Riggo-toni

The 2019 Free Agency Tracker -Added: Landon Collins, Rodgers-Cromartie, Donald Penn, Flowers, Smallwood. Lost:Preston Smith, Nsekhe, Crowder, HaHa

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15 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

Look at Reed. He's been injured AF since signing his contract. Think he would make that money on the FA market now?

Honestly, he was injured AF before the extension, which is why I hated giving it to him. He was the perfect example of a guy it would have been smart to sell high on and trade before gambling big money on him.

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46 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

Honestly, he was injured AF before the extension, which is why I hated giving it to him. He was the perfect example of a guy it would have been smart to sell high on and trade before gambling big money on him.

Is his contract ending soon?

 

He might be a good mid season trade candidate if he can stay healthy and produce for the first part of the season. 

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29 minutes ago, sportjunkie07 said:

Is his contract ending soon?

 

He might be a good mid season trade candidate if he can stay healthy and produce for the first part of the season. 

He's signed thru 2021. Basically (a little rounding) his salaries are about 8, 8.5, 9 with roster bonuses. 

 

He would need to be healthy and produce at a level he hasn't for a couple of years to be worth anything. And that would require some foresight from Bruce and Co. 

 

So no real chance. 

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2 hours ago, sportjunkie07 said:

Is his contract ending soon?

 

He might be a good mid season trade candidate if he can stay healthy and produce for the first part of the season. 

Reed was a heck of a talent...maybe he still is, but he has been steadily declining each year in his career it seems. I doubt we could get much, if anything for him so our only hope is to hope he can get healthy and produce I guess. Unless we could cut him and get some cap relief. His injuries have been synonymous with the lack of success of the team the past few years. If we draft a TE in the 1st or 2nd round I would imagine we'd be moving on from Reed. 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, KillBill26 said:

...

So maybe saying scherff has all the leverage in the world may not be the best way to put it, but I definitely think he is, and will remain, in the driver's seat.  With a front office fighting to retain their jobs, having scherff walk could be the straw that breaks the camel's back as far as a front office overhaul. Imo, the Redskins need scherff more than scherff needs the Redskins.

Scherff will turn 28 this season and although he probably has two contracts left in his career,  you have to think he is expecting his next contract to be the one that sets him up for retirement.  I would think he'd want top five money for RGs, which is $10M+/year.  Which means that the Skins could save money this year by giving him a new contract.

 

Of course, Bruce may wisely think that after an injury it would make sense to pay him the $12M extension and make this a prove-it year.  Then, after he is a pro-bowler, offer him $10M/year in 2020.  When he wants $11M/year after "proving it", franchise him for $13M.  In 2021, offer him $11M/yr and tag him for $15.6M while waiting for a counteroffer.  Of course, the counteroffer will never come because at $15.6M, he'll be the highest paid RG in history and he'll be a season away from signing with a SB contender.  Its a solid strategy, one that's paid off for a master negotiator like Bruce time and time again.

Edited by theTruthTeller
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13 minutes ago, theTruthTeller said:

Scherff will turn 28 this season and although he probably has two contracts left in his career,  you have to think he is expecting his next contract to be the one that sets him up for retirement.  I would think he'd want top five money for RGs, which is $10M+/year.  Which means that the Skins could save money this year by giving him a new contract.

 

Of course, Bruce may wisely think that after an injury it would make sense to pay him the $12M extension and make this a prove-it year.  Then, after he is a pro-bowler, offer him $10M/year in 2020.  When he wants $11M/year after "proving it", franchise him for $13M.  In 2021, offer him $11M/yr and tag him for $15.6M while waiting for a counteroffer.  Of course, the counteroffer will never come because at $15.6M, he'll be the highest paid RG in history and he'll be a season away from signing with a SB contender.  Its a solid strategy, one that's paid off for a master negotiator like Bruce time and time again.

The price tag will be even higher APY if he played out his contract this year plus he'd be a FA and we'd have to FT him.  Only makes sense to do a LTD with him.

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34 minutes ago, theTruthTeller said:

Scherff will turn 28 this season and although he probably has two contracts left in his career,  you have to think he is expecting his next contract to be the one that sets him up for retirement.  I would think he'd want top five money for RGs, which is $10M+/year.  Which means that the Skins could save money this year by giving him a new contract.

