Is this the worst Redskins team in the last 20 years?

[drowland]

1 hour ago, carex said:

 

not everyone considers final record as the deciding factor of what's the worst team

 

You're right since I think the 0-16 Lions and 1-31 Browns showed more fight then this team has so far.

[joeken24]

I'm even beginning to not like Chris Thompson whiny ass. Listen to this **** and you'll see exactly why the Redskins are a ****ed up team. If you listen to players from the Patriot talk about their coach, you'll here a totally different take. **** a player's coach Chris!!!! You've played on one NFL team and that team loses consistently. Hint hint!! How about being coached by someone you might hate? Someone that makes you hate practice, but you end up winning a lot of goddamn football games like every other successful football program!!! Allow us to be men??......WTF!! How about just being a man (instead of having to be allowed to), grab some damn pride, get mad as **** and beat the **** out of the actual man in front of you on Sundays!!! **** this team mentality upside down!! Tired of this ****!

 

[hail2skins]

3 hours ago, carex said:

Spurrier quitting is not a low point.  You want to put his hiring as a low point fine.  But not his quitting

Before Gibbs surprised everyone by coming back to the Redskins, we were looking at Ray Rhodes, Jim Fassel, and Denny Green as the main candidates to replace Spurrier. Plus our first round draft choice QB from 2002 (Ramsey) did not appear like he was going to pan out.  But we were only about a decade removed from the glory years, so the fans still cared enough to be bummed.

 

At the end of Zorn's stint, everyone knew that we were getting Shanahan, who had a decade-long solid run in Denver even after the back-to-back Super Bowls. And at the time, people would've accepted a stapler to make better personnel decisions than Vinny.

 

Today, we are roughly 30 years removed from the glory days, 20 years into Snyder's ownership, and the 10th season since the team was supposedly getting its **** together by parting ways with Vinny. What have we accomplished in those 10 years? Three winning seasons (the best being one 10-6 campaign) and two playoff appearances (with no postseason victories).  With six losing seasons, and, unless something miraculous occurs, hurtling rapidly toward a seventh. We have roughly been .500 overall the past four seasons, but is that really what we want to strive for? The fans do have a rookie QB to look forward to watching, but it seems like the past 25 years already have too many fans in the mindset that Haskins is already doomed to failure.  Which fits in with the prevalent mindset of apathy and somewhat one of fatalism, as in anything this team does is going to be relegated to failure. 

[Jericho]

This isn't a good team, but the worst? Seems like an extreme overreaction to a tough early schedule. I mean this is a franchise that employed both Jim Zorn and Steve Spurrier as NFL head coaches in the last two decades. And neither has any business having that job. It also went 3-13 and had the 2nd worst record in the league under Shanahan. I don't think the 2019 Redskins are that bad, but when you're not good does it really matter if you're 5% better than the 2013 Redskins?

[clskinsfan]

14 minutes ago, Jericho said:

This isn't a good team, but the worst? Seems like an extreme overreaction to a tough early schedule. I mean this is a franchise that employed both Jim Zorn and Steve Spurrier as NFL head coaches in the last two decades. And neither has any business having that job. It also went 3-13 and had the 2nd worst record in the league under Shanahan. I don't think the 2019 Redskins are that bad, but when you're not good does it really matter if you're 5% better than the 2013 Redskins?

 

Brother we just got curb stomped by the Giants. A rookie QB led Giants that threw two picks and we STILL got worked. This is an extremely bad football team.

[hail2skins]

2 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

 

Brother we just got curb stomped by the Giants. A rookie QB led Giants that threw two picks and we STILL got worked. This is an extremely bad football team.

Don't forget how our defense was going to be able to keep mediocre Trubitsky in check last Monday. And he pretty much had his way with our overrated D. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

It remains to be seen.  That 2009 Zorn team was horrific.  Spurrier 2002 team ended up 5-11.  But he was quick to point out they were the worst team. 

 

This does have the chance to top them all.  In order to get any action on it,  you have to set the over/under at 2.5 wins.  And I think most people would still play the under.  

 

If you set it at 3.5, Larry Michael would be the only person taking the over. 

 

It could end up being the worst team record wise in franchise history.

 

They might not be favored against the Dolphins.

 

EDIT: Maybe Joe Thiesman would also take the over.

[carex]

1 hour ago, clskinsfan said:

 

Brother we just got curb stomped by the Giants. A rookie QB led Giants that threw two picks and we STILL got worked. This is an extremely bad football team.

