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Trump Border Wall Post-Shutdown Discussion (Wall-Fight)

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Here's a hint about the border deal and conservatives like Mark Krikorian. They won't like any deal. They are not interested in compromise. Krikorian runs the "non-partisan" Center for Immigration Studies which turns out is quite partisan.

I feel the right-wing position on illegal immigrants is insane. They have blocked any type of Comprehensive Immigration Reform consistently and screwed over Dreamer kids lives. These people are not going to be deported!!! By intentionally not fixing the problem, they create more of the problem.

Yes, I understand the logic of "law breakers shouldn't be rewarded" however, it is what it freaking is and has been. It's time for another "amnesty". Lets not screw people over forever because we can't control the border.

Then do e-verify, build whatever fence, etc (obviously it all would be done the same.)

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Since this has absolutely nothing to do with a wall and everything to do with a campaign promise that needs to be kept for him to have a shot in 2020 Why doesn't trump just tweet this picture and say the big beautiful wall is complete so we can all get on with our lives.

 

It's not like his supporters fact check anything. 

great_wall_beijing.jpg

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5 minutes ago, DogofWar1 said:

 

Trump thinks crowd sizes work like the electoral college.

 

He does.  What I find funniest is that the President of the United States was outdrawn by an unemployed guy that announced he'd be doing an event like 3 days before.   :ols:

Edited by PleaseBlitz
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12 hours ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Agree to disagree.

 

They gave in to ransom.  This will just be the beginning. 

 

Image result for not sure if serious

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The media should just stop covering his rallies.  Maybe send some non camera-equipped reporters there just to give reports of the rally, but at this point there is little to no newsworthy-ness of anything that comes from a Trump Rally.  It's already established that he just lies and people cheer the lies, so I don't even think his lying is worth being given camera time for.  Let Fox carry the Trump mantle and the rest of the news organizations can talk about something important.

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@PleaseBlitz

 

Totally serious.  He may not be getting as much wall money as he wanted but still getting some.  Now he knows how to get things.  Dems should have held firm on not giving a penny to his stupid wall.  

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Just now, TheGreatBuzz said:

@PleaseBlitz

 

Totally serious.  He may not be getting as much wall money as he wanted but still getting some.  Now he knows how to get things.  Dems should have held firm on not giving a penny to his stupid wall.  

 

He's getting less now, after shutting down the government, than he was offered in December.  

 

You will recall that the bill that passed the Senate in December included $1.6 billion  65 miles worth of barriers, just not any of Trump's prototype walls.

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-pledges-long-government-shutdown-without-border-wall-funding-11545398044

 

Quote

In the House, Rep. Mark Meadows (R., N.C.) chairman of the House Freedom Caucus, said he wouldn’t support a deal limited to $1.6 billion in border security but suggested it could be “part of a larger conversation.”

 

“Most conservatives are not supportive of going to a $1.6 [billion] restrictive border wall funding measure,” he said, referring to the Senate’s bipartisan bill. But if Mr. Trump were on board with a deal, that would give House GOP leaders more political room to bring a bipartisan bill to the House floor, even if some conservatives opposed it.

 

The current deal includes $1.375 billion for 55 miles worth of barriers, specifically bollard fences, not any of Trump's prototype walls.

 

In order to get even that lower amount, R's had to agree to reduce the number of detention beds.  In other words, Trump was originally offered $1.6 billion in fencing before the shutdown, is now getting $1.375 billion in fencing after the shutdown and had to make an additional concession on detention beds.  

 

If he signs the thing and it doesn't get a veto-proof majority which, who knows?

 

More:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/02/12/trumps-failed-shutdown-strategy-produced-an-even-worse-deal-than-he-started-with/?utm_term=.197d87714128

 

Quote

The deal as laid out does include some border fencing — $1.375 billion worth, or 55 miles. That’s well shy of the $5.7 billion and 200 miles in wall funding he demanded that led to the shutdown, but it’s not nothing. Trump could argue that he got something out of the 35-day government closure.

 

But only if you ignore two very important things.

 

One is that this compromise includes a concession to Democrats, too: a reduction in the number of detention beds.

