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FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State


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2019 Defense Rankings:

Total Defense: #27

Passing Defense: #18

Rushing Defense: #31

Points: #27

Sacks: #10

Interceptions: #7 (tie)

 

2020 Defense Rankings:

Total Defense: #5

Passing Defense: #1

Rushing Defense: #23

Points: #11

Sacks: #3

Interceptions: #3 ( tie)

 

The decision to use our 1st and 2nd round picks this year on Mo Sweat and Young was the right decision. This is a fantastic turn around defensively, with only one somewhat noteable FA signing in Fuller. Now let’s see if Rivera made the right call to bench Haskins. Perhaps this is a zen moment where Rivera pulled a wild card move to get Haskins to prepare better. I think it was far too soon to pull the plug. I’m hopeful that Dwayne can come back and prove everyone wrong. 

Edited by Skin'emAlive
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Similar situation to Chicago. Regardless of the reason, If you bench a guy in Q1 of a season, unless you are putting in a QB who is deemed "the future", it is hard to envision the original QB not getting another shot at some point.

 

QBs get an unhealthy share of both blame and props for what is a team game. If a team puts themselves in a situation to dump a QB, it is seriously unlikely they will discover newfound success with another. I would expect to see Trubisky again in the same manner I would expect to see Haskins.

 

When/Why that happens.... we will see.

Considering none of our QBs have a particularly quick time-to-throw, it would likely be via another injury.

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Trubisky was given many opportunities to succeed. I think the hip injury did him in. Most don’t even know he was injured. He’s done, imo. Though, the offense has looked flat out awful with Foles under Nagy. I think without a mobile qb, his offense fails to work well. 
 

The book isn’t written on Haskins just yet. 

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Despite Smith’s turnovers, if he plays like he did last Sunday he gives you the best chance to evaluate your roster at quarterback.

 

Starting Smith is 100% the right move of Dwayne wasn’t doing what was expected. But as the season continues and it looks more lost, giving Dwayne a shot, as long as he’s doing what’s expected, is a great idea. If he learned, that’s good.

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Don't see why it's complicated as for Haskins' work ethic.

 

A.  Red flags before the draft along with specific stories on that front

B.  According to multiple people he didn't work hard enough when he got here

C.  Rough training camp.  Once he started rough outings, 2 good games at the end

D.  Rivera, Turner, Doug put Haskins on notice on working harder

E.  Haskins worked harder in the off season.  Optimism from that (including from me 😀)

F.  Once he got the job, strong work habits vanished. "meh" performances.  Rivera upset at that.  Benched.

G. Perhaps among other things they were hoping putting Haskins on notice again would reiginite his work habits from the off season.

 

As for where we are now?  You got me.  If Haskins is working harder again.  Then, good.   My skepticism about it is driven from my own personal experience working with many people over the years.  I've seen people who aren't that driven at times temporarily wake up and kill it for a spell.  But it typically doesn't last.   I think the Brady, Alex Smith, Peyton and name most successful QBs do not need to be egged on to work hard.  They love football and the egg themselves on without external motivators.   External motivators don't typically last. 

 

I was just listening to Michael Phillips who said talking to people around the team and the players there -- they love Ron and trust him.  Marrying that point and what Russell among others said yesterday, the players love that Ron values the players that work hard.  And no one there has a beef with the Haskins benching.  Haskins has to earn it just like anyone else there.

 

Bringing this back to Haskins, I don't think the dude is a franchise QB even if he puts in the time.  But my position on Haskins has been and remains open.  I've been pro Haskins, I've been anti.  I roll with whatever is happening related to him.  I am Zen on Haskins. 😀   I right now certainly negative after leaning positive before the season and was before that negative on him.  But I've waffled.  I didn't like him before the draft.   But if Rivera goes hey Haskins is killing it in practice, rectifying his mistakes and has turned a leaf.  I'd go for the ride.  I want whatever Rivera wants.  Simple as that.

 

 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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1 hour ago, KDawg said:

Despite Smith’s turnovers, if he plays like he did last Sunday he gives you the best chance to evaluate your roster at quarterback.

