Owls0325

New development: Trent Williams wants to be traded/released

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, carex said:

 

there really are not four ways this can end.  Either 1 and 2 cover the 4th he comes up with or vice versa.  Either they wotk it out or he leaves the team

 

The more I listen to narratives about this -- the more it seems like money and not the medical staff stuff is primarily driving this.  but it sounds like what makes it tough for the beat guys to know for sure is they are only getting the team's side of events and Trent and his agent aren't talking on or off the record about it right now.

 

As some have said it could end up being a simple game of chicken where Trent either shows up to play or he doesn't to honor his current contract -- most are guessing he would honor his contract considering there is a lot of money at stake. 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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Posted (edited)

Trent will be there on opening day.  It may not all be about money, but it will be solved with money.  He doesn't want or need to bust it in Spring Training.  Pay him, let him rest and recuperate and he has no excuse but to show out during the regular season. 

Edited by evmiii
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On 6/18/2019 at 11:28 AM, Skinsinparadise said:

 

The more I listen to narratives about this -- the more it seems like money and not the medical staff stuff is primarily driving this.  but it sounds like what makes it tough for the beat guys to know for sure is they are only getting the team's side of events and Trent and his agent aren't talking on or off the record about it right now.

 

As some have said it could end up being a simple game of chicken where Trent either shows up to play or he doesn't to honor his current contract -- most are guessing he would honor his contract considering there is a lot of money at stake. 

 

If Trent’s side talks without a deal, then situation is most likely in trouble. Hope first time we hear is to confirm an extension. 

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17 minutes ago, wit33 said:

 

If Trent’s side talks without a deal, then situation is most likely in trouble. Hope first time we hear is to confirm an extension. 

 

Who knows.  But my guess is even if the Redskins don't oblige to what Trent wants -- he ends up playing anyway.   It's one thing to miss minicamp.  It's another to miss a weekly paycheck of almost a million dollars.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Who knows.  But my guess is even if the Redskins don't oblige to what Trent wants -- he ends up playing anyway.   It's one thing to miss minicamp.  It's another to miss a weekly paycheck of almost a million dollars.

 

Yeah in general Trent has leverage right now but if the Skins play hardball and call him on it and say "ok, sit out then" I doubt that Trent will since he doesn't get much guaranteed this year. But I think that would be a last resort as it would destroy any possibility of repairing the relationship. Trent isn't top 3 anymore IMO but he's still an excellent Tackle. Problem is he just can't stay healthy. 

Edited by mistertim
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1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 Problem is he just can't stay healthy. 

Hard to stay healthy when you are constantly gutting it out and playing when you probably shouldn’t.  

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2 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

Yeah in general Trent has leverage right now but if the Skins play hardball and call him on it and say "ok, sit out then" I doubt that Trent will since he doesn't get much guaranteed this year. But I think that would be a last resort as it would destroy any possibility of repairing the relationship. Trent isn't top 3 anymore IMO but he's still an excellent Tackle. Problem is he just can't stay healthy. 

 

This appears to be a shared thought by a fair amount of people; why is he not considered top 3? Who’s in the top 3? Is it based solely on injuries? 

 

Im 100% on side keeping Trent into mid 30s, but open to arguments or video that shows Trent not moving at an elite level for his position. I watch zero film, but do isolate and watch Trent individually consistently, and replays of commentators going nuts about his ability. 

 

Not coming at ya with any crazy energy, just want to engage and hear what your thoughts are. 

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This guy is hopefully a redskin for life.  Even if he’s not a top 3, he has to be a top 5 LT in this league.  Anybody remember when Chris Samuels retired and before we got Trent?  Yeah that wasn’t fun.  Not trying to go through that again, especially with a rookie QB potential starting or taking over at some point this season.

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1 hour ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Hard to stay healthy when you are constantly gutting it out and playing when you probably shouldn’t.  

 

What does this even mean. So it's hard to be healthy when your playing hurt all the time? 

 

Either way he is hurt. 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, desertbeagle85 said:

 

What does this even mean. So it's hard to be healthy when your playing hurt all the time? 

 

Either way he is hurt. 

He plays hurt when he probably shouldn’t.  Only makes things worse.  Hurt Trent is always better than the guy behind him.  

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47 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

He plays hurt when he probably shouldn’t.  Only makes things worse.  Hurt Trent is always better than the guy behind him.  

 

To be fair half the league plays hurt. Peterson was hurt all last year. That's the NFL for you. 

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

He plays hurt when he probably shouldn’t.  Only makes things worse.  Hurt Trent is always better than the guy behind him.  

 

I dunno. There actually wasn't a that much of a drop off between banged up Trent and healthy Ty. I'm still annoyed that we let him go. He was a really good backup. 

