Jump to content
Washington Football Team Logo
Extremeskins

The Season WILL Begin Anew Next August


kleese

Recommended Posts

18 hours ago, kleese said:

 

I don't disagree with anything you just said. But we've gone 9-7, 8-7-1, 7-9, and now either 7-8 or 8-8. The most recent two years having been decimated by injuries. And the roster isn't really "old" and I don't see us losing some of the core guys that are the main reasons we won when we won (Trent, Scherff, Allen, Payne, etc.) And I do think we've oddly gotten good at drafting which is probably keeping us from bottoming out. I'm just saying if you make a couple predictable subtractions and a couple of predictable additions, I think I'll enter next year looking at a roster similar to what we've had in recent years. And I'm NOT saying that you should "excite" anyone. I get jazzed up regardless because i just like the rhythm of the season and always cross my fingers that maybe we fall backwards into a good season. 

Actually, its not the most recent 2 years, its the past 4 years in a row.  In each of the past 4 years under Gruden we have been one of the league leading teams in injuries.  Its not bad luck, its Jay Gruden and his staff.  So why would this year all of the sudden not have a major rash of injuries like the last 4 years under Gruden?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, Peregrine said:

Actually, its not the most recent 2 years, its the past 4 years in a row.  In each of the past 4 years under Gruden we have been one of the league leading teams in injuries.  Its not bad luck, its Jay Gruden and his staff.  So why would this year all of the sudden not have a major rash of injuries like the last 4 years under Gruden?

 

I agree it's not bad luck, but think you're pointing your finger a bit too low. We've hitched our wagon to injury-prone players...maybe Gruden has a say in that, but I would think it's more the drafting and FA strategy. 

 

Guys like Reed, Docston, and Thompson were known as injury-prone players before they were drafted. We've made it even worse by extending Reed (not that I complained at the time). There are some random ones that are no one's fault (Scherff, for example), but I think the difference between us being league-average in injuries to where we are is mostly due to the players we sign. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Time does not heal a thief con artist owner, shoving plates of garbage down your throat for almost 20 years.

 

But you're right, most of us will likely be back for another helping in '19, regardless 👍

 

Edit, it's not just the losing, though. If this team could simply master the art of losing quietly, they would erase about 65% of my growing vitriol towards them. No, they also have to find themselves in the middle of scandal after scandal after locker room/coach issue that makes me question why I ever commited to them in the first place.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Springfield said:

I will almost certainly be negative going into next season and there isn’t much that can be done to change that.  This team will be a giant bag of suck regardless of Allen staying or leaving.

 

What if Darrell Green is hired as Assistant DBs Coach and London Fletcher consults on the LBs once per week? They were winners here!!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kleese, I enjoyed your post.

 

I just want to clarify your first point a bit as it relates to your thoughts on the generally expressed thoughts that next year is a lost year and we are so doomed.

 

In my view the general view expressed by that is in a world Smith is out and we're jockeying between Josh and Colt and because Smith is out we're going to let a LOT of high priced guys go and go young and essentially rebuild with huge cap penalties and be fortunate to win more than 4 games.   I think this is both a perfectly reasonable projection and, frankly, an optimal one IF Smith is out.   If he is simply not going to return ever or any time soon, we'd be wise to get rid of anything old and simply go young and pray we land on a few while sucking during cap hell.

 

Now, the more interesting discussion is if Smith is back fully.   If we're cruising along again at 6-3 and we finish 9-7 or even 10-6.   This team, THIS YEAR, could have done that.   And here's the question I'm asking.   WOULD that this year have been a good thing to watch or fairly depressing even while winning?   I ask this in some seriousness as this was the least attractive team I've seen play in years EVEN as it didn't openly suck by record.   Now, I could have loved this team if it didn't constantly lay eggs like being dominated by the Colts and the Saints and the Falcons WHILE eeeeeeeeeeeeeeking out 6 wins.   But a team like that which wins tight and loses bad is doomed to suck whenever it matters making it very difficult to much love.

So I'd almost say the BEST case, where it's a LOT LIKE this year and we do pretty well and even finish with 9 or 10 wins, LIKE this year would have been, would be absolutely abysmal to sit through.   So I am KIND of rooting for the first where at least we'll know we properly suck and are eyeing young players emerging rather than hoping not to be outclassed every third game :).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Art said:

Now, the more interesting discussion is if Smith is back fully.   If we're cruising along again at 6-3 and we finish 9-7 or even 10-6.   This team, THIS YEAR, could have done that.   And here's the question I'm asking.   WOULD that this year have been a good thing to watch or fairly depressing even while winning?   I ask this in some seriousness as this was the least attractive team I've seen play in years EVEN as it didn't openly suck by record.   Now, I could have loved this team if it didn't constantly lay eggs like being dominated by the Colts and the Saints and the Falcons WHILE eeeeeeeeeeeeeeking out 6 wins.   But a team like that which wins tight and loses bad is doomed to suck whenever it matters making it very difficult to much love.

