FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[SoCalSkins]

13 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

 

Somewhat, Debbie downer?

 

It is extremely repetitive to the point all of your posts are saying the same thing, and thus you can be ignored.

 

Fun fact football fans are aware of bust rates. No one cares you bet on the favorites every day.  The sad part is that if he has a good game you will be in here debbie doubling down. 

 

I’m the repetitive one? Why don’t you compare football to Shakespeare some more?  You obviously don’t know the stats. Because if you did you would realize he is a bust.  By the way, Shakespeare is not that hard dude. Maybe get a better analogy?

[bakedtater1]

7 minutes ago, SoCalSkins said:

 

I’m the repetitive one? Why don’t you compare football to Shakespeare some more?  You obviously don’t know the stats. Because if you did you would realize he is a bust.  By the way, Shakespeare is not that hard dude. Maybe get a better analogy?

Soooo you think haskins is a bust?..sorry, I'm lazy and not reading over all the posts..lol...and I'm not being sarcastic or trying to start anything 

[Nerm]

I think we are a year or two away from knowing if Haskins is a bust or not.  I also understand the pushback on @SoCalSkins for his certainty in proclaiming him a bust.  But, I think a player can be considered a bust even if he doesn't get much play time.  For example, the Broncos seemed certain that Paxton Lynch was a bust before he had much game time.  He did end up playing 4 games over two seasons, but it seemed clear that he was a bust early on.  Christian Hackenberg, mid second round pick for the Jets, never took an NFL snap and it was clear that he was a bust.  A player can show they are a bust without getting regular season playing time, but I do think it is too early to know on Haskins yet.

[NickyJ]

[Warhead36]

25 minutes ago, Nerm said:

I think we are a year or two away from knowing if Haskins is a bust or not.  I also understand the pushback on @SoCalSkins for his certainty in proclaiming him a bust.  But, I think a player can be considered a bust even if he doesn't get much play time.  For example, the Broncos seemed certain that Paxton Lynch was a bust before he had much game time.  He did end up playing 4 games over two seasons, but it seemed clear that he was a bust early on.  Christian Hackenberg, mid second round pick for the Jets, never took an NFL snap and it was clear that he was a bust.  A player can show they are a bust without getting regular season playing time, but I do think it is too early to know on Haskins yet.

Both those guys were garbage from the get go. Haskins in his first start when he actually had the week to prepare didn't look terrible.

[Llevron]

See what yall dont understand is credibility.  

 

That and fractions. 

[skinny21]

Haskins is a bust.  Evidence:

 

1.  DHall said players had to avoid intercepting him.  Sure, a lawyer might call this hearsay, or might wonder why this hasn’t been made a big deal by any reporters, players or coaches.  It’s ironclad to me.  He’s a bust.  

2.  Coaches thought his preparation could be better.  Unacceptable for a rookie qb.  This problem has since gone way... but it’s still incontrovertible evidence he’s a bust.  
3.  Peterson said he needs to focus on getting the plays down pat (this means he doesn’t understand football).  
4.  Even with few reps and getting thrown into terrible situations... he still managed to throw multiple interceptions.  Sure, in his first start he didn’t throw any, but that’s because coaches weren’t trying to win the game.  Alex Smith threw 4 INTs in his first start and we all know he never improved.  

5.  Most 1st round quarterbacks bust... which is obviously further proof Haskins is a bust.  
6.  Andre Smith was a first round pick that never played and was a bust.  Ipso facto, Haskins is a bust.  
7.  Rookie quarterbacks don’t get better.  
8.  I saw him on the sideline.  His attitude screamed bust; so he is.  
9.  If someone states an opinion as a fact, you must accept it as such.  Sorry, I mean if I state my opinion as fact, it is.  If you disagree, you’re just not smart enough to realize it yet.  I pity you.  
 

TLDR:  In my opinion, Haskins is a bust.  My opinions are facts.  I’ve been right before, so I must be right now.  

[SoCalSkins]

You forgot the Czabe comment about not remembering the watered down version of the plays. Also it was Andre Johnson out of Penn State not Smith. 
 

Otherwise nice effort on the summary. When I am proven to be 100 percent correct  I won’t be as hard on you as the others. Although some of the snark was a bit much, but the comedic effort was an A+.  Bravo!

