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Is this the most talented yet misused defensive front we've had in years?

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We could have 7 All-Pros in the front 7 and they would look like ass with how this defense is schemed. How do you seriously not play to the strength of your defense and only rush 4 constantly? Especially against Dallas, you're just going to accept the fact that they have a good line and not rush, while giving Dak an hour to throw the ball? Not surprisingly the best defense we've had the last 20 years has been the most aggressive, hmm. 

Edited by Burgundy Yoda

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game plan sucks ... having Kerrigan rush wide and get ushered down the field ... yeah that should have happened once at the most ... running untouched through this D Line ... repeatedly ... no way these guys don't know how to play, tackle, take on blockers ... what's wrong then? ... scheme ... that's what's wrong.  No serous blitzing ... no creative blitzing ... high risk plays with no backup ... no pressure on the receivers ... 10+ YARD CUSHIONS?  WTHFO!  Sure guys are hurt but the backups need to be given a chance to do the job ... not surrender 10 yards just because and then hope for open field tackles.  The D Coord mailed this game in ... and the last one.  Never heard of an adjustment? ... didn't watch the first half?  Didn't see what they were working into on offense?  Didn't see what was working in order to adjust?  Didn't see where they were weak and didn't care to adjust and take advantage.  

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1 hour ago, dyst said:

Some people get too excited about what is on paper vs: reality.

 

Too true. It's rare that we underestimate the ****show we're about to walk into as fans, yet here we are. 

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15 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

Too true. It's rare that we underestimate the ****show we're about to walk into as fans, yet here we are. 

It’s desperation on the end of the fans. We’re so desperate for talent that we do overhype guys. Part of it is that our personnel just is not there. The other part is the coaching staff does not develop well.

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Did you know that only one team in the league, the 0-16 Dolphins, have allowed more points than the Redskins(who have played two mediocre offenses).  So much for our amazing defense on paper, because apparently games arent played on paper, and our defense is ironically a wet paper bag.

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Kerrigan should be dealt for a 4th-5th rounder (although I doubt anyone would give that to us for him). Dude plays like a vet min guy out there. He basically earns half his contract whenever we play the giants. Ionnaidis and Payne should be contributing more, in Payne's defense he actually applied pressure on more then one play though so he's got that over the rest. Sweat is a rookie but he's getting man handled out there. Don't think this scheme helps him out. 

 

 

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As someone who can’t imagine being interested enough in watching the all 22, I can only speak for what I observe in-game.  Sweat looks like a damn corpse on the majority of snaps.    Just slow and plodding.  

 

Anyone that puts time in watching film, care to elaborate on what they are seeing from him?

 

Yeah, I get it - 2 games in for a rookie. I just personally haven’t seen any signs that makes me think dude has the goods to be legit pass rusher in the league.  

 

 

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Defense has to live up to their billing if they are going to have a season

 

Biggest takeaway: The pressure will start to mount on defensive coordinator Greg Manusky. The Redskins nearly fired him after last season and, through two games, his group has allowed a combined 63 points and 911 yards. If things don't get better for his group, it's easy to wonder about his future in Washington. The Redskins do have a lot of youth on their defense and were missing two of their top three corners plus end Jonathan Allen Sunday. That matters. But as linebacker Jon Bostic said, "We'll never use that as an excuse... Everyone is in this league for a reason." The Redskins have not had a defense finish in the top 10 in yards or points allowed since 2009. The bottom line is too many plays have big gaps for offenses to run through -- and too many big plays are hit downfield. It's not always about scheme or the coaches. The players have failed, too. Just like on the right side of the offensive line where guard Brandon Scherff and tackle Morgan Moses have combined for four holding penalties this season. They need to play better, too. But the Redskins have no shot this season if the defense doesn't improve.

 
i?img=%2Fi%2Fcolumnists%2Ffull%2Fkeim_john.png&w=80&h=80&scale=crop
John Keim, ESPN Staff Writer15h ago
 

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The pressure is "starting to mount"?  The pressure had already mounted.  Manusky was on the firing line in the offseason before the Redskins broke new ground in dysfunction, by "picking brains" of Bowles and others, only to find out those guys didn't want to work here.  The only worse defensive performance through week 2 is a team that is willfully tanking.  The defense was given new pieces, one of which is the highest paid safety in football history at this time.  There is nothing left to see here, Manusky is butt.  The end.  Move on now and make a statement.

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I asked a question in the game day thread that came off as sarcasm but I really want to know: Is there any theoretical advantage or idea behind no blitzing/ pressure and soft zone coverage? 

 

I would like to be able to annotate what it is they are trying to do and why it is failing when talking to my friends, but as of right now I dont get it. I am far from knowledgeable on the subject so I rely on you guys for this kinda stuff. Like I wanna know what they are trying to do and why they are failing. But most of all what they are trying to get accomplished schematically. Right now to me it looks like they are just putting 11 guys out there and....thats really it? 

