Riggo-toni

The 2019 Free Agency Tracker -Added: Landon Collins, Rodgers-Cromartie, Flowers. Lost:Preston Smith, Nsekhe, Crowder, HaHa

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5 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

I'm not ok with this if it means that we aren't going to sign or draft other players. If we are taking a flyer on a young project, I'm fine with it. 

 

This will not impact our draft plans or board at all. It will probably mean we are not going to sign another vet swing tackle and maybe guard though.

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20 minutes ago, MartinC said:

 

Ty does

 

Ty wanted a chance to start

38 minutes ago, MartinC said:

My 2 cents on Flowers.

 

1. That's too much money for a project. I don't know if other teams were in on him as well but i can't imagine there was much of a bidding war. I would not be surprised if we were essentially bidding against ourselves.

 

 

he's only guaranteed 1.5 mil, that's not even double vet minimum

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44 minutes ago, MartinC said:

2. That's probably too big a deal to give to someone you project just as a backup. They must be hoping he can start (he has playing time incentives as part of the deal) - and that would be at LG.

 

You say in later post that this signing won't change our draft plans or board, I think that's a worry as it implies that we wouldn't be looking for a plug in starting LG high in the draft, which is something that we should be.

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2 hours ago, Master Blaster said:

 

It never ceases to amaze me how posters on here think moves by other teams are good simply because they know the name. 

Yeah but at the same time you see other teams making moves to try and improve themselves while we sit and listen to crickets chirp outside Redskin Park.

I overreacted in the rumors of Berry and Quinn be pursued by our division rival and I really hope the boys overpay for their services. But what are our guys doing? Have they inquire about Josh Sitton for our need at guard? Or have they contacted any wrs that are still available? We need to make some noise for a 7-9 team.

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Just now, MEANDWARF said:

Yeah but at the same time you see other teams making moves to try and improve themselves while we sit and listen to crickets chirp outside Redskin Park.

I overreacted in the rumors of Berry and Quinn be pursued by our division rival and I really hope the boys overpay for their services. But what are our guys doing? Have they inquire about Josh Sitton for our need at guard? Or have they contacted any wrs that are still available? We need to make some noise for a 7-9 team.

 

Yes every move the Redskins have made was in hopes of being a worse team because of it.  Great point.

 

Again, you bring up Sitton because you know the name.  You wholly ignore his age and injury history, which is not what this team needs.

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5 minutes ago, MEANDWARF said:

Yeah but at the same time you see other teams making moves to try and improve themselves while we sit and listen to crickets chirp outside Redskin Park.

 

You have to remember that those crickets costs us 4yr $44M in contracts.  🤣

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Love to hear regular checkups now that we know we plan to move him to guard instead of speculating.

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9 minutes ago, Master Blaster said:

 

Yes every move the Redskins have made was in hopes of being a worse team because of it.  Great point.

 

Again, you bring up Sitton because you know the name.  You wholly ignore his age and injury history, which is not what this team needs.

Whatever, life goes on!

5 minutes ago, RabidFan said:

 

You have to remember that those crickets costs us 4yr $44M in contracts.  🤣

Expensive crickets!😜

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53 minutes ago, carex said:

 

Ty wanted a chance to start

 

he's only guaranteed 1.5 mil, that's not even double vet minimum

Guaranteed is the word though. He didn't warrant guaranteed money. So yeah bad contract.

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Flowers came out of the same draft as Sheriff right ? So it is safe to assume that our current coaching staff has a good deal of data on him and what his abilities / liabilities are. If you account for that, plus the fact that we are paying him next to nothing and he is only 24, this signing seems like a smart move. 

 

yes I know that "smart" and Redskins don't often meet up in the same sentence, but this could very well pan out into a good depth move.

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Let's be honest that Flowers contract is slightly more than scrub money other than if he plays a fair amount of games this year. No big deal to me.

 

What will piss me off is if it is seen in isolation as the LG solution and we then pass over drafting OL within the first three rounds. We simply have to draft a very good OL prospect this year to compete for LG.

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1 hour ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

 

You say in later post that this signing won't change our draft plans or board, I think that's a worry as it implies that we wouldn't be looking for a plug in starting LG high in the draft, which is something that we should be.

 

I don't think it implies that - or at least that's not what I intended to imply.

 

There is good depth to the guard/interior O'Line group. I think it's still very possible we take a C/G in the first 3 rounds (more likely 3rd) who could come in ands compete to start right away.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Burden of proof is on the Skins and Flowers himself. 

 

They’re the perpetual **** ups lol 

Also, this is another move where there’s no clear upgrade to team. In fact, this might be a downgrade even from Lauvao since he was actually a guard. 

 

Outside of Collins (and even there, I’m unsure of the actual on field talent upgrade compared to DJ), there’s been no improvement from opening day 2018. 