 

Of course, Bruce may wisely think that after an injury it would make sense to pay him the $12M extension and make this a prove-it year.  Then, after he is a pro-bowler, offer him $10M/year in 2020.  When he wants $11M/year after "proving it", franchise him for $13M.  In 2021, offer him $11M/yr and tag him for $15.6M while waiting for a counteroffer.  Of course, the counteroffer will never come because at $15.6M, he'll be the highest paid RG in history and he'll be a season away from signing with a SB contender.  Its a solid strategy, one that's paid off for a master negotiator like Bruce time and time again.

I know this isn't your point, which I don't want to take away from. But Scherff will command a lot more than $10 mil a year to be extended. In a league where Ali Marpet and Trai Turner are $11 mil Guards, Scherff will demand, and get, a good deal more than that.

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7 hours ago, Anselmheifer said:

I disagree that Scherff has all of the leverage. He is coming off a pec tendon tear and injuries happen. Career altering injuries are relatively common even if career ending ones are rare. Sometimes it's better to get your money up front. Look at Reed. He's been injured AF since signing his contract. Think he would make that money on the FA market now?

Absolutely.  No question if Jordan Reed was a FA this year, regardless of injury, he'd be getting PAID like a BOSS!!

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3 hours ago, RWJ said:

The price tag will be even higher APY if he played out his contract this year plus he'd be a FA and we'd have to FT him.  Only makes sense to do a LTD with him.

I get your point and you're right about the potential savings.  Consider if the Skins FO has a plan that includes replacing the OL...TW possibly gone in 2021.  Scherff would have to at least be Tagged for 2020 without an extension.  To replace both of them in the next 2 years it's going to cost you your 2019 1st round pick and 2020 1st round pick...or they're keeping one of them past 2020.  If they draft a OT in the 1st or 2nd round this year, I'd expect them to move Scherff.  They're always trying to get by on with some make-shift Guards.  They obviously value that position less then any of the other 3.  You can always tag a guy and then trade him as well.  If they don't get anywhere in negotiations, that doesn't mean anything until we see what happens in the draft and if Scherff can manage to stay on the field in 2019.  I always think it's valuable to see what you can get out of a player who is in a contract year.  The only difference is a franchise player...Cousins wasn't and I don't think Scherff is a Trent Williams as much as a Guard isn't an OT.

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51 minutes ago, TheShredder said:

Absolutely.  No question if Jordan Reed was a FA this year, regardless of injury, he'd be getting PAID like a BOSS!!

I hope you're joking.

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3 hours ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

I know this isn't your point, which I don't want to take away from. But Scherff will command a lot more than $10 mil a year to be extended. In a league where Ali Marpet and Trai Turner are $11 mil Guards, Scherff will demand, and get, a good deal more than that.

 

Agreed. And that scares me a little bit in all honesty. Scherff is a great player. There is no doubting that. But coming off of a torn Pec I am certainly eager to see how fast he bounces back to form. I think it might be a little prudent to wait until camp for both sides.

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On 3/17/2019 at 1:59 PM, Unbias said:

 

 

I have a serious question - Why care what a billionaire does if there's 0% chance they cares about your reaction?

 

Snyder doesn't care what we think, so getting ourselves worked up over his BS only makes us less happy. If you want to make a point don't go to games or buy merchandise. Go to games that don't involve the team and just follow them passively. He still won't care, but at least you are refusing to let him profit from his moves. 

 

 

Gary-Coleman-Confused-Gif-On-Diffrent-St

 

The only reason they would bring him in is to sit him down, show him a low-light reel of NFCE opponents destroying him and having a laugh. 

 

Actually that's some dark stuff that I wouldn't recommend, so there is literally no reason to bring him in. 

 

Edit/add - Ereck Flowers is so bad that in an effort to let us know what your getting his parents went out of their way to misspell his first name...

You're 100% correct my man.  I gave up my season tickets, I refuse to spend more any money on the team.  I care because the Redskins are part of my soul.  It's sad but I become more and more detached from the history that is my foundation in the first place with each passing year.  If this all continues I fear eventually I won't care at all.  I fear it.

