WilberMarshall Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 My family are the biggest beneficiaries of the Skins inept play. I get to be more involved on Sundays from this point forward. They can go ahead and schedule things for me to do Sunday afternoons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 3 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said: Jay didn't do anything really objectionable this game. He mis-managed the clock at the end of the first half, but that's kidnof expected at this point. Manusky just has to go. Like tonight. The defense might not be loaded, but they are under-performing their talent. Jay can not be looked at separate from the rest of the team. He's the Damned Head Coach. The buck stops with him. If we see the same damn passive three or four man rush with no coverage lead to the same routs second half after second half and he shrugs and doesn't intercede it's on him too. Gruden is full of stink. He got very cute with the run in the first half. Never really ran and probably couldn't run in the second half. Still, the cuteness almost felt like an attempt not to use Peterson and Peterson was out of the line up A LOT, including on 2nd or 3rd and short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 2 minutes ago, Burgold said: Jay can not be looked at separate from the rest of the team. He's the Damned Head Coach. The buck stops with him. If we see the same damn passive three or four man rush with no coverage lead to the same routs second half after second half and he shrugs and doesn't intercede it's on him too. Gruden is full of stink. He got very cute with the run in the first half. Never really ran and probably couldn't run in the second half. Still, the cuteness almost felt like an attempt not to use Peterson and Peterson was out of the line up A LOT, including on 2nd or 3rd and short. (This comment not directed at @burgoled) First, please let the record show that I didn't come in here calling for Jay's head and all that. Ok, you talked me into one objectionable thing. The fact he just can't seem to figure out how to get over himself and maximize the talents of one of his most talented players is extrodinarily off-putting. He prefers Guice because Guice runs out of the gun better. Ok, I get it. But AP is just BETTER at this point. And not figuring out how to use AP as a weapon is just mind numbingly arrogant and stubborn. And with Guice not available, Smallwoood got carries. Jay is who he is and wants to run his offense his way. He can scheme up a mean passing game. But his ability to adapt, either in-game or overall to players or situations is what makes him, at best, average. Manusky seems to spend more time working on his biceps than game planning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jhans76 Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 This narrative that people "LIKE" Jay is one of the worst arguments I've heard. Blaming the owner and front office? Yes they are horrid but this doesn't excuse him from doing his job, he is the head coach! Rod Marinelli can delegate play calling to a defensive assistant? But here we are with Jay the head coach, who cant delegate his offensive play calling. In leadership, the lack of delegating is a sign of a weak, insecure leader. Jay should spend less time play calling and managing the whole game. You put your guys in position to succeed and put your ego aside. Why not work on managing the whole game, maybe get your defensive coaches to adjust for a change. I want a head coach for this team not a drinking buddy. The lack of respect and discipline (penalties) is on Jay and it has been for ahwile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 Gruden will do fine as OC in Vegas. He probably can’t wait. Bruce won’t get fired. Danny won’t sell the team. Every coach has struggled under Snyder. It’s been over 20 years. Sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RawRebel Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 4 minutes ago, Hooper said: Gruden will do fine as OC in Vegas. He probably can’t wait. Bruce won’t get fired. Danny won’t sell the team. Every coach has struggled under Snyder. It’s been over 20 years. Sad. That's because we only get 3rd tier talent coaches to take the interview. Top tier coaches wont even meet with Synder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, RawRebel said: That's because we only get 3rd tier talent coaches to take the interview. Top tier coaches wont even meet with Synder. Yep. The only kind of coaches we can get are the kind of coaches who can’t demand the real changes the organization needs to make. Same goes for front office positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedBNG Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 24 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said: Jay didn't do anything really objectionable this game. He mis-managed the clock at the end of the first half, but that's kidnof expected at this point. Manusky just has to go. Like tonight. The defense might not be loaded, but they are under-performing their talent. Yeah, except for the number of penalties in the first half, Gruden gets a pass from me this week. I have no idea what Manusky is trying to accomplish with the secondary. There are times were the other teams are firing at will with no let up. You start