FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

1 hour ago, IrepDC said:

 

Maybe you never played sports but thats a clear cut example

You keep doing this “I played sports, so...” thing and it’s rather lame.  Just to be clear, I played sports as well but more importantly so have an abundance of others that don’t share your point of view.  So you can stop with that stuff now as it has no relevance.

 

Kind of wild to me that one statement is so powerful that literally nobody wants Haskins.  Who would have known that statement holds more weight than Haskins tape and his own actions, to the point that here we sit, at the deadline and not so much as a ham sandwich has been offered.
 

 

[PartyPosse]

1 minute ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

You keep doing this “I played sports, so...” thing and it’s rather lame.  Just to be clear, I played sports as well but more importantly so have an abundance of others that don’t share your point of view.  So you can stop with that stuff now as it has no relevance.

 

Kind of wild to me that one statement is so powerful that literally nobody wants Haskins.  Who would have known that statement holds more weight than Haskins tape and his own actions, to the point that here we sit, at the deadline and not so much as a ham sandwich has been offered.
 

 

He makes it sound like all GMs get a majority of their info from Schefter and Rapaport just like all of us.

[KDawg]

2 hours ago, IrepDC said:

You guys are the ones deflecting, making it like I'm a Haskins homer when I'm not. You in particular KEEP saying I'm placing everything on Rivera, when I'm not.  You keep saying I am letting Snyder off when I haven't lol.. You aren't actually responding to me or my points. You respond to a narrative or strawman that's easier to debate. I have talked about this issue and the culture with plenty of players over the years. 

In the context of saying it in front of the media/ world, it's not smart. In the locker room, sure, but doing it publicly isn't the way. Smart teams keep those things in house. We love our soap opera more than football in DC though.

Gonna start calling you Haskins.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

He makes it sound like all GMs get a majority of their info from Schefter and Rapaport just like all of us.

Right.

 

Or that literally every situation is the same.

 

I know full well that Ashburn is dysfunction junction and that the team has displayed a tendency to poop on people that fall out of favor.  I also know that the team historically makes bad decisions that inevitably lead to drama and hurt feelings.  None of that is a secret.
 

I just don’t see that applying here.  Haskins was clearly way over drafted.  It was said before he ever hit a pro field that he was seen as a round or two later project vs. pick #15.  There are reasons for that and they have nothing to do with Ron.  Since that time, you have two staffs that believe Dwayne leaves something to be desired in regards to work ethic.   Then you have Dwayne’s poor play on the field that only helps to solidify all that.  I don’t think Ron putting lipstick on the pig in regards to Dwayne’s benching changes anything about where we are today.

[PartyPosse]

Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Right.

 

Or that literally every situation is the same.

 

I know full well that Ashburn is dysfunction junction and that the team has displayed a tendency to poop on people that fall out of favor.  I also know that the team historically makes bad decisions that inevitably lead to drama and hurt feelings.  None of that is a secret.
 

I just don’t see that applying here.  Haskins was clearly way over drafted.  It was said before he ever hit a pro field that he was seen as a round or two later project vs. pick #15.  There are reasons for that and they have nothing to do with Ron.  Since that time, you have two staffs that believe Dwayne leaves something to be desired in regards to work ethic.   Then you have Dwayne’s poor play on the field that only helps to solidify all that.  I don’t think Ron putting lipstick on the pig in regards to Dwayne’s benching changes anything about where we are today.

I don't think he was overdrafted, but I think he was drafted by the wrong team. The plan, and everyone knew it, was to keep him on the bench for at least a year and let him learn from there. The plan was never for him to play at all, but, like the fanbase, the everyone got overanxious and threw him in there despite the offense being in shambles. Did his own issues hurt him? Absolutely, but I do think sitting him on the bench for a while to "season" would have been a much more productive way to ease him into the NFL life. The only reason he was touted to go lower was because he wasn't ready. You see other teams do it, draft someone high and let them sit instead of throw them to the wolves. Mahomes sat for a year, Rodgers for I believe 12 (lol). We always threw out our picks immediately with the exception of Jason Campbell. Gruden last year was very clearly not enamored with the pick and deprived him of better coaching. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

7 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

I don't think he was overdrafted, but I think he was drafted by the wrong team. The plan, and everyone knew it, was to keep him on the bench for at least a year and let him learn from there. The plan was never for him to play at all, but, like the fanbase, the everyone got overanxious and threw him in there despite the offense being in shambles. Did his own issues hurt him? Absolutely, but I do think sitting him on the bench for a while to "season" would have been a much more productive way to ease him into the NFL life. The only reason he was touted to go lower was because he wasn't ready. You see other teams do it, draft someone high and let them sit instead of throw them to the wolves. Mahomes sat for a year, Rodgers for I believe 12 (lol). We always threw out our picks immediately with the exception of Jason Campbell. Gruden last year was very clearly not enamored with the pick and deprived him of better coaching. 

