2019 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Burgundy Yoda]

6 hours ago, mistertim said:

I believe Jones is going to go later than people think. I have a feeling that the pundits are inflating his value but that NFL scouts probably aren't. 

I hope so. All it takes is one stupid team not listen to their scouts and start paying attention to these pundits though which is the scary thing.

[Tarpon75]

On 4/2/2019 at 11:28 AM, method man said:

 

Do you think Isabella can play on the outside at the NFL level? Out of the receivers in this class, given his route running, polish and speed, I think he has as much star potential as anyone in the draft. I know he is learning the slot now but he should pick it up. If he does, he more upside than Welker, Crowder, Amendola, Beasley, Edelman and all the other stud slot receivers of the past 5-10 years given his straight line speed

 

Also the other thing this team should think about is drafting two guys in Day 2. Doctson is not on this team in 2020 and Richardson is probably not either. 

 Agree with you on Isabella .Would love to see the Skins go after him,just not sure they will,as it seems they are wanting to give Quinn a hard look in the slot.  I kind of feel like he could play in or out though.

[DWinzit]

On 4/1/2019 at 8:52 PM, skinny21 said:

 

I’be Ok with Harry and maybe Butler after a trade back, but I’m mostly with you.  

Presuming we draft 2 receivers, I keep coming back to whether we get an X first and then back to the well for a Z that can handle snaps in the slot, or vice versa.  I.e. do we focus on a replacement for Doctson first, or a guy that can back up (or even start over) both Quinn and Richardson.  

Gonna be interesting to see how things shake out.  

Hock is the only definite offensive weapon I would take with the first pick...other than Murray which I guess you could consider a weapon.

If there is no worthy trade down option, what about them selecting Fant? 

To he is on the same level as these WR's being discussed. There are many projections showing him going top 15-20 and is a weapon? He would create match up problems for defenses. 

 

I think the way Deebo uses his hands along with his quickness will allow him to create separation. I have him rated at beginning of the second round and ahead of the WR favorites. He could play in the slot or on the outside.

 

[skinny21]

1 hour ago, DWinzit said:

Hock is the only definite offensive weapon I would take with the first pick...other than Murray which I guess you could consider a weapon.

If there is no worthy trade down option, what about them selecting Fant? 

To he is on the same level as these WR's being discussed. There are many projections showing him going top 15-20 and is a weapon? He would create match up problems for defenses. 

 

I think the way Deebo uses his hands along with his quickness will allow him to create separation. I have him rated at beginning of the second round and ahead of the WR favorites. He could play in the slot or on the outside.

 

Yeah, I mentioned Fant earlier as one of the guys at 15.  Not ideal for me because I don’t love the value (some good TEs available later), but I do appreciate how he and Hockenson could help the team, so I’d be ok with either.  

Samuel would be a solid add because he’s talented, but we’d also then have two players - he and Quinn - that could play Z and in the slot.  There are some intriguing split ends we could look to later in the draft.  They may not start ahead of Doctson, but could at least push him and perhaps/hopefully take over next year.  

Speaking of split end, I wonder if we move Sims to that role.  

[clskinsfan]

On 4/2/2019 at 9:05 AM, Anselmheifer said:

I'd like White too, but I can't see any situation in which he falls, and we aren't trading up for a MLB. 

 

Does anyone else not see a lot of separation in this N'Keal Harry video? He looks like a bully, but I'm not sure how far that gets you in the NFL. People have compared him to Garcon, but Garcon was much faster. Catch radius also isn't great. For someone with 33" arms at the combine, he looks like he has short arms. Maybe he will be great. I've watched just one highlight video. I would really, really like a WR who can separate. Or who doesn't need to. I would be thrilled with Hakeem Butler. 

 

 

 

Thing is. Nobody gets big separation in the NFL unless it is a blown coverage or a guy with ridiculously elite speed. Harry is just a nasty player. And you can trust him with one on one balls. Not to mention what he gives you in the running game. The guy blocks better than most pass catching TE's.