Edited by mistertim
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1 hour ago, chaaarmndr said:

This guy is hopefully a redskin for life.  Even if he’s not a top 3, he has to be a top 5 LT in this league.  Anybody remember when Chris Samuels retired and before we got Trent?  Yeah that wasn’t fun.  Not trying to go through that again, especially with a rookie QB potential starting or taking over at some point this season.

 

I hope he plays this year and we draft his replacement in the 1st Rd next year. He's not worth the money he's going to want on his next contract. To old and can't stay healthy. Great player and great Redskin. If he doesn't retire here I could careless. I don't get attached to players anymore. We need a young and cheaper  LT. 

 

 

1 minute ago, mistertim said:

 

I dunno. There actually wasn't a that much of a drop off between banged up Trent and healthy Ty. I'm still annoyed that we let him go. He was a really good backup. 

 

Agreed and that's why the Skins shouldn't extend Trent. 

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10 hours ago, desertbeagle85 said:

 

I hope he plays this year and we draft his replacement in the 1st Rd next year. He's not worth the money he's going to want on his next contract. To old and can't stay healthy. Great player and great Redskin. If he doesn't retire here I could careless. I don't get attached to players anymore. We need a young and cheaper  LT. 

 

 

 

Agreed and that's why the Skins shouldn't extend Trent. 

 

What equates to being “worth the money” in your view? 

 

It seems OL are difficult for fans (including myself) to assign value, as not many stats exist or impact plays that resonate in our mind as contributing to a win. 

 

For example, if it was shown Williams impact is that of Gronkowski or Edelman (both with consistent injury histories like Trent, but elite at their position) at the Oline position would his value be different in the fans view? Or AJ Green, 

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

I dunno. There actually wasn't a that much of a drop off between banged up Trent and healthy Ty. I'm still annoyed that we let him go. He was a really good backup. 

 

He wanted to be a starter and that was not happening here. Both sides knew it so they amicably parted ways. He got $5M/yr which puts him in starting salary range - I believe he is the 22nd highest paid LT. With 32 teams, that makes it starting money. 

 

With Alex's contract the team cannot afford that luxury to pay starter money to a back-up. So it was the economics of football that made it so they had to let him go. 

Edited by goskins10
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3 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

What equates to being “worth the money” in your view? 

 

It seems OL are difficult for fans (including myself) to assign value, as not many stats exist or impact plays that resonate in our mind as contributing to a win. 

 

For example, if it was shown Williams impact is that of Gronkowski or Edelman (both with consistent injury histories like Trent, but elite at their position) at the Oline position would his value be different in the fans view? Or AJ Green, 

 

Health and age

 

Not worth a extension at his age. He already gets hurt a lot do you think that will change with age. 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

I dunno. There actually wasn't a that much of a drop off between banged up Trent and healthy Ty. I'm still annoyed that we let him go. He was a really good backup. 

Sometimes Healthy Ty was needed elsewhere on the line.  Healthy Ty is no longer here, which is even more reason for Trent to play hurt.

Edited by BatteredFanSyndrome

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24 minutes ago, desertbeagle85 said:

 

Health and age

 

Not worth a extension at his age. He already gets hurt a lot do you think that will change with age. 

 

 

 

No extension is a bit too absolute. It depends on what he wants. Say what he wants is the next two years guaranteed and then the team wants to ad two more yrs not guaranteed to keep control of his rights then that would be fine. If he is looking for what amounts to the next 3 to 5 yrs guaranteed then I agree, Have to let him go. And by let him go, I mean call his bluff and see if he sits out for two yrs not playing and not getting paid. Or once he gets to camp try to trade him. Or try to trade him next off-season. 

 

The team has more leverage here than Trent. Long term they hold all the cards. He can make them sweat some this season maybe, but in the end all players can be and will be replaced.

 

Don't get me wrong, I am rooting for Trent to get what he wants. He deserves that. But it's a business. Both sides have to do what they believe to be in their best interest. 

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Apologize if this was already posted.

 

The Washington Post reports "some around the team" expect LT Trent Williams to report for training camp.

Williams demanded a trade earlier this month. He had a minor clean-up procedure last week but should be healthy enough to be ready for the start of camp. The Redskins have been unwilling to trade Williams to this point, and it sounds like there's hope the situation can be resolved. Williams has $14.7M cap hits the next two seasons.

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4 hours ago, desertbeagle85 said:

 

Health and age

 

Not worth a extension at his age. He already gets hurt a lot do you think that will change with age. 

 

 

 

He’s still in middle of his prime. If you agree  with logic that Olineman have longer primes than that of a Skill position. 