 

 

[Nerm]

5 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Both those guys were garbage from the get go. Haskins in his first start when he actually had the week to prepare didn't look terrible.

 

I agree about Haskins not looking terrible last game.  I also think he is a guy that deserves more leeway early in his career due to his only having one season as a starter at The Ohio State University.  I do not consider the guy a bust at all at this point.

 

Im just saying that it is possible to know a guy can't play, even if they get very little actual game time.  If a guy looks lost in practice, you can know that he will not be able to run an offense in an actual game.  I'm talking about this as a general principle, not in relation to Haskins specifically.  I think Haskins first start was a good sign.

[TSO]

14 hours ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

Wow this place sure has changed from years past.  Posters are really at each other's throats now, I guess 20 years of this crap will do that to any fan base.

 

It's actually always been like this, especially regarding the QB position here. 

 

Anyway, I, for one, am excited to see Haskins the rest of the way. I have no idea where it's going to go, but I'll just reiterate that I fell in love with his growth as the season wore on at Ohio State. To my eyes, he improved at every single issue he had by the end of it. It was really fun to watch. 

 

I'm going to post some of what I had seen back then in May (and posted in June as they were previously part of a private discussion) after going through his season chronologically (and some of Daniel Jones') and how it looks now after his first start (bolded what is relevant, red for what I'm saying now about it):

 

https://es.redskins.com/topic/430394-welcome-to-the-nfl-dwayne-haskins-qb-ohio-state/?do=findComment&comment=11521219

 

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Btw, I just finished the Maryland game. Wow, that was actually a fun game to watch, especially that 2nd half. 

 

Dwayne was a mixed bag, really, but I’m happy to finally see something truly noteworthy. That’s what I was waiting for. He made some big throws in key moments. 

 

Honestly, there isn’t much about him that amazes... but one thing that does for me are his throws on out routes outside the numbers. Sometimes the ball is even placed at the LOS on the opposite hash marks and he still manages to get the ball out there with relative ease and accurately, which is impressive considering how far that can be in college with the wider hash marks. It is a thing of beauty. 

 

I felt the way about him well before the MD game, but you could see they started having success in the passing game against Maryland when they started attacking them outside the numbers. 

 

But, yeah, I like that I finally watched a game where he had to lead a comeback to some degree. It definitely wasn’t all him, but he played a big enough role unlike the past 5-6 games I’ve watched. 

 

On to the huge Michigan game for [a chance at] the Big 10! 

 

 I feel like that is beginning to translate. We saw beautiful throws against the Bills outside the numbers. Hopefully it continues as it forces the defense to cover every blade of grass so long as he's generally accurate with everything else. 

 

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Btw, I finished watching Haskins against Maryland, Michigan, Northwestern and the Rose Bowl against Washington. 

 

I have to say, I’m pretty pleased at the growth he showed. I think it’s funny I wrote to you guys after only having watched up to the 1st half of the MD game... because after that he really looked different. 

 

There were many times where he was actually decisive within the pocket and slid left or right, or stepped up nicely, reset and threw a dime. He simply wasn’t doing that before. 

 

I get why people say his game against Michigan is overrated since a lot of it was about YAC and those short crossing routes, but I don’t care. That was as high pressure as it gets and he was calm and accurate. Even the easiest of throws become hard in those situations. A lot of that YAC came as a result of timing and precision, it wasn’t just guys breaking tackles for him and making plays on their own. He also was doing a good job with his feet on a lot of those plays, because he’d start off looking the opposite way to fool Michigan and then come back to the other side and hit the receiver in stride. 

 

But his best game, in my opinion, was against Northwestern. Some of his movement within the pocket in that game had me absolutely giddy. It was really special. If that’s the guy we’re getting? Man, look out. 

 

Rose Bowl was a bit meh. They played a lot of zone and he was effective in the first half at beating it, but then he reverted to “pre-2nd half against Maryland Haskins”, lol. Lot of interior pressure he had no answer for. Part of me thinks that the team just let off the gas a little bit and he followed suit, so hopefully it was just that. 

 

So that’s my final grade on him. There is “pre-2nd half against MD Haskins” who is definitely not worthy of a first round pick and there is the Haskins after that who is. 

