2019 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Going Commando]

1 minute ago, bird_1972 said:

Defense has looked incredibly weak the last two games. We benefited early in the season from a weak schedule and some lucky bounces. We're not just a QB away.  

 

The defense has been hung out to dry by god awful offense the last two games.  This is a championship caliber D.  They're ready to win.  But no defense can overcome the utter lack of offensive production we're getting.

 

Put a QB and an OL on this team and they win 12 games.

[bird_1972]

2 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

Defensive coaching is incredibly weak, but gonna step away to look at more of these players.  This discussion is already occurring in multiple threads.

 

Fair point.

[skinny21]

I’m thinking they need to take one of two options.  1) draft one of the top qbs this year, or 2) draft a third rounder (or so) this year, and then try for a top draftee at qb the following year.  

 

Option one jumpstarts the potential (and experience - i.e. playing time and/or time in the system) at the position, while option two at least gives you a developmental backup and competition, particularly once the ‘franchise’ guy is drafted.  

 

Losing Smith, and now McCoy has (in part) sunk our season.  It could be beneficial for the team in the long term as it may force the FO to make a move at qb sooner than they hoped.  Nothing against McCoy, but it also could force Gruden to find a new backup qb.  McCoy’s decent enough, but I liked the potential/promise we had with Kirk behind RGIII... and Colt is seriously injury prone.  This could be a moot point if Gruden is replaced.  

[Inigo Montoya]

10 hours ago, Blanka said:

What’s everyone else’s general feel on Drew Lock?

Just no! He’s not an nfl quality qb, I live in St. Louis and watched him live suck it up against Kentucky. 

[bird_1972]

1 minute ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

The defense has been hung out to dry by god awful offense the last two games.  This is a championship caliber D.  They're ready to win.  But no defense can overcome the utter lack of offensive production we're getting.

 

Put a QB and an OL on this team and they win 12 games.

 

We will have to agree to disagree on this. I really think the issues on this team run way deeper than just a QB and a few OL pieces. The coaching alone is a major issue for this team, regardless of who is on the team.

[skinny21]

33 minutes ago, Newera said:

Is Drew Lock Matt Stafford.  If so.  I would pass.

That’s the same comp I thought of reading SM’s eval.

26 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

If this team had Matt Stafford, we win the division going away.  That would be strong value from picking a QB in the teens.

Absolutely.  Although, we’d need the oline shored up and probably a couple pieces on D to become legit contenders.  

 

Sure wouldn’t be upset if they found a good receiver too, though (as you alluded to earlier) I think our group is better than the numbers would indicate... passable, at least.  Even more so when you consider the loss of Sims and Davis, Quinn and Crowder missing significant time, a shaky oline, and (partially because of the oline), iffy qb play.    

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I think we'll win the Giants game.  Even with the injuries at QB and on the OL, 7 wins seems to be our perpetual floor under Gruden.

 

I think they lose to the Giants, will see.  They are early 4 point underdogs to the Giants and I don't blame the odds makers on that one.    But I do think they have a shot to win, ditto the road game against Jax.  My guess is they lose all 4. 

 

Might be missing a team but if the idea is every team with 6 wins will win one more and we are stuck at 6.  Just for fun, I'll predict

 

Lions 4-8 (right now picking 5)

(Cardinals, Vikings, Bills, Packers)   They go 2-2

 

Giants 4-8 (6)

(Redskins, Colts, Titans, Cowboys).  They go 1-3

 

Falcons 4-8 (7)

(Packers, Panthers, Cardinals, Bucs).  They go 3-1

 

Jaguars 4-8 (8)

(Titans, Dolphins, Redskins, Texans).  They go 2-2

 

Bills 4-8 (9)

(Jets, Patriots, Lions, Dolphins).  They go 1-3

 

Browns 4-7-1 (10)

(Panthers, Bengals, Broncos, Ravens).  They go 1-3

 

Packers 4-7-1 (11)

(Falcons, Jets, Bears, Lions).  They go 2-2

 

Tampa 5-7 (12)

(Saints, Cowboys, Ravens, Falcons) They go 0-4. 

 

 

 

 

 

[BayouBrave86]

We need Devin White. He’ll be our field general on defense for the next 10 years. 

[bird_1972]

23 minutes ago, BayouBrave86 said:

We need Devin White. He’ll be our field general on defense for the next 10 years. 

 

Which round?

[Going Commando]

1 hour ago, skinny21 said:

That’s the same comp I thought of reading SM’s eval.

 

Big difference is Stafford came out of an offense where he played from behind center, and he throws the ball on the run well.  Lock just doesn't throw it as well from a moving platform.  He needs to set his feet.  That's what had me thinking Goff and Palmer.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

 

[Est.1974]

I fear a rookie QB will have his career ruined here within 18 months of being drafted. Man what a mess. 

