bring in people he doesn't know? The biggest issue we had last year on D was that all D guys didn't see eye to eye. Team Manusky and Team Ryan. Ron now knows: These guys know what I want, they can work together and share my vision. The upside might be a bit lower but the risk is also way lower. He is taking the save road. 

[goskins10]

5 hours ago, wilco_holland said:

 

I do agree that would be fun to bring in an OC from the outside and consult with him on his staff (he doesn't pick then but can make recommendations and is allowed to give his opinion. Get a bit more diverse. Because was that Carolina team so good then? No improvement possible? 

 

But on the other side. Why would Ron Burgundy take a shot at somebody he doesn't know? And bring in people he doesn't know? The biggest issue we had last year on D was that all D guys didn't see eye to eye. Team Manusky and Team Ryan. Ron now knows: These guys know what I want, they can work together and share my vision. The upside might be a bit lower but the risk is also way lower. He is taking the save road. 

 

I see it as taking a bigger risk to hire someone you know but that has no experience doing that job than someone you do not know but has a proven track record of success. Oddly enough, on D where his Ds have always been good he did go outside the Panthers and brought in someone from the outside. Now they have worked together in the past - but certainly he has worked with an OC in his past that has a better resume than Scott. If the team was already established and had a good system in place and was looking for new fresh faces then I would be all for it. You can absorb someone who doesn't perform right away. 

 

Again, I am rooting for him. I would always rather be wrong and have to the team be successful. And I also think Ron has already made some very good decisions. This one to me is a bit of a head scratcher and unlike some others I see this as an unnecessary risk coming to a new team.

[skins island connection]

17 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

I see it as taking a bigger risk to hire someone you know but that has no experience doing that job than someone you do not know but has a proven track record of success. Oddly enough, on D where his Ds have always been good he did go outside the Panthers and brought in someone from the outside. Now they have worked together in the past - but certainly he has worked with an OC in his past that has a better resume than Scott. If the team was already established and had a good system in place and was looking for new fresh faces then I would be all for it. You can absorb someone who doesn't perform right away. 

 

Again, I am rooting for him. I would always rather be wrong and have to the team be successful. And I also think Ron has already made some very good decisions. This one to me is a bit of a head scratcher and unlike some others I see this as an unnecessary risk coming to a new team.

 

 That happens all the time !  lol   JK...

Actually you hit the nail square on the head.  We all see this, when a new HC goes to a team then brings in a bunch of 'his guys'. Remember back when Schottenheimer basically hired his entire family? Like you, I hope things work out, and most likely they will. But the only concern I have is this; in situations where a HC brings people from his old team to his new team, they do good the first year, then the league catches on to what that HC is trying to accomplish, and often it mirrors his old team, then things go south in a hurry.

 

But I am happy that these changes are happening. We've all been pulling our hair out over the evil Thanos { Bruce Allen, the all powerful and misguided } and now that he's gone, we're jumping for joy. I am going to be pessimistically optimistic about the future. Changes are being made; changes are good; at least now us Redskin fans can now go out in public again, and its a beautiful world out there...

[KDawg]

29 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

I see it as taking a bigger risk to hire someone you know but that has no experience doing that job than someone you do not know but has a proven track record of success.

 

Not a chance.

 

Hiring someone you don't know, even if you know they are skilled at their job, in a position that has the utmost importance could sink the whole ship. Hiring people who seem good is such a poor strategy when you first arrive somewhere.

 

You are essentially hoping that a team full of people, who look great on paper, can gel together and come to a common ground to create a team culture.

 

There are people who could assimilate, absolutely. But bringing in many people from many backgrounds to follow your vision is a recipe for disaster. You can do it in a spot or two. You can't do it in several. To have both coordinators be people that Rivera is unfamiliar with would undermine him from day one. They have no buy-in to the culture Rivera is trying to create. They have their own systems and own beliefs.

 

After a year or two, and Rivera's system is in, bringing in people you're familiar with is less important. But to install a culture?

 

You bring in as many people that you are familiar with who buy into your methods and plans as you can.

 

And that doesn't mean cronyism. That doesn't mean yes men. These people could be of dissenting opinions. You just need to know that when the **** hits the fan they have your back. You don't know that with someone that you don't know. No matter how good they may be.

 

The above quote does not at all account for culture. It is strictly a football point of view. Which is what we did when we signed all those big name free agents back in the early 2000s. Fit didn't matter. It was strictly ability.