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4 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

 

Agreed. And that scares me a little bit in all honesty. Scherff is a great player. There is no doubting that. But coming off of a torn Pec I am certainly eager to see how fast he bounces back to form. I think it might be a little prudent to wait until camp for both sides.

Totally agree. He's looking at 14/15mil py at least. No doubt the merits of that are being debated by Bruce and co.

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Posted (edited)
On 3/21/2019 at 7:44 AM, goskins10 said:

 

That's what everyone who is trying to get clicks says about virtually every free agent signed. That's because you pay more in free agency. The problem is they also only focus on the biggest number which is the maximum they can get paid. They do that to get people to over-react to contracts to get hits. The fact is there is only $1.5M guaranteed. That's the important number.

 

So if he ends being a camp body because he can't move to G or be the swing tackle they need - or he just short term insurance until the draft, it cost the team $1.5M. The up side is he Bill Callahan knows just little more than a talking head and turns him into a starting LG. Don't get me wrong of the talking heads Bullock is OK, but he is far from infallible. And like many of the talking heads finds out what the majority thinks then sees what he wants to see. 

 

 

 

Here are several pre-draft reports that have him going mid to late 1st. That was his grade coming out of college by most people who chime in. My point is not whether individually those people have more credibility but that there was a consensus he had first or early second day grade. 

 

And honestly after having participated in the ES Mock Draft with @clskinsfan for several years i would trust his judgement as much or more than many so called professionals. 

 

Mid to late first rd. 

http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2015eflowers.php

 

Has him as playing Guard in the NFL unless desperate for T. Giants misused him. - Late 1st rd maybe falls to the 2nd. 

https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/4/2/8183561/2015-nfl-draft-ereck-flowers-breakdown-offensive-tackle-miami

 

Kiper had a late 1st rd grade on him

https://www.nj.com/giants/2015/05/nfl_draft_2015_heres_how_the_giants_ereck_flowers.html

 

 

 

 

No one is going to "war" for Flowers. So melodramatics aside, it's a risk reward equation. Very low risk with a very high reward. If it doesn't work out they give him his $1.5M and kick him to the curb. It's not that big a deal. It's still March with the draft, OTAs and TC to go before the 53 is decided. 

 

 

 

 

To start they did not give him a $1M, at least not yet. Again, it's only $1.5M guaranteed. As for Nsekhe he is much older and has an injury history. He will turn 34 during the season. Flowers is 9 yrs younger. And Nsekhe cost a lot more - $6.2M guaranteed at signing. So the team should pay a 33 y/o with an injury history $6.2M guaranteed over a 24 y/o $1.5M with an easy out? Makes no sense. 

 

As for Crowder and Smith, the only thing I will say is both also got way over paid, especially Crowder. You are worried about $1.5M with a potential of $3.25M when Crowder got $17M guaranteed at signing and a total of $28M potential and Smith got $16M at signing, $52M total potential.  Crowder has been injured and Smith is uneven, great sometimes, disappears at others. 

 

You are not really making a good case here. Again, it's risk vs. reward. The risk is very much worth the potential reward with very little cost if it fails. 

 

 

You wrote all this garbage and did not once talk about his time in the league. Who cares about his pre-draft grades? He's been in the league. He sucks. Id argue more but you wrote that Mark Bullock says we overpaid on a backup swing tackle FOR CLICKS. Dumb. 

 

The only case I was making is Ereck Flowers sucks. You have said nothing to prove he doesnt. 

 

Congrats on continuing to stick up for the most garbage front office in pro sports. 

 

 

On 3/21/2019 at 5:16 AM, bakedtater1 said:

I don't like the flowers signing...but WE didn't pay him ****...the REDSKINS who we have no control over, might have over paid him, but WE didn't...y'all should maybe consider just joining the cheerleader side of things?..

 

 

You really just came here to hate on a guy saying "we" in a die-hard team message board? 

 

Sorry?

 

Maybe you should think a little bit about how you spend your time. 

 

People say we about teams they like. Literally millions of people.

 

Get over yourself dork.