 

For the Collins signing I'd give an A --overpaid him some but i love the player.  Is he way better than Swearinger?  Don't know but DJ is gone.  Keenum I'd give the deal a B -- as for the player on pure talent I'd give it a C.  DRC I am fine with.  As to Flowers I am not so sure.  I don't hate it aside from wondering why give up these comp picks they would accumulate otherwise.  But yeah it is plausible to me he's a bust.  Will see.  If so, he'd be a cheap bust aside from losing the 6th rounder. 

 

But I agree with your overall point, this team likely isn't better or if it is better it would be just a little better.  It feels like a 6-10 team to me right now.    But heck if they crash and burn its not the end of the world IMO if it leads to change.  Listening to Russell-Finlay right now.  They are giving the impression (as did Hoffman yesterday) that Jay might be nervous about the offense in its current configuration.

 

Dolphins seem to be determined to get Tua and are working on accruing picks for 2020 and shedding veterans for a rebuild.  Going the Cleveland Browns route it seems.  The Redskins don't seem to believe in that.  Much better in the long run to have a 3-13 season than a 6-10 season IMO.  But I'd bet the FO doesn't think its a 6-10 roster and they are pushing for that 9-7 golden year.   

 

Having said that, we still got the draft and some time in FA.   If I was so determined to win now with my sights on a 9-7 sneak into the playoffs year -- I'd draft a pass rusher at 15 and then a LG in the 2nd round and hope the defense and running game could lead the way much like it did at the beginning of last year. 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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1 hour ago, carex said:

 

he's only guaranteed 1.5 mil, that's not even double vet minimum

 

If we guaranteed him $1.5M its at least likely he makes the roster and that would mean he gets $3.2M plus any playing time incentives he earns.

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37 minutes ago, TheBlueIndian said:

Flowers came out of the same draft as Sheriff right ? So it is safe to assume that our current coaching staff has a good deal of data on him and what his abilities / liabilities are. If you account for that, plus the fact that we are paying him next to nothing and he is only 24, this signing seems like a smart move. 

 

yes I know that "smart" and Redskins don't often meet up in the same sentence, but this could very well pan out into a good depth move.

That would make sense but apparently we make moves regardless of coaches analysis....

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39 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

For the Collins signing I'd give an A --overpaid him some but i love the player.  Is he way better than Swearinger?  Don't know but DJ is gone.  Keenum I'd give the deal a B -- as for the player on pure talent I'd give it a C.  DRC I am fine with.  As to Flowers I am not so sure.  I don't hate it aside from wondering why give up these comp picks they would accumulate otherwise.  But yeah it is plausible to me he's a bust.  Will see.  If so, he'd be a cheap bust aside from losing the 6th rounder.

 

The Giants were supposedly considering franchising Collins, no one ever considered franchising Swearinger

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, carex said:

 

The Giants were supposedly considering franchising Collins, no one ever considered franchising Swearinger

 

You won't find a bigger cheerleader on this thread for the Collins signing.  But not sure it matters that the Giants considered franchising Collins and elected not to do it versus no team ever franchised Swearinger.

 

I personally think Collins is better than Swearinger and by a decent margin but not by a mile.  Nonetheless, Swearinger isn't here so the choice isn't Collins versus him.   I gather BraveontheWarpath93's point is we've seen this team with a good safety mixed in the soup and factoring that along with everything else is this 2019 team actually better than the 2018 one?  

 

While I love the Collins signing I agree with his overall point the 2019 team isn't better than the 2018 team when you factor additions and subtractions.  But my point on the FA thread from the get go is I don't care.  I don't mind if this team is the same old and same old or even worse because to me there is a rare upside to that in the long run.  On the other hand, if they strike gold and improve then that's even better.    For me its a no lose season.  I always root for them to win and for the best to happen.  But for this year in particular I don't think its the end of the world if they don't pull that off if this is a win or heads will roll season as some purport.  

 

It's still though I think premature to judge.  If the team went to battle right now IMO its a 6-10 season.  But they aren't going to battle now. 

  

 

 

Edited by Skinsinparadise

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Besides having a good coach Flowers also can get the advice of another OT turned OG in Scherff

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Posted (edited)

I'd rather have a $1.5 mil/yr Flowers in camp and time for our system vs. signing guys off the street in the middle of the season...

 

 

Edited by HigSkin
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Flowers is our best signing so far. We need a starter at guard and depth across the oline. 

 

If he doesn't work out here then he is pretty much done in the nfl. That's the best motivation a player can have. 

 

Flowers was drafted highly and I think the switch to guard will be good for him. If not, we didn't gamble much. 

 

Hopefully this move will prevent an oline reach in the first round. 

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23 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

You won't find a bigger cheerleader on this thread for the Collins signing.  But not sure it matters that the Giants considered franchising Collins and elected not to do it versus no team ever franchised Swearinger.

