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50 minutes ago, volsmet said:

 

In a simplified setting, like the Sr bowl, you see more explosion from athletes because they don’t have the same responsibilities - Payne was criticized at Bama for not being able to rush the passer, but that was simply a large group of humans who didn’t understand what his responsibilities were; it gets frustrating seeing people who don’t have any idea what they’re watching telling everyone what a guys weaknesses are. Payne had extraordinary discipline & experts interpreted that discipline as a lack of ability to get up the field ... unaware that if he had “gotten up the field”, his next location would be the bench.

 

 

There was one game later on in Payne's college season where they let him go up field.  They shifted him from 0 tech to 1 or 3 tech.  You could see the ability.  There's a clear difference in responsibilities/playstyle when after the snap he either showcases his first step and gets into the Guard's shoulder quickly, or he tries to establish space/anchor and keeps his eyes up to follow the play.

 

It can get so frustrating watching DL cutups when you keep reading about their ability to attack and get into the backfield, yet everything you see is read and react because that's their role.  So it's like, are there cutups showcasing a different role that I haven't seen?  Is that from games there are no cutups of yet?  Are those scouting reports just wrong?

 

That said, JJ Watt became JJ Watt because he started doing things his Houston coaches didn't want him to do.  He was supposed to be a read and react 5 tech.  But as the freak athlete he is, he could still fill in his run fits by doing a hard step upfield then crossing the blockers face.  Credit to Houston's coaches for not getting pissed and instead altering his role.

 

I remember drooling over FS Darian Thompson a few years ago.  He was playing well in a traditional safety role, and then I saw a game where they shifted his responsibilities to come down and cover crossers, some big nickel, some man.  He killed it in that game.  I thought "Here's the versatile safety that's still growing with the potential to do every assignment". His later games were not as good.  His combine sucked.  I think he's on his 3rd NFL team now.  That game where he killed it in all of the other assignments?  That was against Hawaii.  So...yeah, level of competition and what not.  Lesson learned about patience, and not all "versatility" translates.

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I hate when players don't get used to their strengths. 

 

I think I hate more when fans don't recognize that, and preach that the player sucks.

 

Sure, coaches have to fit all the different players into a scheme, but they sure seem mighty hesitant to change course if the player/D has major struggles. They have to swallow the pride pill and admit it is their fault. 

 

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Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

I'm shocked!  Shocked I say!  Who would think heavy feet couldn't keep up with elite burst?

 

Still not sure how Flowers was a) drafted so high, and b) what people saw in him besides elite size.  I do remember after the draft, McCloughan (or someone else) sort of said in a roundabout way they didn't think they could trade down and still pick a OT, because Flowers was a clear downgrade.

 

So what do we do with Flowers?  His cap hit is 3.2 million.  Cutting him would save 1.7 million, but still leaves a 1.5 million dead cap hit.  He can't play OT, and he can't play Guard.  Do we keep him around in the vain hope that our OL Coach, Callahan, can work a miracle?

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Alcoholic Zebra said:

 

I'm shocked!  Shocked I say!  Who would think heavy feet couldn't keep up with elite burst?

 

Still not sure how Flowers was a) drafted so high, and b) what people saw in him besides elite size.  I do remember after the draft, McCloughan (or someone else) sort of said in a roundabout way they didn't think they could trade down and still pick a OT, because Flowers was a clear downgrade.

 

So what do we do with Flowers?  His cap hit is 3.2 million.  Cutting him would save 1.7 million, but still leaves a 1.5 million dead cap hit.  He can't play OT, and he can't play Guard.  Do we keep him around in the vain hope that our OL Coach, Callahan, can work a miracle?

 

If I understand they forfeited a 6th rounder comp pick for the signing, too.  The scary thing is what if Trent misses his 4-5 customary games a year -- if so we might be seeing some Flowers. 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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13 minutes ago, Alcoholic Zebra said:

and he can't play Guard

How do you know this already?

