The Skins Can't Win With These Coaches

[skinzplay]

5 minutes ago, Llevron said:

 

The problem with dudes like this and I assume Terry is that the reason they are so good is the mindset. And that same mindset will make them leave the Redskins cause they wanna win. 

 

Exactly. They won't resign with us unless there is a different attitude/mindset instilled by the HC. It's not gonna change with the current one, that's abundantly clear; has been for a while. I don't want to see this young, hungry talent wasted by this coaching staff. We haven't been this loaded with talented youth in a long time. Leaving them to Gruden and Manusky is professional sports malpractice.

[RandyHolt]

The game plan was pathetic.  It starts with the lines and our biggest problems were on full display last night.

 

The Bears DL looked innovative. Stunting Mack time and time again, and then stunting others. Moving Mack all around. Kerrigan meanwhile creates trenches in the field by rushing in the exact same lane over and over.  Why doesn't the NFL track unblocked blitzers, or stun success rates??? We got killed. It's a damn shame our OL has to practice against our vanilla DL over and over, otherwise they would be better prepared for a dynamic aggressive front like we saw last night.  So Jay sees his OL getting abused on basically every single pass, yet Case is still standing there.  It appears Jay has his QBs read deep to short and Case's next contract will pay for it.  I wanted a screen to CT or SW try to catch the Bears overly aggressive. We finally call one to AP, but it was ugly.

 

On defense, the world can see how our OL is getting abused, yet we don't even try any of those same things for our DL.  The one time we had deception presnap, showed 5, moved up a 6th, backed the 5th guy back, we got a stop. Never any deception post snap. Meanwhile, BS gives up a sack when a LB stops to look downfield for a moment. 

 

How embarrassing was our line play, and its 100% coaching.

 

Callahan is horrible, and obviously so is Tomsula. If he wants to be tied to Manusky's fate, perfect, it will make it easier to see positive change one of these years.

[Burgold]

8 minutes ago, Simmsy said:

Gruden is defending Keenum by saying it's his first time in the system. What does that have to do with not throwing balls directly into dirt or into the other team's hands?

The defense of Keenum is twofold:

 

1) Every QB has days like this. Even Tom Brady has had five interception days especially when under constant pass rush pressure.

2) Play calling failed him. When it is clear the pass pro can't hold up... stop calling so many long developing plays that force the QB to throw to early, get smashed, etc. They changed this up finally in the second half, but Gruden's play calling left a lot to be desired in the first half. Also, if you quarterback is being destroyed and your running game is doing okay... maybe use your HOF running back a bit more in the first half... or heck, maybe even use play action once in a while.

[Panninho]

2 hours ago, skinzplay said:

From Keim:  Redskins defensive end Jonathan Allen said while he sees talent on the roster, that doesn't mean a whole lot. "You can look at the worst team in the NFL. Every team has talent," he said. "That means absolutely s - - -. You don't win games with talent. Simple as that."

 

It's not hard to read between the lines there.

 

"I think the most important thing is we have to have some continuity. You know, I can't be changing people every five minutes here." Seems to apply for the DC as well.

[Bonez3]

The Redskins are at a historic low. This team is abysmal. I don't how how any football fan can watch them play if they're not a fan, I can barely stomach it anymore. The NFL should sue Snyder for this product. 

 

With that said, the entire coaching staff has to go this week or the bye week. It's pathetic.

 

* Last night it was the defense that was the greatest disappointment (hard to imagine something worse than the O, I know). 

 

* They routinely rushed 5 with no pressure at all. Very little to no scheme. Basically it was 'beat the man infant of you', they didn't.

 

* If you're gonna do 5 man rushes, you should have gambled with a tighter DB coverage (man/zone). The Bears really don't have a lot of weapons despite their thrashing of us last night. The soft zone and lack of pressure was utterly embarrassing. Trubisky had wide open WRs 3 and 4 yards past the sticks on multiple 3rd downs. Simply inexcusable and pathetic. It has been this way and Manusky should be fired today.

 

* The offense needs to re-evaluate its approach. As stated, if you can't get deep drops because of pressure on almost every snap, than start timing up quick throws and screens. Quinn and CT should have had a combined 20 catches.

 

* Use talent where we have it and don't force it to where we don't. For me CT is not a '3rd down back'. That is pigeon holing him. He should be incorporated on 1st down and in slots and screens. rest him on 3rd down. I'm tired of seeing him get 13 yards for better punting position. He is the best offensive player we had and should have been used on 1st and 2nd down (AND NOT ON THE GOAL LINE, WAY TO GO JAY), sharing series. Stop throwing to Sprinkle, period. 

 

* People say establish the run, and to his own fault Jay tires. Stop, the line sucks... ALOT

 

The Cle/RAMS game the night before showed how a team can get creative on defense and adjust on offense. Clearly had a clever approach to a Rams offense that was far more talented, and they did a good job for most -part. The Redskins last night ran the same damn 3 down, 2 outside rush with a soft zone. I can't recall one time where I saw a play on D drawn up where I was impressed. The Rams adjusted their running strategy to Cle's clever D and it was cool to watch because it worked and setup the pass. How football should be played. Our coaches are pedestrian and that won't get it done.