If nobody else wanted him until at least a round later, that's overdrafted.  My point was that he's not a guy they simply couldn't let pass them by, if not for Danny being in love.  But I agree with you in the sense that it was a bad draft pick simply because we were starting Case Keenum.  That's not a guy who buys you 16 weeks for the rookie to sit.  It was inevitable that he was going to play last year, the only question was when.  That said, I've never seen a glimpse of him on the sideline when not playing where he appears even mildly engaged.  In fact, even when he has been playing, it's been rare to see him in the tablet.

[PartyPosse]

14 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

If nobody else wanted him until at least a round later, that's overdrafted.  My point was that he's not a guy they simply couldn't let pass them by, if not for Danny being in love.  But I agree with you in the sense that it was a bad draft pick simply because we were starting Case Keenum.  That's not a guy who buys you 16 weeks for the rookie to sit.  It was inevitable that he was going to play last year, the only question was when.  That said, I've never seen a glimpse of him on the sideline when not playing where he appears even mildly engaged.  In fact, even when he has been playing, it's been rare to see him in the tablet.

Can you imagine what the offense would have been/is like if we drafted someone other than Terry? What was the team expecting last year from its offense, especially at the WR position because there's absolutely no way they expected this out of Terry. When you look at the drafting of him, Dwayne and Love it was clear the vision was down the road, not immediate. It was as if they wanted the defense to firmly grab the brass ring as the dominant factor on the team while the offense slowly built itself up, but then they kept Gruden and Callahan and suddenly they rushed the young guys in. Last year, IMO, was way worse than the confusion of what we're doing this year in that all these guys were drafted for the future, but you keep a coach around using his assets for the present. It was inconsistent at best.

[El Mexican]

1 hour ago, GOATFrerotte said:

Not sure if this was posted, haven't gone back through the thread. But this pretty much explains the benching. Not sure what people saw on Twitter, they keep saying Haskins wasn't bad. From what I saw it looked like Haskins was completely lost and had no ability to run the offense outside of completing passes around the line of scrimmage. And this definitely shows Allen is a huge upgrade.

 

Interesting graph. Sample size on Allen is way too small, though.

 

He's better than Haskins, of course, but the real difference maker is in the intangibles (where Haskins also failed miserably).

 

I'm talking about the way Jones played the Bucs last night. The pathetic Giants gave them a real scare mainly bc of his great throws.

That last drive by the kid showed he has a huge upside. Sadly, we never saw that with Haskins.

[bowhunter]

2 hours ago, IrepDC said:

It sets a bad precedent. Hence we are THE team for leaks and gossip year in and year out. You either have a "keep things in house" locker room or you don't. If you don't get it, you don't get it.

It's extremely hard to keep the benching of your starting QB quiet. Especially since the  invention of that TV thingy.

 

And once you do, there will be questions to answer. Without an injury of some sort to hide behind, you're reasoning at the mandatory press conference better be good one. Even if the whole world can see that his play sucked. Honestly, you can't keep those things in house. Ron just found a polite way to say that Haskins was not very good at football.

[Cooleyfan1993]

11 minutes ago, bowhunter said:

It's extremely hard to keep the benching of your starting QB quiet. Especially since the  invention of that TV thingy.

 

And once you do, there will be questions to answer. Without an injury of some sort to hide behind, you're reasoning at the mandatory press conference better be good one. Even if the whole world can see that his play sucked. Honestly, you can't keep those things in house. Ron just found a polite way to say that Haskins was not very good at football.

Exactly.  And in terms of keeping things in house, it could be worse. We could be the cowboys, who were saying annonymously that the coaches suck, and aren’t good at their jobs. Even at 2-5, nobody in our locker room is saying that stuff (at least not publicly)

[ExoDus84]

1 hour ago, El Mexican said:

I'm talking about the way Jones played the Bucs last night. The pathetic Giants gave them a real scare mainly bc of his great throws.

