Voice_of_Reason

Evaluating Jay Gruden in 2018

Recommended Posts

The truth is the head coaching position in Washington isn't as sought after by quality candidates as some of us think. Hasn't been for a while. We get retreads, retirees, or severely underqualified people walking through those doors. Josh McDaniels wouldn't come here, Mike McCarthy wouldn't,  hell not even Harbaugh would, just bums looking to add "HC" to their resumes or seeking a big payout. We'd have no problem luring the likes of Dirk Koetter or Hue Jackson to this place. One of the first 9 teams in the NFL reduced to this, can't believe it.

 

 

Edited by BurgundyBooger
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh and another thing...WHAT QB has had  tje most success in the playoffs? They signed mark Sanchez because of "he won some games in the playoffs..." but disregard that kap was in the superbowl and nfc championship twice

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said:

Oh and another thing...WHAT QB has had  tje most success in the playoffs? They signed mark Sanchez because of "he won some games in the playoffs..." but disregard that kap was in the superbowl and nfc championship twice

 

 

Nobody is going to sign Kap, he SUED the league.  He didn't go nicely.  He's likely getting shunned from the NFL because of the fact that he opened an active lawsuit against them.  In fact, I believe the suit is still pending, so who knows what that would mean.  


Jay said they 'discussed' bringing him in... my assumption would be the conversation went:

 

"OK throw out a name and we'll respond"

 

"Colin Kaep-"

 

10 people in the room: "NOPE, ok we discussed it"

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

Nobody is going to sign Kap, he SUED the league.  He didn't go nicely.  He's likely getting shunned from the NFL because of the fact that he opened an active lawsuit against them.  In fact, I believe the suit is still pending, so who knows what that would mean.  


Jay said they 'discussed' bringing him in... my assumption would be the conversation went:

 

"OK throw out a name and we'll respond"

 

"Colin Kaep-"

 

10 people in the room: "NOPE, ok we discussed it"

 

The words...we gonna do best for the team...and they had success, etc etc yet go opposite to the guy who legit was inches from a super bowl win to sign a JOSH JOHNSON! is absurd. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said:

 

The words...we gonna do best for the team...and they had success, etc etc yet go opposite to the guy who legit was inches from a super bowl win to sign a JOSH JOHNSON! is absurd. 

 

 

I'm over this front office as much as anyone, but Kap is not going to win any more games for us this year than pretty much anyone.  I promise I am staying away from the political side of this.  He hasn't even been in an NFL practice in 23 months.  He would be walking into an offense he's never been a part of on a short week, and that's if he would even be allowed to play with a pending lawsuit in place.  I don't know the legal issue of it, as I can't imagine his agent, or his lawyer, would be ok with him running back to the league that he's suing for mistreatment...  There are rumors that the Broncos reached out to him and he declined, so it's very possible that he's not willing, or legally able, to play in the NFL while this is ongoing.  I honestly cannot speak to that with any real confidence.  

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said:

 

The words...we gonna do best for the team...and they had success, etc etc yet go opposite to the guy who legit was inches from a super bowl win to sign a JOSH JOHNSON! is absurd. 

Jay Gruden's explanation on why Kap wasn't sign, man that was bad. Kap will not have time to learn the system, but Capt Butt-fumble and J.J. would.?!?!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, Dancing Bear said:

Jay Gruden's explanation on why Kap wasn't sign, man that was bad. Kap will not have time to learn the system, but Capt Butt-fumble and J.J. would.?!?!

 

EXAAAACTLY. Atleast hey u can keep your rpo side and legit play right off that. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, Dancing Bear said:

Jay Gruden's explanation on why Kap wasn't sign, man that was bad. Kap will not have time to learn the system, but Capt Butt-fumble and J.J. would.?!?!

 

 

What should Jay to say?  He sucks and couldn’t run a pro offense when he played every day and didn’t get any better while out of the league and his polarizing politics would further divide and deplete the fan base? 

Edited by Veryoldschool
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

What should Jay to say?  He sucks and couldn’t run a pro offense when he played every day and didn’t get any better while out of the league and his polarizing politics would further divide and deplete the fan base? 

 

Exactly...it cracks me up when fans act like they deserve full transparency. Anyone who truly believed that the final 4 games of a teetering season was the time to bring in Kaepernick was living in a fantasy land. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It kind of works both ways.

 

Kaep is undoubtedly a better quarterback than Josh Johnson, who's played even less than Kaep has over the last few years.  It looks really bad when guys like Josh Johnson and Mark Sanchez are called in over Kaep.

