veteranskinsfan Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Sheehan this morning says Skins should have kept Crowder instead of going with Trey Quinn. What he fails to understand is the Skins do not keep their own players once they go to free agency. Its all about the money and they were not going to give Crowder a big paycheck. So sure Gruden would rather have kept Crowder and he said so publicly but the front office took that option away. Sheehan said Crowder is having a good year so far- no surprise at all. Ex-Skins usually perform better once they leave. For just one example, Ty Nseche is a starter now with Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 42 minutes ago, skinny21 said: Apke’s been excellent? I have no complaints about the dude (he’s not let free runners deep, so that’s nice), but what makes you say excellent? Not saying you’re wrong, I just haven’t noticed more than 2 good plays and maybe 2 decent ones. Ha, so true. That's mostly the job of the FS. Not let anyone get behind us. Hes saved a couple TDs already just from Norman blowing coverages. Hes generally around the ball and doesn't bite early. If he keeps playing so well, I think well start seeing that 4.3 speed more often and the some game changing plays will come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carex Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 29 minutes ago, veteranskinsfan said: Sheehan this morning says Skins should have kept Crowder instead of going with Trey Quinn. What he fails to understand is the Skins do not keep their own players once they go to free agency. Its all about the money and they were not going to give Crowder a big paycheck. So sure Gruden would rather have kept Crowder and he said so publicly but the front office took that option away. Sheehan said Crowder is having a good year so far- no surprise at all. Ex-Skins usually perform better once they leave. For just one example, Ty Nseche is a starter now with Bills. are you sure, cause he wasn't listed as the starter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veteranskinsfan Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Just Googled Bills starters on offense and he is listed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Bill's have 3 starting Ex Redskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carex Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 1 hour ago, veteranskinsfan said: Just Googled Bills starters on offense and he is listed. And I just googled one who listed Ford and Dawkins as starting tackles, who are the guys listed on screen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 37 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said: Bill's have 3 starting Ex Redskins. The Bills saw something in our players that our own coaches didn't see... and the Bills are 6-2 right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carex Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Just now, zskins said: The Bills saw something in our players that our own coaches didn't see... and the Bills are 6-2 right now. The Redskins starting on the Bills are Nsekhe(possibly) Murphy and Alexander. Alexander is on his third team since the Skins. Trent was praised because we weren't going to overpay for someone who'd been spotty with us and we had Preston Smith. Only Ty was complained about and at the time the Skins decided to let him go the issue with Trent wasn't worked out and you can't pay three tackles like starters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megared Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 29 minutes ago, carex said: The Redskins starting on the Bills are Nsekhe(possibly) Murphy and Alexander. Alexander is on his third team since the Skins. Trent was praised because we weren't going to overpay for someone who'd been spotty with us and we had Preston Smith. Only Ty was complained about and at the time the Skins decided to let him go the issue with Trent wasn't worked out and you can't pay three tackles like starters. Nsekhe signed with the Bills for $5 M/year. Penn will probably get the same provided his incentives were tied to playing time, and he stays on the field. They could've probably signed Nsekhe for less than that, had they not decided a year prior to not engage him in talks. They tagged him for ~$3 M in 2018. They knew he was likely going to start for ~4 games a season (even before the TW situation). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Crowder has 405 yards and 1 TD through 8 games. Lets not make it sound like we let Julio Jones out of the building. He got paid a lot for a #3 slot WR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Warhead36 said: Crowder has 405 yards and 1 TD through 8 games. Lets not make it sound like we let Julio Jones out of the building. He got paid a lot for a #3 slot WR. Damn right. Ex Redskins looking good on other teams needs to be put into context. they look decent compared to crap. Retaining them results in a difference between going 4-12 instead of 2-14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 5 hours ago, veteranskinsfan said: Sheehan this morning says Skins should have kept Crowder instead of going with Trey Quinn. What he fails to understand is the Skins do not keep their own players once they go to free agency. Its all about the money and they were not going to give Crowder a big paycheck. So sure Gruden would rather have kept Crowder and he said so publicly but the front office took that option away. Sheehan said Crowder is having a good year so far- no surprise at all. Ex-Skins usually perform better once they leave. For just one example, Ty Nseche is a starter now with Bills. I think it's impossible to really judge the true potential of these WRs with these QBs. Like how Crowder wasnt doing anything when Luke Falk was the QB. Quinn shoulda had 2 TDs and 150 yards against one of those teams if we had a QB worth a damn. Was it the Giants where he got loose twice down the field and Keenum kept missing him? As far as Nskehe, I wont pretend to have watched a lot of Bills OL play to know how he's doing, but simply being a starter doesnt mean much. He was decent when he was a starter here, is he performing better now? The truth of it is, when he signed with Buffalo, the Skins didnt know Trent was gonna hold out. Maybe he woulda stayed otherwise. And frankly, Flowers at his age and price tag has played well enough that I would prefer that over paying up for an older Nsekhe to insert at G. And Moses wasnt going anywhere so what were they gonna do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 3 hours ago, carex said: The Redskins starting on the Bills are Nsekhe(possibly) Murphy and Alexander. Alexander is on his third team since the Skins. Trent was praised because we weren't going to overpay for someone who'd been spotty with us and we had Preston Smith. Only Ty was complained about and at the time the Skins decided to let him go the issue with Trent wasn't worked out and you can't pay three tackles like starters. To be fair to Alexander, he's 36, about to retire, and wasnt intended to be a full time starter anymore. And he did make the Pro Bowl at LB one of those years. He's been a good player for the Bills overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megared Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 34 minutes ago, justice98 said: As far as Nskehe, I wont pretend to have watched a lot of Bills OL play to know how he's doing, but simply being a starter doesnt mean much. He was decent when he was a starter here, is he performing better now? The truth of it is, when he signed with Buffalo, the Skins didnt know Trent was gonna hold out. Maybe he woulda stayed otherwise. And frankly, Flowers at his age and price tag has played well enough that I would prefer that over paying up for an older Nsekhe to insert at G. And Moses wasnt going anywhere so what were they gonna do? I'm not sure how you can defend that line of thinking, when we were signing guys off of the street last season. We should've prioritized keeping the guys that played well (him, Jonathan Cooper), knowing full well that they'd probably see significant playing time, for one reason or another. In Nsekhe's case, we could've probably locked him up BEFORE we tendered him, at a much more affordable salary. The price the Bills paid wasn't what we had to give him. PFF has Nsekhe rated at 65, and Penn at 59. Penn's 36, Nsekhe is 34. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carex Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 13 minutes ago, megared said: I'm not sure how you can defend that line of thinking, when we were signing guys off of the street last season. We should've prioritized keeping the guys that played well (him, Jonathan Cooper), knowing full well that they'd probably see significant playing time, for one reason or another. In Nsekhe's case, we could've probably locked him up BEFORE we tendered him, at a much more affordable salary. The price the Bills paid wasn't what we had to give him. PFF has Nsekhe rated at 65, and Penn at 59. Penn's 36, Nsekhe is 34. Cooper missed time, in fact that's why we were able to sign him off the street and Nsekhe also missed a couple games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 2 hours ago, megared said: I'm not sure how you can defend that line of thinking, when we were signing guys off of the street last season. We should've prioritized keeping the guys that played well (him, Jonathan Cooper), knowing full well that they'd probably see significant playing time, for one reason or another. In Nsekhe's case, we could've probably locked him up BEFORE we tendered him, at a much more affordable salary. The price the Bills paid wasn't what we had to give him. PFF has Nsekhe rated at 65, and Penn at 59. Penn's 36, Nsekhe is 34. That's presuming he didnt know his own value on the open market. Why would he automatically take