 

The good news is that there is a clear indication of development and growth here. Were it the other way around I’d be devastated. I was devastated all the way through that first half against MD. Just thought that most of his stats were inflated and that he didn’t do much outside of a few really pretty throws to show he’s a must have pick in the 1st. But he changed my mind after that. His footwork was vastly improved and he looked dynamic in the pocket. 

 

I could see why Jay or Kyle were against picking a QB in the 1st. Don’t blame them at all. But I can also see why they were happy they didn’t trade up and got him at 15, that they still got Sweat in the end, and it wasn’t just Haskins in the 1st. 

 

I was leaning towards an 80/20 bust-boom percentage with Haskins when I first talked to you guys. Now? I’m not totally flipped but I’m more like 50/50. Which is worthy of a mid-first round pick. 

 

I hope we get that Haskins I saw those last few games and a half. There is the real possibility that it was just comfort in a simplistic offense that made him look like that in the end and that the NFL will be too fast, too difficult for him to ever get that comfortable in processing things while maneuvering in the pocket, but there is also the possibility it was real and that it was just a taste of what he can become in the NFL. 

 

I like what Jay said about throwing everything at him and that if it takes him a while to grasp it they’ll just move on to Case/Colt getting majority of reps, but if not he’ll be right in the mix.

 

That’s a sound plan. 

 

That gives Haskins the motivation to learn since he’s got a shot to start while also removing the pressure of being forced into a situation where he’s not ready and looks bad. 

 

As of right now, his pocket presence has been decent. His issues with dealing with interior pressure are still there, but not deal breakers. It's hard to tell, though, with as small a sample size as we have. He isn't going through progressions while sliding within the pocket yet, but that might be more a function of not having a mastery of the plays being called and/or not recognizing the defense so well. 

 

He absolutely did do it as he grew within the offense there, so can't write him off on that. 

 

Still, the possibility I mentioned above about it being comfort in a simplistic offense as opposed to anything that would translate is very real and made even more so by what has happened thus far. The plan Jay had for him ended up showing he wasn't able to grasp the complexities of NFL offense's and defense's quickly, which is perfectly fine, but his immaturity showed after that since his motivation waned way too much. That shouldn't have happened no matter what (which is even what Paul Troth, his elite 11 coach who's close to him, said recently on a Keim podcast), but he's only 22. Have to remember that. And now that he's starting he has no reason to lose motivation. 

 

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I’m going to study Daniel Jones next  to really see what the difference is as best I can. Going to be fascinating. Like I said, I really have zero preconceived notions going into this. Or at least more so than any other year. Only thing I know about Jones is that everyone is making fun of the Giants for taking him, lol.  

 

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I’ve watched so far Army, Northwestern, VT, and am into the Georgia Tech game (he missed two games in between Northwestern and VT due to a broken collarbone). 

 

[Jones's] very good with interior pressure. He’s got real toughness in the pocket so he’ll stand in there with a lot of bodies near him, but he’s also quick with his feet and can evade smoothly. He’s got nice touch on his deep throws, even with pressure right in his face, but his guys let him down a lot and don’t make the catch. To me, he’s just very polished. That Oline isn’t very good and he’s basically had a lot of reps dealing with an unclean pocket, which is what the NFL is all about. Reminds me a bit of Matt Ryan physically. 

 

Those are the things he’s clearly better than Haskins at from what I’ve seen so far. He’s got good enough arm strength, but nothing to write home about. Haskins can get the ball out further, quicker than he can for sure. Just no comparison on those out routes outside the numbers from the other side of the hash like I mentioned before. Haskins makes you say “wow” on those. But, yeah, he’s no slouch and his arm is definitely NFL worthy. 

 

The major negatives so far? A lot of the plays are one read and you don’t see him moving people with his eyes a lot, which Haskins did aplenty. He’s not as good as Haskins in terms of ball placement on short routes, which limits YAC. He’s absolutely AWFUL with edge pressure. I mean, just AWFUL. Just has no sense of it and, thus, he’s an easy strip sack. Which is where Haskins excelled in terms of pocket presence. 

 

It’s kind of funny. They’re opposites in quite a few areas. I mean, overall they’re traditional pocket passers, but the subtle differences are polarizing. If you combined them you’d have the perfect QB. 

 

One can handle interior pressure well, one can’t. Same guy who can handle interior pressure sucks with edge pressure, other guy who isn’t good with interior pressure is great with edge pressure. One can throw a beautiful deep ball with air under it (Jones), the other is more of a straight line deep thrower who will put too much on it or too little (Haskins). Etc...