 

No way do I want to let a hall of fame guy go with prime years remaining. The health piece is undeniable though. So it comes down to wanting 12-14 games of elite play. 

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18 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

I dunno. There actually wasn't a that much of a drop off between banged up Trent and healthy Ty. I'm still annoyed that we let him go. He was a really good backup. 

He's 36 yr. old backup swing OT.  OT's last to early 30's historically.  Chris Samuels out at 31.  TW is 32.  Ty got overpaid at 36.  The Skins didn't foresee TW playing this card.  The reality is that TW is 1-2 yrs from retirement.  He's not played a full season since 2013.  He hasn't played more than 14 games since 2015.  Recent avg shows he'll miss +4 games this year.... Basically he's overpaid!!!

 

As a fan perspective, I don't care if he's trying to get some guaranteed money at the end of a contract where he's got no guarantees.  Give him some guarantees for injury enough that would be fair as long as you're not extending him because he's almost done and everyone know's it.  Nobody more than his agent and TW.  From a team sport perspective, he's basically screwing everyone on the roster and more specifically his Head Coach. 

 

If he demands a trade and you can't get at least a second rounder and OT in exchange, then tell him to play out his deal or retire.  If he retires, make him pay back the signing bonus he owes which is about $3.24M.  He's a fool to retire now, so he won't do that.  He want's some guarantees as he knows he's not going to get another contract.  Call his bluff with this BS.  Time for owners to stand up to holding players to the deal they made specifically in situations where the player has declining skills and can't stay on the field.

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3 hours ago, MEANDWARF said:

Apologize if this was already posted.

 

The Washington Post reports "some around the team" expect LT Trent Williams to report for training camp.

Williams demanded a trade earlier this month. He had a minor clean-up procedure last week but should be healthy enough to be ready for the start of camp. The Redskins have been unwilling to trade Williams to this point, and it sounds like there's hope the situation can be resolved. Williams has $14.7M cap hits the next two seasons.

He might not show up for training camp because they won't hold him to those fines if he shows up Week 1.  The issue comes into when he doesn't show up Week 1.  He's not going to do that unless he's committed to retirement.  Skins are not going to extend him.  Noway that's a good idea or makes any sense.  They might make him happy with some guarantees within the existing deal, but these are his last two seasons of value.  If he doesn't show up Week 1, the skins can put him on the naughty list and he'll miss a month of game checks!  The skins have plenty of leverage if they want to with a guy who is in the last two years of his career.  Like i said before, there's noway he's retiring because he'll have to write a check to the Skins for 3.24M to do so.  

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5 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

He’s still in middle of his prime. If you agree  with logic that Olineman have longer primes than that of a Skill position. 

 

No way do I want to let a hall of fame guy go with prime years remaining. The health piece is undeniable though. So it comes down to wanting 12-14 games of elite play. 

 

He'd still be within his prime in theory, if it weren't for his injury history. I think it's difficult to argue that a guy who hasn't been able to play a full season since 2013 is truly still in his playing prime, no matter what his age. When he's completely healthy he's probably still a top 3 OT. But he's almost never completely healthy so that's borderline moot. Yes, the dude is a warrior and plays through being hurt, but that doesn't change the fact that he gets hurt every year and that playing hurt drops his effectiveness.

 

I want to keep Trent on this team as much as anyone, but IMO he isn't worth a big new extension. Especially when he still has 2 years left on his current contract and the Skins hold the cards in the long term because most of his money over these next two seasons won't be guaranteed. If he decides to sit out, he doesn't get paid. 

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Posted (edited)
56 minutes ago, mistertim said:

If he decides to sit out, he doesn't get paid. 

That's the whole point and what people are missing about 'leverage'.  TW actually has no leverage, only perceived leverage as the narrative is that they're trying to win.  I call BS on that one!  They know they're not going to win now and are at least one draft year and another development year away from contending for anything.  Look OT's massively decline after 31 yrs of age.  They're prime is later 20's.  TW is past his prime 100%.  He will not be able to make the money up he'll lose if he plays this silly game.  He's doing everything he can right now to get some guaranteed money because the next injury he gets might be the last time he gets on the field.  I don't blame him but holding the entire organization and fan base hostage is garbage.  If he doesn't show up, then he'll lose money he'll never see again.  Actually he hurt his trade stock by going public.  Unless you can get a 2nd rounder and middling OT in a swap then he's gotta play out his deal or retire.  If he chooses unwisely to retire then he'll do so by writing a check for over 3M.  Odds of that happening are slim to none.

 

My opinion is you try to trade him.  Offer him up to NE and/or wait for a contending team to lose an OT.  Get a 2nd and get something for him now.

Edited by TheShredder
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