That last drive by the kid showed he has a huge upside. Sadly, we never saw that with Haskins.

 

Well, I think most Giants fans at this stage are definitely not sold on Jones. That two point conversion attempt last night pretty much epitomizes his tenure so far in the NFL: He throws an absolute DIME to Tate for the TD, to get them in position to tie it. A gorgeous throw. Then what happens? He's extremely late throwing to a wide open running back, which was his first and only read, and then when he does throw it, it's ugly and behind the RB so there's no chance for a completion. If he leads the RB to the pylon, even though the throw is stupid late, they still probably convert there.

 

Jones is wildly inconsistent. Beautiful play, bad turnover. Great run, turf monster trips him.

[IrepDC]

6 hours ago, bowhunter said:

It's extremely hard to keep the benching of your starting QB quiet. Especially since the  invention of that TV thingy.

 

And once you do, there will be questions to answer. Without an injury of some sort to hide behind, you're reasoning at the mandatory press conference better be good one. Even if the whole world can see that his play sucked. Honestly, you can't keep those things in house. Ron just found a polite way to say that Haskins was not very good at football.

A polite way? This is going to be such an interesting evolution into a winning culture. We are used to so much drama. Guys this isn't normal lol.

 

Right now our all time leading sack leader is requesting a trade according to "rumors." That's our locker room. That's not good. A guy like Kerrigan should have his 2 year incentive laced deal so he can mentor our two premium edge rushers on how to be a pro and represent DC. We think this is normal though lol we have to fix this! 

 

It's really not about Haskins. If he needed to be humbled or benched, you just talk about Allen taking the spot in competition. In house you correct Haskins and hold the team accountable to each other. In winning locker rooms the fans have no clue about all these battles and ups and downs. In Washington we find out EVERYTHING. 

 

It has become a bit of a vice here so some may enjoy it to the point that they'll defend it lol, I get it, but it is a part of the loser culture. It is what it is. 

[IrepDC]

8 hours ago, KDawg said:

Gonna start calling you Haskins.

That strawman is destroying me bro lol and it totoally distracts me from your inability to respond to what I'm saying. I am just doing this for Haskins! You're right lol. Kerrigan wants out. Trent wanted out last year. The LITERAL best offensive and defensive players on our team of the past decade have wanted OUT and PUBLICLY in the past two years and you still don't see it? The players on the team are telling you lol. Players don't like playing here for a reason. I've stated (my opinion) why. The house is still on fire. Everything is okay in your head if you scapegoat Haskins, I guess?

 

"IrepDC is just talking about Haskins and all the other points he's making about how this is a part of a loser culture are just distractions. He doesn't know ANYTHING about football or winning!"

 

Lol it's cool. I'm just sharing my perspective. You're probably high key Haskins biggest fan though because you always and consistently reply to my posts about him. Rarely anything else.

8 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

You keep doing this “I played sports, so...” thing and it’s rather lame.  Just to be clear, I played sports as well but more importantly so have an abundance of others that don’t share your point of view.  So you can stop with that stuff now as it has no relevance.

 

Kind of wild to me that one statement is so powerful that literally nobody wants Haskins.  Who would have known that statement holds more weight than Haskins tape and his own actions, to the point that here we sit, at the deadline and not so much as a ham sandwich has been offered.
 

 

I'm playing sports right now bro. I have a winning percentage right now. I am in winning locker rooms right now lol. I'm sorry if I think thats relevant to mention time to time. 

 

I am typing this one last time in this thread lol the QB threads in DC run the same script for the past 20 years and we still don't get it lol. My humble perspective is that if Haskins is bad(or if he just needs more time), you keep it IN house and play this out as a Kyle Allen story until we get value for Haskins. Any other conversation is not something a winning team has. 

[KDawg]

@IrepDC

 

you use a lot of words to not say much at all in regards to the topic.

 

@HTTRDynasty and I totally disagree on pretty much all things Haskins, but he brings points and counter points to conversations that fuel the conversation.

 

I have yet to see you make a salient point beyond pining about how you feel about the situation.

 

And you have every right to feel one way or another. 
 

But it just seems to clouded to most folks here that you are so behind Haskins that you refuse to see any other perspective. 
 