to know at those points that the opposing teams are starting to click, and our D is beginning to retreat into shellshock mode. Oh well, for the last 2 weeks, no surprises. The question is... can this team beat the Bears and the Giants? I think we can, but if our D continues to let these teams come back, then I'm not so sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 Seemed like Gruden was jawing at Manusky on the sidelines today. Wonder what he was saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinzplay Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 I'll just repeat the thread title for emphasis: The Skins Can't Win with These Coaches. The HC has demonstrated time and again what his ceiling is. He's a play designer, not a team leader. Poor decision-making. Slow decision-making. Faulty adjustments (if any). We've seen this for way too many years now. I can him before the young talent on this team is further demoralized. Same goes for Manusky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Washington Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 It's been six years and still Gruden hasn't figured out how to get plays in on time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emsworth Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 But why wouldn't top tier coaches want a go at Washington? After seeing Danny stick by Jay through 6 seasons of utter mediocrity, surely the incentive is there, how many seasons might he give you if you got the team performing well? Mike and his .375 Zorn-matching winning percentage got four years. I'd understand if a coach came in for interview, explored what it'd mean in terms of working arrangements, asked for some things and got knocked back and so decided not to take it, but surely you'd want to have the conversation. No one really believes that Dan doesn't want to win, he just doesn't know how to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 18 minutes ago, RawRebel said: That's because we only get 3rd tier talent coaches to take the interview. Top tier coaches wont even meet with Synder. That’s a good narrative but actually not true. Marty is a borderline HoF coach, Shanahan was a borderline HOF coach and Gibbs is in the HOF. Dan can attract whoever he wants. The problem is more that Dan hires the wrong executives then trusts them for too long. Vinny then Bruce. 2 minutes ago, Emsworth said: But why wouldn't top tier coaches want a go at Washington? After seeing Danny stick by Jay through 6 seasons of utter mediocrity, surely the incentive is there, how many seasons might he give you if you got the team performing well? Mike and his .375 Zorn-matching winning percentage got four years. I'd understand if a coach came in for interview, explored what it's mean in terms of working arrangements, asked for some things and got knocked back and so decided not to take it, but surely you'd want to have the conversation. No one really believes that Dan doesn't want to win, he just doesn't know how to. Actually, you could argue the Skins are going to have a pretty good situation going into a coaching search. They have a QB who looks like can be developed. They have pieces at skill positions like McLaurin, Harmon and Quinn. They have (completely misused) talent defensively. And they’ll have some cap room next year. The cupboard is not bare. A good coach could take this team and Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MassSkinsFan Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said: That’s a good narrative but actually not true. Marty is a borderline HoF coach, Shanahan was a borderline HOF coach and Gibbs is in the HOF. Dan can attract whoever he wants. The problem is more that Dan hires the wrong executives then trusts them for too long. Vinny then Bruce. I agree with this 100%. We have acquired a few outstanding HCs under Snyder. But they’ve been hamstrung by inept FO. That said, the current coaching staff is putrid. They don’t innovate, inspire or adjust. They tend to double-down in the face of failure. It it makes me ill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 17 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said: That’s a good narrative but actually not true. Marty is a borderline HoF coach, Shanahan was a borderline HOF coach and Gibbs is in the HOF. Dan can attract whoever he wants. The problem is more that Dan hires the wrong executives then trusts them for too long. Vinny then Bruce. He has never installed the traditional GM structure. You know, hire a GM, and let him pick the coach. Cerrato was his lackey. He gave Schotty full control because he couldn’t get him otherwise. Then he fired him after one year because Schotty wouldn’t let him influence football decisions period. Spurrier said he would only take the job if Snyder got him a good GM. Snyder promised he would... and then brought back Cerrato. Gibbs was fine with Cerrato for whatever reason. Probably had something to do with him being out of football forever. Zorn... everything about his hiring and tenure was a joke. Shanny had full control. Snyder won’t give an unproven FO talent the power and freedom he’ll need to succeed, and the proven ones will always have better options. Both Cerrato and Bruce Allen were done in the NFL when Danny came calling. It’s the kind of employee he prefers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randyjohnson Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 I usually try to be patient rational but fire everyone! Team seems unprepared, uninspired unorganized, they don’t seem to care. It’s the same week after week, penalties, sloppily tackling, run the play clock down. I still feel if you don’t fire Bruce nothing will change! I can’t stand watching this team, every game is an away game for this team! