Owls0325

!!!!0mgz!!!! Trent Williams finally showed up

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this trent news taking forever (his getting traded, his staying etc... etc...)

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1 minute ago, bakedtater1 said:

Ok so the skins refuse to trade him?..does this force him to retire?

 

Wouldn't that be a very Redskinish way for it to end. 🙄 A standoff with Trent which ends with him retiring. 

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Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Wouldn't that be a very Redskinish way for it to end. 🙄 A standoff with Trent which ends with him retiring. 

Yes..I mean..is it really true he will never wear another skins uniform?

 

Serious question...is that what would have to happen for him to never play for the skins again?

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1 minute ago, bakedtater1 said:

Yes..I mean..is it really true he will never wear another skins uniform?

 

Serious question...is that what would have to happen for him to never play for the skins again?

 

You mean if they do not trade him or release him? Yes, he could retire instead of play for them. They will hold the rights to him for two years if he ever wanted to come back to the NFL unless the Redskins released him from that contract - which they can do. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, goskins10 said:

 

You mean if they do not trade him or release him? Yes, he could retire instead of play for them. They will hold the rights to him for two years if he ever wanted to come back to the NFL unless the Redskins released him from that contract - which they can do. 

 

 

Yes if the skins refuse to trade him or release him he would have to retire to not play for the skins again...

 

So they own him for 2 years or they can release him from his contract.

 

Hmmm I see him coming back and the convo he had with Penn was.."fill in till I heal up than I'll be back to take over "

 

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43 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

this isn't about Trent

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18 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Wouldn't that be a very Redskinish way for it to end. 🙄 A standoff with Trent which ends with him retiring. 

And then after trent retires and the skins get nothing, Dan turns to Bruce and says, "I like what you did there. Keep up the good work.  You just earned more job security in my eyes". The Redskins Way since 1999!!!

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Wouldn't that be a very Redskinish way for it to end. 🙄 A standoff with Trent which ends with him retiring. 

 

And I could see Snyder and Allen letting it go to that.  They're old school with the Skins and wouldn't forget John Riggins

12 minutes ago, KillBill26 said:

And then after trent retires and the skins get nothing, Dan turns to Bruce and says, "I like what you did there. Keep up the good work.  You just earned more job security in my eyes". The Redskins Way since 1999!!!

 

I think you can actually trade rights like that away though.  It'd just have to be a conditional pick

Edited by carex

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9 minutes ago, carex said:

 

I think you can actually trade rights like that away though.  It'd just have to be a comp pick

Waiting until he officially retires only diminishes his trade value.  A competent gm would trade him to the highest bidder by the end of the week.  Unfortunately we don't have one of those.  

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

Not picking on you here SIP - but this threw me since it's in the Trent thread. Or maybe I have it wrong and am the only one not getting the connection with Trent - but they are talking about Paul Richardson going to Pittsburgh. The $8M in dead CAP is what caught my attention. Trading TW would be about $5.4M dead cap. It's irrelevant in terms of Trent since they are getting hit with that dead cap anyway unless he plays.

 

As to this rumor - IMO Keim is right but for the wrong reason. Redskins should be all over this. Who cares about the dead CAP. It's already spent this yr and it wouldn't impact next year. You get a really high draft pick in a very WR rich draft for next year for a guy who has nice speed but cannot stay healthy. Steelers could offer to pay some of the bonus and I believe the Redskins could recover it if they really wanted Richardson that bad. But I just do not see them doing this or offering a 1st or even a 2nd for Richardson. Guy can't stay on the field. Maybe a 3rd or 4th? But even that's doubtful. Not sure where some of these rumors get started but they are some whoppers. 

 

Back to Trent - while I truly hope they are actually working on this, if it turns out they are playing a game of chicken and GM 1 comes and goes with no movement, then Bruce Allen is an even bigger imbecile than I think he is, and that's a true accomplishment as I already think he is first ballot HOF imbecile when it comes to football.

 

At this point I could care less who is at fault or if it's the training staff or what. Either get him in camp or move him. As my dad used to say; **** or get off the pot! Time is running out - 13 days and counting. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by goskins10
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12 minutes ago, KillBill26 said:

Waiting until he officially retires only diminishes his trade value.  A competent gm would trade him to the highest bidder by the end of the week.  Unfortunately we don't have one of those.  

