2020 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[DazedSkinsfan]

@Skinsinparadise that was a excellent analysis on the Lamb and Jeudy.  I'm curious to hear your thoughts on Jalen Hurts.  Am I totally off when I say I think hes very comparable to Dak? Hes a big solid guy that can move around in the pocket and take off.  I read somewhere that he can squat over 600lbs so injuries are not a huge worry when he takes off running.  Where do you see him going in the draft? Last year I projected him late 4th early 5th but after this season I'm thinking late 1st early 2nd? Do you agree?

[Koolblue13]

I'm preparing myself for Thomas also, but like I've said before, LT is a Redskins pillar. Weve got a great lineage of consistency at the position. 

 

I'd rather Trade, Okadah, Simmons if Youngs out of reach, but LT is fine. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Thomas would fit.  We've done the LT thing for years starting with Chris Samuels.  The odd thing in the mix is this team is bleeding fans and does that effect their call this time?  This team has really struggled to find stars and draws that bring people out.

 

The Giants have stunk as much as we have but with Beckham and now Barkley they have dudes that people come to see and they haven't struggled to draw fans at the stadium or with TV ratings.  The causal checked out Redskin fan isn't going to a game to watch a LT.  do I think that should guide their decisions?  Nope.   But I don't think its lost to some fans that we've had very good LTs but no elite playmakers on offense or defense (aside from Sean) and haven't really ever challenged for a SB under Dan.

 

[Skinsinparadise]

28 minutes ago, DazedSkinsfan said:

@Skinsinparadise that was a excellent analysis on the Lamb and Jeudy.  I'm curious to hear your thoughts on Jalen Hurts.  Am I totally off when I say I think hes very comparable to Dak? Hes a big solid guy that can move around in the pocket and take off.  I read somewhere that he can squat over 600lbs so injuries are not a huge worry when he takes off running.  Where do you see him going in the draft? Last year I projected him late 4th early 5th but after this season I'm thinking late 1st early 2nd? Do you agree?

 

Thanks.  I honestly have a hard time getting a read on Hurst.  I haven't really dived into the QBs because I don't expect us to take one.  I've become over time more enamored with the mobile types like a Hurst.   I read that he ran a 4.48.  If he matches that at the combine, that will help.  His accuracy to me comes and goes.  He fumbles, some INTs.  The Big 12 really doesn't have big defenses so I wonder how much he was challenged.   I wonder about his arm strength, too.  To me he's one of those guys that the draft process in the off season will either help prop him up more or not.  

 

My gut at the moment is if you got one of these modern type coaches who are into the spread they might be able to do something cool with him.  I noticed draft geeks are all over the map about him, some saying late first or 2nd and some saying he's a 5th-6th rounder. 

[Skin'emAlive]

If we are going by ypc, I think you should take into account last year as well. 
 

Jeudy 19.3 ypc 14 TD

Lamb 17.8 ypc 11 TD

 

I think I would agree Lamb has better hands. He has the ability to make some spectacular OBJ type catches, and is electric at times with the ball in his hands. But I lean towards jeudy because more often than not, he wins his matchup at the line of scrimmage and in the open field with elite jab steps, feints, Shimmies, and jump cuts. I’d be happy with either, but I don’t think Lamb is worthy of a top 5 pick. 

[Daniel.redskins]

Most will disagree with me, but I'm not a fan of taking receivers early.  Look at the Falcons.  They have without a doubt the best receiving core in the NFL.  Not a good team and not a team I want to emulate.  I can't even name a San Fran receiver and they have the best team this year.  You can get good receivers in the later rounds (McLaurin).  Draft strength early, not speed.  But again, nothing matters unless the QB play improves.  

[757SeanTaylor21]

Jeudy reminds me of AB and Chad Johnson with his route running. Jerry rice the goat never ran a 4.3 bit was such a great route runner that he was always open. Mclaurin actually is open a great deal. Having both jeudy and mclaurin is a great problem to have but if he was the best option you gotta try and trade down cause like many others have said this is a super deep wr class. If you cant then ok cool take jeudy and be happy you got two elite route runners that are about to expose nfc east corners for 8 games a year for the next 8 years unless Bruce is still here then mclaurin would get greatly low balled and walk.

