Renegade7

Starting QB 2019???

Who should be the starting QB in 2019???  

401 members have voted

  1. 1. Who should be the starting QB in 2019???

    • Alex Smith
      28
    • Colt McCoy
      66
    • Trade for a Veteran
      8
    • Sign a Veteran
      29
    • First Round Pick (2019 draft class)
      65
    • Non-First Round Pick (2019 draft class)
      37
    • Too Early to Answer
      63
    • I don't know yet
      22
    • We're screwed (at least at QB for 2019)
      83


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4 minutes ago, WelshSkinsFan said:

This analysis covers a lot of the issues and I am not claiming it is gospel but it definitely gives me pause.  The comments at the end reference the scheme issues and his performance on the field would seem to suggest the concerns were justified.  I freely admit he could be Tom Brady all over again, I am not a pro scout just a fan, but I would hate to give up anything above a 3rd round pick for a guy with so many obvious red flags.

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/will-grier?id=32194752-4902-2415-512e-3cae73b00f0f

Anticipation is seen as a positive trait for Grier in general, so I’m not really worried about that aspect.  The gunslinger mentality (which I think may partially derived from the conference he played in - ie the need to score lots of points) is a bigger concern.  Now, to be fair to him, I don’t think he has the Rex gunslinger mentality - heaving the ball down the field for the sake of it.  His issue is standing in the pocket too long, trusting his oline too much, and trusting his legs to bail him out while he looks for the best play.  As I’ve said before though, I think this is common for most young qbs - they have to understand the NFL requires you to lean on your D, to throw the ball away, to take the dump offs... in other words, to give the ball up and try again on the next possession.  

 

In response the the Senior Bowl evals...

Learning plays:  Grier excelled at both Florida and WV.  So he’s shown an ability to pick up offenses (to an extent).  I’ll add to this that looking at his growth from Florida - where he ran the ball a lot, bailed from the pocket quickly, and usually didn’t look to pass when scrambling - to his time in WV - standing and maneuvering in the pocket, keeping his eyes downfield when scrambling... it was a huge transition.  Point being, I think he can be coached to not stay in the pocket quite so long, to take the 5 yard run when available, and to accept the need to punt the ball away.  

Panicky:  he was a very smooth operator in WV and playing behind an oline that had 1 week of practice together.  His numbers vs pressure were quite good in WV.  

Accuracy:  I think he’s clearly one of the most accurate passers in the draft.  Quite possibly top 2.  Not only in percentage terms, but how well he leveraged defenders and threw the ball where only his guys can get it.  

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13 hours ago, MartinC said:

 

If the Cardinals want Murray it doesn’t matter what any other team want or offer. They will take him. 

 

And to take any player number 1 overall you’ve got to want him - especially if you traded up last year to take a player in the same position.

 

If don’t want him then I don’t see how showing interest helps them. Or the QB they took last year.

 

Reality might well be they haven’t decided either way yet.

Whether on not the Cards like Murray was never really my argument.  

 

Instead, I’m saying that the Cards can’t afford to stay at #1 unless Murray is definitely their guy. Unless they want Murray, any other guy can be had at #3 and they could’ve gained some extra picks by moving down a few spots. 

 

With that said, the Cards have a vested interest in driving up the value of the #1 pick if they already know that they’re sticking with Rosen. 

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4 hours ago, skinny21 said:

@Skinsinparadise I agree, there are other qbs I’m interested in past round 1.  I’d add Ta’Amu to your list.  

 

Still think Grier’s accuracy trumps everyone else in that category.  

 

Agree on Ta'Amu too. But to me he is likely more in the 4th-5th group range if mocks are on the money. I think Grier, Finley, Rypien, Stidham might go in the 2nd-4th range.

 

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1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Agree on Ta'Amu too. But to me he is likely more in the 4th-5th group range if mocks are on the money. I think Grier, Finley, Rypien, Stidham might go in the 2nd-4th range.