 

Why do you think is value is higher now than at any time up to the trade deadline?

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We've seen plenty of holdouts , but have we ever seen one play out in this "he refuses to play , we refuse to release him" thing and the player just sits in football purgatory?  Someone eventually budges.  Based on the Cousins franchise tag forever thing, im thinking we're the most stubborn team in the league when it comes to things like this.  I want to like it, the idea that we stay strong and won't be pushed around or whatever , but it doesn't seem to be working in our favor.  They should have done something with Cousins sooner than they did, and they need to do something with Trent sooner than later.

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15 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

Why do you think is value is higher now than at any time up to the trade deadline?

My opinion? If you wait til the deadline you know you're dealing him to a team that's near the top of the standings or at least in a playoff position. The pick or picks you get in return will be lower in the round. By trading him now there's still a chance whomever you trade him to will disappoint. Imagine if Indy made a deal for him prior to Luck's retirement. 

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14 minutes ago, Dirt said:

We've seen plenty of holdouts , but have we ever seen one play out in this "he refuses to play , we refuse to release him" thing and the player just sits in football purgatory?  Someone eventually budges.  Based on the Cousins franchise tag forever thing, im thinking we're the most stubborn team in the league when it comes to things like this.  I want to like it, the idea that we stay strong and won't be pushed around or whatever , but it doesn't seem to be working in our favor.  They should have done something with Cousins sooner than they did, and they need to do something with Trent sooner than later.

 

I know other teams have dealt with it, I don't think we have much history, but Sean Gilbert sat out a year under our franchise tag and then we tried to franchise him again

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6 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

Why do you think is value is higher now than at any time up to the trade deadline?

If he officially retires, we lose a ton of leverage, bc all the other teams knows he is definitely not coming back to play for the skins. The fact that Trent hasn't officially said he is done with the Redskins gives us the ability to say "we aren't going to dump the best LT in the game for peanuts" because we can act like there is a chance we can get him back, but when Trent announces to the world he is definitely never playing for us again, we are just going to have to take what we can get.

 

And the longer this drags out, the more other variables enter into the equation "well Trent has been away from football for almost a year now (if we wait til the trade deadline), I wonder what kinda shape he is in?" Etc. And he only gets older with each passing day.

 

On the flip side, what advantage do you see by sitting and doing nothing?  Do you feel there is a possibility Trent has a change of heart and he comes back and we are better off with an aging Trent instead of the generous trade package that he is rumored to command?  Do you believe we need to wait for a team to suffer an injury along their oline, or maybe have their young guys not meet expectations early on in the season, or a coach/gm on the hot seat overreacting and making a panic trade?  I don't think we should sit and wait and expect that to happen.  I dont see the trade package getting richer the more we wait.  If the rumors are true about us getting a 1st and change for him, do it now. No matter what we can actually fetch for him, do you see the trade package improving the longer he is sitting on his couch?  Not to mention we are still two weeks away from the opener, plenty of time for teams to get him up to speed for the start of the season, which is more attractive to other teams than a midseason trade.

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Here's another way of looking at the detriment of waiting. Houston was probably keen on the idea of trading for him. Now, with the injury to Miller, the team isn't gonna run with Duke Johnson and now's there's chatter they're interested in Melvin Gordon. No way they can trade for both.

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28 minutes ago, Dirt said:

I want to like it, the idea that we stay strong and won't be pushed around or whatever , but it doesn't seem to be working in our favor.  They should have done something with Cousins sooner than they did, and they need to do something with Trent sooner than later.

I agree with wanting to stay strong and not just back the brinks truck up during every contract negotiation, so I like that aspect.  But they were foolish with the low-ball offers to Kirk, and I hope they aren't doing the same with scherff.  And as far as staying strong, it reaches a point where you have to transition from holding your ground in a negotiation, to moving onto to gauging what compensation you would get via trade, and deciding to move on sooner rather than later to get a better return.  I dont think doing nothing until he retires or walks (Kirk) shows strength, I think it shows stupidity.