2 minutes ago, Daniel.redskins said:

Most will disagree with me, but I'm not a fan of taking receivers early.  Look at the Falcons.  They have without a doubt the best receiving core in the NFL.  Not a good team and not a team I want to emulate.  I can't even name a San Fran receiver and they have the best team this year.  You can get good receivers in the later rounds (McLaurin).  Draft strength early, not speed.  But again, nothing matters unless the QB play improves.  

Didnt they trade for Emmanuel sanders? A pro bowl wr...and drafted deebo in the second while we drafted mclaurin in the third. 

[Macster]

Chase young is NOT the dominant player everyone thinks he is. I've watched him three games this year and this is what I've seen. When he plays other good teams, he doesn't do Squat. he takes a lot of plays off and is not good against the run. He does not hustle to the ball and basically is only a 3rd down pass rush specialist. I have a feeling when he gets to the NFL against Great offensive lineman, he won't be anything like LT, Von Miller or Khalil Mack. Mark it, dude!

[markmills67]

Just been looking on a draft order and it says we are picking at 3 atm, a win and move 4 to 3 is not a bad day in my opinion. 

 

HTTR 

[Warhead36]

6 hours ago, Daniel.redskins said:

Most will disagree with me, but I'm not a fan of taking receivers early.  Look at the Falcons.  They have without a doubt the best receiving core in the NFL.  Not a good team and not a team I want to emulate.  I can't even name a San Fran receiver and they have the best team this year.  You can get good receivers in the later rounds (McLaurin).  Draft strength early, not speed.  But again, nothing matters unless the QB play improves.  

True enough, but you can say the same thing about drafting LT. I don't think any of the top notch OLs in the league have high 1sts invested in their OL except Dallas.

[Daniel.redskins]

25 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

True enough, but you can say the same thing about drafting LT. I don't think any of the top notch OLs in the league have high 1sts invested in their OL except Dallas.

I agree with that.  Even Dallas is not a dominant team with the best o-line in football.  

[Renegade7]

9 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Thomas would fit.  We've done the LT thing for years starting with Chris Samuels.  The odd thing in the mix is this team is bleeding fans and does that effect their call this time?  This team has really struggled to find stars and draws that bring people out.

 

The Giants have stunk as much as we have but with Beckham and now Barkley they have dudes that people come to see and they haven't struggled to draw fans at the stadium or with TV ratings.  The causal checked out Redskin fan isn't going to a game to watch a LT.  do I think that should guide their decisions?  Nope.   But I don't think its lost to some fans that we've had very good LTs but no elite playmakers on offense or defense (aside from Sean) and haven't really ever challenged for a SB under Dan.

 

I know it's not sexy, but protecting your QB has to be more important then an elite pass rusher.  You can have elite pass rusher and still be irrelevant without a QB, ask Mack and JJ Watt.

[Skinsinparadise]

4 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

I know it's not sexy, but protecting your QB has to be more important then an elite pass rusher.  You can have elite pass rusher and still be irrelevant without a QB, ask Mack and JJ Watt.

 

Disagree.  To me a killer pass rusher beats a stud LT.  Go ask the NY Giants during their SB runs or for that matter the Redskins for almost the full run of the last 20 years.

 

To me its QB.  Then pass rusher.  Then LT. 

[Renegade7]

24 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Disagree.  To me a killer pass rusher beats a stud LT.  Go ask the NY Giants during their SB runs or for that matter the Redskins for almost the full run of the last 20 years.

 

To me its QB.  Then pass rusher.  Then LT. 

 

It's not the 80s anymore, unless those sacks come with turnovers, you can sack a QB all you want and still allow 30 points in today's NFL.  But if we don't protect Haskins we won't have a QB, which you admit is your first priority.  Bringing the fact we had Samuels then Trent is irrelevant to me because of the number of different QBs they had to block for.  That's not saying LT is more important then QB, this league is trying to make defense irrelevant.

 

Are you saying with a straight face Young is the next Lawrence Taylor while ignoring JJ Watt and Khalil Mack have never even been to the super bowl let alone won one?  Id be careful investing heavily in defense when the league is heading towards flag football.  Heaven forbid he is the next LT because he'll be under threats of fines and suspensions every week, ask Clay Mathews what that feels like.