 

I thought he was playing tackle today.

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2 minutes ago, redskinss said:

How do you know this already?

 

 

He's a big guy, with super long arms, who has plodding feet.  When landing a "punch" to slow down a rusher, or stop them, or drive them off the ball in run blocking you want good leverage.  His punches tend to be these wide looping arcs to the defender, that looks like he's about to embrace them in a bear hug.  His elbows are going to be higher.  They look this way because his feet are too slow for him to reset and turn his body.  His elbows should be in closer to the body and down so he can strike the defender with leverage.

 

His slow feet at OT make it hard for him to react.  Once his weight is going one direction he can't re-direct quickly enough to stop an inside move, and if he doesn't do a good kick step immediately at the snap, speed can beat him around the corner.  Also, if he messes up and thinks he's protecting a 5 step drop, when it's a 7, or a 3...he can't recover.  When landing a punch against an Edge guy, it doesn't need to be as technically sound as he's got 50-70 pounds on them.  It's easier to slow them down.

 

His slow feet at Guard make it hard for him to land a good punch.  Everyone at DT is closer to his size if not just as big, it's in a phone booth so there's not a lot of time/space for him to orient his body.  The wider punches he's landing, aren't doing as much, and they aren't affecting the DT's ability to get into his chest.  His looping arms basically invite every DT to attack him with correct fundamentals for good leverage.

 

You know the phrase "low man wins"?  His feet are too slow to square up and get low towards the defender, so his blocks are coming in too high.

 

This could change, if Callahan can drill his footwork to somehow be quicker, and his arms to stop rising up then Flowers can actually have an NFL career.  But from early reports, it doesn't seem like Flowers footwork has gotten any better.

 

6 minutes ago, redskinss said:

 

I thought he was playing tackle today.

 

We signed him to compete for the starting LG job, and if he doesn't get that, he'd be the backup OT/G.  So he's going to be practicing both spots this summer.

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53 minutes ago, Alcoholic Zebra said:

 

I'm shocked!  Shocked I say!  Who would think heavy feet couldn't keep up with elite burst?

 

Still not sure how Flowers was a) drafted so high, and b) what people saw in him besides elite size.  I do remember after the draft, McCloughan (or someone else) sort of said in a roundabout way they didn't think they could trade down and still pick a OT, because Flowers was a clear downgrade.

 

So what do we do with Flowers?  His cap hit is 3.2 million.  Cutting him would save 1.7 million, but still leaves a 1.5 million dead cap hit.  He can't play OT, and he can't play Guard.  Do we keep him around in the vain hope that our OL Coach, Callahan, can work a miracle?

 

C'mon it's way too early to look at Flowers being cut.  We brought him in to see if he can play guard and we will see.  The one thing with him over the couple draft picks is that he has experience.  If he struggles, then he's gone and we have a few guys competing for the left guard position and Christian as a swing tackle.  It does hurt that we lost Nyske in the offseason as I will say having a good backup is important since you are right, Trent will miss a few games. 

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15 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

 

Is it a prank link ?

 

It’s 

giphy.gif

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Thanks for posting that, SIP. It was a decent listen. I never make too much of a player killing it in training camp or OTA's, but generally speaking, it IS very bad when a player doesn't look good. 


Also, since Jimmy Moreland had such a great week, someone posted his RAS score, etc in the appropriate welcome thread. I couldn't help but notice that Sweat's 10 yard split was significantly faster at 1.5 seconds vs. 1.56. 

 

Also, I always like to see how a player does against more elite competition. Just watched Sweat vs. Alabama. He wasn't dominant but was impactful. Multiple pressures. Very good against the run as well. Versatile. Played at both end spots and also had success with stunts and twists up the middle. I don't see how Montez winds up with less than 8 sacks this year. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Anselmheifer said:

Thanks for posting that, SIP. It was a decent listen. I never make too much of a player killing it in training camp or OTA's, but generally speaking, it IS very bad when a player doesn't look good. 


