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FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State


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I wonder how much Haskins can be like Josh Allen (minus the athleticism). His 1st year he was terrible--52.1% comp, 10 TD 12 INT, last year was better, not great, 58.8%, and 20 TDs 9 INTs. This year he's at 70%. While I agree that Haskins isn't going to be an MVP candidate ever, I still think he has the potential be a good QB. I still think his accuracy issues are fixable--they're the kind of issue that coaching, practice, and reps fix. He doesn't turn the ball over, He reportedly reads defenses well (Meyer and others have said as much) albeit I wouldn't be able to tell. Teammates and coaches have repeatedly said he has grown into a leader. And, I'll say it again, even the coaches are calling the offense a work-in-progress. However, if Rivera et al decide he's not after this season and jettison him, adios. But I think he gets all year to prove it--and I'll reserve all judgement until then. So, we'll see.

 

 

 

 

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The problem is the pieces around him are so awful it's hard to even judge his performance. I don't think he's the guy but he's also being set up to fail. Bad O-line, no weapons besides McLaurin and Gibson is a nice little story so far but he's not making defenses gameplan for him.

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Living in Bills country, Haskins is not Allen. In any way. 
 

Allen is big, strong, athletic, has a strong arm and has a ridiculous competitive fire. Haskins is missing a lot of that, aside from the arm.

 

They process things similarly, Allen struggles with reads at times. But the strong arm and processing is about where it stops comparatively.

 

Allen was fully embraced by almost the entire Bills fan base, coaching staff, front office from day one. Haskins wasn’t. 
 

They are different. In many ways.

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1 hour ago, method man said:

Objectively, of the first round picks who have gotten to play the last 3 years, the only WB who looks worse than Haskins is Rosen

Hitting open receivers should be a minimum requirement to be an NFL QB.  If Haskins cannot consistently do that, he should not be playing QB at the NFL level.  I suspect he has this year to prove he is the QB of the future.

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11 hours ago, Mr. Sinister said:

 

Menshoes seems like one of those cats that was like a 3-4 year college starter. Probably not fair to Haskins, though he too had a new system this year

this argument does nothing for me. when you put yourself in the draft that means you're saying that you are ready for NFL ball. so that is on Haskins. should have stayed at ohio state. 

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2 minutes ago, Sticksboi05 said:

The problem is the pieces around him are so awful it's hard to even judge his performance. I don't think he's the guy but he's also being set up to fail. Bad O-line, no weapons besides McLaurin and Gibson is a nice little story so far but he's not making defenses gameplan for him.

 

The Jag's o-line is pretty crappy too,  Their RB (Robinson) is just a JAG.  Their WRs are nothing to write home about (Chark is a good young player and Sheanult looks promising), but they are not leaps and bounds better.  Yet, Jay has Minschew playing so much better.  QBs are either accurate or not.  Haskins has horrible inaccuracy outside the numbers (Look at the missed throw to a WIDE OPEN Inman on the 4th down play that Sims was called for offensive PI).  

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38 minutes ago, heyholetsgogrant said:


 

Today NFL is different, with all the big data and analytics you know right away of a player is going to be good. You may have have listed all of the exceptions to rule (even if you throw in Peyton Manning, who had flashes of being good his rookie year).  The vast majority QB’s don’t work out and the list would be endless if we compared it to yours. Look at Murray, he had a decent rookie year (not great), but you knew he was going to develop into franchise QB, same with all of the current NFL top tier QB’s.

 

Dude, again two different type of QBs here.....Murray has more of an experienced team to work with and grow in...plus the obvious difference in styles of play.

 

Either Haskins will become more like for example ....

Flacco (Rook: 2971 yards -17 touchdowns -11 interceptions) and be a game manager.

or like

Roethlisberger (Rook: 2621 yards -16 touchdowns -12 interceptions) who became more accurate as he played.

 

Both had great defenses, solid O-lines, and beast running backs when they started.

 

Inclined to give him this year to grow and see how he works out with a better O-line next year. Whatever Rivera is pushing right now.

4 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Living in Bills country, Haskins is not Allen. In any way. 
 

Allen is big, strong, athletic, has a strong arm and has a ridiculous competitive fire. Haskins is missing a lot of that, aside from the arm.

 

They process things similarly, Allen struggles with reads at times. But the strong arm and processing is about where it stops comparatively.

 

Allen was fully embraced by almost the entire Bills fan base, coaching staff, front office from day one. Haskins wasn’t. 
 

They are different. In many ways.

 

NO QB in Washington ever is......

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9 hours ago, Rskins91 said:

Troy Aikman was 0-11 with 9 TDs to 18 INTs in his rookie season. 
 

Terry Bradshaw was 5-9 with 6 TDs to 24 INTs in his rookie season. 
 