 

He's really tough and fearless. Haskins is a bit soft and goes down easier, though he improved on that as the season went on. 

 

I don’t think Haskins was strip sacked even once, at least I don’t remember. He has that uncanny feel for when someone is approaching his side. I’ve already seen it happen to Jones like 4 times! If only Haskins didn’t totally panic when he sees the rush up the middle, lol. 

 

Goes back to what I always talk about in terms of roster construction and how important the synergy is. If I’m the Giants I’m investing like crazy in getting top tier tackles to block the edges, whereas if I’m the Skins I’d place a premium on Center and Guard. It’s fascinating, really. 

 

If Jones can gain that sixth sense good QBs always have where they just feel the edge pressure, I think he can be real quality in the NFL. His ceiling is Wentz (well, 2017 Wentz). 

 

I’m glad Haskins already has that sense. That’s a big deal. It might actually be a deal breaker for Jones. He’s basically quicker, and therefore better, than Haskins when he can see the rush because of his footwork and toughness. Haskins, on the other hand, just panics and doesn’t react quickly when he sees it, but he can feel what Jones can’t and if he has somewhere to step up or slide to he can get away from it or at least avoid them enough to where they don’t strip him. 

 

I feel like Haskins has the easier road in terms of development. He just needs to work on his feet and resetting quickly once he avoids pressure up the middle. Jones has to develop that sixth sense that is almost impossible to drill. 

 

But I might be being unfair to Jones, I haven’t seen if he improved throughout the course of the season like Haskins did. He just seems so polished already it’s hard to envision he changed much. 

 

 

In response to being told about Jones's poor accuracy stats in throws that are 10+: 

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That’s interesting to me because I do feel like his deep ball is very nice. Of course, I’m just a few games in so maybe that changes. The stats might indicate that because his guys screwed him out of a lot of plays deep. There’s already like 5 or 6 of them that would’ve boosted his stats, and if you flip his WRs with what Haskins had in guys like KJ Hill, Parris Campbell and McClaurin... I think it’s a different story. 

  

 I just liked the air he gets under it. 

 

But yeah, his ball placement isn’t anywhere near Haskins on short stuff. There isn’t a ton that I recall from either of them in terms of intermediate stuff, so I won’t dispute the stats there. 

    

In response to being told about the complaints regarding Jones during the Senior Bowl with fumbles lost as well as his propensity for sacks and INTs in general: 

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Lol, I didn’t know that. So it sounds like he didn’t improve much there if it happened in the Senior Bowl.

 

Wow, he honestly might bust on that alone. I was stunned at just how bad he is with edge pressure. He has ZERO feel of it. It’s really bad, lol. If he doesn’t see the pressure, it’s over, and his peripheral vision isn’t that great so it happens often. 

 

Thus far his INTs aren’t that bad for the most part. He had a tipped ball that turned into one and the other one wasn’t egregious if I’m recalling correctly. He did get a lot of pressure in his face right away as his Oline wasn’t good at all in the games I’ve watched, so that might be why he’s got so many INTs even with a low YPA. 

 

In response to bringing Haskins back into the conversation again:

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Yeah, man, like I said I was depressed watching those games in the middle of their season. Basically  from Penn State all the way to Maryland... I was losing my mind.  

 

His first few games were good, but he was operating from a super clean pocket almost the entire time and most of the plays were about YAC. Still, it was good to see. 

 

But then Penn State happened. And it was just this terrible lull after that. I honestly panicked, lol. I found very little to nothing to suggest he was even remotely worth a first round pick. It was like the teams figured Haskins and their offense out and they had NO answer. 

 

Then the MD game happened and I saw him make plays I hadn’t seen him make. He was operating in the pocket much more smoothly and he was throwing dimes. Then he followed it with a big time performance in a huge game against Michigan who was playing great D at the time. To me, the situation there is really important to contextualize. That’s as high pressure as it gets and he was as calm and efficient as anything. 

 

Then the Northwestern game is where I officially felt good about him being a first round prospect. He looked like Brady in the pocket at times in that game, I swear. That, I don’t know how to say it, hop stepping after the drop back that just exudes confidence. I loved it. 

 

He and that offense really hit their stride when it mattered most. That’s important, too. He really grew. 

