FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[ThePackisback]

3 minutes ago, bowhunter said:

HOF Packer Bart Starr passed today

I heard. We lost a legend today. Prayers to his family. Thanks for the condolences.

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, wit33 said:

 

 

Down, distance, and time are crucial variables to these snapshots, Cards could be playing soft for different reasons. 

 

It was 2nd and 14.  My point though had nothing to do with that.  i was making the case for how Thompson can be a good passing weapon in this offense that goes beyond just catching screens and in turn be a good outlet for Haskins.   

 

Thompson has talked about how he modeled Jordan Reed among others and takes pride on being a really good route runner.  Cooley echoes that in his film reviews. 

[wit33]

5 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

It was 2nd and 14.  My point though had nothing to do with that.  i was making the case for how Thompson can be a good passing weapon in this offense that goes beyond just catching screens and in turn be a good outlet for Haskins.   

 

Thompson has talked about how he modeled Jordan Reed among others and takes pride on being a really good route runner.  Cooley echoes that in his film reviews. 

 

Probably a case of me reading through multiple postings. I thought it was in regards to play design and Gruden being able to scheme guys open (I’m a supporter of Grudens ability to do so as well). 

[Malapropismic Depository]

I watched more vid of Haskins, and I did see he faced quite a bit of pressure, and was able to get the ball off quick before the pressure got too close.

So, handling pressure didn't seem to be an issue.

But part of the key is he had guys wide open.

So, the question to me is, what happens when both things happen ; the O-line gives up pressure and our receivers don't get open ?

Can he at least bounce around the pocket to buy a little time until somebody gets open ?

[volsmet]

On Haskins v Nebraska - I suspect we will see a lot of zone & pressure v DH. If he starts, we need a guard to be ready to play at a high level or - with the 2nd pick in the 2020 draft, the Washington Redskins select:

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, wit33 said:

 

Probably a case of me reading through multiple postings. I thought it was in regards to play design and Gruden being able to scheme guys open (I’m a supporter of Grudens ability to do so as well). 

 

I guess I was making too many points in that post without clarifying that those clips specifically weren't about capturing all those points -- so that's on me for the confusion.  What I was trying to show in those clips is that we can use Thompson as a horizontal threat at times like Ohio State used Parris Campbell.  

 

As for Jay, yeah I am with you he can scheme guys open.  If you watch his coaching shows with Cooley during the season - he comes off like a savant when it comes to explaining how to get guys open based on what the defense is throwing at him.  He's quick and mega impressive on that front.   Andy Beniot who closely reviews film of every team in season says Jay is one of the top 5 in the league as for play design.

 

I do agree with those who say Jay's run-pass order is way too predictable but that's a different aspect of play calling.    I am hoping that he stays involved with the offense and designs the plays but lets O'Connell call the order of them.

 

My point is I think Jay is an asset not a liability as to scheming up the passing game.  And ditto as to developing Haskins.  But I do think he needs help and people to complement him like really any coach.  Heck most head coaches these days don't call plays so I'd rather not have that on Jay's plate regardless.  

 

[Skinsinparadise]

16 minutes ago, volsmet said:

On Haskins v Nebraska - I suspect we will see a lot of zone & pressure v DH. If he starts, we need a guard to be ready to play at a high level or - with the 2nd pick in the 2020 draft, the Washington Redskins select:

 

 

If we have the 2nd pick of the 2020 draft it would be quite the wild off season next year -- lots of change .     One fear I have now that I didn't experience years back is can this franchise attract top coaching-FO talent if they do a reboot?  In the past, Dan for his faults could get the big names and hot candidates but wonder if that ship has sailed.  Some suggest that Dan would struggle on that front now -- and that would go double if Bruce remained here.  But I digress.

 

Considering this team's man crush on Alabama prospects and considering the need at receiver -- I bet they salivate all college season about Jeudy and try to get him in 2020.  Only thing is I gather they will try to to recoup their 2nd round pick and if so they might pull that off by trading down so wonder if they look at that next group of receivers in a trade down like Tylan Wallace, Tyler Johnson, etc. 

[Malapropismic Depository]

Why are so many people down on our WR group ?

Yes, they are young, inexperienced, and unproven.