 

How'd that work?

[LD0506]

I get the concern about being Carolina centric and all, but IMO the biggest problem and highest priority this year is not offensive production or defensive stats, it is the whole ambiguous hard to define culture change thing. That needs to be the first foundation stone laid, this staff will be dealing with a bunch of players that have gotten used to the way this franchise has been run and all the **** they take for granted. Ron & Co. cannot be expected to completely build a new mindset in the team while simultaneously teaching/training their coaching staff as well. You gotta demo before you build, and we are going to be seeing some of that going on this offseason. I am willing to give this new regime the benefit of the doubt on the demo, this staff is not necessarily the one we'll see in a couple years once the backbiting bull**** is cleared out. So let them bring in a reliable crew they trust and see where it leads.

[goskins10]

6 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

Not a chance.

 

Hiring someone you don't know, even if you know they are skilled at their job, in a position that has the utmost importance could sink the whole ship. Hiring people who seem good is such a poor strategy when you first arrive somewhere.

 

You are essentially hoping that a team full of people, who look great on paper, can gel together and come to a common ground to create a team culture.

 

There are people who could assimilate, absolutely. But bringing in many people from many backgrounds to follow your vision is a recipe for disaster. You can do it in a spot or two. You can't do it in several. To have both coordinators be people that Rivera is unfamiliar with would undermine him from day one. They have no buy-in to the culture Rivera is trying to create. They have their own systems and own beliefs.

 

After a year or two, and Rivera's system is in, bringing in people you're familiar with is less important. But to install a culture?

 

You bring in as many people that you are familiar with who buy into your methods and plans as you can.

 

And that doesn't mean cronyism. That doesn't mean yes men. These people could be of dissenting opinions. You just need to know that when the **** hits the fan they have your back. You don't know that with someone that you don't know. No matter how good they may be.

 

The above quote does not at all account for culture. It is strictly a football point of view. Which is what we did when we signed all those big name free agents back in the early 2000s. Fit didn't matter. It was strictly ability.

 

How'd that work?

 

I do not remember saying just go hire any random OC just because they have a track record. So you are assuming something I did not say or even imply. Of course culture is important. In fact you either missed or ignored where I spoke about Jack Del Rio whom he worked with before AND has a good track record. Surely he knows someone he has worked with that also has a good track record as OC. Isn't that what the interview process is for? In fairness maybe all the people he knows that have good track records as OCs he did not feel fit the culture. If so, fair enough. 

 

And I am a big fan of removing all the people in place - as many as he sees need to go. The team may lose some good people but if they were here under Bruce, they either did not speak up enough, or they were part of the problem. Glad to see them go. But to that end, one thing i keep bringing up that I believe people are missing here (or more likely choosing to overlook) - it's also a matter of work load. With a new OC without much experience and what he has riding on the job being done, he will now have to spend a lot more time with the offense than he would otherwise. And with him basically playing President, GM and HC, all around top guy, he has a lot on his plate that he is not used to. I know they plan to hire a GM and they have some other titles - but it's also clear he is the last word. He owns it all. That is a huge responsibility that only works if you delegate appropriately. And hey, if they hire a true GM (something i hope anyway) that takes much of that work off his plate I will probably be a little less concerned as he will have the time needed to focus on helping Scott be successful. 

 

I just wish he was looking at someone with more experience at OC. That is not changing until Scott proves himself. And again, I am rooting for him. I hope he knocks it out of the park. We have some nice pieces but the offense needs a lot of work and has a lot of young guys. In fairness that may be why he wanted a newer face - a young OC for a bunch of young players. He will be able to relate to the social media habit better. 

In the end, I do not hate that selection which is of course where people go if you say anything not 100% rah rah. I am just not in love with the selection and see some potential for failure here that I feel is unnecessary. 

 

 

 

 

[KDawg]

Just now, goskins10 said:

 

I do not remember saying just go hire any random OC just because they have a track record. So you are assuming something I did not say or even imply. Of course culture is important. In fact you either missed or ignored where I spoke about Jack Del Rio whom he worked with before AND has a good track record. Surely he knows someone he has worked with that also has a good track record as OC. Isn't that what the interview process is for? In fairness maybe all the people he knows that have good track records as OCs he did not feel fit the culture. If so, fair enough. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is where I got that from:

 

I see it as taking a bigger risk to hire someone you know but that has no experience doing that job than someone you do not know but has a proven track record of success.