...

But the bigger issue is this: The amount of funding is actually shy of the original deal Republicans and Democrats reached last year that Trump rejected. At that time, the spending bill for the Department of Homeland Security included $1.6 billion for 65 miles of fencing, both slightly more than the current tentative deal.

 

This was the deal on the table (it passed 26 to 5 in the Senate Appropriations Committee in June) when Trump initially began demanding $5 billion for his wall. He’s now getting slightly less than that $1.6 billion while also making a concession to Democrats on detention beds.

 

This is a big reason the deal was almost immediately rejected by Trump’s most conservative supporters. Sean Hannity called it “garbage,” Ann Coulter retweeted a bunch of people deriding the deal, and House Freedom Caucus Chairman Mark Meadows (R-N.C.) texted to The Post: “This does not represent a fraction of what the president has promised the American people. ... I don’t speak for the president but I can’t imagine he will be applauding something so lacking.”

 

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I wonder if the GOP members who don't want a compromise will be labeled as extreme and outside the norm the same way AOC is.

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6 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

I wonder if the GOP members who don't want a compromise will be labeled as extreme and outside the norm the same way AOC is.

 

I think the number of GOP senators (who are the only ones that matter) that don't actually want a compromise is pretty small.  I think the vast majority want to keep the government open and want Trump to just stop it.  They just need a way to do it without being publicly seen by their voters as breaking with Trump.  

 

To your point, I think that the Dem establishment needs to pick just one or two GOPers to label as entirely outside the norm or just weirdos.  Tough to pick one, but easier to focus on one (in Congress, not Trump).  

Edited by PleaseBlitz

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1 hour ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

He does.  What I find funniest is that the President of the United States was outdrawn by an unemployed guy that announced he'd be doing an event like 3 days before.   :ols:

 

The guy is from Texas, I wouldn’t read much into it..

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2 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

 

The guy is from Texas, I wouldn’t read much into it..

 

One guy is THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.  

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It seems like the detention beds thing is meaningless, since they are already way past the limit and the deal would apparently actually increase the limit a bit.

 

Also wasn’t the original deal including the barrier money as part of a package for the  DHS budget?  Is the deal now giving money for barriers in addition to DHS money for other things in two separate chunks?  I’ve seen conflicting reports on that.

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I get the sense that the detention beds thing is strictly for the purpose of making it so Trump/GOP aren't getting even that extra $75 million in exchange for nothing.

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Actually, maybe I was wrong about the beds.  Not sure.  I was just looking it up and saw this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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29 minutes ago, visionary said:

It seems like the detention beds thing is meaningless, since they are already way past the limit and the deal would apparently actually increase the limit a bit.

 

Also wasn’t the original deal including the barrier money as part of a package for the  DHS budget?  Is the deal now giving money for barriers in addition to DHS money for other things in two separate chunks?  I’ve seen conflicting reports on that.

So, both sides get to claim a symbolic victory? In normal government that'd be pretty normal.

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1 minute ago, Burgold said:

So, both sides get to claim a symbolic victory? In normal government that'd be pretty normal.

Maybe, but who's to say we won't keep going through this or something similar until Trump gets what he wants? 

Although I'm not sure Trump wants a wall as much as he wants a way to believably tell people he built it.  

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9 minutes ago, visionary said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe, but who's to say we won't keep going through this or something similar until Trump gets what he wants? 

Although I'm not sure Trump wants a wall as much as he wants a way to believably tell people he built it.  

I contend that all Trump really wants is a win he can crow about or a villain he can crucify. If his "handlers" (who seem to really suck at their jobs) can convince Trump this is a YUGE win then he will declare victory, move on and go golfing.

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28 minutes ago, visionary said:
 
 

 

 

 

What assholes.  A whole bunch of people's livelihoods depend on the government ****ing functioning.  Just say what you are going to do so they can have a good night's sleep.  This isn't the goddamn commercial break cliffhanger to your ****ty reality show.  

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I read the deal as reported as $1.3B for wall/barrier/peach funding and $1.7B for DHS.... total of $3B.

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