Trade up to draft Haskins???

[SprintBomb]

Just now, Renegade7 said:

 

I don't trust him, are you even listening to me?  And no, no it hasn't been done by just Real GMs with football knowledge, it is not uncommon for a desperate franchise to trade up for a QB, there is no moratorium on doing what you gotta do in that regard. 

Keep playing fantasy football 

[Renegade7]

2 minutes ago, SprintBomb said:

Keep playing fantasy football 

http://www.footballperspective.com/teams-traded-up-for-a-1st-round-qb-16-times-from-2005-to-2017/

 

I'll be here when the combine happens whether you like it or not.

[SprintBomb]

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

http://www.footballperspective.com/teams-traded-up-for-a-1st-round-qb-16-times-from-2005-to-2017/

 

I'll be here when the combine happens whether you like it or not.

I don't care where you are. You think this team is a actually stable enough to sustain giving up draft picks, your nuts? I'm watching the Rams in the playoffs right now. Remember the Rams? The team that we gave all those picks too in order to draft RG3, the franchise QB we needed so desperately. 😂😂😂

[Renegade7]

29 minutes ago, SprintBomb said:

I don't care where you are. You think this team is a actually stable enough to sustain giving up draft picks, your nuts? I'm watching the Rams in the playoffs right now. Remember the Rams? The team that we gave all those picks too in order to draft RG3, the franchise QB we needed so desperately. 😂😂😂

 

I do, and how many of those picks we traded them are still on the Rams roster?  One of them, and he's not starting.

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/2016/03/07/washington-redskins-st-louis-rams-robert-griffin-trade-players

 

This team isn't stable enough to not have a franchise QB.  We can keep trading points with sources or continue trading emojis, your choice.

 

Edit: If anything, the Rams after that trade are perfect example of a team with a plethora of picks and doing pretty much nothing with it. That could easily be us in a trade down scenario.  They also had Bradford at the time of the trade, who was 25 at the time.  No doubt if they were in our situation with three QBs at age 32 or older, they would've take a QB at some point, too (even used them to trade up for someone else).

[SprintBomb]

15 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

I do, and how many of those picks we traded them are still on the Rams roster?  One of them, and he's not starting.

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/2016/03/07/washington-redskins-st-louis-rams-robert-griffin-trade-players

 

This team isn't stable enough to not have a franchise QB.  We can keep trading points with sources or continue trading emojis, your choice.

 

Edit: If anything, the Rams after that trade are perfect example of a team with a plethora of picks and doing pretty much nothing with it. That could easily be us in a trade down scenario.  They also had Bradford at the time of the trade, who was 25 at the time.  No doubt if they were in our situation with three QBs at age 32 or older, they would've take a QB at some point, too (even used them to trade up for someone else).

Keep dreaming brother. A rookie QB isn't going to fix this team. It's like putting a band-aid on a broken arm ,but ok your right. Let's give Arizona or whoever whatever they want. HTTR

[@DCGoldPants]

2 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

if they stay healthy. 

 

This franchise has taken thst approach way too often and it doesn't work. 

 

I'm stunned that you'd trade up for any QB in this draft. Stunned, I say! 

[Renegade7]

12 minutes ago, SprintBomb said:

Keep dreaming brother. A rookie QB isn't going to fix this team. It's like putting a band-aid on a broken arm ,but ok your right. Let's give Arizona or whoever whatever they want. HTTR

 

It's okay, we can come back to this later.  I never said give them whatever they want, there was a discussion on the point system about a page or two ago.

 

I get that a lot of people don't agree with me on this, I'm not even surprised by the poll results.  But I'm open to having a legit conversation about it because this is one of the few places that its possible to do so.  

7 minutes ago, @SkinsGoldPants said:

 

This franchise has taken thst approach way too often and it doesn't work. 

 

I'm stunned that you'd trade up for any QB in this draft. Stunned, I say! 

1

 

No they haven't, they've been getting players with injury history so they can have bargins in draft postiion and contract negotionations and a built in excuse when too many of them get hurt.  If we keep doing that at QB, we're doomed and my kids will never want to be Redskins fans and likely neither will theirs.

