skinzplay Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Well, let's hope it all works. When our guys out-prepare and out-coach the others, and get our players to deliver the goods on the field, we're all gonna be happy. No faith in Gruden, but I'll be the happiest wrongest person in the world if we make a playoff run this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 22 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: I agree with Simms about his arm and mobility. His mobility was better than I expected and his arm was even better than I remembered it from his college tape. The play where he escaped pressure and then tossed a beautiful pass when running to the left (which we all know is very tough to do), which was almost a TD was impressive. I disagree with Simms a little bit on not worrying as much about the INTs. IMO it wasn't so much the INTs themselves (everyone has them), but the reasons for them, that bugged me some. That being said, it's his first live NFL game ever so I'm looking forward to seeing how he learns and progresses in the next game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, mistertim said: I agree with Simms about his arm and mobility. His mobility was better than I expected and his arm was even better than I remembered it from his college tape. The play where he escaped pressure and then tossed a beautiful pass when running to the left (which we all know is very tough to do), which was almost a TD was impressive. I disagree with Simms a little bit on not worrying as much about the INTs. IMO it wasn't so much the INTs themselves (everyone has them), but the reasons for them, that bugged me some. That being said, it's his first live NFL game ever so I'm looking forward to seeing how he learns and progresses in the next game. His arm seriously impressed me, I never really put any focus on his arm talent but damn if some of those throws didn't have me going 'Oh, ****" lol...that almost-TD going against his body was all arm strength and arm talent...his footwork and mechanics were complete **** on that throw, yet it was delivered with an impressive amount of touch considering the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 12 minutes ago, Califan007 said: His arm seriously impressed me, I never really put any focus on his arm talent but damn if some of those throws didn't have me going 'Oh, ****" lol...that almost-TD going against his body was all arm strength and arm talent...his footwork and mechanics were complete **** on that throw, yet it was delivered with an impressive amount of touch considering the situation. Yeah the that's true about the mechanics on that throw but stuff like that I'm not too worried about. It doesn't bother me at all when a QB makes an occasional short armed or side armed pass when things get crazy. Actually, a QB who can adjust and throw from multiple platforms is a huge bonus. My worry with Haskins and his footwork/mechanics is that it tends to go south way too easily...even with a slight hint of pressure sometimes. He also has a tendency to get sloppy feet and mechanics even without any pressure...which is likely the result of having so much arm talent, but he won't be able to get away with that in the NFL. The good part is that all that stuff is correctable with coaching and hard work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 55 minutes ago, Califan007 said: I don't remember reading your thoughts on Haskins' performance Thursday (although that doesn't mean I didn't read them, just that my memory is ****ed lately lol). What were your thoughts on his play? I have no problem with what I saw and was encouraged by a number of plays. His footwork was questionable at times, though, to put it mildly lol...and I'm of the mind that the passes that were intercepted are the types of passes young QBs often learn from if they have their mental **** together. Like you I didn't want Haskins at 15. But I try to avoid confirmation bias with players i like or dislike (not always successfully 😀) and try to watch with an open mind. And the QB position in particular is such a wild card and such a crap shoot that I'd be a fool I think to double down on an opinion about a QB prospect until things play out some. And with Haskins, I recognize that him succeeding IMO would turn this franchise around so if anything I have a pro Haskins bias because I desperately want him to succeed. This team isn't going to rise and fall with the typical player as to whether they are good or not -- but the QB position I think is border line the be all and end all. There are three things I like about Haskins more now then I did pre draft. 1. I like his personality-composure. I watched him in 5 practices but also after every practice deal with fans on the sidelines, taking photos, signing autographs, etc because my kids kept shooting for autographs. He and Guice by a mile were the most generous on that front. But yeah listening to him interact with fans, he came off like a super nice humble dude. He looked to me composed going into his first preseason game. I like that he stays after practice to get more reps, loves to study. All of that stuff. I read Arians book about QB and he goes on and on about how the intangibles are the be all and end all for him as to the success of a QB -- everything else being equal. And Haskins intangibles speak to what Arians looks for. 2. While I disagree with those who say his lateral speed is much quicker than what we saw at Ohio State, I do think he looks faster on QB keeps. I said that during camp and we saw that in Thursday's game. And I'd add I liked his elusiveness in the pocket on two different plays. 