Edited by SkinsNoles21

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On 3/21/2019 at 12:58 PM, goskins10 said:

 

Ok, you can stop with the homer bull****. It's a lazy argument. Proves you have no real point.

 

PFF is OK but not perfect or anywhere close. You have to take their grades with a grain if salt as in the end it's still mostly just opinion, I do not have the time to point out the many many crazy grades they give to people. Suffice it to say that does not really help your argument. 

 

No one is saying the Oline is great. I was more referring to your individual evaluation. But i see its not really your evaluation you just copied PFF. 

 

You dont need to point out anyone other than HaHa Clinton-Dix. 

 

Packers fans did not want him. Packers did not want him. Was graded by PFF as one of the top safeties in the league. 

 

Then he came to the Redskins and was awful here too. 

 

I like to use PFF grades but the Haha grade threw me off.

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, SkinsNoles21 said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You really just came here to hate on a guy saying "we" in a die-hard team message board? 

Oh I've never met anyone in this place so I can't hate on anyone till I meet them in person. 😁

Edited by bakedtater1
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53 minutes ago, SkinsNoles21 said:

 

 

You wrote all this garbage and did not once talk about his time in the league. Who cares about his pre-draft grades? He's been in the league. He sucks. Id argue more but you wrote that Mark Bullock says we overpaid on a backup swing tackle FOR CLICKS. Dumb. 

 

The only case I was making is Ereck Flowers sucks. You have said nothing to prove he doesnt. 

 

Congrats on continuing to stick up for the most garbage front office in pro sports. 

 

 

 

 

You really just came here to hate on a guy saying "we" in a die-hard team message board? 

 

Sorry?

 

Maybe you should think a little bit about how you spend your time. 

 

People say we about teams they like. Literally millions of people.

 

Get over yourself dork.

 

hey, he's not the only person who get pissed off when someone presumes to speak for the entire fanbase.  And he does a decent case of suggesting that Flowers has been misused his entire career

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53 minutes ago, SkinsNoles21 said:

 

I like to use PFF grades but the Haha grade threw me off.

 

I think PFF had Ezekiel Elliot as the 30th ranked RB in the NFL last season.  Good to know that the NFL rushing champion wasn't THE worst starting RB in the league... Some starters were ranked lower!

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16 hours ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

I know this isn't your point, which I don't want to take away from. But Scherff will command a lot more than $10 mil a year to be extended. In a league where Ali Marpet and Trai Turner are $11 mil Guards, Scherff will demand, and get, a good deal more than that.

$10M/yr is where the 5th highest paid RG (David DiCastro) was at according to Overthecap.com.  I probably should have put $10M++/yr to make that clear.  As always, a lot of these contracts are structured to assuage the player's feelings.  If you look at Trai Turner's pay schedule, you'll see that year 4 is iffy and year 5 he'll likely be looking for another job.  It's probably a 3-year, 8.75M/yr deal.  Ali Marpet's contract is confusing me because OTC says that it has $26M in guarantees, but looking at the specifics, there is no downside in cutting him after year 2.

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let's avoid the low grade name calling

 

find more rule-friendly and informative ways to spotlight your fellow poster's lack of intelligence and good judgment :D

 

 

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, theTruthTeller said:

$10M/yr is where the 5th highest paid RG (David DiCastro) was at according to Overthecap.com.  I probably should have put $10M++/yr to make that clear.  As always, a lot of these contracts are structured to assuage the player's feelings.  If you look at Trai Turner's pay schedule, you'll see that year 4 is iffy and year 5 he'll likely be looking for another job.  It's probably a 3-year, 8.75M/yr deal.  Ali Marpet's contract is confusing me because OTC says that it has $26M in guarantees, but looking at the specifics, there is no downside in cutting him after year 2.

The market gets reset every year, these are the top end O lineman that have been signed this offseason and that's what you need to look at when understanding what Scherff will want.

 

Keep in mind Scherff is better than them all so he's at the top of the food chain.  He is probably expecting his worth to be on par with the highest paid RT.  There's almost no doubt in my mind he wants at least $13M per year and will want a hefty guaranteed amount in those first 3 years.  There are 2 seasons to be played before what will probably be a lengthy lockout (Based on what I read from players comments about other leagues and their guaranteed contracts), players will want to collect as much as they can before that happens.