 

so what?  What about these losses are so damn special

[Jericho]

1 hour ago, clskinsfan said:

 

Brother we just got curb stomped by the Giants. A rookie QB led Giants that threw two picks and we STILL got worked. This is an extremely bad football team.

 

And the Giants beat the Bucs, who beat the Rams, who beat the Saints, who beat the Cowboys. Anyone can make wide generalizations based on one game. Usually they are not accurate. Fans always overreact to what just happened lately. Which is what's happening now. The fans are overreacting to the latest game, which was terrible. I'll take a more measured approach. 

 

Football Outsiders does an analytics week by week. And until this year, the 2001 Redskins were the worst team through two weeks in NFL History (or at least as far back as they've tracked, since 1986). Interestingly, not only did those Redskins win 8 games, but many of the worst teams through two weeks finished right around .500:

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/dvoa-ratings/2019/week-2-dvoa-ratings

 

The 2019 Dolphins finally were worse though. They've kept it up through Week 3, become the worst team ever tracked through 3 weeks. Again overtaking the 2001 Redskins. Here's the Week 3 numbers:

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/dvoa-ratings/2019/week-3-dvoa-ratings

 

This does not yet include Week 4, but the Redskins aren't even in the bottom 5 teams through 3 weeks. The bottom five are/were Miami, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Oakland, and the New York Jets. So yeah, the Redskins have not been good. But we knew that. We knew this team was not a good one entering the season. And they've lived up to that. But again, let's not get hyperbolic. The worst team ever? The worst team in the league? The Dolphins have literally played the worst first three games in NFL history. The Redskins are merely just bad.

 

 

[volsmet]

47 minutes ago, carex said:

 

so what?  What about these losses are so damn special

 

Failing to be competitive, 4 games in a row, in a league that prioritizes parity, isn’t particularly easy. 

47 minutes ago, Jericho said:

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/dvoa-ratings/2019/week-3-dvoa-ratings

 

This does not yet include Week 4, but the Redskins aren't even in the bottom 5 teams through 3 weeks. The bottom five are/were Miami, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Oakland, and the New York Jets. So yeah, the Redskins have not been good. But we knew that. We knew this team was not a good one entering the season. And they've lived up to that. But again, let's not get hyperbolic. The worst team ever? The worst team in the league? The Dolphins have literally played the worst first three games in NFL history. The Redskins are merely just bad.

 

 

 

Miami will prove that they’re, unwittingly, better than us, soon enough. 

[skinsmania123]

8 hours ago, Jericho said:

 

 

This does not yet include Week 4, but the Redskins aren't even in the bottom 5 teams through 3 weeks. The bottom five are/were Miami, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Oakland, and the New York Jets. So yeah, the Redskins have not been good. But we knew that. We knew this team was not a good one entering the season. And they've lived up to that. But again, let's not get hyperbolic. The worst team ever? The worst team in the league? The Dolphins have literally played the worst first three games in NFL history. The Redskins are merely just bad.

 

 

And when those numbers come out the Redskins will be in the bottom 3.  Bank it.   Pittsburg won last night. Oakland won Sunday. Yes most of us knew the Skins would not be good.  But the belief was that our D would keep us in games and the O would struggle. That was narrative on this board that I read.  That did not happen in games 1 and 2. In fact it was the opposite.  We would have won if the D had done their part.  So yeah through games 1 and 2 we were bad. 

 

But then we go on the road to the Giants where their D is struggling, hoping Case would revert back to his games 1 and 2 performance, not turn the ball over, and that our team would put up a dog fight on the road for the win.   But no. We were dismantled by a rookie QB who threw how many INT's?  3  I think. And our QB play was an atrocity.  As the game wore on the D reverted back to game 1 and 2 form, joining the suck of our Offensive play.  Blown coverages, crap tackling.   In an attempt to spark the team, Gruden puts in Haskins who is a disaster.  No practice with the first team, timing is off, etc.   Every single sports commentator has blown up the past few days on that move thinking it was irresponsible of Gruden.  Having observed Haskins on the bench, in social media etc, while i think he is a good kid, this was good for his development. I think it brought him back to earth.  I certainly did not hate the move.  He may not be ready for the pro game yet....but he will be.

 

  What "we" said and what I have read on this board was that the Redskins would be a 7-9, 6-10.  I thought 5-11.   That we would beat the Bear's and beat the Giant's and the belief was going into Miami, a game most of us thought we would win would put us at 3-3.   At this point it is the overall play of the team.  It is how they are playing. It is how they are losing.  

