The Official ES 2020 Free Agency Thread /Tracker... Kendall Fuller,OG Schweitzer, KP Louis, Thomas Davis, McKissic, TE Logan Thomas, OT Lucas, QB Kyle Allen (trd 5th Rd pick), RB P. Barber, LB Davis, Ronald Darby

[CommDownMan]

7 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

If I ever have a kid, I'm going to groom him to be a long snapper. Why didn't anyone tell me that was a career option? I can't believe that's a thing. Is ours still Albright? The Red Snapper?

 

I hate the kicking game part of football. I don't care about the kicker as long as he kick gooder.

 

I think Sundberg replaced the Red Snapper when Shanny was here and has been since.  (edit: I looked, Albright left sooner, so some guy inbetween...)

 

Which made me look...he started in 2013 and has made 8.4 mill.  Wow good life decisions...

 

https://overthecap.com/player/nick-sundberg/2035/

[Est.1974]

4 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

JuJu is probably in line to be the second highest paid FA WR behind Robinson and it’s probably not gonna be by much. Probably $17-18m a year. 

I’d go a bit lower and say 15mil max. But 60-70% guaranteed and he walks into another deal aged 28.

[carex]

8 minutes ago, jsharrin55 said:

 

I think Sundberg replaced the Red Snapper when Shanny was here and has been since.  (edit: I looked, Albright left sooner, so some guy inbetween...)

 

Which made me look...he started in 2013 and has made 8.4 mill.  Wow good life decisions...

 

https://overthecap.com/player/nick-sundberg/2035/

 

no, Sundberg has been here since 2010, I checked our past rosters to confirm

[CommDownMan]

2 minutes ago, carex said:

 

no, Sundberg has been here since 2010, I checked our past rosters to confirm

 

Ok, then I did remember the passing to the torch, OTC didnt' go back far enough.  And in that case he's made even more money as a LS.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

Here are some figures at WR per Spotrac Market Value. FYI I expect Godwin and Golladay to get tagged. 
 

- Robinson: 4/80 - 20m APY

- Golladay: 5/95 - 19m APY

- Godwin: 4/69 - 17m APY

- Fuller: 4/68 - 17m APY

- JuJu: 5/78 - 16m APY

- Samuel: 4/48 - 12m APY

- Davis: 2/20 - 10m APY

- M. Jones: 4/38 - 10m APY

- Watkins: 2/20 - 10m APY

- Pascal: 4/32 - 8m APY

- Ross: 1/4 - 4m APY 

[Koolblue13]

21 minutes ago, jsharrin55 said:

 

Ok, then I did remember the passing to the torch, OTC didnt' go back far enough.  And in that case he's made even more money as a LS.

We're a bunch of fools. Rich ****ing longsnapper 

[Koolblue13]

34 minutes ago, carex said:

 

no, Sundberg has been here since 2010, I checked our past rosters to confirm

 

30 minutes ago, jsharrin55 said:

 

Ok, then I did remember the passing to the torch, OTC didnt' go back far enough.  And in that case he's made even more money as a LS.

Now I'm super curious about the typical career of a LS. Do most teams just have a guy who plays 10-12 years, replace him when he retires and then just have another 10 year guy?

 

This is a total life hack. The sweetest spot of professional sports as a career.

[KillBill26]

26 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

We're a bunch of fools. Rich ****ing longsnapper 

When the sports car pulls up, everyone stares in awe.  The valet let's him out, and everyone wonders, is he a doctor?  A lawyer?

 

No, I'm a long snapper.

 

Dilfer can have his qb camp. We need to start the ES School of Long Snapping.  Arrive late, leave early, don't do much of anything in between.

[PartyPosse]

47 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

Here are some figures at WR per Spotrac Market Value. FYI I expect Godwin and Golladay to get tagged. 
 

