TheGreatBuzz Posted December 9, 2018 Share Posted December 9, 2018 1 hour ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said: Maybe i should clarify a few things and what i disagree with and my points in totality: I quoted you on saying that we would be better off with stop worrying about others and focus on our own paper. I replied to you in disagreement to highlight that as a society if we turn a blind eye to only focus on ourselves we alienate a village raising a child. And i stated that for way too long we have turned our eyes to focus on our "own" paper and i feel its the reason why our society and youth are going the way they are. And so i brought forth examples in life that would challenge you to "focus on your own paper". And which you stated, gender identity, sexual orientation, or whatever......You focus it solely on "it has no impact on my life, so why would i care" when kids making grown decisions you should care. Which now...In my examples, no matter the extremity...they still would have no impact on your life. Which is my question to how you would go about seeing those examples and what would you do. If you advocate minding your own business, then mind your own business because if it has no affect on YOU in those extreme cases as well. If you gonna say mind your business in one manner, yet not mind your own in another, when they both have no impact on your life then it gets quite hypocritical. So ill lay this out for you point blank to know where i stand: if a kid to me came and said they was gay, or trans or whatever...wanted to kill, hated blacks, whites,...i would talk to them. I would have a serious dialogue with them whether they are my kids or not. So i wouldn't just mind my own business. I disagree with that philosophy whole heartedly. If i see a man disrespecting a woman, or vice versa i SAY something. Or whatever the case may be that needs to happen. Your too many people worrying about other peoples lives really said which i loosely quote..."religious people need to stfu". Ok hold up. So now you single it to religious people, who have a different view than you. Which the irony in it all was...you said if i couldnt see the difference between xx and zz then i have issues. Ok. Also, religious people need to stfu...why? out of a difference in philosophy right? So they tend to see things one way, you see them differently. But to you, they need to stfu. Not only do they need to stfu, they need to mind their own damg business which meanwhile youre not doing the same. Because youre up in arms about this persons beliefs. You dont find this ideology controlling and any shape hypocritical? How do I determine when eyes should be on ones own paper or not? In short, I use my own values. I made the statement about religious people because, in my opinion, they are the ones that most often want to use their values and push them on others. It is certainly not limited to religious people though. For example I will use my stance on abortion (I am atheist by the way). I personally am pro-life. I think there are only a few exceptions where abortion is acceptable. Outside of them, I think there are better options than abortion. That said, when I am judging a political candidate, I want one who is pro-choice. Why? Because I don't think that is an area where I should press my values onto others. Now if another person decides to get an abortion, or is gay, or wants to switch genders, I think that is that persons business (and to a smaller degree, their family). That is where I say people need to keep their eyes on their own papers. Now if someone is beating their wife or selling drugs (or a host of other things), I would step in. That is when eyes should leave your own paper. I base it all of my own feelings when I should step in or not. Yes it is picking and choosing and based off my own opinion. But so many things that society thinks it is acceptable (and I agree with) are based on opinions when you really get down to it. So since you are challenging me on it, how do you decide when outside forces should step in? Remember you can't just use your own values because that would be picking and choosing. Something you apparently frown upon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted December 9, 2018 Share Posted December 9, 2018 Finally this thread is getting interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busch1724 Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 Well lets get a couple of things straight here. I would bet Tom Brady's life this student did not have a sex change yet. Most doctors will not allow children 16 and under have hormone therapy. Most countries (U.S. included) does not allow reassignment surgery until 18. As someone that's in education, there are currently a few kids working through the transition. They're all freshmen, like the student in the story posted here. This kid is at the beginning of the process with no operation. I suspect, haven't seen data, that most change their minds by the time 18 rolls around. I know of 4 students already, who've changed their minds. Those kids are separate from the 3 current ones. I'm glad there's laws in place because these kids don't know what freaking job they want out of high school or college to go to. I agree with much of the sentiment early on in this thread. I was off the grid this weekend, so I'm late to the party. I didn't see anyone mention where current law sits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve09ru Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 It’s a mental illness and has been diagnosed as such but instead of doing more for mental health we decide that people need to adopt to the individuals who wish to claim they are one or the other and praise it. If adults want to make the switch then by all means go for it but I don’t think we need to be praising these things like we have. what really makes me sick is when you have parents pushing it and allowing it for children still in preschool or elementary/middle school- absolutely sickening but just my opinion and I’m sure I’ll get blasted for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 https://www.gimletmedia.com/science-vs/the-science-of-being-transgender#episode-player Was listening to this earlier and thought it was pretty informative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 On 12/10/2018 at 7:30 PM, steve09ru said: It’s a mental illness and has been diagnosed as such. "Major medical organizations, like the American Medical Association and American Psychiatric Association, say being transgender is not a mental disorder." https://www.vox.com/identities/2016/5/13/17938120/transgender-people-mental-illness-health-care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 1 minute ago, PeterMP said: "Major medical organizations, like the American Medical Association and American Psychiatric Association, say being transgender is not a mental disorder." https://www.vox.com/identities/2016/5/13/17938120/transgender-people-mental-illness-health-care