 

I personally think Collins is better than Swearinger and by a decent margin but not by a mile.  Nonetheless, Swearinger isn't here so the choice isn't Collins versus him.   I gather BraveontheWarpath93's point is we've seen this team with a good safety mixed in the soup and factoring that along with everything else is this 2019 team actually better than the 2018 one?  

 

While I love the Collins signing I agree with his overall point the 2019 team isn't better than the 2018 team when you factor additions and subtractions.  But my point on the FA thread from the get go is I don't care.  I don't mind if this team is the same old and same old or even worse because to me there is a rare upside to that in the long run.  On the other hand, if they strike gold and improve then that's even better.    For me its a no lose season.  I always root for them to win and for the best to happen.  But for this year in particular I don't think its the end of the world if they don't pull that off if this is a win or heads will roll season as some purport.  

 

It's still though I think premature to judge.  If the team went to battle right now IMO its a 6-10 season.  But they aren't going to battle now. 

  

 

 

 agreed.... the team did not get better, in fact i would argue it got worse in 2019 so far with losses of Crowder and Smith and no real replacement for either on the team pre draft.

I do like the signing of Keenum to shore up QB position with decent depth.

Collins offsets the Swerringer loss but is not a major upgrade

Healthy Guice and CT could be interesting if used effectively.

 

We have MAJOR holes at WR and to a lesser degree at outside linebacker. We dont know how long R Foster will be suspended for but i am bracing for a min of 4 games as this will be his 2nd suspension. With Z brown being cut our LBs are worse off at least for the beginning of the season. O line depth is an issue.

 

saying all this i am not sure what everyone is expecting FA wise ... with our salary cap limitations and the fact that most of the FAs so far have been grossly overpaid and will not play up to the contracts signed.. happens every year,  I am not all that upset by Skins being mostly quiet. You can make an argument that FO should have made more of a push to sign crowder and Smith earlier but you could just as easily make an argument against both since both got overpaid based on ability to stay healthy and performance. With the amount of pics Skins have and having mostly good drafts recently, they should be able to replace these losses in the draft as long as they dont trade them all away to trade up for a qb.

 

After the draft I am expecting to see a much better/ more complete team overall (at least on paper) 

 

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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, Califan007 said:

 

So Flowers' contract is $4M guaranteed for one year?...Because Peterson's contract was announced as 2 yrs/$8M, and people started criticizing paying a 33/34 year old that much to be a backup, etc, etc...of course the details of the contract showed that it was nowhere near paying AP $4M/yr and only guaranteed $2.5M of it. If we don't know the details of the Flowers contract yet, it is absolutely asinine to take that initial contract number and run with it as if that's all you need to know. Galdi should know better. In fact, Galdo DOES know better...he always talks about waiting to hear the details of the contract before passing judgment. So unless it's been verified (and I don't know either way if it has), better to just wait and see.

$1.5 Million is reportedly what is guaranteed (He didn't warrant any guaranteed money). Cap hit is $3.2 million. Now the Redskins could cut him if he doesn't work out prior to the 1st game to recoup $1.7M of the cap hit, but are on the hook for the $1.5 million.  To be clear I'm not complaining as much about the $3.2 million it is the 1.5 that shows the stupidity of the front office.  If he makes it to week 1 (Without being cut)  he'll make $3.2mil - no ands ifs or buts that is way too much to be paying him.  Hope he turns his career around and makes whatever the $800,000k in incentives are.

 

Edit

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/washington-redskins/ereck-flowers-16733/

Edited by nonniey
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8 minutes ago, nonniey said:

$1.5 Million is reportedly what is guaranteed (He didn't warrant any guaranteed money). Cap hit is $3.2 million. Now the Redskins could cut him if he doesn't work out prior to the 1st game to recoup $1.7M of the cap hit, but are on the hook for the $1.5 million.  To be clear I'm not complaining about the $3.2 million it is the 1.5 that shows the stupidity of the front office. 

 

That tells me they are going to keep trying to make him a Guard all year long even if it doesn't work out.

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The Flowers contract cannot really be judged at this point though.  We don't know what other offers he may have had on the table and so it is reasonable to assume he would not have signed for less, certainly he would be unlikely to rush into signing for vet minimum this early in the FA process and presumably we wanted to lock him down and this is what it took.  We have a good, maybe great OL Coach and for the most part our scouting department is decent too and they clearly believe he is going to contribute in a meaningful way.  It is entirely possible once the games start that we look at this contract as a steal for us, if the transition to guard is a success and he becomes even half of the player he was projected to be then he will be an upgrade.

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51 minutes ago, @SkinsGoldPants said:

 

That tells me they are going to keep trying to make him a Guard all year long even if it doesn't work out.

 

They should have made this into a 2 year contract... if Flowers works out as a Guard then i guess we will lose him to FA hoping to recoup a comp pick in 2021

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