[Stormy]

I agree with everything you said. One of the best things the Redskins can do in this draft is to add a marquee skill position player (or TE) who can help diversify a very 1 dimensional offense. To add a player who can be a matchup threat for opposing defenses, who also can help on the exterior with run blocking, would be a huge boost. This is one of the reasons I've been in favor of adding a guy like Hockenson, or even Fant after a small trade back. Harry has moved himself solidly into my top tier of options, as well, hopefully after a slight move down into the early 20s?

 

We haven't had a WR with a bully streak since Garcon, and in my opinion Harry has that plus superior size. He can make plays in the short and intermediate game (which is most of our offensive playbook), but also has the ability to make plays on contested balls in the red zone. Outside of elite vertical speed, he pretty much possesses everything that our recent crop of passive, drop-prone, non-big play threat WR corps has been lacking. To top it all off, he seems to be a fantastic kid. 

 

Sign me up for Harry in the #19-25 range, if possible, as maybe being one of my top scenarios for how the first round of this draft could play out!

[757SeanTaylor21]

22 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

 

Not to mention what he gives you in the running game. The guy blocks better than most pass catching TE's.

 To be fair, most pass catching tes arent really known for run blocking...ie jordan reed. Moreso they actually are liabilities. So harry being better at run blocking than a pass catching te isnt really saying much. Does he run block better then hockenson tho? 😛

[mistertim]

2 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

 

Thing is. Nobody gets big separation in the NFL unless it is a blown coverage or a guy with ridiculously elite speed. Harry is just a nasty player. And you can trust him with one on one balls. Not to mention what he gives you in the running game. The guy blocks better than most pass catching TE's.

 

That's a good point. Good separation in the NFL basically means having a couple of steps on a guy, whereas good separation in college means having a couple yards. Many times in the pros it comes down to who is smarter, more prepared, and more precise. I don't really think Metcalf, Harry, or Butler are instant stars but I think Harry has the best chance of being productive right out of the gate.

[Anselmheifer]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001025021/article/charles-davis-2019-nfl-mock-draft-20-bengals-broncos-go-qb

 

I would be so happy to see the Giants select Rashan Gary and then Daniel Jones. Almost wouldn't even care who we drafted. That would be a successful draft. 

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

1 hour ago, Anselmheifer said:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001025021/article/charles-davis-2019-nfl-mock-draft-20-bengals-broncos-go-qb

 

I would be so happy to see the Giants select Rashan Gary and then Daniel Jones. Almost wouldn't even care who we drafted. That would be a successful draft. 

 

He has Brian Burns to us.  McShay recently did a mock with Burns to us as well.  I wonder if there's some rumblings about it.

[Brixtion_skin]

54 minutes ago, Alcoholic Zebra said:

 

He has Brian Burns to us.  McShay recently did a mock with Burns to us as well.  I wonder if there's some rumblings about it.

I have not seen any of the prospects play, however from what I have read, Burns seems mainly suited to passing downs.  I think I would want a player who would play on most downs with the no 15 pick.

[DWinzit]

1 minute ago, Brixtion_skin said:

I have not seen any of the prospects play, however from what I have read, Burns seems mainly suited to passing downs.  I think I would want a player who would play on most downs with the no 15 pick.

While an exciting rusher, I agree it a lot for a part timer. Similar to taking Parris Campbell on the offensive side at 15.

Now a trade down a little then maybe. 

[skinny21]

2 minutes ago, Brixtion_skin said:

I have not seen any of the prospects play, however from what I have read, Burns seems mainly suited to passing downs.  I think I would want a player who would play on most downs with the no 15 pick.

Especially considering how we use our OLBs (setting the edge), yeah, Burns is likely a situational rusher for us.  Not sure he has the frame to get to where we’d want him either.  Of course, we could really use a speed rusher for passing downs, but value is an issue.  

On the other hand, Burns has such fantastic length, he could further develop his hand usage to better keep blockers at bay.  Good ILB play (and the addition of Collins) could also mitigate any issues he’d have holding up vs the run.  

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

4 minutes ago, Brixtion_skin said:

I have not seen any of the prospects play, however from what I have read, Burns seems mainly suited to passing downs.  I think I would want a player who would play on most downs with the no 15 pick.