3. I knew he had a gun. But seeing it in person it came off much more impressive than it looked on TV. It's not that I am all sold on Haskins now, I still think he's a 50-50 boom-bust prospect. A lot of that for me is just driven by what I think about college QBs in general -- its not easy to transition from college to the NFL at that position. More fail then succeed. We've seen it with this organization plenty. As for the game, I loved 4 plays in particular, his first play where he booted to the right, the one where he threw an intermediate out route on the left, the one where he rolled out to the left and almost completed a TD to Sims and one of his scrambles where he evaded two pass rushers and took off, I showcase that play below. I didn't like the two interceptions. I am stating the obvious but to me it goes deeper. The first one was him under throwing a wheel route and I mentioned during camp from my point of view he was struggling on short out throws in the flat. That play wasn't exactly that but it was in that same flavor. That is, his accuracy on short throws in the flat was inconsistent at the practices I was at. And he was under throwing them much like that play. Even some of Haskins' complete passes in camp with those throws in the flat had the receiver turning back to catch the ball as opposed to catching it in stride. His niche in camp when I was watching were passes in between the numbers -- crosses, slants, shallow digs, etc. Also Haskins (ditto alas the other 2 QBs) just seemed to be throwing a lot of picks in camp period. And granted the defense knows what's coming but also you aren't really dealing with real pass pressure, etc. So I like his attributes among the soup. For a dude making his first start I think he did fine. On the aggregate i liked the performance albeit he clearly had hiccups but I expect early hiccups. I am not all in as him being the goods. I am not all out. I have ultimately fallen for every young QB we've had here because I desperately want them all to succeed and recognize if they don't -- the franchise is likely set back for years. haskinsrun2 (1).mp4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 1 hour ago, skinzplay said: Well, let's hope it all works. When our guys out-prepare and out-coach the others, and get our players to deliver the goods on the field, we're all gonna be happy. No faith in Gruden, but I'll be the happiest wrongest person in the world if we make a playoff run this season. I think we have the talent. But, like you, my faith in Jay is shaky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: Interesting...hate saying a player's injury could be good for the team but might slightly be the case here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Sorry if this has already been posted, but everyone must witness this, so just making sure...even though it was incomplete. 49 minutes ago, Califan007 said: Interesting...hate saying a player's injury could be good for the team but might slightly be the case here. When I first saw your post I thought it was in reference to a player we'd like to stash on IR, to preserve him. But then I read and found out it was Woodrum who got hurt. How does that benefit the team ? I don't follow your thinking. You a big fan of Woodrum, that you want to stash him for the year ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJ Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Califan007 said: Interesting...hate saying a player's injury could be good for the team but might slightly be the case here. Connor Cook is a camp body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 6 hours ago, skinzplay said: I hope like hell he's learning from Cavanaugh and Smith, and not Gruden and Rattay. You don't invest a 1st-rounder in a kid at this position and then entrust his development to Gruden and to someone who has never coached in the NFL and sure as hell didn't develop anybody at LA Tech. He only had that job because he'd been a QB there; legacy hire. Cavanaugh was just demoted. I’d remind you Jay did a good job developing Dalton. 5 hours ago, JoggingGod said: Haskins is gonna have KOC too next year but as HC I’m starting to really believe Jay won’t last the season. So he might have KOC this year. And I think it’s Bruce who fires Jay to save his own ass, not Dan. 3 hours ago, Califan007 said: If we drafted Haskins because we needed him to be the best looking rookie QB in the first preseason game of the year, then we are one million percent screwed as a team, as a franchise, and as a fan base. What is somewhat refreshing is I don’t actually feel like Dan/Bruce thought Dwayne was a day 1 solution. 