Owls0325

!!!!0mgz!!!! Trent Williams finally showed up

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Perhaps it’s time to stop putting Bruce on a pike for not trading Trent, and instead give Dan the “credit” for holding on to him?

 

Ill hang up and listen...

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10 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

Perhaps it’s time to stop putting Bruce on a pike for not trading Trent, and instead give Dan the “credit” for holding on to him?

 

Ill hang up and listen...

Just because it might be a reasonable outcome doesn’t mean the path to get there was even remotely correct.  Bruce screwed this up from the beginning.  The Skins might get slightly lucky, but there was no need to get lucky.

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I will give him some credit for probably at least be partially responsible for Snyder moving on from Allen. Based on the fact that Allen is now gone and we have moved on from the old coaching staff, this is a new beginning.  Based on his history of being injured and missing 4 or so games a year, the fact that he tapped out on his teammates over some dispute with the team doctor his words not mine, and the fact that he has not played for a year, I personally would not be upset if we move on.  And I certainly would not give him a 3 year extension at some ungodly number based on his injury history over the last several years.  

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Just spitballing here...with an entire season to heal (and I get the disappointment in him missing the season but...you know we did get everything we wanted in the Bruce Allen situation and the #2 pick from our 3-13 season. It wasn't the worst thing not having him) is it possible his body has fully recovered for the first time in his professional career? He's always had nagging injuries but he's also generally played through them and taken care of himself in the off-season the way you want. 

 

He's an absolute freak for the position he plays. It's POSSIBLE he has a long career yet, and even if he misses a few games a season, there's a lot of value in that when you think you might already have your franchise QB, some stud skill players, competent HC and FO (we hope), and the makings of a talented defense with a good DC ALL in place.

 

I'm not saying we're in a position to go all-in to win now. I'm still very open to trading him.

 

What I am saying is that I'm at least open to the idea that we may be entering the type of competitive window I didn't think was possible 6 weeks ago, and that a franchise LT for 12-14 games a season if he has years left in his career...that's valuable both to our young QB and in terms of not creating another hole that won't be filled by an All-Pro talent. He could play till 37 like some of the other borderline HOF-type talents have this decade. 

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Some of his accusations were corrosive, and I'm disappointed in him for that. 

 

Afraid that the big stick will be his money demands, at this point.  He averaged 11 games a season, the three seasons before he played 0 this season.  We got 16 out of an older Penn, who did a fair job this year; what is Trent's net value, then, at 11 games of Pro-Bowl versus 16 of OK?  Maybe Trent is well-rested now, but he also has wear and tear, and the knees and head are a concern.

 

Does it all depend on how much money he wants, versus what we could get for him?  Guess a #2 is looking pretty good now.

 

 

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We can't even know what he would want, money wise, if that was the sticking point moving forward. Turning a large portion of his existing contract guaranteed might even do it, it's the lack of guaranteed money he's spoken about in regards to risking his health. 

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26 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

We can't even know what he would want, money wise, if that was the sticking point moving forward. Turning a large portion of his existing contract guaranteed might even do it, it's the lack of guaranteed money he's spoken about in regards to risking his health. 

 

From the numbers I have, he's already #3 in the league in total guaranteed, and $100k from being #2.  And #1 (Lewan) is only 29 years old.

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21 minutes ago, Jurgyfan1 said:

 

From the numbers I have, he's already #3 in the league in total guaranteed, and $100k from being #2.  And #1 (Lewan) is only 29 years old.

 

But he doesn't have much guaranteed money left moving forward, right? That's what I meant. Maybe I'm misremembering. I haven't thought about this situation for a while until today. 

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10 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

But he doesn't have much guaranteed money left moving forward, right? That's what I meant. Maybe I'm misremembering. I haven't thought about this situation for a while until today. 

 

Yes, he has one year left at $12.5M plus $2M bonus.  I think one of the issues is the money he lost by going AWOL this year.  

 

I mean, I love his play, but we don't get it as much as we need it.  That's the way I'm thinking.   And I really don't believe he has earned the top contract in the league, and I image that what he wants.

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10 hours ago, Jurgyfan1 said:

 

Yes, he has one year left at $12.5M plus $2M bonus.  I think one of the issues is the money he lost by going AWOL this year.  

 

I mean, I love his play, but we don't get it as much as we need it.  That's the way I'm thinking.   And I really don't believe he has earned the top contract in the league, and I image that what he wants.

I don't disagree but I think TW means a lot to the guys on this team, he's one of the leaders and a top player at his position in the league. He holds value in ways that don't include his games played or on field performance. I also believe we'll get more out of him with a guy like Rivera and a positive culture moving forward. I think there are arguments to be made both ways as far as keeping or trading but I also think there are intangibles that we don't know about. He took a stand for all the players on the team and they respect him a lot. Teams need leadership in the locker room and he's our leader.