 

It was likely just a misread, as generally you are very well versed and parse things carefully. But, "bigger risk hiring someone you know vs. hiring someone you don't know". I'm not really commenting on the experience part. Turner has experience. It's not droves of it, but it's just as much as KOC. And people here would fall on a sword for KOC, but Rivera doesn't know him. So if it ultimately came down to Turner vs. KOC, for instance, both have similar levels of experience (read: very little), but Rivera knows one and not the other. Your point isn't about those two, though. I get it. 

 

The implication I based the entire premise of that post from was the line I quoted. But here is seems like your take is that Rivera could have hired someone he knew? Just seem to have some wires crossed here.

 

And I am a big fan of removing all the people in place - as many as he sees need to go.

 

same page!

 

In the end, I do not hate that selection which is of course where people go if you say anything not 100% rah rah. I am just not in love with the selection and see some potential for failure here that I feel is unnecessary.

 

I see less potential for failure here now, with Turner, than I did if KOC stayed. Unfamiliarity is a beast.

 

 

[goskins10]

Just now, KDawg said:

 

 

This is where I got that from:

 

 

Fair enough - I could have worded it better after reading it. But to be clear, i agree you don't just hire someone with a record. They need to work with the culture you are building. And i get that is easier with someone you know so fair enough. 

 

Just now, KDawg said:

 

 

It was likely just a misread, as generally you are very well versed and parse things carefully. But, "bigger risk hiring someone you know vs. hiring someone you don't know". I'm not really commenting on the experience part. Turner has experience. It's not droves of it, but it's just as much as KOC. And people here would fall on a sword for KOC, but Rivera doesn't know him. So if it ultimately came down to Turner vs. KOC, for instance, both have similar levels of experience (read: very little), but Rivera knows one and not the other. Your point isn't about those two, though. I get it. 

 

The implication I based the entire premise of that post from was the line I quoted. But here is seems like your take is that Rivera could have hired someone he knew? Just seem to have some wires crossed here.

 

I know you did not say I was a KOC fan so not directed at you - just providing clarity. I was not a big KOC fan. I was mostly ambiguous. My thoughts were if Ron wants him then fine. If not then fine. And in fact I did myself say In Ron we trust and am now kind of reversing that.. 🙂  I am a fan I am allowed to be fickle. 

 

On a side note I never saw the love or dislike for KOC. Honestly for me I see him and Scott about the same. So if it came down to those two, then yes I get it - the guy you know that fit's into your culture vs the guy you don't know and was in a viper pit before. 

 

Just now, KDawg said:

I see less potential for failure here now, with Turner, than I did if KOC stayed. Unfamiliarity is a beast.

 

 

As stated above, this I agree with. I just wish he had reached out to someone he knew with a better track record - and again in fairness, maybe he did and there was just not a fit. 

 

Again, I wish them both luck. 

[Thinking Skins]

5 hours ago, LD0506 said:

I get the concern about being Carolina centric and all, but IMO the biggest problem and highest priority this year is not offensive production or defensive stats, it is the whole ambiguous hard to define culture change thing. That needs to be the first foundation stone laid, this staff will be dealing with a bunch of players that have gotten used to the way this franchise has been run and all the **** they take for granted. Ron & Co. cannot be expected to completely build a new mindset in the team while simultaneously teaching/training their coaching staff as well. You gotta demo before you build, and we are going to be seeing some of that going on this offseason. I am willing to give this new regime the benefit of the doubt on the demo, this staff is not necessarily the one we'll see in a couple years once the backbiting bull**** is cleared out. So let them bring in a reliable crew they trust and see where it leads.

 

One of the things I'm leaning on here is the "greater than the sum of its parts thing". And I think what's going on right now is critical to the whole culture thing. Its important to have competent people at every position, but it is also important to know that if I'm having an off day I can depend on somebody for support instead of being ridiculed for it, or knowing that there are others I can lean on to help me recognize my flaws and grow in other areas. That's something that stood out to me about the whole "don't draw me a map if you haven't been there before". 

 

And what I'm seeing is that even with the inexperience we have Scott Turner and potentially KOC is that Ron has trust relationships with both their fathers. I beileve that Ron's first or second position in the NFL was as a DC under Norv with AJ Smith. Now he's potentially hiring both their sons. What that tells me is that Ron possibly has relationships with both these parents either directly or through their children. And so we are still building on these relationships. 