 

I say all that as someone who always said that his play doesn't move the needle enough for me to put up with the drama that signing him would welcome.  But at this point in the season, with where we are at QB, I can totally understand why this only helps further cement the notion that the NFL has blackballed him.  But I also agree that it's not like he'd come in here and save the day.  I also haven't heard a peep out of him about actually wanting to play football and is actively waiting/pursing opportunities to do so.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

What should Jay to say?  He sucks and couldn’t run a pro offense when he played every day and didn’t get any better while out of the league and his polarizing politics would further divide and deplete the fan base? 

 

5 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

Exactly...it cracks me up when fans act like they deserve full transparency. Anyone who truly believed that the final 4 games of a teetering season was the time to bring in Kaepernick was living in a fantasy land. 

 

Claiming Reuben Foster was worse. Kap is leaps and bounds better than J.Johnson.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Morneblade said:

 

 

Claiming Reuben Foster was worse. Kap is leaps and bounds better than J.Johnson.

 

Reuben Foster isn't even news anymore...and he will either be a viable addition to the team (cleared of charges) or be released. The Kap firestorm probably has more legs AND he'd be someone we are planning to keep here for a month. 

 

In short, my opinions on DV aside, Foster is far less unique politically and is a long-term play while Kap is the face of the NFL lawsuit and is only here for 4 games. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What I've begun wondering today is what degree of Adrian Peterson's success was due to Alex Smith's playcalling? We've seen how the moment that Smith went down we went straight back to the Cousins' approach of 70% passing/30% running. Did Gruden really call that many more runs with Alex in tow or did Smith consistently check to a run in run/pass option conditions?

 

Heck, even with our third string QB in who has never practiced with the team we dropped the run almost entirely. Maybe Smith is the only reason Peterson got his carries and that's why Gruden was reportedly frustrated with him?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Burgold said:

What I've begun wondering today is what degree of Adrian Peterson's success was due to Alex Smith's playcalling? We've seen how the moment that Smith went down we went straight back to the Cousins' approach of 70% passing/30% running. Did Gruden really call that many more runs with Alex in tow or did Smith consistently check to a run in run/pass option conditions?

 

Heck, even with our third string QB in who has never practiced with the team we dropped the run almost entirely. Maybe Smith is the only reason Peterson got his carries and that's why Gruden was reportedly frustrated with him?

 

It makes you wonder.  The plays that Peterson was getting the ball appeared to be schematically different as well.  When Smith was in there I feel like Peterson was getting more outside, less interior but I could be wrong.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

Reuben Foster isn't even news anymore...and he will either be a viable addition to the team (cleared of charges) or be released. The Kap firestorm probably has more legs AND he'd be someone we are planning to keep here for a month. 

 

In short, my opinions on DV aside, Foster is far less unique politically and is a long-term play while Kap is the face of the NFL lawsuit and is only here for 4 games. 

 

Politically, maybe. Morally? Not even close. And long term? Honestly, Foster will be one of those stories that is not going to sit on the right side of history.

 

And Kap is better than Josh Johnson. There are STILL better options out there than Josh Johnson. Sam Bradford is a better option. There are likely 20 guys on PS out there that are better options. E.J. Manuel is a better option. And we pick a guy that hasn't played in 5 years because Gruden was around him for a second? We are ****ing idiots.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think there every scenario is different, but yes - Gruden does have a tendency to forget about the run.

 

That said, we saw Alex play QB.  Gruden saw a lot more of it than we did.  Alex and Gruden talk every day.  He had a better vibe about what Alex could and couldn't do than we ever could.  I'm sure he knew that Alex wasn't capable of running the offense the way he expected and leaned on the running game more. 

 

Still there are so many variables about why and how things work, like who we were playing, what they were doing, and even more importantly - who we have out there in front of them. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

Politically, maybe. Morally? Not even close. And long term? Honestly, Foster will be one of those stories that is not going to sit on the right side of history.

 

And Kap is better than Josh Johnson. There are STILL better options out there than Josh Johnson. Sam Bradford is a better option. There are likely 20 guys on PS out there that are better options. E.J. Manuel is a better option. And we pick a guy that hasn't played in 5 years because Gruden was around him for a second? We are ****ing idiots.

 

I'm comparing the "headache" aspect of this, not the moral part of it. Certainly there's no comparison between what Kap has done (peaceful demonstrations) vs. what Foster has done (legal issues).

 

But, from how distractions might impact the football side of things, the pendulum swings the other way. For one, Foster isn't even with the team right now while Kap would be practicing with them. Secondly, there would be a flood of questions that the media has been saving up for 2 years...suddenly our backup QB would be the focus.