Thanks for the insight Art. Thinking of Smith, I believe people thought that maybe we were following the model of the 2011 49ers when he was at the helm, as the defense was playing well and creating turnovers in at least some games. I remember the line "after Matt Ryan, we won't play anyone worth a damn the rest of the year." Then Fitz lit us up and we won due to turnovers and a once-in-a lifetime correlation between giving up 500 yards and only allowing 3 points. Then Watson was effective. Then Dak with Cooper. Then Wentz. Even Eli without OBJ. Only the past two weeks where we've faced relative stiffs at QB has the D looked decent. I don't expect that trend to continue against Nick Foles.

 

But on a bigger level, what do you think is the main issue besides the very top of the FO?  I notice that there are important folks like Scott Campbell and Alex Santos who either were or have been with the Skins for a while during this whole time. Are/were these folks good at their jobs?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Art I don’t have the energy for all of that at all, I really don’t. Like I said, I’m about a week away from checking out until August. I mean that not quite literally as I’ll certainly be aware of what goes on in the off-season but it’s very passive. 

 

I’ll just show up in August and hope for that best. Get excited about the games as long as they allow it. If we are 6-3 again and doing it in the plodding fashion we did it this year, I won’t really care. I’ll still root for playoffs. We go so rarely that I’ll take it regardless. I have more or less given up on us being a great franchise again. So now I just root that maybe we can have a random great season. And if we are alive for that in any given season I’ll just sort of plug my ears and say “lalalalalalalalala” until it ends. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, hail2skins said:

But on a bigger level, what do you think is the main issue besides the very top of the FO?  I notice that there are important folks like Scott Campbell and Alex Santos who either were or have been with the Skins for a while during this whole time. Are/were these folks good at their jobs?

 

I think our problems are obvious and clear from a personnel perspective.    Now if we ASSUME perfect health our biggest weaknesses are all four linebackers (with a small caveat that Brown has a different issue than the other three) and the interior of the offensive line.    On offense our scheme doesn't help in that we so frequently bunch all 11 guys inside the hash marks like NO OTHER TEAM DOES, bringing EVERYONE on their team inside, so there's no way to run if you were great.   But, our interior is weak both at run blocking and pass blocking.   We frequently get big-bodied and dominated on the interior as teams over match this part of the field which leads to constant negative runs by our running backs for years now.   This is part scheme, but mostly players simply getting ganked.   We have ZERO athleticism inside so we have no versatility.   We run at you and hope.   As we don't have guys who can move, other than Williams, teams KNOW what we're doing and we can't really do any backside action or pulling or traps.   We need a new center and left guard who are athletic, yet can hold up to a beefy guy pushing them back.

 

On defense, the problem is more obvious.   Our linebackers have ZERO lateral ability.    This isn't to say they can't turn their hips and run to the side.   They simply can't slide to the side.   This allows any competent offense to shred us endlessly.   Mason Foster is a ONE DOWN BACKER.   Goal line and first down.   If on first down they pass his SOLE job should be to run his body at the running back, period.   Zack Brown has the athetic skills, but lacks the awareness.   He's kind of our current Breeland.   Kerrigan can ONLY pass rush.   If left to cover the flat we're doomed.   Same with Preston.   This means you ALWAYS have at least one guy, and sometimes two, in coverage you can't hide.   And against the run, teams have been gapping us on the edges MOSTLY.   Because the lateral ability is so bad they just stretch until something opens.   

I'm a Kerrigan fan and have no issue with him rushing the passer every down and essentially having us run a 4-3.   But he's NOT a linebacker.   Preston Smith, who I thought had died until he showed up and made a play once a few games ago, is a complete liability.   He isn't good enough rushing the passer to overcome his tremendous weakness in any sort of coverage OR against the run.   Mason is just a slower version of Jeremiah Trotter.   If he can run downhill we're fine.

The only way to play with our personnel is UBER aggression.   You have to have press corners and you have to speed up the offense.   We have a zone backend, except for Dunbar, with a man backer group in that they are so bad in zone you can ONLY play man on the backend to protect them.   Because we have such limitations if you give the other team time they will beat us.  It's why we routinely suck on third and long.   We sit back and get carved up.   Obviously our scheme on both sides is questionable and frankly doesn't fit the players in any discernible way.   