 

This team is at a historic low IMO and needs to move on this coaching staff today. 

[RandyHolt]

I have to admire the stubbornness of whoever permanently instilled our vanilla rush scheme on D.   Admire them, for obviously trying to get fired and get out of our dysfunctional organization.  Bruce is literally too stupid to push them out the open door.  Our DL likely never blows an assignment at least, because they just engage the blocker in front of them on every single play.

 

The Bears whiffed on a late 3rd down to finish 8 for 13 on 3rd downs, likely hurting our chances at the NFL all time futility record for 3rd down conversions through 3 games. Too bad, as futility records may be the only thing that may trigger change. 

 

I predicted Trubinksy would go 23 for 29 (thinking he would get yanked in a blowout).  He was 25 for 31 so I was damn close. 

 

Thru 3 games opposition QBs are 79 for 100 79% for 813 yards and 9 TDs. I am afraid to look at rushing stats.

 

Our soft predictable D front is actually inflating QB salaries league wide.  That is a great angle for a beatnik reporter to get a laugh out of Jay, and get him to spill the beans on who is in love with a 1970's approach to defensive line play. Meanwhile the Bears DL looked like it was from the future, and ran circles around us.

 

 

[skinzplay]

7 minutes ago, Panninho said:

 

"I think the most important thing is we have to have some continuity. You know, I can't be changing people every five minutes here." Seems to apply for the DC as well.

 

Yep, and it all goes back to decision-making, both on Gruden's part and on the part of the team president, who does hamstring him in some ways by limiting what he's able to do in terms of firing people. But he's the one who opted for Barry instead of Wade. And he's the one who was so utterly unprofessional by not only waiting late in the game to talk to Wade, but by giving him what was an insulting, sophomoric interview........something like a hungover college student would conduct. Gruden is just a horrible decision-maker, and you can't have that kind of person leading your team.

[Tuck28]

7 hours ago, Xameil said:

The only way tonight has any silver lining is that I wake up in the morning to hear that Gruden is no longer the coach and manusky is out as well..

 

Totally agree.

[RandyHolt]

I am no expert but would swear the game plan early was to ft. Jeremy Sprinkle. It went better than expected, for he is a young raw neither hands nor blocking TE.

 

But then we had him lining up to block Mack, and he blocked no one, and Mack ran right by him. If he isn't going to wow with skills, he cannot blow assignments as well.

 

Amazingly, Sprinkle is the least of our problems.  We cannot pile on him for being JAG.  It's the game plan.  WR quickly became the depth of our team and think we can just go ahead and not use a TE for a few games. Get Vernon in the game in obvious passing downs.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

58 minutes ago, skinzplay said:

Exactly. They won't resign with us unless there is a different attitude/mindset instilled by the HC. It's not gonna change with the current one, that's abundantly clear; has been for a while. I don't want to see this young, hungry talent wasted by this coaching staff. We haven't been this loaded with talented youth in a long time. Leaving them to Gruden and Manusky is professional sports malpractice.

And who exactly is going to work with the coaching staff at building a roster to fit what they are trying to do? to find great scheme fits? to know when and who to re-sign? when and who to trade? how to get value back in trade? how to effectively work with players and agents and build trust? to implement a culture change from the top and empower the head coach to carry it through? 

[skinzplay]

I want the current team president gone as badly as everyone else. Short of new ownership (which is the longest of long shots), that's the highest hope we can reach for.

[megared]

13 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

I am no expert but would swear the game plan early was to ft. Jeremy Sprinkle. It went better than expected, for he is a young raw neither hands nor blocking TE.

 

But then we had him lining up to block Mack, and he blocked no one, and Mack ran right by him. If he isn't going to wow with skills, he cannot blow assignments as well.

 

I can't think of any TEs that could reliably block him 1:1;  if our gameplan hinged on our #3 TE being able to contain Mack, we deserved to lose.  

[RandyHolt]

4 minutes ago, megared said:

 

I can't think of any TEs that could reliably block him 1:1;  if our gameplan hinged on our #3 TE being able to contain Mack, we deserved to lose.  

 

Maybe it was supposed to be 2 TEs on Mack. Still a disastrous plan.   The way Vernon Davis ran over there from the other side of the formation, maybe it was a trap block (flashing back to Terps late 80s) and Case was supposed to step up.  Or, Vernon was looking out of the kid, and hustled over to try to save Case. 

[TradeTheBeal!]

11 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

 

Maybe it was supposed to be 2 TEs on Mack. Still a disastrous plan.   The way Vernon Davis ran over there from the other side of the formation, maybe it was a trap block (flashing back to Terps late 80s) and Case was supposed to step up.  Or, Vernon was looking out of the kid, and hustled over to try to save Case. 