 

I believe Miami will beat us.  Right now we may not be crowned the worst team but we are making a strong showing for that honor to go between us in Miami.   We are in the bottom three headed towards the bottom rung.   Cincinnati, Miami and Washington suck.  All three are awful teams, beyond bad.  But the most undisciplined team is Washington.  Creating new opportunities for failure every single week.  And that is why they will battle it out for the worst team in football here in 2019.

[Old Bay]

It feels like this team doesn't have much fight.  It seems like this has crept in sooner than it has in most seasons.  A lot of times we'd be fairly incompetent but showed some form of fire, at least early on in the year.  That seemed to just leave the building at half time of the Eagles game and I haven't seen much since then.  I think that's what makes this team seem so bad.  I think there is some talent.  I know we often over value our own, but still I think there is some form of talent.  But mentality? Doesn't seem to be there. 

 

I thought this team would go 5-11.  Having a rough starting schedule was going to doom us.  Without any fight there's no way we're getting to 5 wins.

[justice98]

After 4 weeks:

 

Offense

Points = 28th

Yards = 28th

Passing = 16th

Rushing = 30th

3rd down% = 29th

Giveaways = 28th

Yards per play = 27th

Penalties = 30th

1st downs = 31st

 

Defense = 28th

Points = 31st

Yards = 28th

Passing = 19th

Rushing = 29th

3rd down% = 32nd

Takeaways = 18th

Sacks = 29th

QB hits = 30th

Yards per play = 24th

Penalties = 11th

 

Point differential = 30th

Yard differential = 30th

 

By the numbers, this team is tough to beat.  However, I cant imagine that 2000 Marty team that was 0-5 was not worse than this at the same point.  They didnt stay that way, but we cant forget how truly awful they were through the first 5.

[Warhead36]

The difference between this year and 2001 is that Marty was purging vets and trying to create a winning culture for the future, and it worked out with the 8-3 finish.

 

We're actually trying to win now and still sucking. Its sad.

[jbird2]

39 minutes ago, justice98 said:

After 4 weeks:

 

Offense

Points = 28th

Yards = 28th

Passing = 16th

Rushing = 30th

3rd down% = 29th

Giveaways = 28th

Yards per play = 27th

Penalties = 30th

1st downs = 31st

 

Defense = 28th

Points = 31st

Yards = 28th

Passing = 19th

Rushing = 29th

3rd down% = 32nd

Takeaways = 18th

Sacks = 29th

QB hits = 30th

Yards per play = 24th

Penalties = 11th

 

Point differential = 30th

Yard differential = 30th

 

By the numbers, this team is tough to beat.  However, I cant imagine that 2000 Marty team that was 0-5 was not worse than this at the same point.  They didnt stay that way, but we cant forget how truly awful they were through the first 5.

What is astounding is that we are middle of the pack in terms of passing offense.

 

If there is 1 thing you don't want to change on this team, it is the Passing game..... .... and yet it is the one area where we have a big change coming that is going to wind up making us worse in the short run.

 

It appears clear the the biggest issues facing this team are Rushing offense, and Rushing D. As well as defending the QUarterback and pass.

 

We need to run the ball and we need to sack their QB. That is our starting point for change.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I think everyone is underselling how bad that 0-5 start under Marty seemed while it was happening. That story has changed based on how the team finished. But I was there, and everyone thought the world was coming to an end.

 

That 3-13 Shanahan year felt like it at least had a point to it. It didn't, but it felt like it at the time.

 

The second Zorn season was brutal. That's my pick for worst season of the Snyder Era.

 

Having said that, that team started 2-2 and was in a lot of close games.

 

This team has not really been competitive in a game since the first half of the first game.

 

I feel like all questions will be answered after Miami. That game will reveal if we are looking at something historically bad here.

 

 

[KDawg]

This can't be the worst team...

 

Belichick is praising our three quarterbacks.

 

See? Deceitful Bill thinks we're solid.

[Veryoldschool]

The worse Redskins team in the last 20 years?  Gee I dunno that is a really extreme standard to meet because the Skins have a few real stinkers.  I'm not ready to hand the futility trophy to the 2019 Skins just yet, I need to see more ineptitude first.  Certainly they are contending for the title versus such recent treasures like the "all in for week one" 2013 & "Gruden can fix him" 2014 teams.  I think 2019 is a bad team for sure now that we've seen how putrid the defense is removing any hope of a .500 level season, but  2013 or 2014 butt ugliness will have to be established, I'm not there yet.  Haskins may show us something in the coming weeks, let's hope.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

This can't be the worst team...