And QB :).

But that goes without saying.   If we had Peyton Manning in his prime we'd be just fine :).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/25/2018 at 6:03 AM, FrFan said:

“The difference between faith and insanity is that faith is the ability to hold firmly to a conclusion that is incompatible with the evidence, whereas insanity is the ability to hold firmly to a conclusion that is incompatible with the evidence.” William Harwood

Insanity and faith aren't the same thing, whether you're Aquinas or William James.  Though I don't doubt that, like with art and scientific genius, there can be some overlap between the exemplars of the two.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I picked the Skins to go 5-11 Pre-Season Poll. 

 

From what I watched, they outperformed IMO.  Also had the total ceiling as 10-6 (in my comments).  They were and are a .500 to sub .500 team.  I was impressed with the way they started off the first half of the season with some decent defense and running game (via AP). 

 

I haven't changed my view of what needs to happen to get to the next level, nor is there any reason to suspect that it will change with what is in place.  The injuries are a bit excessively consistent.  Need to find a way to diagnose this disorder.  We can only guess, but those inside the building have the means to discover the ailments and invoke some remedies. 

 

I feel as though Jay Gruden did a decent enough job to stay on another year.  If he's given enough of his starting lineup to consistently practice and perform, he gives them a chance to compete.  However, I haven't seen anything spectacular from him as a Head Coach and don't see any real reason for that to change.  If there's a better candidate for the position, my vote would be to try something new in 2019. 

 

Someone has to take responsibility for the way this team has performed.  I think it lands on the HC first.  Also don't see who might be available as an improvement.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/27/2018 at 10:00 PM, Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin said:

Insanity and faith aren't the same thing, whether you're Aquinas or William James.  Though I don't doubt that, like with art and scientific genius, there can be some overlap between the exemplars of the two.

Are you sure when talking about this franchise ?

 

tumblr_lgaxbvlF9d1qe0eclo1_r9_500.gif

 

“Faith is a torment. It is like loving someone who is out there in the darkness but never appears, no matter how loudly you call.”

The Seventh Seal (1957)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've found a way to separate the Redskins on the field to the Redskins off of it.

 

Fortunately, I don't think the on the field product is as trash as it once was. The roster actually has some nice pieces and you can tell they were trying to create an identity...

 

Only problem is, I never liked Gruden as coach; didn't like the bamma in Cincy either.

 

So for next year, I just hope it's Gruden's swan song. Anything short of a playoff appearance and he's outta here.

 

The injury excuse won't work three years straight and I believe he can't overcome his mediocrity.

 

I'm not watching 2019 with hope... For me, it'll be more about how this Gruden era ends. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/25/2018 at 1:10 AM, gooseneck said:

you take any of this seriously? I have been a fan since Otto Graham was coach.  The point is some coaches and organizations have winning philosophy's.  Lombardi could spot talent (Only here one year but spotted Larry Brown and Mike Bass), some coaches can build a dynamic (George Allen-over the hill gang), solid coaching and know above average talent, no mistakes.  Gibbs is self evident.  Bruce Allen should be no more than a contract person.  He could not spot talent if it kicked him in the balls.  Gruden would be fine in developing a QB what would need a kick ass defensive and offensive coordinator.  Many players are going to rebel because their I.Q., though only of a grapefruit, are much higher than Allen or Snyder's.  Can you imagine in any real business, not one that is expanding as a welfare program for any owner, that any of these clowns would be around?

 

Good points, especially the one about the dynamics. It is often said that a team will take on the personality of its coach, I do not see that with Jay. The team does not have an identity.   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Despite the current situation with the team, I still believe the roster that was on the field at 6-3, could have won 3-4 more games to get to 9/10 wins.  The problem is that this team seems to take these massive volume injuries every single season under Gruden so it is no longer a "freak occurrence" it is the norm until it isn't anymore.   I am not in a position to blame someone or someones specifically for the injuries issue, all I know is that it happens too much and it is like it is contagious.  With Reed & CT, hell even Doctson I sort of expect it, but it is just so much more expansive then the "injury prone players usually get injured" thing. 

 

The whole "build like the 2011 49ers" blue print is fine, however people forget it took a handful of 5 (and less) win seasons, quiet seasons, seasons where they lost, but remained humbled, stuck with the plan, knew the direction they wanted.  This defense is improving but they are not in a position to be dominate let alone compete with the better offenses.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...