[Skinsinparadise]

3 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Are you saying with a straight face Young is the next Lawrence Taylor while ignoring JJ Watt and Khalil Mack have never even been to the super bowl let alone won one?  Id be careful investing heavily in defense when the league is heading towards flag football.  Heaven forbid he is the next LT because he'll be under threats of fines and suspensions every week, ask Clay Mathews what that feels like.

 

Mack transformed their defense last year.  If you got a crap QB, you typically got a crap team.  Bosa transformed SF's D.   I somewhat reject the premise of your point because to me the question in play isn't that Chase and Andrew Thomas are equal players so pick the position value.   IMO Chase Young (elite player) is by a nice margin better than Andrew Thomas (very good player) so I don't think its an apples to apples conversation anyway

[Renegade7]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Mack transformed their defense last year.  If you got a crap QB, you typically got a crap team.  Bosa transformed SF's D.   I somewhat reject the premise of your point because to me the question in play isn't that Chase and Andrew Thomas are equal players so pick the position value.   IMO Chase Young (elite player) is by a nice margin better than Andrew Thomas (very good player) so I don't think its an apples to apples conversation anyway

 

This is focusing on winning the draft more then winning the Superbowl.  In your defense, this is a draft thread.  So, we invested heavily in the dline already with 2 first rounders and a player just gave an extension to who ESPN considers one of the most underrated players in the NFL.  Plus we drafted a pass rush specialist in the first round last year.  At the same time we don't have a left or right tackle right now.  

 

Is Young going to turn us into the Bears or SF? Not if Manusky is still the DC.  I look at happen to Andrew Luck and i can't think of a single player that's worth that happening to us.  We got problems everywhere, the right thing to do with no second rounder is to trade down, I'm just now seeing there's a LT that might be with standing pat.  This conversation is irrelevant if Haskins gets hurt, draft value, none of it matters.

 

I get some who say not to reach on need, but i think we look crazy drafting a player at a position we've already heavily invested in over position that is now completely empty and you claiming in the third most important position on the team.  Stepping back it just doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Skinsinparadise]

49 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

 

I get some who say not to reach on need, but i think we look crazy drafting a player at a position we've already heavily invested in over position that is now completely empty and you claiming in the third most important position on the team.  Stepping back it just doesn't make sense to me.

 

 

I am a BPA guy.  We drafted Payne and Allen back to back drafts.  We can't do that at edge?  Kerrigan is aging and in this season he's ordinary at best.  You'd have a tough time convincing me to draft ANY player who is distinctly IMO inferior to another just to fit a need -- let alone a pass rusher.

 

I'd entertain your idea if Andrew Thomas was the superior player to Chase or his equal.  But IMO he isn't.  As much as my idea doesn't make sense to you.  Your position equally makes little sense to me.  So let's agree to disagree. In short, I can care less about a dude who will be a 32 year old pass rusher next season who has 4.5 sacks.  That's not going to stop me from drafting an elite pass rusher. 

[Renegade7]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I am a BPA guy.  We drafted Payne and Allen back to back drafts.  We can't do that at edge?  Kerrigan is aging and in this season he's ordinary at best.  You'd have a tough time convincing me to draft ANY player who is distinctly IMO inferior to another just to fit a need -- let alone a pass rusher.

 

I'd entertain your idea if Andrew Thomas was the superior player to Chase or his equal.  But IMO he isn't.  As much as my idea doesn't make sense to you.  Your position equally makes little sense to me.  So let's agree to disagree. In short, I can care less about a dude who will be a 32 year old pass rusher next season who has 4.5 sacks.  That's not going to stop me from drafting an elite pass rusher. 

 

Fair, but until hes actually playing hes jus another prospect.  So I can understand hes an elite college pass rusher, but hes not an elite NFL pass rusher yet, he hasnt played a down.  I fell for that with Orakpo. I'm personally not doing that again.

 

I'm flexible enough to do what's best for the team, so I believe we can have this discussion without a debate on if BPA vs Need is the better overall philosophy where someone has to be a winner, that can be it's own thread. I'd personally lose my mind if we drafted QB in this draft, that doesnt mean I hate the BPA approach overall.

 

We havent even gotten to free agency yet.  I bring that up because it'd be interesting Clowney being avaliable, but damn if he wasnt supposed to be this sure fire pass rush prospect as well.  If we arent going trade down we cant swing and miss picking that high, BPA or Need.