Rich Gannon was 37 when he had his MVP Season after years of futility in the 90’s. 
 

Alex Smith had 1 TD to 11 INTs in 9 games played his rookie season.

 

I’m not saying Dwayne will be an All-Pro, but I’m also not saying he’s a complete bust. Let’s give him time to get “it” and learn from his mistakes.

 

 

You want to wait until Dwayne is 37? LOL. Terrible, terrible example. It’s easier than ever for a rookie or 2nd year QB to come in and be successful. Dwayne has shown none of that. The most important thing he has done for this team was something nobody saw, the Locker room speech. 

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19 minutes ago, cakmoney61 said:

Hitting open receivers should be a minimum requirement to be an NFL QB.  If Haskins cannot consistently do that, he should not be playing QB at the NFL level.  I suspect he has this year to prove he is the QB of the future.

 

We're probably focusing solely on the talent around him if he just hits open people. 

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1 hour ago, tmandoug1 said:

I have an idea.....let's draft an o-ine next year.


No draft QB every year until one works out cause a good one makes the TE/WR/OL all look better. 
 

I don’t know why we haven’t drafted 7 of them a year yet honestly 

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5 minutes ago, Llevron said:


No draft QB every year until one works out cause a good one makes the TE/WR/OL all look better. 
 

I don’t know why we haven’t drafted 7 of them a year yet honestly 


I agree, the QB position is so important, we haven’t had a franchise QB since Joe Theismann.  Might as well draft one every year until we find one.  Bare minimum you have to hit open receivers. 

Edited by heyholetsgogrant
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11 minutes ago, Llevron said:


No draft QB every year until one works out cause a good one makes the TE/WR/OL all look better. 
 

I don’t know why we haven’t drafted 7 of them a year yet honestly 

Funny you say that, a growing opinion in the analytics community is that you SHOULD take a QB somewhere in the draft every year because of health and cost. 

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6 minutes ago, heyholetsgogrant said:


I agree, the QB position is so important, we haven’t had a franchise QB since Joe Theismann.  Might as well draft one every year until we find one.  Bare minimum you have to hit open receivers. 

 

That's been Elway's move. Hasn't worked out for him yet though. So few of these Day 2/3 QBs end up actually hitting that you are taking away resources from other positions, where you can find starters with those picks. This team has unfortunately kept drafting back after back with mid round picks that they could've used on other positions. I like Gibson but I'm on the record for wanting Jones the OT or Baun the LB instead at that pick.

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9 hours ago, Rskins91 said:

Troy Aikman was 0-11 with 9 TDs to 18 INTs in his rookie season. 
 

Terry Bradshaw was 5-9 with 6 TDs to 24 INTs in his rookie season. 
 

Rich Gannon was 37 when he had his MVP Season after years of futility in the 90’s. 
 

Alex Smith had 1 TD to 11 INTs in 9 games played his rookie season.

 

I’m not saying Dwayne will be an All-Pro, but I’m also not saying he’s a complete bust. Let’s give him time to get “it” and learn from his mistakes.

 

 

 

These are useless comparisons.  For every one of these, there's literally half a dozen highly drafted QBs that were bad to middling early and stayed that way.  Joey Harrington, Tim Couch, Josh Rosen, etc, etc. The list is long.

 

Now, I'm not making a judgement one way or the other on Haskins, just that cherry picking other QB successes doesnt really make his case.

 

At any rate, if we're riding with Haskins and giving him a fair shake, he should get this year AND next, based on the talent deficit around him.  I dont know if folks have the patience for that.

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1 minute ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Funny you say that, a growing opinion in the analytics community is that you SHOULD take a QB somewhere in the draft every year because of health and cost. 


While I’m good at sarcasm I actually believe you should draft a QB every year if you have a team that can support one. 
 

it’s that if, that ruins it for us. It’s why I say we let Haskins take the hits, while we build the squad, and if he’s still standing when we have something .....great. If he’s not then we have a young cheap one waiting. It makes no sense to do anything else. Actually we have done everything else and we always end the same way. The only guy who got to start playing here with good WRs, a good TE and a ok-ish-kinda oline was Cousins and he did well enough. We should try that again. 
 

Haskins is cheap and young. The perfect cat to build a squad around. Focusing on his position every year however is a waste of resources if you don’t fix anything else. 

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I was really hoping the Haskins of the last few games last year would come back and get better. So far, he is not as bad as when he started last year but he has not even reached his level of play at the end of last year. Lot's of very legitimate reasons - poor Oline, new OC, HC and entire off, lack of weapons around him, very unusual offseason with very little contact and I am sure there are more. 