- Robinson: 4/80 - 20m APY

- Golladay: 5/95 - 19m APY

- Godwin: 4/69 - 17m APY

- Fuller: 4/68 - 17m APY

- JuJu: 5/78 - 16m APY

- Samuel: 4/48 - 12m APY

- Davis: 2/20 - 10m APY

- M. Jones: 4/38 - 10m APY

- Watkins: 2/20 - 10m APY

- Pascal: 4/32 - 8m APY

- Ross: 1/4 - 4m APY 

Samuel at 12 is criminal overpayment for a guy with 14 TDs in 4 years.  It's also wild that for a "gadget" guy, his 11.1 average per reception places him in a whopping 84th place, almost half a yard behind the immortal Randall Cobb.

[CommDownMan]

6 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

Samuel at 12 is criminal overpayment for a guy with 14 TDs in 4 years. 

 

Fuller at 17 would make me cry.

 

Corey Davis 2/20 and Samuel 4/48?  If true, I'd happily switch to Davis.  I think 1 of those 2 guys in the 10ish range is my ideal while having room for other FAs.

[FootballZombie]

1 hour ago, PartyPosse said:

I don’t even think he’s immature. He’s done some cool things in his life. He went to prom with another dude after the dude’s date bailed on him. He sat with a kid who was eating all alone in high school (or college?). I think he just got caught up in the limelight but he doesn’t seem like a headcase at all.

Gibson waves to a rival player in a heated game and now he’s a potential problem child!?

 

By all means, Juju is a not just a good dude but a great one. He kills it in the community, he is well respected in his own locker-room and is all around impressive given his young age. The issue is his playfulness can be seen as a lack of seriousness, and if you get enough of that, it can bring out the worst in others rather than the best. I think that is a big part of Claypool's immaturity for example. When the elder statesmen of your core is dancing on other teams logos, and scripting TD dances, that rubs off on the young guys. While he himself is not a headcase, he can help to build an environment that breeds them.

 

As for Gibson, it has been well documented on this board that the specific wave vs Dallas was not his first example of taunting his opponents so I wont open that debate again. You can go back over the Gibson thread if you want the deets. While Gibby is by no means a full on showboat, If you have a player on the team that does some of the things Juju did last year, it will only embolden an impressionable young player like Gibson to push his own antics even farther.

[PartyPosse]

4 minutes ago, jsharrin55 said:

 

Fuller at 17 would make me cry.

 

Corey Davis 2/20 and Samuel 4/48?  If true, I'd happily switch to Davis.  I think 1 of those 2 guys in the 10ish range is my ideal while having room for other FAs.

If people switched their draft position, more people would be jockeying for Davis. The fact he hasn't lived up to being a top 5 pick means people are more critical than they are a guy who was drafted late in the second. I like Samuel a lot and would love him to be on Washington, but we don't necessarily need his style as much as we do Davis. It seems like every receiver we have here is a Samuel type gadget/all-purpose guy 

[CommDownMan]

59 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

Here are some figures at WR per Spotrac Market Value. FYI I expect Godwin and Golladay to get tagged.

 

Also, if this is true I hope we at least reach out to LaVante David.  I don't see him leaving, but it's worth the shot.

[PartyPosse]

2 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

By all means, Juju is a not just a good dude but a great one. He kills it in the community, he is well respected in his own locker-room and is all around impressive given his young age. The issue is his playfulness can be seen as a lack of seriousness, and if you get enough of that, it can bring out the worst in others rather than the best. I think that is a big part of Claypool's immaturity for example. When the elder statesmen of your core is dancing on other teams logos, and scripting TD dances, that rubs off on the young guys. While he himself is not a headcase, he can help to build an environment that breeds them.

 

As for Gibson, it has been well documented on this board that the specific wave vs Dallas was not his first example of taunting his opponents so I wont open that debate again. You can go back over the Gibson thread if you want the deets. While Gibby is by no means a full on showboat, If you have a player on the team that does some of the things Juju did last year, it will only embolden an impressionable young player like Gibson to push his own antics even farther.