 

Edit:  When combine comes around and scouts and professionals say to back off of this guy, I will too. But right now they are saying the opposite, so I'm all in right now.

[skinfan2k]

a Rookie QB even if he is the next tom brady won't help because we have 0 playmakers on offense. 

[Renegade7]

7 minutes ago, skinfan2k said:

a Rookie QB even if he is the next tom brady won't help because we have 0 playmakers on offense. 

*sigh, its not like we aren't going to get playmakers if we have a Tom Brady here.  

 

Not saying this guy will be, but this is bigger then next year or year after that.  I mean, if he's here 10 years, at some point he will have what he needs to make noise.  I only say this because I'm not sold on CT and Reed being healthy, but when they are, they are absolutely playmakers, I don't get this logic like this is a win now move, its not.

[skinfan2k]

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

*sigh, its not like we aren't going to get playmakers if we have a Tom Brady here.  

 

Not saying this guy will be, but this is bigger then next year or year after that.  I mean, if he's here 10 years, at some point he will have what he needs to make noise.  I only say this because I'm not sold on CT and Reed being healthy, but when they are, they are absolutely playmakers, I don't get this logic like this is a win now move, its not.

 

CT and Jordan reed are playmakers but its time to get rid of them both.  They are never healthy and too fragile.  They are our Ryan Zimmerman.  

[Renegade7]

Just now, skinfan2k said:

 

CT and Jordan reed are playmakers but its time to get rid of them both.  They are never healthy and too fragile.  They are our Ryan Zimmerman.  

 

I agree wholeheartedly.  They should trade them as soon as we're allowed to, but they won't do it.  They'll give CT an extension that's reasonable because he can't stay healthy and try to sell how good our offense is when he is.  This is the cycle going forward with Bruce, he's not even trying to hide it anymore, its terrifying.

[Koala]

6 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

No, but an undersized QB that is quick to leave the pocket is gonna get crushed.

 

Doesn't even matter. We have no talent on offense. Zero. Maybe half our defensive players are good.

 

If we traded our first away this year for more picks, I'd be fully behind it.

Dwayne Haskins has good size hes at least 220 lbs, and he is definitely a pocket QB, not a runner by any stretch even if hes got decent speed, which he uses reluctantly an.

 

Let's try to get past the knee jerk assumptions about black  "running" QBs, Haskins is more Roethlisberger than RG3.

 

Anyhow all of the knocks on Dwayne have to do with the knocks your expect from young inexperienced QBs -- he rushes his throws when facing the blitz, his mechanics get iffy under pressure, he relies on arm strength to fit the ball into tight windows at times. 

 

He needs a year or two of seasoning, no doubt, but he gonna be good, now the question is do we have the patience and a plan to build around him?  That's where most of my doubt is, not in Haskins, as I'm fairly certain a competent organization could turn him into an elite QB. 

 

 

[SprintBomb]

1 minute ago, Koala said:

Dwayne Haskins has good size hes at least 220 lbs, and he is definitely a pocket QB, not a runner by any stretch even if hes got decent speed, which he uses reluctantly an.

 

Let's try to get past the knee jerk assumptions about black  "running" QBs, Haskins is more Roethlisberger than RG3.

 

Anyhow all of the knocks on Dwayne have to do with the knocks your expect from young inexperienced QBs -- he rushes his throws when facing the blitz, his mechanics get iffy under pressure, he relies on arm strength to fit the ball into tight windows at times. 

 

He needs a year or two of seasoning, no doubt, but he gonna be good, now the question is do we have the patience and a plan to build around him?  That's where most of my doubt is, not in Haskins, as I'm fairly certain a competent organization could turn him into an elite QB. 

 

 

 Unfortunately, we are not a competent organization 

[skinfan2k]

we need to tank for trevor lawerence.  This organization is too stupid, too impatient and doesn't allow anyone to make mistakes to grow as a player to develop a franchise qb that needs some seasoning. 

lawrence is like andrew luck.  They can command an offense from the start

[scstand]

We do need to draft a QB this year but we cant trade up for Haskins, too many holes to fill for someone needing years to groom.  I've watched several OSU games this and do not recall many snaps under center so I would have a concern about footwork and timing under center, in addition to previously mentioned concerns. 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

1 hour ago, Renegade7 said:

*sigh, its not like we aren't going to get playmakers if we have a Tom Brady here.  