 

Starting Smith is 100% the right move of Dwayne wasn’t doing what was expected. But as the season continues and it looks more lost, giving Dwayne a shot, as long as he’s doing what’s expected, is a great idea. If he learned, that’s good.

 

Smith is also the ultimate professional.  If the idea is to do a culture reset, he's the perfect soldier for that.  And I am far from enamored with Alex Smith as a player.  But as a dude, he's second to none.  And as a player, I thought he played mostly well on Sunday sans the interceptions.  and yeah the interceptions of course sinks the performance.  But I doubt Alex is all of a sudden going to turn into a turnover machine.    

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The moment Rivera benched Haskins to 3rd string, this thing could only go one of two ways.  Either he pouts and goes into a shell or it motivates him to do more.  I'd imagine Ron's hope was that it would serve as a wake up call.  Haskins could easily get another shot if Smith goes down or when the wheels fall off the season (some would say they already have).

 

Something tells me the passion to be great is innate, and either you have it or you don't.  I haven't seen much to suggest that Haskins has that innate fire, but we'll most likely get an opportunity to see if that is the case or not.

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He lost weight in the offseason.  The second he was anointed the starter, he didn't put the work in.  I mean there was that Athletic article which said that they had a way to monitor each player and how much time they spent studying film and that Haskins study time was "abnormally low".  I'd rather see what we have in Steven Montez before going back to Dwayne.  

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3 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Something tells me the passion to be great is innate, and either you have it or you don't.  I haven't seen much to suggest that Haskins has that innate fire, but we'll most likely get an opportunity to see if that is the case or not.

 

This - every coaching staff has said in their own way he is a phony who isnt up to the task.  Sort of like leadership you either have it or you don't - this is why the OL was literally laughing in his face when he was trying to deliver his "motivational" speech - when you dont have "it" you come across as disingenuous.  People will always fall back to their default and his is not a highly driven NFL QB.  Cooley said it, you risk losing the team completely by putting him back in there because everyone "in the room" knows the dude is a chump who is far more likely to crap his pants on any given day than become a viable NFL starter.  Again, Ron has put the grown ups in charge, anyone who needs a pacifier needs not apply.  Win or Lose, I like the mentality.

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

 

Something tells me the passion to be great is innate, and either you have it or you don't.  I haven't seen much to suggest that Haskins has that innate fire, but we'll most likely get an opportunity to see if that is the case or not.


Agree. It’s not something you would think comes and goes. At his age, that desire to remain in the #1 seat, once earned, should have been immeasurable. 

 

 

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29 minutes ago, ntotoro said:

Haskins put in work making videos on his weight loss and throwing between cones. We don't know what kind of work he actually did in terms of being an NFL QB.

 

The coaches did, though, and they kept saying Haskins put in the level of work they wanted him to achieve. Beat guys reflected those sentiments as well.

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38 minutes ago, mojo said:

Aside from the off the field stuff, my problem with Haskins is so slow footed and awkward in the pocket.  He really a statue, couple that with his lack of accuracy on deep throws and its a mess.

 

Lack of accuracy in general, the Haskins Humpers keep talking about this so called "arm talent" - its comical.  What talent?  He does not have a cannon like a Josh Allen and he CERTAINLY does not have touch like a Brees/Brady type, so what "talent" are they talking about.  Maybe the talent of turning the WR core into Ringling Bros trying to make circus catches all over the field.  Even his one "goto throw" of the short slant typically had WR having to break stride or jump all over the field to reel in his lame ducks.  He is a slightly above average NOVA flag football QB at best..  B league, not A league.

 

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1 minute ago, Califan007 said:

 

The coaches did, though, and they kept saying Haskins put in the level of work they wanted him to achieve. Beat guys reflected those sentiments as well.

 

 

Coach-speak is coach-speak.

 

Whether it’s positive or negative anything a coach says publicly about a player should be taken with a nano-grain of salt. Coaches more often speak with the objective of manipulating public perception and motivating the players they discuss than truly elucidating their private views.

 

What a coach or coaching staff really believes remains to reporters and fans alike as amorphous and unclear as a distant landscape on a foggy day.