 

So I’m pleased for now. 2nd half of the Rose Bowl game kind of brought back those depressing vibes of that lull from Penn State through Michigan State... but I hope it was more about them letting off the gas than anything else. 

 

I know the scores during what I call the “lull” seem to indicate he did fine, but I just wasn’t impressed with what he did overall during those games. It was more the defense or running game coming through. Or just the opposing team’s lack of talent eventually giving in as they hit the 4th quarter. 

 

It’s like Haskins has three versions of himself during the season.

 

You’ve got the green, raw talent that helms an explosive offense with speedy weapons at WR and a very clean pocket for him to distribute to them (Oregon State, Rutgers, TCU, Tulane). This version is more of a very good point guard operating a simple offense than anything else. 

 

Then you got the guy who gets figured out a bit, flashes (rarely) but can’t handle the pressure up the middle at all, and loses a lot of the accuracy that made him good previously (Penn State, Indiana, Minnesota, Purdue, Nebraska, Michigan State).

 

Then, finally, you have the guy who grows in confidence, operates better in the pocket, starts showcasing his arm talent consistently again, and is as cool as can be in the biggest moments (2nd half Maryland, Michigan, Northwestern, Washington). I don't think there was a better player in college football during this time. He was simply on fire. 

 

So that’s what gets me excited about him. How much of it was his growth or was it more about Ohio State’s offense starting to click and he was a beneficiary... I think those things can be debated. But I’m pretty confident I saw him improve. There was something different about his pocket movement. Maybe the fact that they had him running the ball more just made him more comfortable with contact and, thus, he wasn’t as susceptible to panicking. I don’t know, but something changed. 

 

In response to Jones's ability to make plays on the move: 

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Oh, I’m glad you pointed this out. I forgot to talk about throws on the move. You’re absolutely right, he does throw well on the move. That is something he’s clearly better than Haskins at. 

 

That was one of the key differences I saw in Haskins. The first two “versions” of Haskins, he was horrid throwing on the move. Totally inaccurate and just in general he was panicking versus looking down field. 

 

But the third version of Haskins? He actually had a few beautiful throws outside the pocket on the move in big moments. He simply hadn’t done that before. 

 

So there are things to be excited about in terms of trajectory with Haskins. There was some real growth in his game. He added things to his arsenal. If that continues, we just might have the guy for once! Can’t believe I’m even saying that. 

 

Ok, lot to unpack there. 

 

Some great takes there if I may say so myself, lol. Some also bad ones. 😛  

 

As for Jones, I think I was a bit off about his deep ball. Not sure, but I think he's struggled there thus far.

 

I think I had him pegged with how he handles interior pressure well. He's still tough, can slide in the pocket, and make plays improvising when he sees the rush. That has largely translated. 

 

 The arm strength comparison between them is also something I'll maintain as true. 

 

 Have to pat myself on the back regarding the stuff I said about Jones and how he senses edge pressure. Man, that has definitely translated. I knew that might actually be a deal breaker with Jones and that it'd contribute to a lot of turnovers, and thus far that has been dead on accurate. I think he leads the NFL in fumbles and from what I've seen pretty much ALL OF THEM come from him not seeing the pressure coming from the edges. I'm proud of myself on this one.  

 

   As for Haskins, when I compared the two regarding edge pressure versus interior, I think it's still spot on. Haskins has actually surprised me more with his toughness, though, but it's not a strength, yet. He can still go down pretty easily. I feel like he still does sense edge pressure well (I think he had one bad play regarding that against the Vikings, or was it the Giants? Can't remember exactly), but he still has the habit of panicking with interior pressure. The difference is, in college he'd just go down quickly or throw an erratic pass. Now he's mostly tucking the ball and running. Which can be good, can be bad. But you definitely would rather he slide in the pocket better and keep his eyes downfield. Or escape the pocket but prolong the play behind the LOS while he looks downfield. 

 

So I still think we're seeing a very polished Daniel Jones that might never really improve much from what he is (but if the Giants really go all in on getting him great Tackles to protect the edges and build solidly around him in general, that's still good) whereas with Haskins he's got a long way to go, but a significantly higher ceiling. 

 

Haskins wasn't particularly adept at throwing on the move in college, but he improved immensely on that towards the end of the season and made great throws outside the pocket in big situations. That hasn't translated, unfortunately. In college it was almost exclusively tied with his level of confidence, so hopefully the same happens in the NFL eventually. 