 

Not saying this guy will be, but this is bigger then next year or year after that.  I mean, if he's here 10 years, at some point he will have what he needs to make noise.  I only say this because I'm not sold on CT and Reed being healthy, but when they are, they are absolutely playmakers, I don't get this logic like this is a win now move, its not.

 

Tom Brady, in that offensive scheme, makes guys playmakers. Those playmakers go to other teams and most look quite a bit different.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, skinfan2k said:

we need to tank for trevor lawerence.  This organization is too stupid, too impatient and doesn't allow anyone to make mistakes to grow as a player...

2

 

You sure about that?

[Renegade7]

Just now, Califan007 said:

 

Tom Brady, in that offensive scheme, makes guys playmakers. Those playmakers go to other teams and most look quite a bit different.

 

This is a point I didn't want to bring up yet without getting to the combine.  Brady is the best QB in NFL history, kinda want to avoid comparisons to him just yet.  But great QBs absolutely can help hide other problems with a team and bad QBs can absolutely make a team look worse then it is.  We see this all the time.

[SprintBomb]

7 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

This is a point I didn't want to bring up yet without getting to the combine.  Brady is the best QB in NFL history, kinda want to avoid comparisons to him just yet.  But great QBs absolutely can help hide other problems with a team and bad QBs can absolutely make a team look worse then it is.  We see this all the time.

The Redskins are not the Patriots. The Redskins are not good. They are not owned by the Krafts and are not coached by Belichic. The Patriots have put together a deep roster and it took them years to do it and maintain it. Inserting a rookie QB into the Patriots roster, coached by a multi Super Bowl winning coach coach/GM, may work. Redskins don't have that. 

[Renegade7]

43 minutes ago, scstand said:

We do need to draft a QB this year but we cant trade up for Haskins, too many holes to fill for someone needing years to groom.  I've watched several OSU games this and do not recall many snaps under center so I would have a concern about footwork and timing under center, in addition to previously mentioned concerns. 

 

That's a good point.  From what I've seen and read, he seems solid candidate for WCO, this article even has us a list of teams that would be an ideal fit for:

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/dwayne-haskins-declares-for-2019-nfl-draft-here-are-the-quarterbacks-five-best-fits/

 

Quote

Dwayne Haskins has declared for the 2019 NFL Draft, to the surprise of ... not many. But it did make us wonder, which NFL teams would represent the best fit for the record-setting, one-year starter at Ohio State?

Haskins flashed the ability to push the ball down the field in 2018, as 70 percent of his throws made 30 or more yards downfield were deemed "on target" by Sports Info Solutions. He had 10 touchdowns, one interception, and a passer rating of 124.3 on those deep throws.  

However, Haskins mostly shredded defenses with the quick passing game, which allowed the Buckeyes' skill-position talent to thrive. Of his 533 attempts in 2018, 482 of them (90.4 percent) came 20 or fewer yards downfield (or behind the line of scrimmage). And 73.1 percent of Haskins' attempts were made 10 yards or fewer down the field. 

Sure, a lot of that had to do with Ohio State's scheme, but it's safe to say the speed at which Haskins can get through his reads and his pinpoint ball placement at the short-to-intermediate levels make him an ideal quarterback prospect to run the West Coast Offense. 

The vast majority of the NFL runs some variant of the West Coast Offense, yet a few teams, coaches, and offensive coordinators are more rooted in that famed scheme than others. Those clubs represent Haskins' best fits; here's a look at each.

 

 

Jay doesn't just need a young QB, he needs someone that can run his offense.  A lot of people have noticed how AP has looked better in shotgun as well then he has previously in his career and even catching more passes. Even if we see a lot of shotgun with that being Hanskin's strength, I'm not as scared of it nullifying AP as a lot of articles wrote our offense would when we signed him.  