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33 minutes ago, Dirt said:

We've seen plenty of holdouts , but have we ever seen one play out in this "he refuses to play , we refuse to release him" thing and the player just sits in football purgatory?  Someone eventually budges.  Based on the Cousins franchise tag forever thing, im thinking we're the most stubborn team in the league when it comes to things like this.  I want to like it, the idea that we stay strong and won't be pushed around or whatever , but it doesn't seem to be working in our favor.  They should have done something with Cousins sooner than they did, and they need to do something with Trent sooner than later.

 

John Riggins. Sat out a whole year then was ‘bored, broke and back’ the next season. That was a while ago though.

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38 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

As to this rumor - IMO Keim is right but for the wrong reason. Redskins should be all over this. Who cares about the dead CAP. It's already spent this yr and it wouldn't impact next year. You get a really high draft pick in a very WR rich draft for next year for a guy who has nice speed but cannot stay healthy. Steelers could offer to pay some of the bonus and I believe the Redskins could recover it if they really wanted Richardson that bad. But I just do not see them doing this or offering a 1st or even a 2nd for Richardson. Guy can't stay on the field. Maybe a 3rd or 4th? But even that's doubtful. Not sure where some of these rumors get started but they are some whoppers.

Excellent post all around.  I hadn't heard the p rich to Pitt rumor.  I agree with you, I don't even think he would fetch a 4th, but as someone who has been advocating to cut p rich and start shedding the contract to give the roster spot to one of the young guys, I hope they consider a late pick for him, due to the other benefits from moving on from an overpaid, oft injured player with limited production.

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Posted (edited)

 

20 minutes ago, KillBill26 said:

If he officially retires, we lose a ton of leverage, bc all the other teams knows he is definitely not coming back to play for the skins. The fact that Trent hasn't officially said he is done with the Redskins gives us the ability to say "we aren't going to dump the best LT in the game for peanuts" because we can act like there is a chance we can get him back, but when Trent announces to the world he is definitely never playing for us again, we are just going to have to take what we can get.

 

And the longer this drags out, the more other variables enter into the equation "well Trent has been away from football for almost a year now (if we wait til the trade deadline), I wonder what kinda shape he is in?" Etc. And he only gets older with each passing day.

 

On the flip side, what advantage do you see by sitting and doing nothing?  Do you feel there is a possibility Trent has a change of heart and he comes back and we are better off with an aging Trent instead of the generous trade package that he is rumored to command?  Do you believe we need to wait for a team to suffer an injury along their oline, or maybe have their young guys not meet expectations early on in the season, or a coach/gm on the hot seat overreacting and making a panic trade?  I don't think we should sit and wait and expect that to happen.  I dont see the trade package getting richer the more we wait.  If the rumors are true about us getting a 1st and change for him, do it now. No matter what we can actually fetch for him, do you see the trade package improving the longer he is sitting on his couch?  Not to mention we are still two weeks away from the opener, plenty of time for teams to get him up to speed for the start of the season, which is more attractive to other teams than a midseason trade.

 

The team loses very little leverage. Teams already know he does not want to be here. Him retiring doesn't really change that much. Maybe a little - but if a team gets desperate - say they are making a PO run and they lose their starting LT - they will pay up if they believe TW will un-retire for them. So yes, I could actually see a trade package getting better if a team gets desperate. 

 

9 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

Here's another way of looking at the detriment of waiting. Houston was probably keen on the idea of trading for him. Now, with the injury to Miller, the team isn't gonna run with Duke Johnson and now's there's chatter they're interested in Melvin Gordon. No way they can trade for both.

 

But when they lose their starting LT and his back-up mid season they will find whatever they need. 

 

Having said that, I do wish they would get something done - at least before the 1st game. Let's move on from the drama and be done with it. Let the players - especially the Oline focus on football. 

 

Edited by goskins10

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3 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

John Riggins. Sat out a whole year then was ‘bored, broke and back’ the next season. That was a while ago though.

Valid point, I'm glad the skins didn't trade him!!  

 

I'm not saying it's impossible for a scenario to unfold where it would work out to not pull the trigger now, I just think the odds of us getting a better trade package are better making a move now vs waiting.  We shall see.  In Bruce we trust!!  (I just threw up typing that)

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