But they are talented. And it's not unusual to see WR's blossom in just their first or second year.

So, just because they're unproven doesn't mean it's set in stone that they won't be a significant factor this year.

If you're not going to bank on them (which is perfectly fine and understandable), then at least have hope in them.

There's no reason to have the total opposite opinion of banking on them, which is no hope at all for our WR's this season.

[volsmet]

15 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

Why are so many people down on our WR group ?

Yes, they are young, inexperienced, and unproven.

But they are talented.

 

Every WR group in the NFL is talented, we are down on the group because we have no one who has proven to be a good nfl player & we have a rookie QB who needs a reliable target to get open & make some plays.

28 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

If we have the 2nd pick of the 2020 draft it would be quite the wild off season next year -- lots of change .     One fear I have now that I didn't experience years back is can this franchise attract top coaching-FO talent if they do a reboot?  In the past, Dan for his faults could get the big names and hot candidates but wonder if that ship has sailed.  Some suggest that Dan would struggle on that front now -- and that would go double if Bruce remained here.  But I digress.

 

Considering this team's man crush on Alabama prospects and considering the need at receiver -- I bet they salivate all college season about Jeudy and try to get him in 2020.  Only thing is I gather they will try to to recoup their 2nd round pick and if so they might pull that off by trading down so wonder if they look at that next group of receivers in a trade down like Tylan Wallace, Tyler Johnson, etc. 

 

I find it very hard to believe we can win more than 4-5 if DH is thrown in from the start. The elite draft pick could be what we need to take the next step, better than going 8-8. 

[Malapropismic Depository]

1 minute ago, volsmet said:

 

Every WR group in the NFL is talented, we are down on the group because we have no one who has proven to be a good nfl player & we have a rookie QB who needs a reliable target to get open & make some plays.

 

Yea I understand that. I'm just saying it's not a reason to pass a final judgment on them before they even play.

There's a huge difference between having low hope in our WR's, and being utterly hopeless that they will do anything.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 minutes ago, volsmet said:

 

Every WR group in the NFL is talented, we are down on the group because we have no one who has proven to be a good nfl player & we have a rookie QB who needs a reliable target to get open & make some plays.

 

I'd add that it's no new rodeo about potential at WR.  I was jazzed to see T. Pryor for example.   But post 2016, we've had one of the worst receiving crops in the league.  We've gone from riches at that position in the days of D. Jax-Garcon-Crowder to one of the weakest corps in the league. 

 

And as I've mentioned here, I am higher on McLaurin and Harmon than most but rookie receivers rarely thrive immediately.  IMO we don't really have at the moment a true #2 receiver let alone a true #1.  One can emerge and become that guy but I'll buy in only when I see it go down.  

 

The running game though can be special if our O line holds up. 

9 minutes ago, volsmet said:

 

I find it very hard to believe we can win more than 4-5 if DH is thrown in from the start. The elite draft pick could be what we need to take the next step, better than going 8-8. 

 

I've said on the draft thread I'd rather go 4-12 than 8-8 if that's the two choices for the same reason.   We've talked about how this team has struggled with the QB position in the draft -- that same point applies to WR.  If they can get a WR who is special -- that would be fun.  Trying to think who was the last true #1 they've drafted?  Art Monk?

[volsmet]

30 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

 

Yea I understand that. I'm just saying it's not a reason to pass a final judgment on them before they even play.

There's a huge difference between having low hope in our WR's, and being utterly hopeless that they will do anything.

 

I don’t think many are saying they’re guaranteed to be awful, it’s just a group we are skeptical about right now. Sip loves the rookies, Haskins is familiar with McLaurin which could help, Doctson & Rich have plenty of talent, they could surprise with a QB who is able to stretch the field like DH can.

28 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

I've said on the draft thread I'd rather go 4-12 than 8-8 if that's the two choices for the same reason.   We've talked about how this team has struggled with the QB position in the draft -- that same point applies to WR.  If they can get a WR who is special -- that would be fun.  Trying to think who was the last true #1 they've drafted?  Art Monk?

 

Hell yeah, Httr has expressed the same, I’m always in 0-16 or contend for the SB mode. Unlike most, I don’t see any value in going 0-1 in week 18, we’ve done that often enough.