 

Edit - I should add it wouldn't stop me drafting one in 2019, and 2020 for that matter. We just also need to shift the rest of the crap out from the organisation at the same time.

[PartyPosse]

2 hours ago, bird_1972 said:

 

We will have to agree to disagree on this. I really think the issues on this team run way deeper than just a QB and a few OL pieces. The coaching alone is a major issue for this team, regardless of who is on the team.

Agreed. The DL and the OLB haven’t been effective at all and QBs always seem to find the guy streaking while being (poorly) covered by one of the ILBs. Our schemes are predictable which is why QBs are becoming more and more effective against us each week.

[BayouBrave86]

4 hours ago, bird_1972 said:

 

Which round?

The first? He’s the best LB in college football. 

[Skinsinparadise]

PFF mock, they don't do their mocks typically based on expectations but their metrics

 

 

1. SAN FRANCISCO – NICK BOSA, EDGE DEFENDER, OHIO STATE

While the 49ers have used first-round picks along their defensive line in three of the last four seasons, those are sunk costs at this point. They’d be overthinking it to go anywhere other than the best player available, and that’s Nick Bosa. The Ohio State edge defender has led all FBS defensive linemen in pass-rush win rate each of the past two seasons.

2. OAKLAND RAIDERS – JUSTIN HERBERT, QB, OREGON

Every move head coach Jon Gruden has made since taking over in Oakland suggests he has no ties to quarterback Derek Carr. If Gruden likes what he sees from Herbert — and there is a lot to like — he has more than enough draft capital to do whatever it takes to go get him.

3. NEW YORK JETS – GREEDY WILLIAMS, CB, LSU

Ever since he saw his first snap of college football back in 2017, Williams has been lights out. His career passer rating against is a stingy 43.0. Standing 6-foot-3, Williams has the length teams will covet highly.

4. ARIZONA CARDINALS – JONAH WILLIAMS, OT, ALABAMA

This is the perfect combination of need, positional value and talent. Arizona’s line ranked last in our latest offensive line rankings and could use any position up front. Williams has allowed all of nine pressures this season and no sacks on 396 pass-blocking dropbacks.

5. DETROIT LIONS – DEIONTE THOMPSON, S, ALABAMA

The Lions simply need an influx of talent in the secondary and Thompson has plenty of that. He makes plays from the middle of the field that college safeties aren’t supposed to make. He’s allowed a passer rating of 54.0 on his 30 targets this season.

6. ATLANTA FALCONS – QUINNEN WILLIAMS, DI, ALABAMA

Call him a one-year wonder if you want but Williams’ one season is as good as we’ve ever graded for college interior defensive linemen. In fact, his 95.8 overall grade would be the highest single-season grade we’ve ever given to a defensive interior player. He’s shown he can stop the run and rush the passer from any alignment on the ‘Bama front.

7. NEW YORK GIANTS – ED OLIVER, DI, HOUSTON

Odds are Oliver’s potential is still going to win out with NFL GM’s. You simply can’t teach 280-plus pound men to move the way he does. That being said, he still has a ways to go as a pass-rusher. His 88.4 pass-rushing grade is only fifth in the country among interior players despite facing lesser competition in the AAC.

8. BUFFALO BILLS – DALTON RISNER, OT, KANSAS STATE

Three years ago it was Jack Conklin. Two years ago it was Ryan Ramczyk. Last year it was Frank Ragnow. This year it’s Dalton Risner. All offensive linemen who aren’t necessarily receiving immense draft hype, but have crushed the PFF grading system at every turn of their college careers. Risner allowed only 28 pressures on 1,489 pass-blocking snaps in his college career and could step in and start immediately at right tackle for the Bills.

9. JACKSONVILLE JAGUARS – DWAYNE HASKINS, QB, OHIO STATE

While there’s a chance that quarterbacks like Teddy Bridgewater, Jameis Winston and Derek Carr are available this offseason, the Jaguars will be hard pressed to make a serious play at any of them with their cap situation. Insert Haskins who has flashed high-level quarterback traits in his only season as a starter at Ohio State. His 134.4 passer rating when kept clean is the second best in the nation.

10. GREEN BAY PACKERS – JOSH ALLEN, EDGE DEFENDER, KENTUCKY

Yet another edge defender who improved mightily over the offseason. He went from being listed at 230 pounds last season 252 this year and the result is our highest-graded edge defender in college football. His skill set will appeal to teams that ask their edge players to drop in coverage as he’s been impressive in that aspect as well with an 82.1 coverage grade.

11. CLEVELAND BROWNS – BYRON MURPHY, CB, WASHINGTON

After taking Denzel Ward last year, the Browns go back to the well to build a budding, young secondary. Listed at 5-foot-11, 175 pounds Murphy doesn’t have near the size of a corner like Greedy Williams, but he makes up for it with athleticism and ball skills. Murphy is the highest-graded corner in the country (91.2) and has 13 combined pass breakups and interceptions.