 

Capture.thumb.JPG.7b26e5af38279a38c780ad20b0079db0.JPG

 

 

Edited by JSSkinz

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SkinsNoles21 said:

 

 

You wrote all this garbage and did not once talk about his time in the league. Who cares about his pre-draft grades? He's been in the league. He sucks. Id argue more but you wrote that Mark Bullock says we overpaid on a backup swing tackle FOR CLICKS. Dumb. 

 

The only case I was making is Ereck Flowers sucks. You have said nothing to prove he doesnt. 

 

The so called "garbage" was making a point you are choosing to ignore because it does not fit your narrative. You are right about one thing. I actually agree he has not been good. But that as not the point at all.  It's all about the risk reward. Coming out of college he was projected by many to be a G. The giants insisted he be a T. It would not be the first time someone has been really bad on one position but then moved and was very good. Even if all he ends up being is a back=up it not's horrible. 

 

Calling other people posts garbage and their opinions dumb is a bully tactic, one that does not really work very well here. I am sure you can find a better way to express yourself.

 

 

Quote

 

Congrats on continuing to stick up for the most garbage front office in pro sports. 

 

I am as hard on this front office as anyone as I believe Bruce is the worst GM in the NFL. But that does not mean every single thing they do is trash. I am able to analyze things for their own face value. If you can't separate the two the conclusions are wrapped in emotion not rational thought.  

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by goskins10
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3 hours ago, theTruthTeller said:

$10M/yr is where the 5th highest paid RG (David DiCastro) was at according to Overthecap.com. 

Yeah, this is kind of a common mistake I see here, where people look at something like the top 5 contracts for a position and assume that's what sets a price tag. It isn't. Salaries go up every year as the cap does. And especially for premier players. Top players don't base their demands on contracts that were signed 3 years ago. And they especially don't limit themselves to things like Right Guard, as opposed to all Guards. 

 

The 5th highest Safety contract, for example, was about 9 mil a year before this offseason. But three guys got contracts in the $14 mil range in the last month. 

 

The kinds of players who look for top 5 money are the Za'Darius Smith types.

3 hours ago, JSSkinz said:

The market gets reset every year, these are the top end O lineman that have been signed this offseason and that's what you need to look at when understanding what Scherff will want.

 

Keep in mind Scherff is better than them all so he's at the top of the food chain.  He is probably expecting his worth to be on par with the highest paid RT.  There's almost no doubt in my mind he wants at least $13M per year and will want a hefty guaranteed amount in those first 3 years.  There are 2 seasons to be played before what will probably be a lengthy lockout (Based on what I read from players comments about other leagues and their guaranteed contracts), players will want to collect as much as they can before that happens.

Basically this. 

3 hours ago, theTruthTeller said:

 As always, a lot of these contracts are structured to assuage the player's feelings.  If you look at Trai Turner's pay schedule, you'll see that year 4 is iffy and year 5 he'll likely be looking for another job.  It's probably a 3-year, 8.75M/yr deal.  Ali Marpet's contract is confusing me because OTC says that it has $26M in guarantees, but looking at the specifics, there is no downside in cutting him after year 2.

You're right about Turner's deal, it's more lie 9 mil a year.. But the Market deal will pay him over 10 mil per year, no matter when he's cut.

 

Anyway, those were just quick examples of players no one thinks are in Scherff's league, and Scherff and his agent will rightly not even entertain the idea of being paid in their range.

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We have three lineman who are getting paid pretty decently. Trent, Moses and I assume Brandon. If you have 3 lineman “good” enough to get paid, then they better ne dominate and outside of Trent I don’t think we are a great oline team. Just my opinion. 

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1 hour ago, dyst said:

We have three lineman who are getting paid pretty decently. Trent, Moses and I assume Brandon. If you have 3 lineman “good” enough to get paid, then they better ne dominate and outside of Trent I don’t think we are a great oline team. Just my opinion. 

We have to do well in our drafts.  We have one of the best capologist in the NFL.   I for one would like to see Kyle Smith be allowed to do the drafting w/o any influence for the next 2 year and see what type players he can put on the field.

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