I think the problem with Pitts is the fact the culture has gotten stale. What I mean is that the regime has been there so long, from the coach to the QB, that there is more a level of comfort than competitiveness. It's all great when they're winning, but as we saw, when things start to break down it's a cluster****. You can go through the history of inmates running the asylum there, from AB to Leveon to Ben... the culture there really expects players to take accountability for their own actions and if they don't then cya. I don't know if that necessarily reflects on the players and I imagine a more disciplinarian coach can iron out those kinks. Tomlin, for as good a coach as he is, seems perfectly content letting the players shoot themselves in the foot and then have to deal with the consequences. 

[CommDownMan]

1 minute ago, PartyPosse said:

If people switched their draft position, more people would be jockeying for Davis. The fact he hasn't lived up to being a top 5 pick means people are more critical than they are a guy who was drafted late in the second. I like Samuel a lot and would love him to be on Washington, but we don't necessarily need his style as much as we do Davis. It seems like every receiver we have here is a Samuel type gadget/all-purpose guy 

 

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2021-free-agency-top-100-free-agents

THings are all over the place, but I've consistently seen Davis higher $$ (link 16.25) and Samuel (8.33 mill).

 

Price being equal I'd go Davis, but either will be an upgrade and I'd rather have room for others as mentioned.

 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

sporrac has David at 3/39 for a 13m APY

[PartyPosse]

I think market value and what players will get are two entirely different things. I don't think market value takes into consideration draft expectations (ie teams more willing to spend on a big FA may opt to go the cheaper route in a WR deep class) nor is it taking into account the unknown cap ramifications from this year. I would honestly be shocked if either Davis or Samuel got more than 10 mil a season and if they do it'll be a short term bridge deal for 2 years max. Teams are either gonna go after one of the marquee names or draft someone. Both Curtis and Corey could use one more really productive season to really prove their worth similar to what Robby Anderson did last year in Carolina.

28 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

sporrac has David at 3/39 for a 13m APY

That would make him the 18th highest paid WR which is insane.

 

edit I just realized you were talking about Lavonte

[CommDownMan]

54 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

sporrac has David at 3/39 for a 13m APY

 

37 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

I think market value and what players will get are two entirely different things. I don't think market value takes into consideration draft expectations (ie teams more willing to spend on a big FA may opt to go the cheaper route in a WR deep class) nor is it taking into account the unknown cap ramifications from this year. I would honestly be shocked if either Davis or Samuel got more than 10 mil a season and if they do it'll be a short term bridge deal for 2 years max. Teams are either gonna go after one of the marquee names or draft someone. Both Curtis and Corey could use one more really productive season to really prove their worth similar to what Robby Anderson did last year in Carolina.

That would make him the 18th highest paid WR which is insane.

 

edit I just realized you were talking about Lavonte

 

PFF has David at 13.33, so fairly similar.  Davis at 10 and David at 13 vs Robinson at 20 I'd rather the duo (I don't think this is 2 DL for 1 in Brucy fashion). 

 

@PartyPosseWhat guys will get is really tough to gauge and again will depend on a cap of 175 vs 195 or whatever.  However, every year FA opens and I have several "holy **** that guy got $$XXX!?!?!".  So while you may be right, I won't be surprised if both get $10+.

[Est.1974]

4 hours ago, PartyPosse said:

Samuel at 12 is criminal overpayment for a guy with 14 TDs in 4 years.  It's also wild that for a "gadget" guy, his 11.1 average per reception places him in a whopping 84th place, almost half a yard behind the immortal Randall Cobb.

Agree, that’s nonsense. I’d gladly take him at 6-7mil max py deal.

[KillBill26]

I continue to be a big proponent of signing samuel.  I think he is a perfect fit for this offense.  His numbers first few years were low, with cam a running qb and CMC hogging touches.   He can stretch the field and mix it up with an occasional run.  With tmacs and gibson's versatility, it will be a tough group to game plan for.