 

It's all going to come down to how well he picks it all up. And it's not as much about the offense than it is about NFL defenses. People get too caught up in the offensive play calls or scheme around the QB when it's more about how well the QB identifies the defense and what they're trying to do. It was a good sign regarding that issue against the Bills that there wasn't any "what the heck was he thinking there" type of throws into double or triple coverage. But that might just be indicative of an extremely simplified game plan for him and a Bills' defense that wasn't threatened because of it, so they didn't do much that was complicated. I didn't watch the All 22 to attempt to decipher that at all, though.

 

 In the end, I hope we have a clear voice in the personnel department who can evaluate everything at the deepest of levels properly. Because if we have the opportunity to get someone at QB with our top pick who they evaluate as having a higher ceiling (and they should be able to conclude with some degree of confidence what Haskins' ceiling is with the rest of these games he's starting), then I hope we listen to that voice. The opportunity might not be there for a long time and there's no reason to really be married to Haskins right now, contractually (rookie salary) or emotionally (likely new coach). Not his fault, but it is what it is when they made the decision to take a long term project in the first round with a coach on the hot seat being told to win now.        

[KDawg]

Some of you really need to calm down a little here.

 

There's nothing going on worth getting this fired up about

 

After all, I woke up this morning and told myself, "Self, the Skins situation could actually be worse... we could have a guy on our team who attempted to murder another man on the field. We don't. #Winning."

 

Yes, I actually thought to myself, "hashtag winning"

 

Carry on, purveyors of overreaction and lack of rational thought and all of you generals of rationality!

[Reaper Skins]

Watching how the Steelers are handling Mason Rudolph's baptism by fire and are still managing to stay competitive vs. how our FO is babying Dwayne and setting progressively lower and lower expectations for what is "just normal for a rookie QB" is really starting to piss me off.

 

I'll make a sig bet with anyone on the board that Rudolph earns the respect of his teammates for gutting out his rookie year in horrendous circumstances, becomes a better QB because of it, and has a better, longer, more productive NFL career than Haskins.  The front office and coaching staff is doing him no favors.

[DJHJR86]

22 hours ago, SoCalSkins said:

Rosen is probably a 6th round pick now. You bring him into camp with Keenum/Colt type and see what Alex can do. I have a Rosen bias because I went to UCLA so it might not be the most objective take. Doesn’t change the fact that Haskins sucks. 

 

I'd rather just start Trey Quinn in 2020 than have Rosen, Keenum, and Captain Checkdown himself trying to make a comeback and compete for the job.  Haskins playing blindfolded and with one arm tied behind his back would have me more excited than Alex Smith coming back.  

[dballer]

1 hour ago, Reaper Skins said:

Watching how the Steelers are handling Mason Rudolph's baptism by fire and are still managing to stay competitive vs. how our FO is babying Dwayne and setting progressively lower and lower expectations for what is "just normal for a rookie QB" is really starting to piss me off.

 

I'll make a sig bet with anyone on the board that Rudolph earns the respect of his teammates for gutting out his rookie year in horrendous circumstances, becomes a better QB because of it, and has a better, longer, more productive NFL career than Haskins.  The front office and coaching staff is doing him no favors.

 

I bet Rudolph doesn't start any games for the Steelers after this season...he is, well, garbage. They don't have a tough schedule down the stretch, but I bet they go 2-4. If you have watched the Steelers this year, it is evident Rudolph is not a quality starting QB in the NFL. 

[Llevron]

1 hour ago, Reaper Skins said:

Watching how the Steelers are handling Mason Rudolph's baptism by fire and are still managing to stay competitive vs. how our FO is babying Dwayne and setting progressively lower and lower expectations for what is "just normal for a rookie QB" is really starting to piss me off.

 

I'll make a sig bet with anyone on the board that Rudolph earns the respect of his teammates for gutting out his rookie year in horrendous circumstances, becomes a better QB because of it, and has a better, longer, more productive NFL career than Haskins.  The front office and coaching staff is doing him no favors.

 

Ill ****ing take that bet. Lets do this. 

[SoCalSkins]

3 hours ago, Reaper Skins said:

Watching how the Steelers are handling Mason Rudolph's baptism by fire and are still managing to stay competitive vs. how our FO is babying Dwayne and setting progressively lower and lower expectations for what is "just normal for a rookie QB" is really starting to piss me off.