 

Belichick is praising our three quarterbacks.

 

See? Deceitful Bill thinks we're solid.

 

That ____house run the score up on a great man in Coach Gibbs to the tune of 52 points. 

 

I shudder to think what he'll do to an amateur hour clown like Gruden Sunday. 

 

Hail. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

22 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

The worse Redskins team in the last 20 years?  Gee I dunno that is a really extreme standard to meet because the Skins have a few real stinkers.  I'm not ready to hand the futility trophy to the 2019 Skins just yet, I need to see more ineptitude first.  Certainly they are contending for the title versus such recent treasures like the "all in for week one" 2013 & "Gruden can fix him" 2014 teams.  I think 2019 is a bad team for sure now that we've seen how putrid the defense is removing any hope of a .500 level season, but  2013 or 2014 butt ugliness will have to be established, I'm not there yet.  Haskins may show us something in the coming weeks, let's hope.

2

 

2019 Redskins- 

 

 

Hail. 

 

 

[SkinsFTW]

3 hours ago, justice98 said:

After 4 weeks:

 

Offense

Points = 28th

Yards = 28th

Passing = 16th

Rushing = 30th

3rd down% = 29th

Giveaways = 28th

Yards per play = 27th

Penalties = 30th

1st downs = 31st

 

Defense = 28th

Points = 31st

Yards = 28th

Passing = 19th

Rushing = 29th

3rd down% = 32nd

Takeaways = 18th

Sacks = 29th

QB hits = 30th

Yards per play = 24th

Penalties = 11th

 

Point differential = 30th

Yard differential = 30th

 

 

 

But if we had  Alex Smith we'd be so close!!!

 

Close to mediocre.

[Veryoldschool]

On 10/1/2019 at 2:09 PM, SkinsFTW said:

 

But if we had  Alex Smith we'd be so close!!!

 

Close to mediocre.

 

A butt ugly team aspires to build up and become mediocre.  Fans here throw out the word mediocre with contempt when if they knew better they would understand that achieving mediocrity should be a short/medium-term goal for this putrid team.  You can't go from Loserville to Championship City without passing through Mediocre.  You may not want to reside there for decades but it is much better to be ensconced in Mediocre than broke down and in the ditch in Loserville. 

 

I'd love to have Alex Smith leading this team to a .500 or better season this year, are you kidding that would be fun, much better than this mess.

[justice98]

5 hours ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

I think everyone is underselling how bad that 0-5 start under Marty seemed while it was happening. That story has changed based on how the team finished. But I was there, and everyone thought the world was coming to an end.

 

 

Folks recall that first half we had against the Eagles where we looked like an adult football team for 30 minutes.  That Marty team didnt even have one of those.  lol

 

That team was -110 point differential through 4 weeks, this team is only -52.

[SkinsFTW]

Screw mediocre.

 

If mediocre is your Superbowl, which it apparently is, then why didn't our clown keep Marty Schottenheimer 20 years ago since he was proven to actually be a notch above mediocre everywhere he went.

 

If mediocre is the goal then they need to go out and get Marvin Lewis asap. Keep him around for a decade+ like the Bungles did. We'd go 6-10 to 10-6 every year just like we have been the past several years with 0 hope of actually winning anything.

3 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

Folks recall that first half we had against the Eagles where we looked like an adult football team for 30 minutes.  That Marty team didnt even have one of those.  lol

 

That team was -110 point differential through 4 weeks, this team is only -52.

 

That team got over the butthurt and ended up winning 8 games.

 

This one is probably going to do what Spurriers team did the last year he was here. It's going to be pretty funny. Doofus Dan still won't replace his puppet because the fans will likely be content with another sacrificed HC.

[Mooka]

Read it somewhere on this board but I definitely agree that the last year of (insert coach besides Joe Gibbs) is the worst team. 

 

2003, 2009, 2013 and now 2019 are all equally bad. 

 

Another super awesome trend to look forward too, these are the drafts after our worst seasons:  

 

2004 draft - 1 3 5 6

2010 draft - 1 4 6 7 7 7

2014 draft - 2 3 3 4 5 6 7 7

2020 draft - 1 3 4 5 7 7  (so far) 

 

Assembling our worst teams cost us potentially our best draft picks. Not a single 1-3 or 1-7 draft directly following our worst records. Franchise can't even lose correctly.