3 hours ago, skinzplay said: Roger that. Cavanaugh has never been allowed to do what he does best. Callahan would be a much better HC for this squad that Gruden; it would be obvious in less than 5 minutes to every player and assistant coach on the team. Does it go down as Callahan interim HC, Ray Horton DC........We'll see. Of course all of that means little or not enough success/demonstration of progress early in the season. As a lifelong fan, I sure as hell don't want to see that for our team. I want to annihilate every stinkin' team on the schedule, especially those dummies down in Texas and those little green men up I-95. But having faith in Gruden is not an easy proposition. I’m not going to go into every reason why, I think @Skinsinparadise already did that, but to me this take is complete pretty coocoo bananas.... But everybody is entitled to their opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanguard Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 4 hours ago, Califan007 said: His arm seriously impressed me, I never really put any focus on his arm talent but damn if some of those throws didn't have me going 'Oh, ****" lol...that almost-TD going against his body was all arm strength and arm talent...his footwork and mechanics were complete **** on that throw, yet it was delivered with an impressive amount of touch considering the situation. An arm like that and only 22 years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakedtater1 Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Soooo if all QBs are struggling and continue to struggle through pre season do the skins just say **** it and feed dh to the wolves?..how brutal would that be..divisional game...In philly lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Malapropismic Depository said: Sorry if this has already been posted, but everyone must witness this, so just making sure...even though it was incomplete. Few things I had thought about: 1) If that had been caught, this board would have been proclaiming both Haskins and Sims need to be starting and to cut Doctson so that Sims could be WR1... 2) I kinda think Doctson would have caught the pass...may not have landed in bounds lol, but could've caught the pass. Quote When I first saw your post I thought it was in reference to a player we'd like to stash on IR, to preserve him. But then I read and found out it was Woodrum who got hurt. How does that benefit the team ? I don't follow your thinking. You a big fan of Woodrum, that you want to stash him for the year ? No, quite the opposite...I'm all for bringing in someone else as the new camp arm. 2 hours ago, RWJ said: Connor Cook is a camp body. Yeah, but I'm hoping he could be a (slightly) better camp body than Woodrum, maybe even prove himself to be worthy of the practice squad. 45 minutes ago, Vanguard said: An arm like that and only 22 years old. Damn, very true...I forgot about his age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said: What is somewhat refreshing is I don’t actually feel like Dan/Bruce thought Dwayne was a day 1 solution. I feel the same way...I know conventional wisdom has Dan throwing papers and staplers across the room insisting his son's BFF be made unquestioned starter for the 1st game of the season, but I'm not feeling that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheShredder Posted August 11, 2019 Share Posted August 11, 2019 5 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said: 2. While I disagree with those who say his lateral speed is much quicker than what we saw at Ohio State, I do think he looks faster on QB keeps. I said that during camp and we saw that in Thursday's game. And I'd add I liked his elusiveness in the pocket on two different plays. He wore a knee brace in college to protect from injuries and isn't wearing it in the Pros. He'll be moving faster than he did in college from that for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted August 11, 2019 Share Posted August 11, 2019 30 minutes ago, TheShredder said: He wore a knee brace in college to protect from injuries and isn't wearing it in the Pros. He'll be moving faster than he did in college from that for sure. Ok sound good. He also looks to me that he might be in better shape or at least slightly in better shape. Sheehan was going on about it and I agree that he looks thinner than he did at times at Ohio State. Maybe that's wrong but that's how he looks to my naked eye. I stood and watched just some of their camp and the sun was baking. And then the dude after practice would sign autographs in the heat for 30 minutes. He might have lost 5 pounds or so in camp. I jog often and used to run some track. And I've noticed over the years when my weight fluctuates even a 5 pound difference can have some impact on my quickness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted August 11, 2019 Share Posted August 11, 2019 As for the Dan - Haskins stuff. My theory that there is a lot of grey in that story. I don't really care because to me its irrelevant. My best guess based on all the narratives is Dan did indeed make it clear he wanted Haskins but he didn't force the issue and Doug backed him on liking Haskins. Jay, Kyle, etc liked Haskins as well but didn't love him where they wanted to use the 15th pick on him. They really really liked Sweat So when they