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3 minutes ago, TrancesWithWolves said:

 

 

Coach-speak is coach-speak.

 

 

So what you're saying is that we fans DO know what level of work Haskins put in during the offseason, and we know enough to ignore whatever Rivera, Turner, and the beat writers said.

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All of the best NFL QBs have a work ethic and attention to detail that border on the obsessive. Some of the low-mid guys like Cousins maximize their potential and stick around because of these factors, too.

 

Several of the best current guys also placed a chip on their own shoulders based on low draft position or thinking they didn't get a fair shot, and this provides fuel for their drive to excellence.

 

My sense is that Ron is trying to install this type of motivational tool in Haskins. It's fine if he gets all butthurt, if that's what it takes to get him working hard every day.

 

It could just as easily go the other way, and I guess we'll know soon enough.

 

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7 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

So what you're saying is that we fans DO know what level of work Haskins put in during the offseason, and we know enough to ignore whatever Rivera, Turner, and the beat writers said.

 

 

How you arrived at that conclusion from the totality of my post (not just the excerpt you quoted) is beyond me.

 

Rather than arguing against a straw man I’ll quote from my earlier post in the hope that it will answer your queryWhat a coach or coaching staff really believes remains to reporters and fans alike as amorphous and unclear as a distant landscape on a foggy day.”

 

Simply put, the only thing we can be certain of with respect to the actual value the coach(es) put on the physical and mental work that Haskins performed this off season is that we can’t be certain of anything at all.

 

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, TrancesWithWolves said:

 

 

How you arrived at that conclusion from the totality of my post (not just the excerpt you quoted) is beyond me.

 

Rather than arguing against a straw man I’ll quote from my earlier post in the hope that it will answer your queryWhat a coach or coaching staff really believes remains to reporters and fans alike as amorphous and unclear as a distant landscape on a foggy day.”

 

Simply put, the only thing we can be certain of with respect to the actual value the coach(es) put on the physical and mental work that Haskins performed this off season is that we can’t be certain of anything at all.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your poetry is stellar, but it lands over my head... feller.

 

:ols:

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Don't be surprised if Haskins is QB1 in 21.

I get the feeling that Rivera may be simply showing him some "fatherly tough love", as opposed to basically rejecting him.

The question is, how will Haskins respond to the tough love, which will determine if the first sentence comes true.

For this reason, I am not at all surprised that he wasn't traded before the deadline.

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25 minutes ago, TrancesWithWolves said:

 

 

How you arrived at that conclusion from the totality of my post (not just the excerpt you quoted) is beyond me.

 

Rather than arguing against a straw man I’ll quote from my earlier post in the hope that it will answer your queryWhat a coach or coaching staff really believes remains to reporters and fans alike as amorphous and unclear as a distant landscape on a foggy day.”

 

Simply put, the only thing we can be certain of with respect to the actual value the coach(es) put on the physical and mental work that Haskins performed this off season is that we can’t be certain of anything at all.

 

 

The totality of your post amounted to "I don't believe them."

 

You don't offer any reason for not believing them other than the cliche' of "It's all coach-speak," which tends to be used by people to dismiss anything a coach says that contradicts their preconceived views. Because the nanosecond we acknowledge that we as fans have no idea, we are no longer in a position to dismiss the words of those who do have the knowledge and experience to know. There's nothing left to contradict the coaches' words other than our desire to not believe them.

 

As the other poster said, as fans we really don't know **** about how much or how little work Haskins put in. So we're left with the choices of either believing coaches like Rivera and Turner to be genuine in their assessment of Haskins, along with the beat writers who claim that they've been hearing the same assessments of Haskins' effort behind the scenes...or believing they're not being genuine. I've heard Rivera contradict himself about his own decisions and actions, but I've yet to hear him contradict himself when it comes to his perceptions of players. So unless or until I'm given reason to doubt his assessments, I definitely do not believe I possess enough knowledge of Haskins' effort this offseason to easily dismiss the coaches' appraisals of him. For me, only those fans who do believe they possess enough knowledge would dismiss Rivera's words.

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