less from us? And basically no guarantee of a starting job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWinzit Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 3 hours ago, megared said: I'm not sure how you can defend that line of thinking, when we were signing guys off of the street last season. We should've prioritized keeping the guys that played well (him, Jonathan Cooper), knowing full well that they'd probably see significant playing time, for one reason or another. In Nsekhe's case, we could've probably locked him up BEFORE we tendered him, at a much more affordable salary. The price the Bills paid wasn't what we had to give him. PFF has Nsekhe rated at 65, and Penn at 59. Penn's 36, Nsekhe is 34. I think Geron was scene as Nsekhe's replacement along with a future draft pick from the 2019 draft class, that's why they didn't offer him a contract.They new he had earned a pay day and other teams would step up. He and Cooper both earned their $ last year. I was sure Cooper was the one guy they would resign. They didn't plan for TW to hold out or Moses to suck as bad as he has. I think they planned on resigning Scherff prior to the TW issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megared Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 38 minutes ago, justice98 said: That's presuming he didnt know his own value on the open market. Why would he automatically take less from us? And basically no guarantee of a starting job. We escalated his salary, by the 2nd round tender. Had we gotten something done the prior offseason (2017) we could've avoided being in that situation. If we indeed had no intentions of signing Nsekhe after 2018, why didn't we try to get something in return for him? We didn't even get a comp pick for him, after all of the maneuvering we did in 2018 to keep him. 9 minutes ago, DWinzit said: I think Geron was scene as Nsekhe's replacement along with a future draft pick from the 2019 draft class, that's why they didn't offer him a contract.They new he had earned a pay day and other teams would step up. He and Cooper both earned their $ last year. I was sure Cooper was the one guy they would resign. They didn't plan for TW to hold out or Moses to suck as bad as he has. I think they planned on resigning Scherff prior to the TW issues. Even with the complete decimation of our O-line last season, Christian didn't start a single game, and only appeared in 2. Nsekhe was considered one of the best backups in the league. Did we really think a rookie 3rd round pick was going to be able to fill that gap? I think Cooper got vet min from the Raiders, or close to it. He was cut by them (his signing was insurance for the suspended Incognito). We didn't plan on guys being unavailable due to injury either. But since there's room for 53 guys, I'd assume at least some of your depth should have the ability to step in, should they be needed. The fact that we had to scour the streets for credible NFL players indicates that our depth was/is garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carex Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 the fact that we had to scour the street for players is a sign our depth got hurt too. We finished the season with seven OL on injured reserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megared Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 11 minutes ago, carex said: the fact that we had to scour the street for players is a sign our depth got hurt too. We finished the season with seven OL on injured reserve. Tyler Catalina (G) - didn't play a single game (Shoulder) Geron Christian (T) - 0 starts, appeared in 2 (Knee) IR-ed week 11 Jonathan Cooper (G) - 4 games started (Bicep) IR-ed week 14 Arie Kouandjio (G) - didn't play a single game (Quad) Austin Howard (G) - 1 game started, appeared in 5 IR-ed week 17 Shawn Lauvao (G) - 5 games started IR-ed week 10 Brandon Scherrf (G) - 7 games started (Pec) IR-ed week 10 As you can see, our problem was mostly with Guard. Christian's injury wasn't a blip on the radar, because the top 3 guys (TW, Moses, Nsekhe) were all healthy enough to play. Trent started 13 games, Moses started all 16. If anything, that unit being uncharacteristically healthy lulled Allen into thinking he had a wealth of riches at the position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carex Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 okay... we didn't actually do much scouring the streets for tackles. Austin Howard could play guard and tackle but everyone we signed was, as you said mainly for guard I'm not sure what your point is here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megared Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 25 minutes ago, carex said: okay... we didn't actually do much scouring the streets for tackles. Austin Howard could play guard and tackle but everyone we signed was, as you said mainly for guard I'm not sure what your point is here? That we didn't have to