[Commander Wolffe]

1 hour ago, volsmet said:

On Haskins v Nebraska - I suspect we will see a lot of zone & pressure v DH. If he starts, we need a guard to be ready to play at a high level or - with the 2nd pick in the 2020 draft, the Washington Redskins select:

 

 

I know we have kicked this around a bit... but where are you at with the Scherff extension?

[volsmet]

13 minutes ago, SkinsFootball said:

I know we have kicked this around a bit... but where are you at with the Scherff extension?

 

I don’t like Scherff as much as most here, I don’t really want to pay him like an elite guard, but he’s a top 15 guy and we’ve struggled so much to find anything on the interior that I may be more inclined to lock him up than I was heading into the draft - particularly needing to protect and be able to run the ball for DH, he (Scherff) may now be our most important piece on offense. I value guard more than 99.999% of humanity, so I don’t mind paying at the position, but he hasn’t been as dominant as I hoped he’d be .. though he has moments that are extraordinary.

 

 

[PlayAction]

1 hour ago, volsmet said:

 I find it very hard to believe we can win more than 4-5 if DH is thrown in from the start. The elite draft pick could be what we need to take the next step, better than going 8-8. 

 

Elite rookie QBs often have a poor win-loss record off the bat.  They are learning and the team often isn't that good.  I really don't care what the record is as long as the Skins do their best to develop DH.  If that means starting him game 1 to boost him up the learning curve then good.  If instead the coaches feel he should sit for half the season then that's fine too.  The only reason to select another QB next year is if it's obvious that DH is not going to be able to become a long term starter for the Skins.  I don't think the Skins will know for sure in just one year.  If we wanted an "elite QB" from next year's class we should have passed on DH this year.  I'm hopeful but keeping expectations tempered.  

[volsmet]

4 minutes ago, PlayAction said:

 

Elite rookie QBs often have a poor win-loss record off the bat.  They are learning and the team often isn't that good.  I really don't care what the record is as long as the Skins do their best to develop DH.  If that means starting him game 1 to boost him up the learning curve then good.  If instead the coaches feel he should sit for half the season then that's fine too.  The only reason to select another QB next year is if it's obvious that DH is not going to be able to become a long term starter for the Skins.  I don't think the Skins will know for sure in just one year.  If we wanted an "elite QB" from next year's class we should have passed on DH this year.  I'm hopeful but keeping expectations tempered.  

 

I agree with all of that, the gif I posted was meant to be of Jeudy, not Tua. 

[Commander Wolffe]

1 hour ago, volsmet said:

 

I don’t like Scherff as much as most here, I don’t really want to pay him like an elite guard, but he’s a top 15 guy and we’ve struggled so much to find anything on the interior that I may be more inclined to lock him up than I was heading into the draft - particularly needing to protect and be able to run the ball for DH, he (Scherff) may now be our most important piece on offense. I value guard more than 99.999% of humanity, so I don’t mind paying at the position, but he hasn’t been as dominant as I hoped he’d be .. though he has moments that are extraordinary.

 

 

I'm with you on this one although I do believe Scherff is a little better than a Top 15 guy. I'm thinking closer to Top 5. I enjoyed him out on screens with Chris Thompson and pulls notably AP's long run against the Giants last year.

 

We have had this conversation before indirectly. Given we will draft Trent Williams or Moses replacement high in the next few years I believe we can afford to pay Scherff.  Depending on how Geron  develops he could potentially replace one of the aforementioned players.

 

As a result Scherff would be our only offensive lineman not on a rookie contract. If not we will atleast have rookie contracts at the tackle position which as you know is highest paid. All leads to us having being able to afford a slight overpaid for his services.  Yes! This is with keeping Haskins in mind and mitigating interior pressure. Which is all setup by our running game and stable of backs.

[Vanguard]

Wtf @ that Brandon Scherff clip.  The tackle flew to the other side of the screen.

[volsmet]

15 minutes ago, SkinsFootball said:

 

As a result Scherff would be our only offensive lineman not on a rookie contract. If not we will atleast have rookie contracts at the tackle position which as you know is highest paid. All leads to us having being able to afford a slight overpaid for his services.  Yes! This is with keeping Haskins in mind and mitigating interior pressure. Which is all setup by our running game and stable of backs.