12. TAMPA BAY BUCCANEERS – BRIAN BURNS, EDGE DEFENDER, FSU

While Florida State went backward this year, Burns took a big jump forwards. The junior filled out his lengthy frame over the offseason and that increased strength has paid off big dividends as a pass-rusher. His 69 total pressures are the most in the country.

13. CINCINNATI BENGALS – DEVIN WHITE, LB, LSU

I’m no proponent of drafting solely for need, but it’s not a hot take to say the Bengals have the worst linebacking corps in the NFL. White would immediately be the most explosive linebacker on the Bengals roster and his 90.7 coverage grade this season would be a welcome addition.

14. PHILADELPHIA EAGLES – GREG LITTLE, OT, OLE MISS

Jason Peters will be 37 years old by the start of next season. With his play slipping and uncertain health, Peters’ left tackle spot should be addressed sooner rather than later to keep Carson Wentz upright. Little allowed all of 10 pressures on 465 pass-blocking snaps this season.

15. MIAMI DOLPHINS – CHRISTIAN WILKINS, DI, CLEMSON

The Dolphins simply haven’t been able to replace the disruption the Ndamukong Suh brought to the table. Wilkins isn’t quite Suh, but he’s freakish in his own regard. His 92.6 overall grade this season is third-best among all defensive linemen.

16. INDIANAPOLIS COLTS – DEANDRE BAKER, CB, GEORGIA

The Colts need any sort of help they can get at cornerback. Their highest-graded corner this season, Pierre Desir, is a free agent at year’s end. Baker is a physical corner who ranks second among Power-5 cornerbacks with a 29.8% forced incompletion rate.

17. CAROLINA PANTHERS – CLELIN FERRELL, EDGE DEFENDER, CLEMSON

At 6-foot-4, 265 pounds, Ferrell certainly looks the part of a 4-3 defensive end in the NFL. The concern is that even with that ideal build, he’s never quite dominated at the college level. His 84.7 overall grade this year as a redshirt junior is a career high.

18. TENNESSEE TITANS – JACHAI POLITE, EDGE DEFENDER, FLORIDA

While Brian Burns and Josh Allen moved way up from most preseason draft boards, you’d have been hard-pressed to find anyone who had Polite ranked in the preseason. The junior had played 451 non-descript snaps his first two seasons at Florida before bursting onto the scene this fall. In 479 snaps already this season, he’s almost doubled his pressures (38 vs 21) from his first two years.

19. DENVER BRONCOS – DEXTER LAWRENCE, DI, CLEMSON

While the Broncos are set at edge for the foreseeable future, the interior of their defensive line has slipped mightily from their Super Bowl peak. Lawrence is the rare do-it-all nose tackle that will help pad Von Miller’s sack totals.

20. MINNESOTA VIKINGS – TYLER BIADASZ, OG/C, WISCONSIN

The redshirt sophomore is no sure thing to declare, but if he does, he’s the most impressive interior lineman in the class. Biadasz is the highest-graded center in the country after finishing fourth a season ago. He has the skill set to play any of the interior line positions for the Vikings.

21. WASHINGTON REDSKINS – MARQUISE BROWN, WR, OKLAHOMA

The value of speed continues to grow with modern NFL offenses and Brown possesses as much of it as almost anyone in this class. Brown’s 592 deep receiving yards are the fifth most in the country.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/draft-bosa-goes-first-renners-first-2019-mock

[Burgundy Yoda]

We need to tank for 6-10. Hopefully that nets a top 10 pick, there is no point in winning another game this season. We've got to have a vision. 

[desertbeagle85]

11 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Which is why its gonna work out where we lose out and going to trade up anyway, its destiny. Theres nothing were going be able to do to stop this team from getting desperate on the QB issue, my hope us the people that lead to this situation arent involved with how to get out of it.  I'd like McCarthy with influence on that decision.

 

Get ready to be disappointed then.

 

If they do this they will ruin the team again. They can't give up the farm for another RG3. 

[The Consigliere]

1 hour ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

We need to tank for 6-10. Hopefully that nets a top 10 pick, there is no point in winning another game this season. We've got to have a vision. 

 

One little positive: we own the opponents winning percentage tiebreaker against nearly every team likely to pick between 5th and 15th, so that could really help. 

 

 

[Going Commando]

Elephant in the room with the QB talk is Gruden.  Is he going to get a fourth chance at getting his QB?  That seems hard to fathom, but honestly, I'm not opposed to it.  I don't think our coaching staff has been the problem.