 

Not a big deal in the big-picture from a fan standpoint, but not ideal when you're a coach trying to win a game to stay in contention. 

 

Edit: To me, the Foster claim was low-impact to the actual 2018 football operations. Not much different than a draft pick who wouldn't join the team yet. Gruden and the players had to answer a few questions, but then it went away as they are mostly firewalled off from how the front office is proceeding while Foster is on the commissioner's exempt list. 

Edited by TD_washingtonredskins

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Morneblade said:

 

 

Claiming Reuben Foster was worse. Kap is leaps and bounds better than J.Johnson.

 

I think the Foster acquisition is callous and stupid and some disgusted fans will probably throw in the towel over it, I don't know.  There is no doubt that Kaepernick alienates a very significant portion of the fanbase.  Snyder is bleeding fans already he doesn't need to stick his thumb in the eyes of many and lose maybe 20+% permanently.  Even if Kaepernick was good it would be bad business to sign him as it is it would be suicidal.

Edited by Veryoldschool

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

I think the Foster acquisition is callous and stupid and some disgusted fans will probably throw in the towel over it, I don't know.  There is no doubt that Kaepernick alienates a very significant portion of the fanbase.  Snyder is bleeding fans already he doesn't need to stick his thumb in the eyes of many and lose maybe 20+% permanently.  Even is Kaepernick was good it would be bad business to sign him as it is it would be suicidal.

 

There is likely a good portion that it rejuvenates as well. Without going into politics, this issue has 2 sides and there would be A LOT of people that would be very happy with it.

Foster doesn't do that, unless you're a complete scumbag.

 

What I'm also noticing is no one is touching why we went aft Josh Johnson instead of, quite literally anyone else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
59 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

There is likely a good portion that it rejuvenates as well. Without going into politics, this issue has 2 sides and there would be A LOT of people that would be very happy with it.

Foster doesn't do that, unless you're a complete scumbag.

 

What I'm also noticing is no one is touching why we went aft Josh Johnson instead of, quite literally anyone else.

Yes, I am sure there is a portion of the fanbase that would be excited at least at first but then he when plays and isn't good they are not going to be satisfied and meanwhile you have lost the significant number he offends and these folks are going to so pissed off they won't ever come back.  

Edited by Veryoldschool

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

I'm over this front office as much as anyone, but Kap is not going to win any more games for us this year than pretty much anyone.  I promise I am staying away from the political side of this.  He hasn't even been in an NFL practice in 23 months.  He would be walking into an offense he's never been a part of on a short week, and that's if he would even be allowed to play with a pending lawsuit in place.  I don't know the legal issue of it, as I can't imagine his agent, or his lawyer, would be ok with him running back to the league that he's suing for mistreatment...  There are rumors that the Broncos reached out to him and he declined, so it's very possible that he's not willing, or legally able, to play in the NFL while this is ongoing.  I honestly cannot speak to that with any real confidence.  

Josh Johnson hasn't thrown a NFL pass since 2011.... but in your mind and the Redskins he will learn faster and be better than Kap

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Riggodrill44 said:

Josh Johnson hasn't thrown a NFL pass since 2011.... but in your mind and the Redskins he will learn faster and be better than Kap

 

 

I didnt say that.  Josh Johnson isn't going to come in here and be the savior either.  Nobody is walking in here and putting this team on their back... carrying them to a playoff berth, let alone playoff win.  Josh Johnson doesn't have people writing articles about him saying he's the teams best chance at turning around the season... Kap does.  I was responding to the back and forth that Kap would be brought in here to be a starter.   NOBODY is claiming Josh Johnson is an upgrade at the starting position.  I just don't think that given the circumstances, short week, injuries, current coach, all of those things, to then expect Kap to come in here ON TOP of the fact that he hasn't been on an NFL practice field for 2 years, and be effective AT ALL prior to the end of the season is just not something I can get behind.  Josh Johnson was brought in to back up Mark Sanchez for the final 4 games of the year... People were suggesting Kap was going to save our season.  Different levels of expectation.  

Edited by OVCChairman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

What should Jay to say?  He sucks and couldn’t run a pro offense when he played every day and didn’t get any better while out of the league and his polarizing politics would further divide and deplete the fan base

"Deplete the fan base"?

 

Redskins Set Lowest Home Opener Attendance Mark In FedEx Field History 

Screenshot_2018-09-17-Empty-Seats-Galore-on-Twitter-613x606.png

 

 

The Fanbase already getting depleted bro!!!!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Dancing Bear said:

"Deplete the fan base"?

 

 

The Fanbase already getting depleted bro!!!!!!

 


I think he meant "further divide AND (further) deplete the fanbase"

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.