[JSSkinz]

This is an interesting hire, a guy who believes in analytics and has even developed his own systems, not sure we've ever had that around here so it's refreshing.

[Skinsinparadise]

28 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

 

One of the things I'm leaning on here is the "greater than the sum of its parts thing". And I think what's going on right now is critical to the whole culture thing. Its important to have competent people at every position, but it is also important to know that if I'm having an off day I can depend on somebody for support instead of being ridiculed for it, or knowing that there are others I can lean on to help me recognize my flaws and grow in other areas. That's something that stood out to me about the whole "don't draw me a map if you haven't been there before". 

 

 

It's a good way to put it.  The thing is you can come into an organization and preach this and preach that.  And believe in a certain type of culture, etc.  But like anything in life the best laid plains rarely go smooth.  You are going to have rocky moments, heck rocky years.  You typically need some time and patience to see it all through without panicking about the inevitable bumps in the road which can even include a bad season. 

 

John Schneider who many say is the best GM in the league had arguably two awful back to back years as for drafting.  It happens.   People are going to make bad decisions and have off moments and you got luck as a factor in the mix.

 

There are three owners who continually get slammed by media folk who say they have a good handle on them based on what they've heard from others who worked in that environment with them.  Sadly it looks like we got one of those owners.  And to that point, I just don't want someone Dan is close to whispering in his ear, Dan, Rivera preached X, Y, Z and looked some of that has failed, so can we trust this guy anymore?  That type of drill has been described some as to how Redskins Park has worked where you got factions with competing agendas.

 

And from that context, I like it that Rivera has people there who have his back and I'd be naturally skeptical about keeping around anyone that Dan has a long history with to avoid some of those backstabbing type of conversations. 

 

When you hire a new anything, there is optimism typically all around.  But if you think about it most (not all) of the people who have had high positions here have left with a least a certain amount of animosity towards them from a segment of the fan base and with their reputation somewhat tattered.   We hopefully want to avoid that here.  Because all the initial good will (out with old in with the new) will be tested because the honeymoons don't tend to last.  I think it will be easier for Rivera to navigate that minefield if he has his people in the mix who will have his back without interference with people close with Dan.

 

[Thinking Skins]

49 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

There are three owners who continually get slammed by media folk who say they have a good handle on them based on what they've heard from others who worked in that environment with them.  Sadly it looks like we got one of those owners.  And to that point, I just don't want someone Dan is close to whispering in his ear, Dan, Rivera preached X, Y, Z and looked some of that has failed, so can we trust this guy anymore?  That type of drill has been described some as to how Redskins Park has worked where you got factions with competing agendas.

 

 

People (fans) want change and I think this is the most demonstrable institute of change as we've seen since Snyder took over. Marty just fired Vinny and brought in his (1) guy. Ron is bringing in a coaching staff (similar to Marty) but also bringing in a whole new environment, front office, medical, and people. Nobody's close to Dan any more. So this is a situation where I was asking last Monday, who will Dan have to talk to. All his friends are now gone. I'm still skeptical that he'll find some way to resort to his normal tendencies, but the fact that these actions are being taken are a corrective course of action. Its like he knows he's a habitual drinker so he's saying that the least he can do is stop having drinks in the fridge. 

[Skinsinparadise]

21 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

 

People (fans) want change and I think this is the most demonstrable institute of change as we've seen since Snyder took over. Marty just fired Vinny and brought in his (1) guy. Ron is bringing in a coaching staff (similar to Marty) but also bringing in a whole new environment, front office, medical, and people. Nobody's close to Dan any more. So this is a situation where I was asking last Monday, who will Dan have to talk to. All his friends are now gone. I'm still skeptical that he'll find some way to resort to his normal tendencies, but the fact that these actions are being taken are a corrective course of action. Its like he knows he's a habitual drinker so he's saying that the least he can do is stop having drinks in the fridge. 

 

Agree.  I've come to the conclusion that you got to go cold turkey with Dan.  It just is what it is.  It could be just coincidence here and this is how Rivera would roll in any situation.  But even if so, I think you got to wipe the slate as clean as possible.  IMO you got to break up the gang as for Dan.  Make him feel isolated where he doesn't have a guy he can go to and gripe about or feed into his emotionalism. 