 

I'll make a sig bet with anyone on the board that Rudolph earns the respect of his teammates for gutting out his rookie year in horrendous circumstances, becomes a better QB because of it, and has a better, longer, more productive NFL career than Haskins.  The front office and coaching staff is doing him no favors.

Maybe Jonathan Allen can beat Haskins across the head with a helmet after every practice to toughen him up? 

[DJHJR86]

Remember when Josina Anderson leaped to Haskins defense for something that literally no one ever said or implied (he can't read defenses)?  Seems like she's recently got the whole foot in mouth syndrome.  

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Redskins' invigorated Dwayne Haskins sees 'a different me'

 

ASHBURN, Va. -- Dwayne Haskins feels it when he's on the field, whether in practice or the games. It's why he's ready -- and hopeful -- about the next seven games now that he'll be the Washington Redskins' starting quarterback the rest of the season. It's why the Redskins (1-8) hope they see progress, providing a boost heading into the offseason.

"A lot more comfortable, a lot more confident. Different me back there," Haskins said.

That was in comparison to his first outing, a relief appearance against the New York Giants in Week 4. Multiple people in the organization felt it was an eye-opening experience for Haskins, not because of the numbers he produced (9-for-17, three interceptions), but because of the sort of mistakes he made -- botched playcalls led to confusion in assignments at the line of scrimmage, for example.

 

Haskins, the No. 15 pick in April, will play in front of his home fans for the first time Sunday against the New York Jets (1 p.m. ET, Fox). His first three outings -- including his first start in Week 9 at Buffalo -- came on the road.

Regardless, he says the difference stems from what happens during the week to make him more comfortable. He has been taking almost all of the first-team reps in practice for the past three-plus weeks.

"I just felt like the more reps I get, the easier it'll be for me to be able to play naturally, instinctively," Haskins said. "As I play, the more mistakes I'll learn from and the better plays I'll make."

 

The caveats still remain: He's young (he turned 22 in May); he's still learning all the ways he must prepare and with what intensity. There's still uncertainty about where he goes from here. But steps have been taken. Progress has been made -- often in subtle ways.

"He'd be the first to tell you he's taken a lot more ownership," said Redskins receiver Terry McLaurin, a teammate at Ohio State as well. "When he wasn't the starter it's easy to be like, 'I may not have to prepare as well,' but these last three or four weeks he's prepared like he was going to be the starter, even before he was. That helped the transition.

 

...Spinner said he worked with Haskins on using more of his lower half when he throws, something he wasn't doing earlier this season, causing his passes to sail. They also have plans to watch film together at night.

 

"I saw an invigorated guy, the same guy I had seen in years previous," Spinner said. "A guy that was a lot more confident about the task at hand, more comfortable with his approach and figuring out what he needed to do differently at this level. He's still working on it ... [but] he has that swag about him again, that confidence.

 

"He's trying to figure out the best approach and what he's doing now is trying to show guys, 'This is what I'm about.'"

Part of the early struggles, Spinner said, were about Haskins needing to figure out life in the NFL. He also noted Haskins had to learn an offense that's complicated for anyone not coming from a West Coast system, and that everything he said and did was being watched by teammates at a different level than in college.

 

..."He's light years from where he started," veteran running back Adrian Peterson said. "Us veteran guys, we can look back and know if a guy is on his stuff or not. The way you keep that respect with the veterans is coming out, being on point and executing. That's what he's been doing."

McLaurin knows as well as anyone what Haskins looks like on the field when he's rolling. He, of course, saw Haskins throw 50 touchdowns and only eight interceptions at Ohio State last season. He saw him play with a swagger, with poise and with confidence.

"I describe it as an elite shooter like Ray Allen ... being in a zone," McLaurin said. "It's like, man it doesn't matter who's in front of him and what he's seeing -- the ball is going in. I see that a lot out of Dwayne when he gets going, when he's confident. He's just in a zone that's hard to describe. But when he's in it, he's in it. He hasn't quite gotten there yet, obviously. I think he'll get there."

 

https://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/39252/redskins-invigorated-dwayne-haskins-sees-a-different-me

 

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[veteranskinsfan]

Just hope he does not turn out to be like Jason Campbell.  I kept hoping Campbell would turn the corner and he never did.