 

I know 12 mil per sounds high, and I think we can get him for lower than that, but if thats the range that it takes to get him, do it.  I think that this is much better value than a Rob (or attempt for amari last offseason) at 20 mil per.  

 

Here is a snippet that summarizes why I want samuel. He is my #1 wr target.

 

“He doesn’t say very much, doesn’t complain, doesn’t make excuses; he’s just got a tough mindset. And he does whatever needs to be done. You can coach him. If he says something to me, I listen. I have a lot of respect for him,” Rhule said last month. “He’s so versatile, to be able ... to have someone who can run and catch and get open and block, to do it at his level might be rare, and it’s a lot of credit to him.“

This year, Samuel has 61 receptions on 72 targets for 585 yards and three receiving touchdowns. 30 receiving first downs have come from those receptions and his catch percentage is 84.7% — far higher than any previous year of his career (his three-season average coming into this year was 55.1%) and fifth-highest in the NFL.

Does it help that Teddy Bridgewater is a more accurate quarterback than others who Samuel has played with? Sure, he’s completing 70.7% of his passes, second in the league behind Drew Brees. Not among Cam Newton’s best qualities is being accurate with the football, but Samuel has also proven to be reliable for Bridgewater. Samuel only has two drops this year, per Pro Football Reference.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.charlotteobserver.com/sports/nfl/carolina-panthers/article247854115.html

 

PS - samuel is only 24 years old.

PPS - double hard pass on juju.  

[PartyPosse]

4 hours ago, jsharrin55 said:

 

 

PFF has David at 13.33, so fairly similar.  Davis at 10 and David at 13 vs Robinson at 20 I'd rather the duo (I don't think this is 2 DL for 1 in Brucy fashion). 

 

@PartyPosseWhat guys will get is really tough to gauge and again will depend on a cap of 175 vs 195 or whatever.  However, every year FA opens and I have several "holy **** that guy got $$XXX!?!?!".  So while you may be right, I won't be surprised if both get $10+.

I think we’re gonna see A LOT of bigger money short term deals, especially at WR. Guys like Golladay and Robinson are gonna want their big deal in 3 seasons or so. I expect a majority of the guys to sign for short deals.

[Skinsinparadise]

I'd rather pay $35 for a steak than spend $28 for a high end burger.  I know its sort of the uncool less frugal approach but we did that years back ironically when we skipped Robinson for up and coming Paul Richardson.  This isnt apples to apples granted.  Robinson has evolved into one of the best receivers in the league and the other options are more attractive this time.  But I am not paying 16 million for Juju or even 12 million for Samuel.  If i am spending big, I am shooting for a high end player. 

 

If those are the prices ranges I am going for the fliet mignon, Allen Robinson.

 

 

 

 

 

[kingdaddy]

20 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I'd rather pay $35 for a steak than spend $28 for a high end burger.  I know its sort of the uncool less frugal approach but we did that years back ironically when we skipped Robinson for up and coming Paul Richardson.  This isnt apples to apples granted.  Robinson has evolved into one of the best receivers in the league and the other options are more attractive.  But I am not paying 16 million for Juju or even 12 million for Samuel.  If i am spending big, I am shooting for a high end player. 

 

If those are the prices ranges I am going for the fliet mignon, Allen Robinson.

 

 

 

 

 

If we get Allen Robinson we are set at WR for a good while and we might have the best 1-2 punch of WR's in the league. Whatever we offered Amari Cooper offer the same to ARob...

[Skinsinparadise]

10 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

If we get Allen Robinson we are set at WR for a good while and we might have the best 1-2 punch of WR's in the league. Whatever we offered Amari Cooper offer the same to ARob...

 

They were willing to aim high for Cooper last time.  If they have the same approach -- Robinson IMO is a better receiver than Cooper.  A clear peg better IMO. 

[JSSkinz]

Robinson has upside, he put up those numbers with poor and inconsistent QB play for his entire contract, that might be a reason he shys away from us but I hope its not.

 

He's a complete player.