 

Shanny kept some holdovers.  He actually kept almost the full FO he inherited.  Jay kept many of the holdovers.  I like just wiping this out as clean as possible.  I got my favs that I'd rather keep in theory (mainly Kyle Smith) but I am 100% on board to dumping anybody he wants to replace including Kyle if need be. 

[Burgold]

I think it's interesting (and less explored) as much as the Redskins are cleaning house so are the Panthers. For some reason, I think ours is a rebuilding effort while theirs is an abandoning ship one. Don't really know though. I haven't followed the Panthers close enough to know if they should blow up their coaching staff, their front office, and trainers.

 

Certainly, if this was a divorce the owner lost all his friends and everyone is siding with Rivera.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

7 minutes ago, Burgold said:

I think it's interesting (and less explored) as much as the Redskins are cleaning house so are the Panthers. For some reason, I think ours is a rebuilding effort while theirs is an abandoning ship one. Don't really know though. I haven't followed the Panthers close enough to know if they should blow up their coaching staff, their front office, and trainers.

The new owner wants to put his stamp on things, for better or worse.

 

7 minutes ago, Burgold said:

Certainly, if this was a divorce the owner lost all his friends and everyone is siding with Rivera.

Not sure that it really shakes out that way.  The owner seems to be cutting off his friends vs. losing them and Rivera has jobs to offer.

[Vanguard]

So who is the GM?  Or is it a collaboration?  People are happy that it seems Doug isn’t picking the players.  But wasn’t last year’s draft a success so far?

[RWJ]

15 minutes ago, Vanguard said:

So who is the GM?  Or is it a collaboration?  People are happy that it seems Doug isn’t picking the players.  But wasn’t last year’s draft a success so far?

Vanguard , that's the last move to be made.  A lot of people thought it was going to be Marty Hurney, current GM of the Panthers but from the tweets/reports I have read he is staying on in Carolina.  It will be interesting to see who will be named the new GM.  I hope that title goes to Kyle Smith soon. 

[evmiii]

The overall responsibility of a head coach is so comprehensive that he has to surround himself with people he trusts to do their jobs IAW his plan without constant supervision.  The area he has the most personal experience (i.e. Defense) he can hire from credentials.  This is pretty much exactly what I expected.  I have zero doubt we will be a better football team next year, but I don't expect miracles.  Just appearing to be an organization run by adults is a great step in the right direction.

 

I'm  confident Rob can handle contracts and the administrative duties in a manner that the coach likes.  I am a bit intrigued by the analytical angle to his experience.  Welcome to the Redskins.  HTTR!

[dyst]

2 hours ago, Vanguard said:

So who is the GM?  Or is it a collaboration?  People are happy that it seems Doug isn’t picking the players.  But wasn’t last year’s draft a success so far?

Last year we got a major infusion of talent. Which is funny to say because our record was putrid but Sweat, McLaurin, Harmon, Sims, Holcomb and the Corner all played and played well. Haskins still iffy but overall decent draft.

[Gibbs828791]

Ron has to bring in new guys, we dont know who is leaking or which media guy is playing both sides. Any media guy that gets that upset over some cap guy...yea just lost a source of inside info, what we call leaking.

[Commander Chaaarmnder]

On 1/9/2020 at 6:29 PM, SkinsGuy said:

Snyder is really shaking things up and cleaning house.

 

My only small concern is bringing in all these Panther staff people Rivera knows.

 

It reeks a little bit of cronyism.

 

Will we be making fun of the "Carolina connection" the way we made fun of the "Tampa Bay connection" with Bruce Allen?

 

Time will tell.

I’ll take this over the Tampa connection we’ve been subjected to the past 9-10 years!

[TSO]

@goskins10 @KDawg @Thinking Skins @Skinsinparadise @LD0506 and everyone else... great conversation going on in here, well done. 👍
 

Tell you what, though, we’re going to forever be linked with the Panthers on a scale unlike many others. It’s fascinating. 

[JaxJoe]

13 hours ago, evmiii said:

 I am a bit intrigued by the analytical angle to his experience.  Welcome to the Redskins.  HTTR!

I’m intrigued, too specifically in regards to analytics as it pertains to contracts. We all know metrics like completion percentage for a QB or pro bowl selection for any player are typical in most contracts as incentives. But, how do analytics play into a contract?  Maybe it doesn’t and Rob Rogers is the resident nerd like PFF or FO to give him more insight in how much to offer a player.