 

Yeah, and to be clear - I wasn’t trying to say ”you left Ta’amu off”, I meant more “in my opinion, Ta’amu might belong in that group as well”. 

 

Big question for him is can he learn, and can he learn to process faster, because I think all of his areas of concern are coachable.  He’s a guy that probably take 3 years or so to get comfortable in the NFL.  I think he would have been an interesting choice for us if Smith had stayed healthy.  PS this year, backup in 2020, and a chance to take over sometime after that.  

 

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On 3/21/2019 at 4:00 PM, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

3 months ago this draft class at QB 'sucked'. Now all of a sudden its a full on feeding frenzy across the league.

Its the same every year. Kiper an Mayock hype the crap out of whoever the QBs coming out are into legitimate 1st round talents. That's their job. When was the last time you heard any of these guys say, you know. I know Team A is sitting there at 3 and really needs a QB but honestly nobody coming out is worth a first round pick.  ?? I'm thinking never.  Murray with one year playing is the no question number one pick. Grier is now a first round talent. Pretty soon we will be moving up to 3 to get him. 

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23 hours ago, Fat Stupid Loser said:

Its the same every year. Kiper an Mayock hype the crap out of whoever the QBs coming out are into legitimate 1st round talents. That's their job. When was the last time you heard any of these guys say, you know. I know Team A is sitting there at 3 and really needs a QB but honestly nobody coming out is worth a first round pick.  ?? I'm thinking never.  Murray with one year playing is the no question number one pick. Grier is now a first round talent. Pretty soon we will be moving up to 3 to get him. 

Boy i hope you are wrong. With as many picks as we have this year it seems like a good year to load up everywhere but QB and grab one next year. We could move back, add picks and really work the draft to fill numerous holes while rolling with Keenum this year and pounding the rock. I know patience probably isn't gonna happen with this franchise but we could set ourselves up nicely with patience and shrewd drafting this year and grabbing the QB next year. Just my opinion.

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11 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Boy i hope you are wrong. With as many picks as we have this year it seems like a good year to load up everywhere but QB and grab one next year. We could move back, add picks and really work the draft to fill numerous holes while rolling with Keenum this year and pounding the rock. I know patience probably isn't gonna happen with this franchise but we could set ourselves up nicely with patience and shrewd drafting this year and grabbing the QB next year. Just my opinion.

 

I agree, I think the Skins would be wise to avoid a 1st round QB unless one of Haskins/Murray had an unexpected fall out of the top 8 or so.  I really expect a better QB will be available next year for the Skins to get.  Moving back to add picks in rounds 2-4, and/or adding high draft picks next year seems smart to me.  The TE class this year is deep, you can get a good starter in the 2nd /3rd round that would help save a lot of $ in the near future.  Maybe grab a QB in rounds 3 or 4 that you think has a chance to develop.  If you get lucky, you might have a cheap starting QB and a bunch of premium picks in the future to build around him.  If not, you have the draft capital to get the QB you want next year.

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Saw a mock draft last night that had us taking Marquise Brown and it made perfect sense. Rather then settle for  Haskins or trading for a Rosen roll the dice with Keenum and draft the best WR of 2019, Our WR situation is as dire as our QB situation so why settle for the 3 or 4th best option at QB when you could have the BEST at WR ?

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1 minute ago, JoeJacobyHOForRIOT said:

Saw a mock draft last night that had us taking Marquise Brown and it made perfect sense. Rather then settle for  Haskins or trading for a Rosen roll the dice with Keenum and draft the best WR of 2019, Our WR situation is as dire as our QB situation so why settle for the 3 or 4th best option at QB when you could have the BEST at WR ?

This is what Ive been saying..I truly believe we go best wr available

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2 hours ago, JoeJacobyHOForRIOT said:

Saw a mock draft last night that had us taking Marquise Brown and it made perfect sense. Rather then settle for  Haskins or trading for a Rosen roll the dice with Keenum and draft the best WR of 2019, Our WR situation is as dire as our QB situation so why settle for the 3 or 4th best option at QB when you could have the BEST at WR ?

