Malapropismic Depository Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 1 hour ago, dyst said: Patriots will trade us Maurice Harris back for Trent. It all makes sense now. Trent for Nsekhe straight up makes more sense. 25 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: Hey, isn't that "Steve" guy actually Rob Ryan's brother, IIRC ? If so, does Louis know that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghedrick Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 42 minutes ago, mistertim said: Problem is, with Trent's injury history you know that you're likely only getting between 10 and 14 games worth of that pro bowl talent. Is that still worth a 1st when you throw in being 31 as well? What good is the pro bowl talent if he won't be there for your playoff run?I don't know...it might still be worth a 1st, but it probably depends on how many teams are bidding. I feel he is worth it still.If we Traded our 1st the year we took Doctson and got an ageing star it would have helped us alot more than he has even if the ageing star only played 10 -14 games a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 26 minutes ago, HardcoreZorn said: What does this mean you think? I am pretty sure his key source with the Redskins is Doug based on other posts and TV segments he's done this year on ESPN. And Riddick also said today that trading Trent would be dumb (I disagree with him on that personally if they can get good value for him). So I am guessing Doug told him they don't intend to trade Trent. Just trying to piece everything I am reading together -- my thought is if they do intend to trade Trent I doubt they'd leak it to anyone. For 2 reasons: 1. You want to keep leverage in a trade so you want to act like a reluctant trading partner versus a team that's trying to unload a guy so you can get more value. 2. If you are leaking that you intend to trade Trent and there is still some intention to keep him if you don't get good value for him -- then wouldn't that potentially rub more salt in the wounds if he's open to coming back? Obviously I got no idea if they intend to trade him or not but if I were them and I was toying with trading him -- no way I'd leak it. I'd be especially close vested and if anything leak the opposite. If I took a stab at guessing what's going on by piecing narratives -- some of which granted are conflicting, I'd guess this: A. Their plan A is to keep Trent B. But if Trent wants more money, wants the training staff fired or whatever is driving him and they don't think it will work out -- then they'd try to trade him. C. They are still working on trying to assuage Trent so they aren't in give up mode on that front I think that would marry the conflicting reports about him being on the market versus not being on the market. Personally, I am relaxed about the outcome. He's a stud LT and a leader and if he stays -- great. And on the contrary, I still think this is a rebuilding team and the next draft looks insanely loaded at WR and LT so if they can acquire another first then I am good with rebooting at LT. WR is so stacked in the next draft and we are missing a 2nd rounder so everything being equal, I want one of the top guys like J. Jeudy, Lamb, Ruggs, etc. I'd rather not use that spot on a future LT where I'd have to skip WR early in this coming draft. But if you can pull off both positions in the same draft -- I'd love that. So I got no issue trading Trent if they get good value for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: Just trying to piece everything I am reading together -- my thought is if they do intend to trade Trent I doubt they'd leak it to anyone. For 2 reasons: 1. You want to keep leverage in a trade so you want to act like a reluctant trading partner versus a team that's trying to unload a guy so you can get more value. 2. If you are leaking that you intend to trade Trent and there is still some intention to keep him if you don't get good value for him -- then wouldn't that potentially rub more salt in the wounds if he's open to coming back? Well, the thread title says he asked for a trade. So of course, if that's accurate, he's not going to be bitter if we discuss trade options. Plus he's gotta have that basic understanding of the business, that it makes sense for a team to explore trade options for a holdout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
max21 Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 1 hour ago, dyst said: Patriots will trade us Maurice Harris back for Trent. It all makes sense now. This really made me Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 Another thing I've wondered about in the thread title, is Trent supposedly asking for his release, as one of the options. Surely he doesn't really believe that the team would just outright release him ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 12 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said: Well, the thread title says he asked for a trade. So of course, if that's accurate, he's not going to be bitter if we discuss trade options. Plus he's gotta have that basic understanding of the business, that it makes sense for a team to explore trade options for a holdout. The thing is we don't now though what Trent is thinking. He's clearly upset about something. But we don't know for sure what that is regardless of how the thread is titled here. There are multiple theories. We got no idea which one is right or if its something else. In the mix of those theories (Lake Lewis talked about this one, Brewer, Russell to some extent too), is that Trent didn't love them drafting Geron Christian -- not because he saw him as a threat to his job right away but saw that as another log in the fire as to them being ready to move on or they are willing to cut him if needed (lack of guaranteed money for the tail end of his contract, especially next year, etc). If that theory is part of the soup then a failed attempt to trade him I don't think would make him feel warm and fuzzy on return. I am not saying any of this is the case. But I don't know we can say we know what's going on. Forget Trent, it's common for teams if shopping a player to not always advertise it especially in cases where there is a strong viable option of that player staying put. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Russell on 106.7, just now saying the Redskins have nothing to gain to say that Trent is on the trading block even if he is -- you lose leverage (I agree). He thinks Trent isn't on the trading block but they would naturally consider trading him if they can't work things out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskinscub Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Move a defensive lineman to OL and forget Trent, ship him to a weed friendly team. The team has stood behind him with his injuries and suspensions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 At this point I’m kind of all for trading him even if he didn’t ask for a trade. This sounds like the kind of thing that could linger and have an affect on some of the younger players. If he’s got a problem with the team, whether justifiably so, I’d rather just move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 This is a possibility that I'm considering. Penn talked to Trent, and Trent did not necessarily say he's definitely not coming back, and left it open. I know Penn said he wants to start, but maybe Penn and Trent are such good friends that Penn doesn't mind being backup to Trent if he returns. This is all speculation though, which is all any of us are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Hypothetically if Trent does come back, what are the chances he kicks it inside to guard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COWBOY-KILLA- Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 We are a better team with Trent. I hope we get this fixed. If we had to trade him I say a 1st and a 3rd, would be the range I’d be happy with. Ultimately I’d settle for a first and something. If it doesn’t involve a first then I’d say 3 picks between rounds 2-3.. at least two in round 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poindexter Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 29 minutes ago, PartyPosse said: Hypothetically if Trent does come back, what are the chances he kicks it inside to guard? He played guard for a half against the Giants and made it perfectly clear he's a tackle......when Ty was playing well when Trent was out, he was awfully pissed when rumors about him moving to guard popped up. No chance he plays guard....we would be lucky to get Trent back in a skins uniform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbias Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 3 hours ago, NewCliche21 said: Well, yeah, I'm a fan so that's the perspective I'm coming from. You're totally right about it from Gruden's perspective, but it's Allen who makes all the calls. Remember, Jay found out about us being interested in Alex Smith when he was told by Allen that they were working out a deal for him. It wasn't permission, it was notification. I hope Gruden stays, but even if he's fired, I don't think his record will speak for itself from any GM's position. I was using Gruden as an example. A team trading for Trent has the same coach/GM pressures, but not the same organizational structure. I still Think the Texans are the right fit, but I see why NE is interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan93 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 If we can get a first rounder, then trade him. It would probably give us enough ammo to move up for a top tier LT next year. His salary off the books would help our cap. Am I the only one who is pissed that he his holding the team hostage with this bs? His gripe may be legit but sitting at home is not the way to resolve it. Lastly I’m tired of seeing him not be able to play a full season. Teams that succeed are ones where the entire line stays intact all year. When’s the last time Trent played 16 games? How about 5 years ago when he was 26. Now he’s 31. Also in 9 years he’s played a full season just twice. Do the math. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 2 hours ago, COWBOY-KILLA- said: We are a better team with Trent. I hope we get this fixed. If we had to trade him I say a 1st and a 3rd, would be the range I’d be happy with. Ultimately I’d settle for a first and something. If it doesn’t involve a first then I’d say 3 picks between rounds 2-3.. at least two in round 2. We'll be incredibly lucky to get a 1st rounder, let alone a 1st and a 3rd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 4 hours ago, Malapropismic Depository said: This is a possibility that I'm considering. Penn talked to Trent, and Trent did not necessarily say he's definitely not coming back, and left it open. I know Penn said he wants to start, but maybe Penn and Trent are such good friends that Penn doesn't mind being backup to Trent if he returns. This is all speculation though, which is all any of us are doing. Trent told Penn that when Trent comes back, he'll "accidentally" get an ACL injury halfway through the season. Trent starts half, Penn the other, everyone's happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COWBOY-KILLA- Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 2 hours ago, mistertim said: We'll be incredibly lucky to get a 1st rounder, let alone a 1st and a 3rd. Yeah I said what would make me happy, not predicting what will actually happen. In the end we don't have to do anything. He's under contract for 2 years. If we don't get an excellent and fair offer for a 7 time pro bowler, perennial stud LT, and best player on our team then I don't make the move. I do believe there is a scenario we get a 1st plus some. We'll see how it shakes out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 15 hours ago, NewCliche21 said: I can get all the way through God LOL@Redskins fans, but I just can't get to the part about him needing to be replaced. It's likely 90% player loyalty, but Williams was drafted about 30 seconds after Samuels found out about the spinal stenosis and that he'd have to stop playing. There was time to prepare, and we hit the LoTtery again. I just don't see how, at this point, we can be decently prepared moving forward at the position. I also don't follow college football because I don't want to get attached to a future Cowboy, so I don't know what the draft class looks like. Even so, from what I remember, Okung was the top choice over Williams, but I'm glad we took the gamble on the raw talent. You can't be prepared for it unless it's something you see coming. And, to be honest, the writing on the wall with Trent started about two years ago. I've been fairly adamant (as have others, to be fair) that it was getting close to replacement time for 71. Not because I didn't think he was talented. Not because I don't like him. But because injuries are piling up on an already injury prone team. Both of those aspects are important to this conversation. He's aging. He's more oft injured. He fights through a lot of it, but you can tell he's not playing at anywhere near his peak. (To be clear, he was still the best OL on the team even banged up, I think that says a lot for his abilities). We are also saddled with a bad contract for Moses at the