Is that true? Who knows. But it’s certainly what the surface appears as.

 

As for not responding to your posts in other threads... do you post in other threads? Not trying to be funny but I don’t even notice you other than here.

[Riggo#44]

4 hours ago, IrepDC said:

It's really not about Haskins.

Isn't this the Haskins thread?

[Thinking Skins]

Just heard Rivera's statement on Haskins and it was a much more positive thing than what was initially said that Wed. Maybe he realizes that he was too harsh in that initial press conference. He still said that there needs to be more development and they're in a division race but it was a lot more positive sounding. 

[KDawg]

14 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

Just heard Rivera's statement on Haskins and it was a much more positive thing than what was initially said that Wed. Maybe he realizes that he was too harsh in that initial press conference. He still said that there needs to be more development and they're in a division race but it was a lot more positive sounding. 

We take coach speak to the media entirely too “exact”. What he says behind closed doors will not always word for word or tone for tone match what is said behind closed doors.

 

Have you ever heard a coach stand at a podium and say, “This one is on us as a staff. We weren’t prepared properly and we didn’t execute.”

 

He is probably taking blame, but he’s going to go behind closed doors and **** all over his QB that threw 3 picks and his RB who fumbled 3 times and D that couldn’t stop a JV offense...

 

Coaches also are sometimes more concise in pressers than they are behind closed doors. Chances are the team knew the tone from day one. The team certainly seems to be in support of his moves.

 

Having said that, sometimes Rivera goes into too much detail and sometimes he’s too concise and it always seems to be in the opposite situation you’d want him to do either one. He can improve his media handling, for sure.

[Thinking Skins]

4 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Coaches also are sometimes more concise in pressers than they are behind closed doors. Chances are the team knew the tone from day one. The team certainly seems to be in support of his moves.

 

Having said that, sometimes Rivera goes into too much detail and sometimes he’s too concise and it always seems to be in the opposite situation you’d want him to do either one. He can improve his media handling, for sure.

I have no problem with him taking the blame or being too concise. I wish he were more concise like JDR. But I am not a fan of ohw he handled the situation originally. Basically the 52 vs 1 comment was over the line for me. But what Scott and what others have said since then haven't been so much for me. 

 

As far as him being in third string, it'd be different if Haskins was behind DiNucci. But he's behind Allen and Smith. One is an UDFA, but he's starting. The other is a 16 year vet. I don't have high hopes that he'll have a career here, but I'm trying to take Ron at his word that he's not done here, particularly if Allen struggles or gets hurt or if we are out of the division race in these next few weeks. 

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

I have no problem with him taking the blame or being too concise. I wish he were more concise like JDR. But I am not a fan of ohw he handled the situation originally. Basically the 52 vs 1 comment was over the line for me. But what Scott and what others have said since then haven't been so much for me. 

 

As far as him being in third string, it'd be different if Haskins was behind DiNucci. But he's behind Allen and Smith. One is an UDFA, but he's starting. The other is a 16 year vet. I don't have high hopes that he'll have a career here, but I'm trying to take Ron at his word that he's not done here, particularly if Allen struggles or gets hurt or if we are out of the division race in these next few weeks. 

It shouldn’t be over the line in MY opinion...

 

Hes not saying the 1 sucks. He’s saying the 1 isn’t ready. And to develop a guy (the 1) when he’s not ready to take the reigns means the rest of the team (the 52) is going to underperform where a different, more experienced QB, can take them.

[OVCChairman]

3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

We take coach speak to the media entirely too “exact”. What he says behind closed doors will not always word for word or tone for tone match what is said behind closed doors.

 

Have you ever heard a coach stand at a podium and say, “This one is on us as a staff. We weren’t prepared properly and we didn’t execute.”

 

He is probably taking blame, but he’s going to go behind closed doors and **** all over his QB that threw 3 picks and his RB who fumbled 3 times and D that couldn’t stop a JV offense...

 

Coaches also are sometimes more concise in pressers than they are behind closed doors. Chances are the team knew the tone from day one. The team certainly seems to be in support of his moves.

 

Having said that, sometimes Rivera goes into too much detail and sometimes he’s too concise and it always seems to be in the opposite situation you’d want him to do either one. He can improve his media handling, for sure.