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The prior FO flat out didn't prepare for a TW holdout and to me it'd be better to get him back in here for a couple years which gives us a chance to draft a replacement.  We'll have the cap space.  Right now, it seems we're screwed without him because we aren't getting any of the top tackles in the 2020 draft.  JMHO.

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22 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

I don't disagree but I think TW means a lot to the guys on this team, he's one of the leaders and a top player at his position in the league. He holds value in ways that don't include his games played or on field performance. I also believe we'll get more out of him with a guy like Rivera and a positive culture moving forward. I think there are arguments to be made both ways as far as keeping or trading but I also think there are intangibles that we don't know about. He took a stand for all the players on the team and they respect him a lot. Teams need leadership in the locker room and he's our leader.

I also thought of him as a "leader" up until he quit and pouted. He was a grown ass man under contract to play for his team. Are you sure you want this kind of "leader"  showing the youngins what it means to be a professional?

I like the prospect of him playing once more, he's a great talent and among the best at what he does. It would certainly scratch one of off season needs off the list. But before I welcomed him back with open arms, I would sure as hell test the trade market to see if he could fetch us a early pick.

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8 minutes ago, bowhunter said:

I also thought of him as a "leader" up until he quit and pouted. He was a grown ass man under contract to play for his team. Are you sure you want this kind of "leader"  showing the youngins what it means to be a professional?

 

Regardless of who any of us think is "right" here, players (for good reason, in general) overwhelmingly side with and support each other on issues like this.

 

So having a respected stud like Trent come back and buy into what Rivera's selling could actually be huge for those young players and a good first step toward rebuilding a winning culture here. 

 

Like you I also am still open to trading him if it's worth it, and weigh that against opening another hole in the roster. 

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When Riggins skipped a year, a new regime came in and fences were mended.  Worked out well then and there’s no reason to not pursue that course now.

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1 hour ago, bowhunter said:

I also thought of him as a "leader" up until he quit and pouted. He was a grown ass man under contract to play for his team. Are you sure you want this kind of "leader"  showing the youngins what it means to be a professional?

I like the prospect of him playing once more, he's a great talent and among the best at what he does. It would certainly scratch one of off season needs off the list. But before I welcomed him back with open arms, I would sure as hell test the trade market to see if he could fetch us a early pick.

Fair point, I would just say that we don't know the medical side of this and how betrayed or pissed he must have felt. And then he had to deal with Bruce.

Was it leadership in his taking a stand against management or was it quitting on his team? Morgan Moses had his back. I am certainly not close enough to this situation to say what it was. 

I will say that I haven't seen one teammate come out and call him a quitter. Now that Bruce is gone, if Trent is committed and ready to return, and both sides are comfortable with his contract, I don't know that any draft pick could have a greater impact on turning this team around than a fully healthy and motivated Trent Williams can. I would think his teammates and coaches would be pumped to have him back. 

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13 hours ago, Jurgyfan1 said:

Some of his accusations were corrosive, and I'm disappointed in him for that. 

 

Afraid that the big stick will be his money demands, at this point.  He averaged 11 games a season, the three seasons before he played 0 this season.  We got 16 out of an older Penn, who did a fair job this year; what is Trent's net value, then, at 11 games of Pro-Bowl versus 16 of OK?  Maybe Trent is well-rested now, but he also has wear and tear, and the knees and head are a concern.

 

Does it all depend on how much money he wants, versus what we could get for him?  Guess a #2 is looking pretty good now.

 

 

 

at the very least the Redskins have a legit reason not to raise him to much.  Last year of the CBA prohibits raises beyond a certain point

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12 hours ago, Jurgyfan1 said:

 

Yes, he has one year left at $12.5M plus $2M bonus.  I think one of the issues is the money he lost by going AWOL this year.  

 

But none of it is guaranteed.  He could've been cut by the team, with virtually no cap implications, anytime before week 1 (when his contract would then be guaranteed for the year).  Even the bonus is invariably tied to him being on the roster after that point.

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I think he will be back, actually.  All but guarantees best player available picked in draft at #2 pick.  If he doesnt come back then i think the team needs to consider drafting a franchise LT...

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8 minutes ago, illone said:

I think he will be back, actually.  All but guarantees best player available picked in draft at #2 pick.  If he doesnt come back then i think the team needs to consider drafting a franchise LT...

I'm not sure there is a franchise LT in the 1st rd.....

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Trents gettin a new deal, seems inevitable as it also takes the edge off picking Young at #2 and not really having the chance to get another OT to start.

 

 

 

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Trent in coming back, might very well end up becoming a real fan hero. 

History may show that he was the number one reason why BA was fired. 

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