He probably did not have a great offensive team because when he left the Skins he looked better with the new team.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

 

[Veryoldschool]

1 hour ago, veteranskinsfan said:

Just hope he does not turn out to be like Jason Campbell.  I kept hoping Campbell would turn the corner and he never did.

He probably did not have a great offensive team because when he left the Skins he looked better with the new team.

 

At this point, Haskins is going to improve a lot to be fairly compared to Jason Campbell.  I would be thrilled if he started to resemble Jason Campbell by end of the year, that would be a very hopeful sign.

 

As of now, I am just hoping Haskins doesn't use the next 7 games to confirm SoCal's grossly premature bust declaration.

[DJHJR86]

Let's say Haskins has a good game against the Jets, but then either has games like the one against the Giants, or meh ones like the Bills game the remainder of the year.  Would you still be okay with rolling with him, or (depending on our draft position) would you want the Skins to take another QB?

[Morrissey1972]

Haskins is a project QB and at the time, the Skins were the last organization that could afford to draft a project QB in the 1st round.  
 

Any JV football position coach would’ve known that the right move would’ve been to maneuver for Hockenson and to have made Keenum the starter from day one. Instead, this organization found the most ridiculous and predictable manner to F things up. 

 

 

There little else to say. 

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, DJHJR86 said:

Let's say Haskins has a good game against the Jets, but then either has games like the one against the Giants, or meh ones like the Bills game the remainder of the year.  Would you still be okay with rolling with him, or (depending on our draft position) would you want the Skins to take another QB?

 

Personally, I am looking for flashes from him.  So it would be based on my eye test.  Scouts like to say the hardest thing to do in their profession is judging college QBs and how they'd adjust to the pros and no one has figured out any secret formula to judge it.

 

I was back and forth on Haskins on the draft thread but at the end before the draft when I dived a bit deeper I was against drafting him.  But what do I know?  If scouts have a hard time figuring it out with vast more information and expertise than us - how am I supposed to beat that?  😀  That's my long winded way of saying I'd trust O'Connell or whomever to make that call but the key is the experts should decide not Bruce-Dan.

 

I am not saying we can't all have opinions on it, its fun to read what people think about him but hard for me to see how we can be definitive pro or con.   Right now, I want Chase Young badly.  So if I can get him, I am perfectly fine skipping a QB even if my thoughts at that point would be trending negative.   I love Tua.  Not sure about Burrow.  I see here Burrow is used as tool at times by both the pro Haskins is likely the goods crowd and anti ones in different ways.  Mike Lombardi was just on air talking about it on 106.7, suggesting he'd take Burrow and thinks he's distinctly better than Haskins.

 

Some say since Haskins beat Burrow for the Ohio State QB that means he's better.  I disagree with the logic.  Wouldn't that also mean that JT Barrett is a better QB than Haskins, too?   A college HC could just in their mind have already committed to a QB and would lean that way -- just as some have accused Jay doing with Colt and or QB's could grow from one year to the next especially at the college level.  Conversely, IMO I can't say Burrow is better just because he's the hot name du jour.  One year wonder QBs flame out in the pros plenty and heck isn't that one of the criticisms some have of Haskins?     So yeah for me judging Burrow is a separate exercise removed from Haskins IMO one way or another. 

 

Hopefully, Haskins excels and this all becomes moot.  If we finally got a QB in the fold to me its a game changer.  It's a great draft for receivers.  A dude like Young I think can transform this defense, etc.  I get some are down on Haskins.  And again, I actively was rooting against them drafting Haskins on the draft thread.  But I am just a layman like everyone else here.  I've done decently on some of my draft projections over the years with some mistakes.  But on QB I am as hit and miss as anyone so I am not riding on my thoughts.  If O'Connell is as good as some purport, hopefully he makes the call.  

[Veryoldschool]

10 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

Let's say Haskins has a good game against the Jets, but then either has games like the one against the Giants, or meh ones like the Bills game the remainder of the year.  Would you still be okay with rolling with him, or (depending on our draft position) would you want the Skins to take another QB?

 

Can't we just see how it plays out?  Obviously, his success is far from certain but I'd rather we all stay hopeful while the kid plays the rest of the season and hope he can demonstrate that he is progressing towards competence before contemplating contingencies.