 

 

 

I don't know that I need him to be any different than he has been.  He's been transparent, while making decisions and moves based on what he thinks is right... fans and media be damned.  He's distributing information, not writing a novel.  The end game is a moving target.  The season in fluid and constantly changing.  He's also doing all these things while maintaining and repairing a franchise that's been in flux for decades.  Your first 4 sentences are what most successful coaches do.  They publicly support the team and player while still providing information.  As you said, the narrative and tone to the media is likely very different than the one in the locker room.  

 

The only time Rivera has come out publicly against a player, it was AFTER the player (agent) came out publicly against he team.  It's also likely that was a shot across the bow of the agent to say, remember who he plays for, and who you work for.  The agent works for the player... the player works for the team.  I was not a big fan of this when it happened either... in fact I wish it hadn't happened at all... but Rivera had not to that point, and has not since, come out with any sort of criticism of any other player, despite multiple players possibly deserving it... Collins and Apke being examples of that.  Rivera was a lot more political with his responses to the questions regarding those players.  

[KDawg]

To be clear, I don’t need him to be more or less of anything. He’s a pro and is taking the route he deems best. I wouldn’t handle it the same, but that doesn’t mean I know a damn thing about handling media in a setting like that, because I don’t.

 

He’s the head guy for a reason.

[Thinking Skins]

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

Hes not saying the 1 sucks. He’s saying the 1 isn’t ready. And to develop a guy (the 1) when he’s not ready to take the reigns means the rest of the team (the 52) is going to underperform where a different, more experienced QB, can take them.

See the thing that upset me was this part because he made it seem that the 1 was not trying to win. He was trying to win. So was Apke. So was Collins. So was Martin. So is Hopkins. So is Thomas. So is JDM. So is Gibson. But he singled out Haskins as a guy who is the 1 vs all of these other guys who are / were making regular mistakes.

 

If he had put it as a thing of Haskins is making mistakes and still has a lot to learn it'd be one thing but he made it sound like Haskins wasn't trying. Then the leaks came out that he wasn't trying in practice and that he must be in the dog house and something must be up and it just stunk to the high heavens. I will say that I don't buy the leaks, but even further I'm not going to place them on Rivera because as with the Kerrigan stuff he was able to dismiss it because its not from his camp. 

 

I guess we'll see. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Sheehan talked about this some this morning and I agreed with his point.  It's doubtful that Rivera feels that hot about Haskins.  the leaks came from credible sources.  being demoted to third string speaks for itself.

 

But the issue is if they want to trade Haskins, if various national and local reporters are correct, other teams aren't interested.   And you need to try to jack up trade value.  The Cards did it well with Josh Rosen where they were pumping him up as a possiblity to still be the starter right until they finally traded him. to dump Haskins you got to try to do something similar.

 

If haskins was brimming with talent and it was about Rivera being some mean spirited dolt as for wanting to discard Haskins then teams would be lining up for a trade.  The Cards had no problem finding multiple suitors for Rosen as an example.   But alas clearly the league isn't in love with Haskins.  The idea as Keim said that its possible that Haskins wouild have fallen out of the first round if the WFT didn't take him -- seems to be coming to life in the context of interest around the league.  Granted it likely will be easier to trade Haskins in the off season but am still doubting they get much.

 

 

[KDawg]

54 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

See the thing that upset me was this part because he made it seem that the 1 was not trying to win. He was trying to win. So was Apke. So was Collins. So was Martin. So is Hopkins. So is Thomas. So is JDM. So is Gibson. But he singled out Haskins as a guy who is the 1 vs all of these other guys who are / were making regular mistakes.

 

If he had put it as a thing of Haskins is making mistakes and still has a lot to learn it'd be one thing but he made it sound like Haskins wasn't trying. Then the leaks came out that he wasn't trying in practice and that he must be in the dog house and something must be up and it just stunk to the high heavens. I will say that I don't buy the leaks, but even further I'm not going to place them on Rivera because as with the Kerrigan stuff he was able to dismiss it because its not from his camp. 

 

I guess we'll see. 

The funny thing to me is perspective. I didn’t get the vibe that he was saying Haskins wasn’t trying at ALL. You obviously did. We both have different perspectives and we saw things very differently. 
 

Very strange how our own thought processes influence these feelings.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I didn't take it as 52 versus 1.  I took it as his responsibility as coach of a 53 man football team is to make decisions that he feels are best for all 53 vs. one guy.  He's certainly not the first coach to make a statement like that.