 

That’s all well said with points towards the future I had overlooked, I feel like we may pay Trent another big contract, but if we do move on & secure his replacement in the draft, things open up for us financially. 

 

I don’t really care if Haskins is a bust, I just want him to have a chance. Obviously I hope he becomes a hall of fame player, but nothing will piss me off other than failing to protect him in his first few years. I’d be disappointed if he isn’t good, but it’s an insane position to play, particularly if you play from the pocket 100% of the time - we drafted a guy who won’t be able to run away from guys, so I’d like to see us do all we’re able to make sure he doesn’t have to; I’d play a journeyman like Chris Ivory at RB over Guice if the vet was 100% on his protections & Guice was not. We aren’t winning a SB in 2019, protecting Haskins - giving him a legitimate chance to learn at this level, is what the season comes down to, offensively, for me. 

 

15 starts ago he played .... Churchill? His next 3 starts may be @Philly, v Dallas & v the Bears — that’s absolutely crazy. 

[bakedtater1]

2 minutes ago, Vanguard said:

Wtf @ that Brandon Scherff clip.  The tackle flew to the other side of the screen.

Brandon Scherff is strong?...

[Anselmheifer]

4 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I guess I was making too many points in that post without clarifying that those clips specifically weren't about capturing all those points -- so that's on me for the confusion.  What I was trying to show in those clips is that we can use Thompson as a horizontal threat at times like Ohio State used Parris Campbell.  

 

 

Yes. This. Thompson is our offensive MVP when he is healthy. I'm really hoping that Love can pick up some of Thompson's receiving acumen and pass blocking toughness. 

[Anselmheifer]

59 minutes ago, SkinsFootball said:

I'm with you on this one although I do believe Scherff is a little better than a Top 15 guy. I'm thinking closer to Top 5. I enjoyed him out on screens with Chris Thompson and pulls notably AP's long run against the Giants last year.

 

We have had this conversation before indirectly. Given we will draft Trent Williams or Moses replacement high in the next few years I believe we can afford to pay Scherff.  Depending on how Geron  develops he could potentially replace one of the aforementioned players.

 

As a result Scherff would be our only offensive lineman not on a rookie contract. If not we will at least have rookie contracts at the tackle position which as you know is highest paid. All leads to us having being able to afford a slight overpaid for his services.  Yes! This is with keeping Haskins in mind and mitigating interior pressure. Which is all setup by our running game and stable of backs.

 

I don't know how I feel in general about giving guards 15 million. It seems like the kind of thing New England would never do. I don't think it's the best way to build a team, from a cap distribution standpoint. I was going to make a post about this in the draft thread to see what people think about the wisdom of taking a G at number 5 overall and then having to pay him 15 million. Looking back at that draft, the picks immediately following Scherff weren't great, so I understand the pick. It just doesn't seem ideal if there are other equally talented players at more important positions. 

 

Regarding Geron, my fingers are crossed, but I'm not overly hopeful. It would be such a massive Boon if Geron were able to take over at LT, or if Flowers were able to take over at RT. 

[ThePackisback]

How's the Redskins D line going forward? 

[volsmet]

8 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

I don't know how I feel in general about giving guards 15 million. It seems like the kind of thing New England would never do. 

 

NE drafted Wynn in round 1 to play guard last year, they drafted Thuney with pick 78 in 2016 and then took Karrass later in the same draft, they took Froholdt in round 4 this year, and they drafted Mason in the 4th in 2015, he was the 2nd guard they took in the 4th that year. They attack the interior of the OL with top 4 round picks. I don’t think any guards make $15m, Acherff would probably command 11-12 though. 

 

Quote

The Patriots signed Mason to a five-year contract extension worth up to $50 million, a league source confirmed Monday. The deal includes $23.5 million guaranteed and makes him one of the highest-paid guards in the NFL.Aug 27, 2018

 

 

14 minutes ago, ThePackisback said:

How's the Redskins D line going forward? 

 

The Burgundy Body Snatchers? Legit.

[Malapropismic Depository]

50 minutes ago, ThePackisback said:

How's the Redskins D line going forward? 

 

Well, we substituted Preston Smith, with Montez Sweat.

Big upgrade.

Sorry, Packers fans,

Oops !

😄