 

He's not Clelin Ferrell, but he's not a pushover on run downs.  He does a surprisingly good job of using his hips and feet well to help get leverage for contain.  His sheds from there are just ok.  I wouldn't call him a negative against the run, but he's not a positive either...if that makes sense.

 

He's not a pin his ears back and go after the QB at all costs type of player.  His average snap for FSU featured him reading the action first and then going after the QB.  I'm assuming that's coaching, but he's clearly willing to follow a gameplan at expense of what he does best.

 

Keep in mind, he's the youngest upper tier Edge prospect in the draft, and he tested/moved well at the combine at 249, when his playing weight was rumored to be 230-ish?  If he holds that weight well, does that help his run game.  He is young, he's not old enough to drink yet.  His 21st birthday is April 23rd.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

[mistertim]

3 hours ago, Brixtion_skin said:

I have not seen any of the prospects play, however from what I have read, Burns seems mainly suited to passing downs.  I think I would want a player who would play on most downs with the no 15 pick.

 

I think it depends on what you're looking for and how your defense is set up. Speed on the edge is something we desperately need IMO. Big DEs/OLBs who can set the edge in the run game are easier to find than great pass rushers. In an ideal world you'd find a guy who's elite at both but that's not easy to find. That being said, an OLB doesn't have to be 270 lbs to set the edge as long as he has good strength and technique. I'd be fine with a pass rush specialist early in the draft if we truly believed he could be an elite pass rusher and/or he could learn to be at least decent in the run game. 

[Anselmheifer]

18 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I think it depends on what you're looking for and how your defense is set up. Speed on the edge is something we desperately need IMO. Big DEs/OLBs who can set the edge in the run game are easier to find than great pass rushers. In an ideal world you'd find a guy who's elite at both but that's not easy to find. That being said, an OLB doesn't have to be 270 lbs to set the edge as long as he has good strength and technique. I'd be fine with a pass rush specialist early in the draft if we truly believed he could be an elite pass rusher and/or he could learn to be at least decent in the run game. 

 

Plus one. It's a passing league now. Our base defense is our nickel defense. We have no speed rusher. Brian Burns was not nearly as productive as Simeon Rice in college, but in searching for a ceiling for Burns, Rice for some reason popped into my head. A tall thin rusher with great bend and blazing speed. We have good run defenders at DT and at LOLB. Reuben Foster should be an upgrade against the run, as should Landon Collins. I would be just fine adding a speed rusher. Brian Burns isn't my top choice for the 15th pick, but I wouldn't mind him at all. 

 

I don't know why, but i'm starting to fear we will be trading our 15th this year for Rosen. 

Also, can I put in an early vote for Jerry Jeudy in the first next year?

 

[Anselmheifer]

Regarding Noah Fant, he had 39 receptions and 7 TD's this year, so you are paying more for potential than production. Still, he does have some schematic flexibility when you even just look at his highlights. 

 

 

 

At 2:29 he lines up in the backfield and catches a pass for a TD. There are multiple plays in which he lines up as a WR and looks very natural. He is a good route runner and seems to track the ball well downfield, and also does well on little swing passes/bubble screens. He certainly looks more versatile and useful than Parris Campbell, for instance. I wouldn't be mad at Fant at 15, now that I have watched him. 

[Ghedrick]

I am all for trading 15 for Rosen instead of doing some bone head trade like trading multiple 1st and second round picks for Haskins or Lock.These guy are average QBS at best. If Rosen had stayed in school this year he would be challenging Kylar as the best QB in the draft.Bruce and Jay trading multiple high picks to land Haskins would be the ultimate screw you to this organization before they get canned.

[757SeanTaylor21]

4 hours ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

Also, can I put in an early vote for Jerry Jeudy in the first next year?