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 24 minutes ago, NoCalMike said: Seemed like Gruden was jawing at Manusky on the sidelines today. Wonder what he was saying. Why are you a **** coach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 33 minutes ago, Emsworth said: But why wouldn't top tier coaches want a go at Washington? After seeing Danny stick by Jay through 6 seasons of utter mediocrity, surely the incentive is there, how many seasons might he give you if you got the team performing well? Guys are not going to be impressed by longevity. Their contracts are guaranteed, if the owner fires them before the contract is up, they still get paid. Coaches want an opportunity to win. 2 decades in, and Dan still hasn’t created an environment conducive to doing that. Sure, there will always be somebody that talks themselves into thinking they will be the one to turn the tide. But having a Bruce Allen led FO with at minimum, the perception that they are a mess, is not a selling point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Sure, there will always be somebody that talks themselves into thinking they will be the one to turn the tide. But having a Bruce Allen led FO with at minimum, the perception that they are a mess, is not a selling point. If it’s an outside hire, I could see them asking for and receiving personnel control. Danny have 3 coaches with big reputations full control. Marty, Gibbs and Shanahan. If he was to attract a big name coach (and honestly I’m not even sure who that is) I could see him taking personnel from Bruce and giving it to new coach. Remember, Bruce was hired and did not have final roster authority. He got that only after Shanahan was fired. Its not terribly likely, but it’s possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 6 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said: If it’s an outside hire, I could see them asking for and receiving personnel control. Danny have 3 coaches with big reputations full control. Marty, Gibbs and Shanahan. If he was to attract a big name coach (and honestly I’m not even sure who that is) I could see him taking personnel from Bruce and giving it to new coach. Remember, Bruce was hired and did not have final roster authority. He got that only after Shanahan was fired. Its not terribly likely, but it’s possible. It’s also not a great way of doing things. Snyder needs to do the one thing he hasn’t tried. Have the league help him find good GM candidates. Hire one and let them pick the coach. Get out of the way. It it will probably fail — everything under Snyder does — but why not try what most franchises do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSSkinz Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 We can ride it out and have a top 5 draft pick or fire Jay and Manusky and put one of the assistants in charge for the rest of the year. Personally I've seen enough of Jay, I do think he's a good offensive mind but I can't defend him as a good leader of men, it's impossible. I think a change would be good, why would we expect this to get better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CjSuAvE22 Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 The dumbest thing was not hiring Andy Reid i was so happy when philly let him go and then we hired jay gruden... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 1 minute ago, Hooper said: It’s also not a great way of doing things. Snyder needs to do the one thing he hasn’t tried. Have the league help him find good GM candidates. Hire one and let them pick the coach. Get out of the way. It it will probably fail — everything under Snyder does — but why not try what most franchises do? Actually, that’s false also. Bruce is the President/GM and he hired Jay. You can dispute whether Bruce is the right guy, but we actually have the most traditional setup right now. The issue is Bruce is an idiot, and he hired a “meh” coach. He also let Vinny hire Zorn. So he’s actually done it twice. But the setup is actually traditional. The problem is not the structure. It’s the people in the structure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeJacobyHOForRIOT Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 You could bring in the ghost of Vince Lombardi or Joe Gibbs from the 80's , won't make any difference, There is toxic culture under Dan Snyder that is larger and goes beyond the X's & O's of the game. It starts in the locker room and on the practice field. Better to just laugh and take the season with little to no expectations instead of becoming a emotional train wreck of hysteria like some 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 Just now, CjSuAvE22 said: The dumbest thing was not hiring Andy Reid i was so happy when philly let him go and then we hired jay gruden... Was that really the same year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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