[OVCChairman]

12 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Elephant in the room with the QB talk is Gruden.  Is he going to get a fourth chance at getting his QB?  That seems hard to fathom, but honestly, I'm not opposed to it.  I don't think our coaching staff has been the problem.

 

If they want to sign him to a multi-year extension and stare 8-8 in the face for the tenure, then he should get another shot.  If he's not in our future plans and we're going to be moving on, I don't want us drafting a QB because I want to draft a QB to fit the system we plan on running for multiple seasons.  Not have a QB come in and have to learn a system, then play with the pressure on the coach of his job being in limbo.  Then we would have to hire a new HC with the limitations of either focusing on someone who's system fits the new QB... forcing the coach to change his system to take advantage of the new QBs skillset, OR (and the most likely outcome of this) force the QB to change in order to try and play in a system he's not built for.   None of those situations is a blueprint imho for success, unless you get a legit STUD who can execute any offense... and I don't see any of those types in this draft. 

 

 

Which is why NOW is the time that makes the most sense to start fresh and hit the ground jogging instead of taking 1 step forward and 2 steps back. 

[Going Commando]

19 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

None of those situations is a blueprint imho for success, unless you get a legit STUD who can execute any offense... and I don't see any of those types in this draft. 

 

Agreed with your whole post, the only way I want to see Jay get another chance at QB is if he's in the long term plans.  But I'm actually not opposed to keeping Jay long term.  I do think he's a good offensive coach and that he knows how to handle and develop the QB position.  I won't cry if he gets fired, but I think he can handle the job.

 

Highlighted this point to respond that there never are QB prospects who could excel in any system.  Everyone has limitations.  Fairly wide variety of styles at the QB position too--even from just a mechanical perspective.  A legitimately good coach figures out the best way to coach his players and builds his system around them.

[crabbypatty]

19 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Big difference is Stafford came out of an offense where he played from behind center, and he throws the ball on the run well.  Lock just doesn't throw it as well from a moving platform.  He needs to set his feet.  That's what had me thinking Goff and Palmer.

 

He's got an amazing level of arm strength when he can get his feet set though. Abbreviated throwing motion like Uncle Rico but man does that ball fly.

Mocks that I've been reading lately have him moving up to the #1 qb this year.. hard to predict this far out but teams are gonna fall in love with his arm strength.

[BayouBrave86]

Our future QB is not in this draft. We need to continue to stack the defense and reenforce the Oline. Get the skill players through FA and draft our future QB in 2020.

[OVCChairman]

55 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Agreed with your whole post, the only way I want to see Jay get another chance at QB is if he's in the long term plans.  But I'm actually not opposed to keeping Jay long term.  I do think he's a good offensive coach and that he knows how to handle and develop the QB position.  I won't cry if he gets fired, but I think he can handle the job.

 

Highlighted this point to respond that there never are QB prospects who could excel in any system.  Everyone has limitations.  Fairly wide variety of styles at the QB position too--even from just a mechanical perspective.  A legitimately good coach figures out the best way to coach his players and builds his system around them.

 

 

I completely agree with you... There are a handful of QBs that I feel can execute just about any system, or are THAT GOOD that the system fit is not the priority.  Brady, Brees, Peyton, Luck (to an extent), Rodgers... Those type of QBs are going to be successful regardless of who the coach is because they can run the system themselves.  Those are the type of players that you're literally only bringing in a coach to accent their ability because the talent level is so high.  You have one of them, you bring in a coach that works for them.  I don't see that QB in this draft.  The OVERWHELMING majority if the QBs that are out there, the system has to take the priority, and you find the right QB for that system, and the guy who can execute it.  I also prefer a coach who is familiar with a system.  Yes the better coaches figure out the best way to coach his players and builds the system around them, but I still would prefer bringing in a HC who has a system they are very comfortable with and getting a guy who fits that direction.  I just feel like the transition is easier, the teaching and coaching is easier, and the comfort level is better when a coach has been running something for 10 years, vs a coach who has to teach himself how to run an offense, THEN he has to help coach a QB to understand it how HE is trying to understand it....

 

does that make sense? 

[skinny21]

41 minutes ago, BayouBrave86 said:

Our future QB is not in this draft. We need to continue to stack the defense and reenforce the Oline. Get the skill players through FA and draft our future QB in 2020.

If this winds up being the case, I’d still look at a mid round qb.  We need a developmental guy that can serve as a backup, both for next year and to replace McCoy down the line.  Whole lot cheaper too.  

 

 

Not tied to the draft persay, but the NFL really needs to up the roster limit IMO.  Practice squad is nice and all, but if a player shows any talent they’re liable to get poached.  The bigger issue though is the number of players that are injured but aren’t put on IR - puts that much more stress on teams to manage their rosters in-season.  Of course, maybe I wouldn’t feel so strongly about this if we weren’t consistently one of the most injured teams...