 

 

I love jeudy as a prospect. If we was to draft him next year in the first we would either need to get a second first rounder and hope we do horribly this year. We need a qb either this year or next

[volsmet]

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

11 hours ago, Ghedrick said:

I am all for trading 15 for Rosen instead of doing some bone head trade like trading multiple 1st and second round picks for Haskins or Lock.These guy are average QBS at best. If Rosen had stayed in school this year he would be challenging Kylar as the best QB in the draft.Bruce and Jay trading multiple high picks to land Haskins would be the ultimate screw you to this organization before they get canned.

 

If that's the choice then I'd agree that it would be the least bad among a number of bad decisions they can make.  I don't think aside from Murray any QB is worth trading up for.   

 

I'd rather not take a QB at 15 period or trade for Rosen if its that pick.  I was just doing the math on this and to me this draft looks very likely to be one where we get a surprise fall like .Jonathan Allen in 2017 and Derwin James  in 2018.  I am starting to see Devin Bush some go top 14 (supposedly the Lions, Denver among others really like him) and TJ Hockenson. 

 

The odds that either Burns or Ferrell or maybe even both land at 15 might be good.    I personally think its folly to go for a boom-bust QB at 15 when you can potentially get a bonafide stud pass rusher.  Also if they want to accrue picks they'd really need the first rounder to do so.  If their first pick is in the mid second, you are already getting too far down to have a pick with that much value for a decent trade down.   Granted if Jay and or Kyle don't see the QBs as boom-bust then pull the trigger considering the value of the position.

 

To me Lock and Rosen are similar in that they are both boom bust prospects IMO but for different reasons.  

 

Lock's boom = rocket arm, can throw on the move, athletic, can throw from odd arm angles, really good deep thrower, seems to have a great personality

Lock's bust:  wildly inconsistent, poor touch on short passes, didn't play well against big teams, bad plays at times with pass pressure

 

Rosen's boom = fearless, tough, great footwork, pretty arm motion, deadly accurate up the middle-intermediate throws, smart, played under a number of O coordinators already

Rosen's bust = mega turnover prone including fumbles, takes a lot of sacks, slight frame-concussions/injury concerns, poor touch on short throws. Isn't hot throwing on the move-boots.  Isn't athletic.   Personality questioned.  Work ethic questioned. 

 

IMO to love either prospect you have to rationalize it some because their weaknesses are really in your face and hard to miss if you watch enough games.  I've seen the way its done with Rosen is to gloss over his decision making/turnovers as just being part of his a cool gun slinger mentality and his supporting cast is at fault.  And for Lock its typically his inconsistency is glossed over by some with a variation of points about how he's just in need of a good NFL head coach to sharpen his big time tools.   And that in the end could be true in both cases.  But to me while their tools are enticing (for me Lock is more intriguing than Rosen but I see it for either QB) I think they both have high bust potential, too. 

 

As for Haskins I just started watching him.  I haven't made up my mind but I've seen enough to know I don't want to trade up for him.

 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

On 4/3/2019 at 12:58 AM, Tarpon75 said:

 Agree with you on Isabella .Would love to see the Skins go after him,just not sure they will,as it seems they are wanting to give Quinn a hard look in the slot.  I kind of feel like he could play in or out though.

I like Isabella as a R3 guy. If we don't address WR in R1 or R2 i think he's a good guy to target.

 

Reason I love AJ Brown so much is that he can play slot or outside. So depending on how Quinn develops, Brown can be a safety blanket.

 

Listening to podcasts, following Matt Miller, doing some tea leaf reading ... I think my true dream scenario for Day 1/2 is ...

 

1. Trade #15 to a team in the 20's and get a 3rd. Or late 1st and get a 2nd.

2. Draft AJ Brown if he's there ... with your new 1st

3. Trade your 2nd and a 2020 pick for Josh Rosen

4. Use 3 other Day 2 picks (whether 2/3/3 from trade down or 3/3/3) to address LG, Edge, TE

 

I think you then use the 5th rounders on another DB and LB. Take a fllier on a WR in the 7th.

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

The point below was echoed by Peter Schrager too.  Schrager said talking to people at the owners meetings -- a bunch had Lock above Haskins on their board. 

 

 

 

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

If people like Football Outsiders QBASE projections, here we go:

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2019/qbase-2019

 

TL;DR, this QB group is odd.