Also, since Jimmy Moreland had such a great week, someone posted his RAS score, etc in the appropriate welcome thread. I couldn't help but notice that Sweat's 10 yard split was significantly faster at 1.5 seconds vs. 1.56. 

 

Also, I always like to see how a player does against more elite competition. Just watched Sweat vs. Alabama. He wasn't dominant but was impactful. Multiple pressures. Very good against the run as well. Versatile. Played at both end spots and also had success with stunts and twists up the middle. I don't see how Montez winds up with less than 8 sacks this year. 

 

 

You know what’s great to see from Montez in this highlight tape against Alabama?  His non-stop hustle. There’s so many college players who go all out for a few plays and then take off for a bunch. Montez is consistently hustling even after the ball is thrown or the play is away from him. 

 

The more I watch him the more I see Andre Carter in him. Same kind of build and skill set except Montez is a bit better. I always loved his hustle and tenacity and if it wasn’t for a switch to a 3-4 he would have played longer here. 

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19 minutes ago, skinsfan93 said:

You know what’s great to see from Montez in this highlight tape against Alabama?  His non-stop hustle. There’s so many college players who go all out for a few plays and then take off for a bunch. Montez is consistently hustling even after the ball is thrown or the play is away from him. 

 

 

Is there any tape of any confrontations between Sweat and Pierschbacher in that game ?

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10 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

 

Is there any tape of any confrontations between Sweat and Pierschbacher in that game ?

None that I saw as Montez was lined up either on the left or right side of the line. 

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On 5/30/2019 at 7:49 AM, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

Montez becoming the best Edge in the class would be no surprise to me. Great trade by Washington.

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29 minutes ago, volsmet said:

 

Montez becoming the best Edge in the class would be no surprise to me. Great trade by Washington.

 I think that is gonna be josh allen especially with jax defense...when iwatched his cut up above against alabama...im just not too impressed with his pass rush. I dont see much bending of the edge...he gets squared up pretty easily by the offensive tackles. I like the physical traits and hustle... its just whether or not he gets it all together. 

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6 minutes ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said:

 I think that is gonna be josh allen especially with jax defense...when iwatched his cut up above against alabama...im just not too impressed with his pass rush. I dont see much bending of the edge...he gets squared up pretty easily by the offensive tackles. I like the physical traits and hustle... its just whether or not he gets it all together. 

 

True, he’s far from a finished product, but his testing showed the agility people thought he lacked prior to the combine. I had him in the top 5 before the combine, this is the rare occasion we took the guy I most wanted... well, with Ed Oliver an impossibility.

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19 minutes ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said:

 I think that is gonna be josh allen especially with jax defense...when iwatched his cut up above against alabama...im just not too impressed with his pass rush. I dont see much bending of the edge...he gets squared up pretty easily by the offensive tackles. I like the physical traits and hustle... its just whether or not he gets it all together. 

 

Josh Allen is awesome. That’s not much of an insult.

 

I’d take Sweat over Bosa for sure. Bosa is injury prone. ACL in HS. Missed almost all of last year with a soft tissue injury. Now he’s out with a hamstring. 

 

I’d take Sweat over Burns. He’s longer, much better against the run and already has a bull rush and can convert speed to power. 

 

Sweat is a converted TE. He’s only been playing DE for a short while and is already super productive. I think his floor is a 10 sack a year guy that is also good against the run. That’s a steal at pick 26. Sweat’s ceiling is tantalizing. All of that speed and length and power. I’m not even going to hypothesize about his best case scenario,  it it’s better than we’ve had in DC in my adult lifetime. 

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Lack of bend was something Danielle Hunter was heavily criticized for coming out as well. He still found a way to get 14.5 sacks last year. Albeit Hunter was younger (and a lot more raw) coming into the league.

 

Guys win in different ways. We just need for Sweat to develop an elite move, and an elite counter to that move, that can win at the NFL level.  Everything else is gravy. 

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