moment, so he's not replaceable despite how banged up and injury prone he is. Something had to give. 71 has said he doesn't want to move inside (which would be a boon for both him and the team, but I digress). Now he's unhappy. The time was nearing to replace him anyways due to his age/damage to his body. I thought that would be when his contract was up originally... but the date was approaching. Why would we want to extend him AND pay him more money when his body isn't holding up? This is a major criticism I have had about our FO over the years and it's not getting better. We still rely on multiple injury prone players. As much of a freak accident it was, Reuben Foster is just another example of this. Dude is hurt a lot. Dude is out for the season after a single play. We added Bostic, who is a starting ILB for us at the moment... he's oft injured. We take a lot of shots on these guys. And they turn out to be studs. Until they're hurt. Williams is a different case. He's been around and playing for a decade. But his age is putting him more in the category detailed above. Each year his body breaks down more in one of the absolute most physical positions in football, going against some of the most ridiculous freaks of nature every single play. Loyalty is a good thing. I strongly believe in it. But that is also what has kept teams away from moving forward. Trent and the Redskins are at a point where, in my opinion, it's likely beneficial to both for them to move on. Are the Skins BETTER, right now, if they move on? Absolutely not. Losing Trent Williams hurts. Is it better to get the idea that we need to replace him on the radar now, especially after we drafted our rookie QB who hopes to be the future, and to find a cornerstone LT to grow with him moving forward? Yeah. I think so. For Williams, dude deserves a shot at some playoff games. Can the Skins get there? Sure. But they are often beat up and bruised due to how the team is structured. Trent deserves a consistent shot at the title for the last stage of his career. I am as big of a Trent Williams fan as anyone... But keeping him here, unhappy, and injury prone, is unfair to both the team and the player. Quote The impact this departure would have on the locker room I feel would be more significant than any other player departing given his tenure, his sacrifice, his performance, his reputation, and his weed hook-up (I kid, I kid). Allen (the good one, not Bruce) seems to be stepping into a leader role, but, I don't know. I don't even know what I'm trying to say here. You're trying to say his leadership will be missed. I agree. I am quite happy, though, that Adrian Peterson, Alex Smith, Jon Allen are all around. The team seems to really respect them and listen to them. Don't slowly take the band-aid off because you're afraid. Rip it and get it over with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Welp our goose is cooked on this one. A shout out to those that didn't rush to judgement on our teams best player. He always struck me as a bird of a different feather and so pushed back on anyone proclaiming to know the inner workings. There was WAY too much smoke around the tumor for me to ignore. So it appears his demand is that he wants the entire training staff replaced. With our volume of injuries / games lost the past 2 years, it's hard to argue with that stance as a common sense thing for management to consider. Trent limped through the year, I am sure countless others did, including Moses, so our man games lost would have been even higher without the old NFL mantra "he's gonna try and give it go" still very much in play. At least Bruce got Donald Penn before someone else, but dare I think Jay's connection with Penn had a big hand in this, so won't pat Bruce on the back too hard. But it sounds like Bruce has decided to not let anyone on his staff assist in trading Trent, evaluating possible incoming talent, assist in assessing value etc. Apparently he didn't even tell his staff. Wonderful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbias Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 1 hour ago, RandyHolt said: At least Bruce got Donald Penn before someone else, but dare I think Jay's connection with Penn had a big hand in this, so won't pat Bruce on the back too hard. But it sounds like Bruce has decided to not let anyone on his staff assist in trading Trent, evaluating possible incoming talent, assist in assessing value etc. Apparently he didn't even tell his staff. Wonderful. I think Jay knows it's not his call, so he's just staying away from it. The more involved he gets the more he'll be emotionally invested in something he can't control. Weather it's Trent, Kirk or whomever, it's just not his place to publicly voice his opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 They need to ship him out this week or next...end this thing and turn the page. I understand he's probably pissed about the medical staff telling him to play through something that turned into cancer. I'd be shook too...but in the end, it's HIS health and if you have any doubts you go get yourself a second opinion. This goes back to personal accountability that many people don't have. You don't trust a football medical staff to perfectly diagnose something that isn't football related - period. Now, he feels how he feels and that's all that matters now. Trade him and move on. Bending to his demands now would be asinine. You'd be setting a horrible precedent and doing it for all the wrong reasons with the wrong type of player. You don't give more money or fire personnel for a single player...but you certainly don't do it for one who won't even still be good the next time the team is ready to compete for something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 10 minutes ago, Unbias said: I think Jay knows it's not his call, so he's just staying away from it. The more involved he gets the more he'll be emotionally invested in something he can't control. Weather it's Trent, Kirk or whomever, it's just not his place to publicly voice his opinion. Oh I suspect Penn was dealing directly with Jay and vice versa, likely without Bruce's knowledge. Otherwise your post stands. Jay knows his place. One of which is being the PR punching bag sent up to the podium to explain the moves of the front office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Not that any of us are this lucky, but imagine the other side of this... Trent taking a stand, leading to the departure of Bruce Allen, and a complete overhaul in Ashburn. Okay, I’m dreaming, but man - what if? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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