ended up with both, everyone was happy. I could be totally wrong but that's my best guess piecing together some narratives including from Keim who typically is very conservative sharing gossip. While Dan IMO is a bad owner. I don't think he's a total dolt. And I'd think he'd have to be a dolt to insist that Haskins start. It's a lose lose for him. He'd want Haskins to look good when he plays. He gains little to risk otherwise. Also, if you start Haskins right away what else can fans look forward to if he gets off to a rough start? Having Haskins sit on the bench for a bit helps build some anticipation and story lines into the season. My point is I have no idea where Dan is on this or not. But I am not with the logic that if Haskins was really Dan's guy in a big way then he's matured if Haskins ends up sitting. The reason being is if I ran with the Dan narrative and I were him I wouldn't want to start Haskins either right away -- its a risk on the PR side, too. I get the lets get people in the seats argument but I think that would be temporary at best if Haskins started and struggled. So Dan I think would really have to be a moron to push the envelope on Haskins because I think it's a loser's bet for him no matter what angle. Unless the coaching staff felt Haskins was really ready. That's my long winded way of saying is I got no idea how hard or not Dan pushed Haskins. Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. I don't think we have any evidence to rule it in or out. There are narratives that lead to both thoughts. But if I played with worse case scenario that Dan pushed Haskins -- I still would see him as no threat to push Haskins to start because IMO it wouldn't serve any purpose for him -- it would if anything more likely backfire. That's why I see Dan really irrelevant as to Haskins at the moment. As long as Dan stays away for wanting to hang out with Haskins ala Portis, RG3, etc -- I think were safe from Dan with Haskins. Heck even Cerrato in an interview months back while admitting that Dan did interfere with personnel while he was there and it was up to the scouts to convince Dan he was wrong -- at the same time he said that Dan didn't interfere as for playing time for players. He cited how he was eager to start Sean Taylor but Gregg told him to be patient and wait and Dan did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSSkinz Posted August 11, 2019 Share Posted August 11, 2019 1 hour ago, Califan007 said: Few things I had thought about: 1) If that had been caught, this board would have been proclaiming both Haskins and Sims need to be starting and to cut Doctson so that Sims could be WR1... 2) I kinda think Doctson would have caught the pass...may not have landed in bounds lol, but could've caught the pass. This play and the one where he rolled right are the ones that clearly separate his ability from any QB we've had here for decades. Being able to elude the rush or break tackles is one thing but keeping your eyes upfield and throwing on the run accurately is next level, that's the stuff that kills defenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted August 11, 2019 Share Posted August 11, 2019 2 hours ago, bakedtater1 said: Soooo if all QBs are struggling and continue to struggle through pre season do the skins just say **** it and feed dh to the wolves?..how brutal would that be..divisional game...In philly lol No, I believe Colt is the default winner if there's no separation between them...not my opinion, but what I've read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted August 11, 2019 Share Posted August 11, 2019 4 hours ago, RWJ said: Connor Cook is a camp body. Every time I see that name, I think of that other QB named Connor that we signed. The UDFA who literally retired days after we signed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted August 11, 2019 Share Posted August 11, 2019 10 hours ago, Califan007 said: If we drafted Haskins because we needed him to be the best looking rookie QB in the first preseason game of the year, then we are one million percent screwed as a team, as a franchise, and as a fan base. He was a sexy pick. Sex sells. Mission accomplished. Thank you. Signed: Dan and Bruce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheShredder Posted August 11, 2019 Share Posted August 11, 2019 2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said: Ok sound good. He also looks to me that he might be in better shape or at least slightly in better shape. Sheehan was going on about it and I agree that he looks thinner than he did at times at Ohio State. Maybe that's wrong but that's how he looks to my naked eye. I stood and watched just some of their camp and the sun was baking. And then the dude after practice would sign autographs in the heat for 30 minutes. He might have lost 5 pounds or so in camp. I jog often and used to run some track. And I've noticed over the years when my weight fluctuates even a 5 pound difference can have some impact on my quickness. He was definitely looked stronger to me. Leaner muscle, possibly maturing muscle but he's putting in work. I'm sure he's highly motivated and following the plan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.