 

Not only is M. Brown a good receiver but he is an explosive playmaker.  I believe the front office notices they need to target these type of players right now.  

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40 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

I agree with Brandt...

Me too, HigSkin.  I think it takes a first, slim possibility of a 2nd to get Rosen.  Love Murray but we know he goes to the Cards.  My 2nd choice is Rosen.  I'm hoping for Rosen. :)

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Posted (edited)

I understand (on Tuesday?) Gruden is supposed to provide an explanation about McCoy being on crutches, and hopefully, provide some comments on Colt's readiness for the OTAs in May.

 

If McCoy did have some kind of set-back, it could be a serious matter for the Skins -- and could impact the team's draft plans, possible trading strategy, etc. 

 

I'm hoping McCoy is just using the crutch as a safety pre-caution; still, at this stage in his healing process, you'd imagine he could be "safe" by just using a decent cane rather than a crutch.

Edited by Wyvern

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I'd say it's concerning seeing Colt on crutches...I think something is gonna happen this year in the draft..I didn't think Colt was the favorite for the starting job but it looks like he's further away from any plans to qb for the skins.. Giants get there wr in Metcalf, we trade with the Jets and get Haskins.

What would it take to trade with the Jets?

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1 hour ago, Skin'emAlive said:

It’s not a precaution. He had a setback and a second surgery. We shouldn’t be relying on him.

What makes you think it's a set back? Do you have inside info on the team? Preventative maintenance is what I read. That could mean anything. My guess is a knee scope unrelated to his fibula fracture.

 

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1 hour ago, rumplestilskin said:

What makes you think it's a set back? Do you have inside info on the team? Preventative maintenance is what I read. That could mean anything. My guess is a knee scope unrelated to his fibula fracture.

 

 

So your guess is a injury know one knew about? Yeah I'm going with it has something to do with the broke leg. 

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McCoy is pretty much our back up already. Can't see Keenum not being the starter at this stage. If we are trading for Rosen or drafting a QB in round one, McCoy is pretty much expendable. Get back over 3mil in cap space too. Always then got Josh Johnson as a more affordable #3 option once fit.  

 

That being said, there is no immediate need to get rid of McCoy, so a QB structure including him, Keenum, and Rosen/1st round QB does bring more short term depth for 2019.

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3 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

McCoy is pretty much our back up already. Can't see Keenum not being the starter at this stage. If we are trading for Rosen or drafting a QB in round one, McCoy is pretty much expendable. Get back over 3mil in cap space too. Always then got Josh Johnson as a more affordable #3 option once fit.  

 

That being said, there is no immediate need to get rid of McCoy, so a QB structure including him, Keenum, and Rosen/1st round QB does bring more short term depth for 2019.

 

The crazy thing is Josh Johnson had ankle surgery this off-season too!  😷

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, desertbeagle85 said:

 

So your guess is a injury know one knew about? Yeah I'm going with it has something to do with the broke leg. 

No. The poster said he had a setback.  "Preventative maintenance" can mean anything but would not indicate a setback. So yeah.. I will go with maybe a knee scope, bone spur clean up related to something chronic and not a new acute injury. Otherwise it could be possible removal of fasteners related to his fracture, which is not a setback. However no initial reports said his injury required fasteners.

Edited by rumplestilskin

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11 hours ago, desertbeagle85 said:

 

So your guess is a injury know one knew about? Yeah I'm going with it has something to do with the broke leg. 

 

So your guess is his guess is wrong?

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9 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

McCoy is pretty much our back up already. Can't see Keenum not being the starter at this stage. If we are trading for Rosen or drafting a QB in round one, McCoy is pretty much expendable. Get back over 3mil in cap space too. Always then got Josh Johnson as a more affordable #3 option once fit.  

 

That being said, there is no immediate need to get rid of McCoy, so a QB structure including him, Keenum, and Rosen/1st round QB does bring more short term depth for 2019.