 

Unfortunately none of that has anything to do with putting the ball on a guys numbers. He is making some decent reads just missing guys. No where near ready to give up on him. He needs another 4 to 6 weeks. But man I would like to see some improvement. He looked like the same QB this week as last. Not good. 

 

As for some complaining about taking him in the 1st rd - I did not want to draft him - but if you do draft him it had to be in the 1st rd. He was never making it to the 2nd rd - that is pure fantasy. You can have the argument of it we should have taken him but not where he was taken. If you draft him it had to be in the 1st rd. In fact many felt he was the best QB in the draft (concerned about Kyler Murrays injuries - or Kyler was best in talent).  

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Haskins reminded me of RG3 in his come back year.  Jittery in the pocket, he never stepped up into the pocket and literally ran directly into 2 sacks in the first quarter, and inaccurate due to poor fundamentals.

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Just now, DJHJR86 said:

FYI, the "he didn't have a preseason" argument was over after week 1.  Starters usually play 4 quarters of preseason football.

 

Cmon now, you are just poking at him and those supporting him. Huge difference between this season and playing a half Quarter, then have a full week of practice with the 1s, then another quarter of play and another full week of practice, then a half of play and yet another full week of practice, then you sit the week but have another full week of practice leading up to the first game. Thats 5 weeks of practice vs. 2. And its at least 3 different defences and game plans. 

 

I agree he has been disappointing - I just defined that above. But no need to pile on. There are enough legitimate issues to point out.  

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5 minutes ago, Llevron said:


While I’m good at sarcasm I actually believe you should draft a QB every year if you have a team that can support one. 
 

it’s that if, that ruins it for us. It’s why I say we let Haskins take the hits, while we build the squad, and if he’s still standing when we have something .....great. If he’s not then we have a young cheap one waiting. It makes no sense to do anything else. Actually we have done everything else and we always end the same way. The only guy who got to start playing here with good WRs, a good TE and a ok-ish-kinda oline was Cousins and he did well enough. We should try that again. 
 

Haskins is cheap and young. The perfect cat to build a squad around. Focusing on his position every year however is a waste of resources if you don’t fix anything else. 

I don’t necessarily disagree. If we aren’t bad enough to get Lawrence and can’t find a good deal for one of the vets, I’m ok bringing him back long as he shows something at some point this season.

 

I think our issues (pass catchers and OLine) will be addressed this offseason. I think we’ll just need average QB play in 2021 to compete for a playoff spot. 

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Just now, goskins10 said:

 

Cmon now, you are just poking at him and those supporting him. Huge difference between this season and playing a half Quarter, then have a full week of practice with the 1s, then another quarter of play and another full week of practice, then a half of play and yet another full week of practice, then you sit the week but have another full week of practice leading up to the first game. Thats 5 weeks of practice vs. 2. And its at least 3 different defences and game plans. 

 

I agree he has been disappointing - I just defined that above. But no need to pile on. There are enough legitimate issues to point out.  

 

No I am not "poking at him".  I want a #15 round overall pick to look at least as good as a 6th rounder (who also didn't have a preseason, also has a new coaching staff, AND also has ZERO offensive weapons) who has outperformed him since day one.  

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19 minutes ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Funny you say that, a growing opinion in the analytics community is that you SHOULD take a QB somewhere in the draft every year because of health and cost. 

 

Belichick basically was doing that.  They drafted 10 QBs in the 19 years after Brady became the starting QB.

 

I think Holmgren drafted 6 in 7 years in GB.

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11 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

No I am not "poking at him".  I want a #15 round overall pick to look at least as good as a 6th rounder (who also didn't have a preseason, also has a new coaching staff, AND also has ZERO offensive weapons) who has outperformed him since day one.  

 

All that is fair but the stuff about the preseason is not. Again, plenty of legitimate complaints about him. I voiced some myself. But equating the amount of play this season so far and a normal preseason is not legitimate. It's taking a shot for no reason. Not responding after this. 

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This is an insane year, and there's no QB on our roster who even has a shot to be our "future" at this point beyond Haskins. I'm ready to ride with this guy all season long and make up my mind at the end. Barring some complete epic meltdown, I expect the season to be back and forth like it's been so far, but I just want to see steady improvement as the year goes on and he's given a chance to feel a sense of consistency and hopefully calm under Rivera's guidance. To be going this nuts after Week 2, especially considering all the crazy events/changes of last season, seems irrational. Nothing irrational about noticing the glaring issues and being concerned, but way too early to cut the cord completely at this point.  

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1 minute ago, goskins10 said:

But equating the amount of play this season so far and a normal preseason is not legitimate. It's taking a shot for no reason. Not responding after this. 

 

Uh...when you play roughly 3-4 quarters of football in the preseason, and comparing that to playing 8 full quarters of a regular season is not "taking a shot for no reason".  

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