Fake news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 On 12/10/2018 at 7:30 PM, steve09ru said: It’s a mental illness and has been diagnosed as such but instead of doing more for mental health we decide that people need to adopt to the individuals who wish to claim they are one or the other and praise it. If adults want to make the switch then by all means go for it but I don’t think we need to be praising these things like we have. what really makes me sick is when you have parents pushing it and allowing it for children still in preschool or elementary/middle school- absolutely sickening but just my opinion and I’m sure I’ll get blasted for it. It has not been considered a mental illness by medical and mental health professionals for a very long time. The only mental health or medical professionals (if you use the term loosely) that still "diagnose" it as a mental illness are right wing quacks and conversion therapists. It stopped being listed at all in the DSM over 30 years ago. Please do not spread disinformation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve09ru Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 On 12/17/2018 at 9:53 AM, mistertim said: It has not been considered a mental illness by medical and mental health professionals for a very long time. The only mental health or medical professionals (if you use the term loosely) that still "diagnose" it as a mental illness are right wing quacks and conversion therapists. It stopped being listed at all in the DSM over 30 years ago. Please do not spread disinformation. Didn’t realize the WHO just removed it In the latter part of 2018 so apologies there. However, still doesn’t change my thoughts on allowing and pushing children to switch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 1 hour ago, steve09ru said: Didn’t realize the WHO just removed it In the latter part of 2018 so apologies there. However, still doesn’t change my thoughts on allowing and pushing children to switch The WHO removed it in 1992, but not sure what the WHO even has to do with it. We're talking about in the US. Here it hasn't been officially considered any sort of mental illness for 30 years. The American Psychiatric Association actually voted to remove it from the DSM as a it's own mental illness in 1973 but it stuck around a bit as a vaguely defined "sexual orientation disturbance". It was removed entirely in 1987. Obviously you're free to have your own thoughts and beliefs on children switching (it certainly is a complex topic that deserves discussion), but the fact is that it really isn't considered a "mental illness" outside of 3rd world countries and conversion therapy proponents. I'm also not sure where you're coming up with the "pushing children to switch" line. I don't see anywhere in this story that insinuated this child was pushed or coerced into gender reassignment. If there was any evidence of that, then I would be right there with you, but it seems like you injected that yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve09ru Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 1 hour ago, mistertim said: The WHO removed it in 1992, but not sure what the WHO even has to do with it. We're talking about in the US. Here it hasn't been officially considered any sort of mental illness for 30 years. The American Psychiatric Association actually voted to remove it from the DSM as a it's own mental illness in 1973 but it stuck around a bit as a vaguely defined "sexual orientation disturbance". It was removed entirely in 1987. Obviously you're free to have your own thoughts and beliefs on children switching (it certainly is a complex topic that deserves discussion), but the fact is that it really isn't considered a "mental illness" outside of 3rd world countries and conversion therapy proponents. I'm also not sure where you're coming up with the "pushing children to switch" line. I don't see anywhere in this story that insinuated this child was pushed or coerced into gender reassignment. If there was any evidence of that, then I would be right there with you, but it seems like you injected that yourself. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/717758002 and the injectingnpiece was because we were on the topic of children/kids making decisions for themselves and how dangerous that can be which is a completely different topic so apologies on going a step away from the direct article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSSkinz Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 People are so damn self-righteous, just do your job and mind your own business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 20 hours ago, JSSkinz said: People are so damn self-righteous, just do your job and mind your own business. Trans Teenager Claims Teacher Demanded He ‘Prove’ He Was a Boy In Bathroom A 15-year-old transgender boy in West Virginia is alleging that his assistant principal confronted him while he was in a bathroom stall, challenging him to “come out here and use the urinal” to prove that he was really a boy. That allegation and others are detailed in a Dec. 17 letter from the American Civil Liberties Union of West Virginia addressed to Dr. Mark A. Manchin, superintendent of Harrison County Schools. According to the ACLU-WV’s letter, the transgender boy—Michael Critchfield—was using an otherwise unoccupied boys’ restroom in Liberty High School before a late November band trip when Assistant Principal Lee Livengood allegedly entered and asked why he was there. Critchfield, according to the ACLU-WV, explained that he was a boy and that the bathroom was empty. But that was when the assistant principal allegedly issued his challenge to “use the urinal.” The ACLU-WV alleges that the assistant principal then blocked the door to the restroom to prevent Critchfield from leaving. “Mr. Livengood continued to berate Michael, his voice rising, asking Michael what would happen if another boy thought Michael was checking him out,” the letter continues. “Michael’s classmates later told him they could hear Mr. Livengood yelling from outside the restroom in the hallway and cafeteria.” Click on the link for the full article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 I know my views of the name incident that started this thread weren't as progressive as most but even I think this story is WAY outta line. Like holy **** that family better have a huge payday coming. I'd even like that guy to be prosecuted somehow. Attempted sexual assault maybe? What would I be charged with if I demanded some girl let me watch her pee? He should get the same charges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 I know we had a thread about this dude but cant find it. Someone can bump that one if they prefer. https://weartv.com/news/nation-world/colorado-baker-back-in-court-over-2nd-lgbt-bias-allegation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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