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Kerrigan is getting older, I am wondering if he is less able to handle being an every down player.  If he could be replaced on 1st & 2nd downs, and turned into a 3rd down pass rush specialist where he could put all his strength and energy into those downs, maybe he could thrive? Sort of the way they modified Bruce Smith's rotation later in his career.

 

Gruden was asked about Allen's availability against the Bears.  He didn't really have much to say besides the usual "We'll how much work he can put in on Wednesday and go from there" 

 

From the way Gruden was talking at the presser just now it seems pretty clear that he feels the defense is under-performing for what their talent level is.  In other words he likely thinks Manusky is hampering the defense. 

Edited by NoCalMike

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Problem with firing Manusky immediately is who will take his place? Not saying that as a defense of Manusky...I really can't imagine anyone being much worse. Just wondering what would happen. Would Tomsula take over for now maybe and we'd go after someone else in the offseason? Would we try to recruit Rex Ryan immediately? Give Rob a shot?

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13 hours ago, nuposse87 said:

Kerrigan should be dealt for a 4th-5th rounder (although I doubt anyone would give that to us for him). Dude plays like a vet min guy out there. He basically earns half his contract whenever we play the giants. 

 

Kerrigan's probably one of the only vets we could get good value out of, because his contract is so affordable. 

 

He's being paid like the 26th best edge defender at ~$11.5 M/year.  

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1 hour ago, mistertim said:

Problem with firing Manusky immediately is who will take his place? Not saying that as a defense of Manusky...I really can't imagine anyone being much worse. Just wondering what would happen. Would Tomsula take over for now maybe and we'd go after someone else in the offseason? Would we try to recruit Rex Ryan immediately? Give Rob a shot?

I might go with KO.  He’s been around the defense for a while now and he’s an unknown quantity.  Allows the other higher pedigree guys to stay in their lanes.  I like the idea of going with the (relatively) younger guy too.  He’s also most likely to say yes as it’s a great opportunity for him.  Avoids the awkwardness if they offer to a guy that says no, and perhaps even the “why him over me?” angle.  

 

Probably less of a loss than if we took Horton off dbs (or maybe this would be a good thing given their performance) or Tomsula off dline.  

 

Give him the reins and tell him to get after the qb.  

Edited by skinny21

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I don't mean this sarcastically but I think the next opponent is perfect to mount a resurgence.  Last year, the defense could shut down crap-mediocre offenses.  That's what their wheel house was.  And not every defense plays well against bad offenses.  But this defense really shined in those type of situations. 

 

The defense would get boat raced last year for the most part against good offenses.  So they got boat raced the first two games this season against good offenses.  But I think they shut the Bears offense down or close enough to it.  If the Bears steam roll this defense then they got some serious issues. 

 

 

 

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My problem with our guys playing well against **** competition is that it gives our coaches and FO excuses. It's sort of the equivalent of going 8-8. It allows the FO and coaches to claim "See? We're almost there" even when most of those wins were racked up against bad teams. And it gives that asshat Manusky a way to claim vindication. I'd much rather see them get trounced by a really bad offense if it meant the FO finally realized what a **** show that dude is and canned him. We already know they were close to getting rid of him before this season. 

 

It still drives me up the goddamn wall that we apparently had a chance to hire Wade Phillips but turned him down in favor of promoting Manusky. 

Edited by mistertim

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This might be one of the worst Skins pass rush I have ever seen.

 

Its largely based on the approach of our DC.  But Sweat hasn't shown me being worthy of 2 2nd rounders. In fact penalty aside I haven't seen him.  Kerrigan is still motoring wide like a robot same speed same move with a sack every other game - same biceps.  Losing Allen hurt. Payne is a player but guys slip his grasp he is coming at them so fast.  Matt and Settle seem to be MIA. 

 

Of course its easy to say all this when it's 5 on 4 every pass play, or 6 on 4 with a back in.  More drill work doing the same thing over and over this week, to fix it!

 

In almost every other game I watch, I see a DC unleash his blitzers and guess what, not be burned for TDs deep. We don't even try and instead just are once again giving up the long slow taxing drives that give offenses worlds of confidence, while demoralizing ourselves and our home fans.

Edited by RandyHolt

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3 hours ago, SkinssRvA said:

Sweat is bad.  

 

Isn't 2 games in just a tad early to make this pronouncement on a rookie? True, he hasn't really stood out but our entire defense hasn't stood out, unless you count standing out for bad things. He's a rookie who's also playing in a **** scheme for a **** DC. 

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20 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

Wait, are we allowed to criticize Kerrigan around here now?

 

It's certainly fair to criticize him for this season.  I never got why anybody would want to criticize him before this season though.  He's coming off the best 3 year stretch of his career.

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