scour the streets for a T until this season...and only because we lacked the foresight to re-sign a guy we knew could play in this system. The fact that we almost HAVE to draft a T this offseason, was a self-inflicted problem. A team with a vision (or a sense of reality of where the team is) would've used Nsekhe to leverage Trent for assets. Or they could've held onto him for insurance purposes. As it is, we're paying Penn the damn near identical salary Nsekhe is now making in Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFi Skins Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/11/12/buccaneers-cut-vernon-hargreaves/ Buccaneers cut Vernon Hargreaves Yes, we should.... see what he has moving forward. Could be a major piece for us going in to the draft. The Buccaneers have had enough of Vernon Hargreaves. Hargreaves, the cornerback who was benched on Sunday for not hustling, has been released, according to Adam Schefter of ESPN. That means he’ll be available to any team that wants to claim him on waivers. Hargreaves is a former first-round draft pick who has started every game this season, so it’s possible some team will want him down the stretch, but there’s also a fairly big risk associated with picking him up: Hargreaves’ 2020 fifth-year option salary of $9.954 million is guaranteed for injury, which means that if he were to suffer a serious injury this year that prevented him from playing next year, his new team would be on the hook for that salary. Hargreaves was the No. 11 overall pick in the 2016 NFL draft. http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/vernon-hargreaves?id=2555299 OVERVIEW Hargreaves carries the football genes of his father, Vernon II, who was on UConn's 100th anniversary's team and has coached linebackers and special teams for multiple schools (USF, Houston, Arkansas). He was the National Defensive Player of the Year by the Touchdown Club of Columbus as a senior high school, a finalist for the Florida Mr. Football award, and the Most Valuable Player of the Under Armour All-American game. So it was no surprise that he worked his way on the field as a true freshman, ranking among the leaders in the SEC with 14 passes defended, including three interceptions. Hargreaves not only earned first-team All-SEC honors in all three of his seasons in Gainesville, but also lined up multiple All-American honors in 2014 (three interceptions, 13 pass breakups) and 2015 (four interceptions, four pass break-ups) due to his playmaking ability. ANALYSIS STRENGTHS Premier, quick twitch athlete with explosion pulsing through his hips and feet. Instant click-and-close action to explode forward and attack the throw. Vertical springs to go up and over receivers at the high point. Smooth, controlled backpedal with ability to weave and mirror route progressions. Plays with outstanding body control and balance. Feet are electric. Can overwhelm lesser opponents across from him. Instinctive and urgent in his play. Excels from press, off or zone coverage. Fiery competitor with a strong desire to own the pass. Has quick, soft hands. Posted 38 passes defensed and 10 interceptions over last three years. Could see early kick or punt return action. Unwilling to stay blocked and doesn't hesitate for one moment in run support and against wide receiver screens. Chest-up tackler who runs through his target. WEAKNESSES Lean, wiry frame. Aggressive nature allows teams to bait him with double moves. Quicker than fast and doesn't have closing speed to make mistakes underneath and still recover on top. Allowed 16.5 yards per completion this season. Scouts worry about his height outside. Big receivers will pose a challenge on the next level. Had his two worst games of the season in SEC Championship game against Alabama and Citrus Bowl against Michigan. Willingness to throw body around in run support could cause him to break down. DRAFT PROJECTION Round 1 NFL COMPARISON Joe Haden BOTTOM LINE While scouts have voiced some concerns about Hargreaves' size and recovery speed, you won't find anyone who doesn't admire his competitiveness and consistency of production. Hargreaves has a level of suddenness and explosiveness in his movements that should always have him near the ball. With top-notch ball skills and exceptional instincts that drew praise from Alabama's Nick Saban, Hargreaves possesses the football makeup to become a Pro Bowl cornerback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drowland Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 If Hargreaves is claimed off waivers does the team inherit his 5th year option? It would be so Redskins to claim him, he gets hurt and they're forced to pay his $9M salary in 2020. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 30 minutes ago, drowland said: If Hargreaves is claimed off waivers does the team inherit his 5th year option? Yes they would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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