[Skinsinparadise]

2 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Fair, but until hes actually playing hes jus another prospect.  So I can understand hes an elite college pass rusher, but hes not an elite NFL pass rusher yet, he hasnt played a down.  I fell for that with Orakpo. I'm personally not doing that again.

 

I'm flexible enough to do what's best for the team, so I believe we can have this discussion without a debate on if BPA vs Need is the better overall philosophy where someone has to be a winner, that can be it's own thread. I'd personally lose my mind if we drafted QB in this draft, that doesnt mean I hate the BPA approach overall.

 

 

Agree that we don’t know until they play but a main point of this thread is to stick our necks out as to which players we feel are best.  So we ride on our thoughts otherwise what fun would that be otherwise?

 

And we wouldn’t be going out on a leap about Chase being a better player than Andrew Thomas. Every draft geek that I’ve noticed feels the same, I don’t recall one saying it’s even close.  

[Renegade7]

13 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Agree that we don’t know until they play but a main point of this thread is to stick our necks out as to which players we feel are best.  So we ride on our thoughts otherwise what fun would that be otherwise?

 

And we wouldn’t be going out on a leap about Chase being a better player than Andrew Thomas. Every draft geek that I’ve noticed feels the same, I don’t recall one saying it’s even close.  

 

I understand, and this is why I typically avoid voicing my opinion in these prospect threads.  That and I don't like college football. We are required to stay on topic on an issue that affects multiple offtopic matters considerably.

 

Typically I watch the championship game to see if any of those top prospects pass the eye test on the biggest stage.  It never ceases to amaze me how dominant players can be in one conference and not stand a chance against a team in another conference.

 

So, I'll bow out and check back later.  We havent even done combine yet. So this thread is jus way too early for me, but I like checking in every once in a while because I trust yall on this more then myself.

[joeken24]

I'd like the Redskins' focus to be on finding some cornbread fed, large hand, 6'5, nasty attitude TEs. And that's plural. I want at least two. One could be a young FA. But I want two easy targets for Haskins next year. I'm cool with the rest of the skill positions. I'm even cool with OL. I'm even cool with a defense in it's second year off communication. A first round playmaker whatever that position may be is extra. 

But of course, Bruce has got to go to make it all come together. As a matter of fact, I actually think Trent would return if Dan fired Bruce and his medical minions.

[clskinsfan]

4 hours ago, Macster said:

Chase young is NOT the dominant player everyone thinks he is. I've watched him three games this year and this is what I've seen. When he plays other good teams, he doesn't do Squat. he takes a lot of plays off and is not good against the run. He does not hustle to the ball and basically is only a 3rd down pass rush specialist. I have a feeling when he gets to the NFL against Great offensive lineman, he won't be anything like LT, Von Miller or Khalil Mack. Mark it, dude!

I am going to have to disagree with you. Young is a beast. And he can do it as a down lineman or standing up. In fairness most pass rushers arent great against the run. Even Donald got run over last week. In fact the easiest way to to beat all of those guys is to double them and run right at them. But you are always going to have passing downs in the NFL. You cannot successfully run it every play. And when you have a passing down, those guys including Young are game changers.

[Skinsinparadise]

47 minutes ago, joeken24 said:

 

But of course, Bruce has got to go to make it all come together. As a matter of fact, I actually think Trent would return if Dan fired Bruce and his medical minions.

Who knows?  But both Standig and Hoffman suggested that they think Trent might return if Bruce gets let go.    I'd rather trade him myself but don't know if his trade value is ruined already by waiting until this off season. 

[joeken24]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Who knows?  But both Standig and Hoffman suggested that they think Trent might return if Bruce gets let go.    I'd rather trade him myself but don't know if his trade value is ruined already by waiting until this off season. 

If he comes back, its actually a plus. He gets a whole year to recover and get healthy. you also gain more depth on the Oline which has been surprisingly healthy so far. As a matter of fact, the left guard position is no longer a position of need IMO. Haskins gets another year to get comfortable with the pass protections and it's not bad. Add a couple big body pass catchers (TEs) that can knock the snot out of someone on a block and ya never know.

[clskinsfan]

11 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Who knows?  But both Standig and Hoffman suggested that they think Trent might return if Bruce gets let go.    I'd rather trade him myself but don't know if his trade value is ruined already by waiting until this off season. 

I agree with you. The OL has been good enough to let Trent go before or during the draft. We badly need to recoup our lost 2nd rounder.