One would think but it's been said and documented plenty of times how much Gruden thinks of McCoy.  I'd like to see him cut but Gruden loves the guy.

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Posted (edited)
On 3/24/2019 at 6:27 AM, bakedtater1 said:

This is what Ive been saying..I truly believe we go best wr available

 

Confused by the take in reference to M. Brown. Granted WR's never consistently play out in line with the rankings, but generally the consensus rankings are really tier specific this year with a ton of disagreement on how the top 3-4 should be ranked in particular, but in general the top 4 NFL Tier seems to be:

 

Tier 1:

Metcalf

Harry

A.J. Brown

Hakeem Butler

 

Tier 2:

K. Harmon

Deebo Samuel

M. Brown

Arcega-Whiteside

Paris Campbell

Andy Isabella

 

And that's your top 10 and I rarely ever see Marquise Brown anywhere inside the top 5. 

 

Personally and amongst the analytics people as well there's a greater emphasis on Isabella, Campbell, and Samuel, a deemphasis on Metcalf, and concerns about Butler (1 year of production, late breakout age), Marquis Browne (size, injury, breakout age, lack of a quality dominator/market share of his offense) Harmon (lack of athleticism), Arcega-Whiteside (lack of athletic info), and Campbell (struggled to produce on a crowded team).

 

My top 2 tiers for now are:

Tier 1:

1.N'Keal Harry

2. A.J. Brown

 

Tier 2:

3. D.K. Metcalf

4. K. Harmon

5. A. Isabella

6. D. Samuel

 

I'm struggling to order the rest of my top 10 because of the lack of info.

 

To be fair, the consensus rankings from the NFL, from the Analytics community etc never match how things ever play out, so having differing opinions on valuations makes sense, but if you do have say a Marquis Brown that high, you want to trade down, you sure as hell don't want to reach a round or two for him. 

 

 

Here's the predraft WR rankings from the last 5 Drafts w/what would be current rankings based upon accomplishments to this point and my predraft rankings afterwards (except '14 where I didn't rank them)

 

Famed 2014 Rookie Class Rankings 

1. Watkins (6)

2. Evans (2)

3. Cooks (4)

4. OBJ (1)

5. K. Benjamin (7)

6. J. Matthews (8)

7. D. Adams (3)

8. M. Lee (9)

9. A. Robinson (5) 

10. C. Latimer (10)

 

2015 Draft:

1.A. Cooper (1)              (My #1)

2. D. Parker (5)            (My #5)

3. K. White (8)             (My #4)

4. B. Perriman (7)        (My #2)

5. P. Dorsett (6)          (My #6)

6. N. Agholor (4)         (My #9)

7. DGB (10)                  (My #3)

8. D. Funchess (3).     (My #7)

9. J. Strong (9)            (My #8)

10. T. Lockett (2)        (My #10)

Comments: Been shocked at how bad Parker was, and disappointed in DGB because it really appeared to be a mental make up problem). I had Lockett fly up my rankings by 2016 so at least theres that, but this was a supposedly good to very good WR draft that just imploded, mostly due to classic projection issues (White, late breakout age, Perriman overly reliant on athletic #'s, Dorsett was just never as good as advertised, Agholor lacked NFL caliber athleticism, DGB was a head case, Strong got in the dog house, and Funchess has terrible hands and is a tweener, Lockett was just really underrated)

 

2016 Draft:

1. C. Coleman (6)       (My #1)

2. L. Treadwell (7)    (My #3)

3.J. Doctson (5)        (My #2)

4. W. Fuller (2)         (My #6)

5. M. Thomas (1)      (My #4)

6. S. Shepard (4)     (My #8)

7. T. Boyd (3)           (My #5)

8. L. Carroo (10)       (My #9)       

9. M Mitchell (8)      (My #5)

10. B. Miller (9)        (Not ranked in my top 10)

 

Comments: I'm never going to get over seeing us closely linked to Michael Thomas, and then taking a WR I preferred in Doctson. Whoops. Coleman was an athletic dream, Treadwell was an athletic nightmare, Doctson had a great profile other than late breakout age, Fuller had a lack of hands and a thin frame, Shepard was a pure slot guy being overrated, Boyd was the #1 guy in this class in 2014, and #2 in 2015 and then fell way down after his middling '15 and combine, Carroo was a mental makeup guy, Mitchell's knock was a crazy history of injury and it knocked him out of the league.