 

I think Vernon was supposed to go into the pattern and broke it off to try and block Mack.

 

At any rate...poor scheme with worse execution.  Which is a Jay Gruden hallmark, at this point.

[justice98]

19 minutes ago, megared said:

 

I can't think of any TEs that could reliably block him 1:1;  if our gameplan hinged on our #3 TE being able to contain Mack, we deserved to lose.  

 

But our gameplan seemed to involve nobody blocking him. He seemed to be running around with no resistance just looking for ballcarriers to kill.

[RandyHolt]

9 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

 

I think Vernon was supposed to go into the pattern and broke it off to try and block Mack.

 

At any rate...poor scheme with worse execution.  Which is a Jay Gruden hallmark, at this point.

 

Yeah unfortunately the handling of Mack last night showed that there is problem. It's like we had no plan for him. If there was one, it was the worst possible plan.  Hey if he beats a OT/Chip, I can live that. But unblocked on 2 consecutive pass plays is mind boggling. Yep the next play he stunted and shot down the A untouched.  We'd have been better served to have every OL try to block him and hey what happens happens, but he is not going to beat us.

 

I like the chicago stunt. It has a slight delay to it, to let the blockers get fully distracted. And Chicago is also smart, and stunts with their fastest rushers. If we do ever try a stunt ourselves, rest assured it will be our slowest guy motorin' in late, late sometime in 2020.

[ntotoro]

11 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

 

I think Vernon was supposed to go into the pattern and broke it off to try and block Mack.

 

At any rate...poor scheme with worse execution.  Which is a Jay Gruden hallmark, at this point.

That was exactly my thought. The look of the play was that no one was there to block Mack and Vernon was left saying “Oh, ****... “ and had to break his route before it even began.

 

That Jay went the entire first half without doubling Mack was inexcusable. This guy was that good even at UB.

[megared]

3 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

I like the chicago stunt. It has a slight delay to it, to let the blockers get fully distracted. And Chicago is also smart, and stunts with their fastest rushers. If we do ever try a stunt ourselves, rest assured it will be our slowest guy motorin' in late, late sometime in 2020.

 

I loved the play Trevathan made to get the sack against Scherff. 

 

 

 

Even though they knew they could beat us straight up, you could tell they were prepared to exploit things they saw on film.

[Introspect]

I am a Colts fan living in the DMV. Your coaches are BAD. Nobody blocking Mack multiple times thus allowing free runs at your QB. Of course Keenum is going to play badly when faced with that monster coming. I feel sorry for your fanbase. This team was the epitome of excellence in the 80's and early 90's. This team has an owner that just wants that money. He claims he is a fan but .... I don't know.

[kingdaddy]

When does Dan Snyder speak to the fans? Here in Philly when things get rocky the owner will address the media and be accountable. When does Dan Snyder stand up and take responsibility for the pathetic organization he leads? 

[RandyHolt]

7 minutes ago, megared said:

 

I loved the play Trevathan made to get the sack against Scherff. 

 

 

 

Even though they knew they could beat us straight up, you could tell they were prepared to exploit things they saw on film.

 

That was one of those close to rock bottom moments for our franchise. Our best OL, just offered a big fat contract extension, Monday night big stage - it's so us. We often hear its a copy cat league. Someone needs to tell Manusky and Tomsula. If they don't consider adopting the simple things that abuse our best OL, they will never change.

 

And insult to injury or vice versa

 

 

[TradeTheBeal!]

6 minutes ago, ntotoro said:

That was exactly my thought. The look of the play was that no one was there to block Mack and Vernon was left saying “Oh, ****... “ and had to break his route before it even began.

 

That Jay went the entire first half without doubling Mack was inexcusable. This guy was that good even at UB.

 

Jay spent the entire week constructing a gameplan that didn’t account for Khalil Mack.

 

Theres really no other way to put it.

[RandyHolt]

3 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

 

Jay spent the entire week constructing a gameplan that didn’t account for Khalil Mack.

 

Theres really no other way to put it.

 

Maybe it's a thing of the past, but instead of just blind running up the gut, what about running it right at Mack?  I remember teams would try to run at Dexter Manley and when he would get a stop he would be frothing at the mouth with pride.

 

Our run game is pathetic and I am sure the idea of running it straight at their best pass rusher was not tried.

[justice98]

Now, in aggregate, I don't think we have a coaching staff full of bad coaches.  I think our position coaches are mostly respected guys in those roles.   

 

Manusky is overmatched at DC, and Gruden need not be the head coach.  But I almost dont even blame Manusky.  He shouldnt have been hired in the first place.  He wasnt close to the best candidate available, as I remember.  I really wanted Pettine, who's coaching a pretty good defense in GB with our boy Preston.  

 

And then, Manusky didnt retain himself this past offseason.  He is a known quantity as the DC here.  They knew he wasnt good which is why the tried to replace him.  As Doc would say, it's now on the people that keep putting him out there.

[boobiemiles]

We can not win with this owner, and the Redskins are in the wrong division.