 

Just out of curiosity, I actually found this pretty interesting:

 

https://www.sharpfootballstats.com/snap-rates--shotgun-v-under-center--off-.html

 

It's almost expected to be a run out of undercenter, a pass in shotgun, and teams on average are in shotgun more then under center.  Cool actually seeing that in numbers, but we aren't even trying to hid it:  

 

We're in Shotgun in 62% overall, 68% of the time we're under center we run, 78% of the time we're in shotgun we pass.

[Renegade7]

13 minutes ago, SprintBomb said:

The Redskins are not the Patriots. The Redskins are not good. They are not owned by the Krafts and are not coached by Belichic. The Patriots have put together a deep roster and it took them years to do it and maintain it. Inserting a rookie QB into the Patriots roster, coached by a multi Super Bowl winning coach coach/GM, may work. Redskins don't have that. 

 

Do me a favor and stop talking to me like I'm 5 years old with your captain obvious routine.  

 

Let's not even get into how much Brady has had to save their ass since the first 3 super bowls they won.  Patriots haven't drafted somebody in the first round that went to the Pro Bowl since 2012.  Hell, you think they don't have a first round pick in three of the last 6 years if they didn't have the best QB of all-time who somehow is still playing at an all-pro level in his early 40s?

[88Comrade2000]

No.  The Skins will go into the season with Colt and JJ or they may sign a stop gap QB.

 

2020  or later is when we draft our franchise QB.  you focus on building up other areas; so that franchise QB will have the pieces around him. 

[Koolblue13]

7 hours ago, Koala said:

 

 

Let's try to get past the knee jerk assumptions about black  "running" QBs, Haskins is more Roethlisberger than RG3.

 

I honestly didnt know he was black. I've just read about him here and don't watch college. Between his name and baseball, I assumed he was a white guy.

[Koolblue13]

12 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Yes, because people are going to stop going to the games and none of what your talking about will matter without a franchise QB.  I disagree on only having one starting olinemen, i think we have 3-4 and need a 5th plus better, younger depth in case any of them get hurt.  But if you don't want to have this convo, don't keep coming in here being disrespectful.

People dont go to games because the team sucks most of the time and has for 25 years. The team sucks because we've flushed too many draft picks and made poor decisions in FA. 

 

We're just starting to turn that around and you're suggesting trading the future away, in a QB poor draft to move up for another one year wonder. Now that is disrespectful. 

[Burgold]

9 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Does our front office, coaching staff, or roster look anything like what Philly had last year or this year?  You're reaching even suggesting we'd have similar results with Foles here.

In fairness, Philly's roster was considered one of the worst in the league the year Chip Kelly was fired. Two years later that team won a Superbowl with a back up QB that was almost run out of the league for ineffectiveness.

 

I believe we have much more talent then we display on the field especially on defense. I think we won games at the beginning of the year on pure defensive talent in an incredibly vanilla scheme which meant our guys just beat their guys and it stayed that way until someone figured out the chess move to beat us. Unfortunately, our coaching staff never found a counter move.

 

I'm not sure about our talent offensively. I thought Richardson had some moments, but Thompson, Reed, and Crowder were basically no shows last year. We needed them to be the players they were historically. Quinn flashed, but man, he might be one of our most fragile players and that's saying a lot, but on a pure talent/roster basis... I think you bring over Philly's staff and our 7-9 team wins at least nine and maybe ten games. If nothing else, the Philly staff probably would have kept Bibbs who was producing and overachieving him over Marshall who the team values for his potential despite him never doing anything. If Bibbs is on the field, Alex Smith may never have suffered that injury.

[Renegade7]

43 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

 

We're just starting to turn that around and you're suggesting trading the future away, in a QB poor draft to move up for another one year wonder. Now that is disrespectful. 

 

With all do respect, you were the one that answered the question without knowing anything about him.  They are going to pick this guy apart over the next couple months to help determine if he really is going to be special, but there's a lot of people leaning in that direction right now, hard. 

 

Plus he grew up in the area, there's a lot more to this for me saying it's worth it then any depth player that can be thrown in this discussion.  Mess around and we get to April and there's a bidding war for that top pick, maybe then ill step back, but it will just scream that more people agree with me that he's worth it. 

 

Having an elite franchise QB is worth giving up a couple first round picks, how many would you have given up to have one in the last how many years?  I'm sorry, I meant to say decades.