 

2017 Draft: 

1. C. Davis (4)           (My #1)

2. M. Williams (7).   (My #3) 

3.J. Ross (9)            (My #6)

4. Zay Jones (8)     Not ranked in my top 10      

5. C. Kupp (2)         (My #7)

6. Juju (1)                 (My #5)

7. C. Samuel (6).     (My #4)

8. C. Godwin (5).     (My #2)

9. K. Golladay (3)   (My #9) 

10. T. Taylor (10)    (My #8)

 

Comments: Much like with Boyd, my chief frustration with this draft is that I ignored a favorite draftnik tactic of mine from the '90's and aughts of going after elite guys who had a bad final year. Boyd and Juju were classic examples of that with great breakout ages (breakout age and market share/dominator are more predictive of future success than anything else for WR's) and early market shares who had a bad final season, and saw their valuation collapse. Juju, like Boyd, was at the top of his class before his final year, in this case Juju was ranked #2 in the class in the spring/summer of 2016, but after bad QB play at USC, and an underwhelming combine, he fell way out of the top rankings, generally ranked somewhere intbetween John Ross, and Curtis Samuel in most peoples rankings. W/Regards to this class, I nailed a lot (Samuel, Godwin being huge value, I still believe in Taywan Taylor too, but I missed horribly on Juju who I had #2 a year earlier and then dropped to #5, and Golladay and Kupp who I just didn't study enough. 

 

2018 Draft:

1. Moore (1)            (My #1)

2. Ridley (2)          (My #7)

3. Sutton (8)         (My #2)

4.Kirk (4)              (My #4)

5. A. Miller (7)      (My #3)

6. J. Washington (10) (My #5)

7. Gallup (5)                (My #10

8. Pettis (3)                (My #9)

9. Trequan Smith (6) (My #6)

10. A. Callaway (9) (My #8)

 

Comments: This class can't really be ranked now, but I took a shot at it as best as I could. A year ago I had them tiered out as:

 

Tier 1:

DJ Moore

 

Tier 2:

C. Sutton

 

Tier 3:

A. Miller

C. Kirk

J. Washington

Trequan Smith

C. Ridley

A. Callaway

 

Tier 4:

D. Pettis

 

Tier 5:

M. Gallup

D. Hamilton

 

What fascinates me with the group is that I can't see a bust amongst them right now. Not all of them were successful, right now the guys that seem most poised for opportunity and success seem to be Moore, Sutton, Pettis, Ridley, Gallup, Kirk and Miller, w/Washington having a chance at starting as well, but you also have guys like Trequan and Callaway that were super explosive in limited opportunities, the former who has a chance to grow, the latter who now seems buried after that OBJ trade. I like to some degree or other literally all of these WR's. 

 

Rather than draft a WR, I'd be ecstatic if the Redskins went trolling for a rookie deal WR from the loaded '17 and '18 classes that is buried behind FA's and draftees like Taywan Taylor, A. Callaway, or guys like Curtis Samuel, or a Trequan Smith or a Justin Watson, or Chris Godwin. Hell I'd trade our 2nd right now for Godwin. Taywan Taylor can probably be had for a late day 3 pick and he's a starter caliber WR in my book (I'd also troll for idiot WR Carlos Henderson who ****ed his way out of the league after Denver cut him for infractions with the law and being a colossal whiny idiot following the Sutton/Daesean Hamilton picks). 

 

I would trade a day 2 pick for a Trequan, a Pettis, Samuel or Godwin, and I'd happily trade a day 3 pick for guys like Taylor, Callaway, or Watson etc. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by The Consigliere
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