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NFL.com: Kirk Cousins tops biggest contracts (Special rule---you can refer to the Redskins in this thread---M.E.T.)

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6 hours ago, SkinsGuy said:

 

Ryan Kerrigan or Jonathan Allen smashing Cousins to the ground numerous times when the Redskins destroy them in the playoffs. :headbang:

 

The odds we will meet the Vikings in the playoffs at all are low.

 

The truth here is you don't want to make a concrete prediction about Kirk, because he'll probably exceed it.  So you'll wait until the Vikings lose a playoff game, and then you'll call him a choker who loses big games.

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12 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

:rofl89:

 

So this is where the bitter go to pile on?

 

Yes. You are here aren't you. :P

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20 hours ago, Tsailand said:

 

The odds we will meet the Vikings in the playoffs at all are low.

 

The truth here is you don't want to make a concrete prediction about Kirk, because he'll probably exceed it.  So you'll wait until the Vikings lose a playoff game, and then you'll call him a choker who loses big games.

 

Concrete predictions are difficult, but I'll try to make a couple predictions on what I think (note: this was not directed at me):

 

  1. Cousins will throw for 4,000 yards or so (about 500 more than Keenum did last year)
  2. Cousins will have a 2:1 TD:INT ratio (worse than Keenum) but will throw for a few more TDs
  3. Cousins will have 3+ times in December or the playoffs where he significantly under-performs based on his per-game averages
  4. The above will result in the Vikings not making it to the NFC Championship Game as they did in 2017

 

I don't know if I consider that crashing and burning, but I don't think he'll get them over the hump - at least not in 2018.

Edited by TD_washingtonredskins

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Summore "leadership" talk from Cousins:

 

“At some point you have to be given a license to lead. You have to be given permission to take charge, and when you’re still having internal competition it’s hard to do that,” Cousins said. “I’ve been in those situations in the past.”

 

Not only in Washington, where he played his first six years as a pro, but in the early part of his time in college at Michigan State.

 

“It was hard to really assert my personality in the locker room, because I didn’t want to step on the toes of the other people,” Cousins said.

 

“So that’s something, when you know your role and it’s been defined, you can then lead from a place of greater comfort and from that platform. I think that helps the overall dynamic.”

 

[...]“I was surprised by how much my teammates gave me that license to lead quickly. I thought they were going to want to have me prove myself a little bit longer than maybe I had to,” Cousins said. “They were very supportive and said, `No, man. It’s your show. Let’s go.'”

Edited by Califan007
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4 hours ago, Califan007 said:

Summore "leadership" talk from Cousins:

 

“At some point you have to be given a license to lead. You have to be given permission to take charge, and when you’re still having internal competition it’s hard to do that,” Cousins said. “I’ve been in those situations in the past.”

 

Not only in Washington, where he played his first six years as a pro, but in the early part of his time in college at Michigan State.

 

“It was hard to really assert my personality in the locker room, because I didn’t want to step on the toes of the other people,” Cousins said.

 

“So that’s something, when you know your role and it’s been defined, you can then lead from a place of greater comfort and from that platform. I think that helps the overall dynamic.”

 

[...]“I was surprised by how much my teammates gave me that license to lead quickly. I thought they were going to want to have me prove myself a little bit longer than maybe I had to,” Cousins said. “They were very supportive and said, `No, man. It’s your show. Let’s go.'”

Leaders don't wait to be given a chance to lead.  They just do it.

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1 hour ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Leaders don't wait to be given a chance to lead.  They just do it.

 

Exactly.

 

You don't wait around for permission to lead. You just take the bull by the horns and take charge.

 

Probably explains why GM Scott has described Cousins as "good, but not great".

Edited by SkinsGuy

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The games will start soon and Kirk’s critics during his playing days in Washington who act so butthurt now that Cousins has moved on will have Alex Smith to focus on instead of Kirk.  Hopefully we will all be happy with Smith and the 2018 Redskins including me who also be cheering on the Vikings.  I hope Cousins leads the Vikings to a win in the Super Bowl and Kirk’s many critics finally STFU!  

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6 hours ago, Veryoldschool said:

Kirk’s many critics finally STFU!  

Never happening.  No matter what happens they can wiggle their way out of it.  As you can see, he now “has to win the Super Bowl”.  As if every season is exactly the same as the last.  If the Vikings don’t make and win the Super Bowl, it will certainly be his fault. :rofl89: 

 

I get that the Vikings almost made it there last season and see Kirk as the missing piece and rightfully so.  But just because you almost make it one season doesn’t mean that you add a piece and automatically make it the next.  So many variables at play.  But given the roster they’ve built, barring injuries, they should be in a good spot.

Edited by BatteredFanSyndrome
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Speaking only for myself, I certainly do not hope the Vikings win the Super Bowl no matter whom the QB might be.  My earliest Redskins memories involve getting bludgeoned by Chuck Foreman and the PPE in the playoffs and those scars run deep.

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14 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Never happening.  No matter what happens they can wiggle their way out of it.  As you can see, he now “has to win the Super Bowl”.  As if every season is exactly the same as the last.  If the Vikings don’t make and win the Super Bowl, it will certainly be his fault. :rofl89: 

 

 

 

You're probably right, some people never learn they lie to themselves instead. 

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On 7/28/2018 at 11:42 AM, SkinsGuy said:

 

Exactly.

 

You don't wait around for permission to lead. You just take the bull by the horns and take charge.

 

Probably explains why GM Scott has described Cousins as "good, but not great".

 

That might explain why his teammates were saying things like "it's your show, let's go" to him. You don't wait around and have someone come up to you and say "please lead me"

 

I also don't believe just anyone can lead. Some of us just aren't wired that way and it's not part of our DNA. It doesn't mean he's any less a QB or can't succeed, he just may never be that alpha male on his teams. 

On 7/28/2018 at 7:40 PM, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Never happening.  No matter what happens they can wiggle their way out of it.  As you can see, he now “has to win the Super Bowl”.  As if every season is exactly the same as the last.  If the Vikings don’t make and win the Super Bowl, it will certainly be his fault. :rofl89: 

 

I get that the Vikings almost made it there last season and see Kirk as the missing piece and rightfully so.  But just because you almost make it one season doesn’t mean that you add a piece and automatically make it the next.  So many variables at play.  But given the roster they’ve built, barring injuries, they should be in a good spot.

 

I think it depends...if they get the defense and running game people expect, then there will be a pretty discerning eye pointed toward the passing game. If that doesn't hold up its end of the bargain, criticism is valid. 

 

On the other hand, if Cousins is leading them to 35 points per game but the D takes a step back somehow, I don't think too many people will be pinning any lack of team success to the QB. 

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39 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

I think it depends...if they get the defense and running game people expect, then there will be a pretty discerning eye pointed toward the passing game. If that doesn't hold up its end of the bargain, criticism is valid. 

 

On the other hand, if Cousins is leading them to 35 points per game but the D takes a step back somehow, I don't think too many people will be pinning any lack of team success to the QB. 

I'm not saying that Cousins has no say in how things end up faring for the Vikings.  Obviously his play contributes to however they end up, for better or worse.

 

I just meant that I don't believe he'll ever receive a fair assessment by many of the folks here.  Not unlike much of the criticism received while he was playing QB here.  Sure, some of it's valid - but a lot of is just flinging poo.  The more I look back at last seasons 7-9, given the onslaught of injuries at critical positions, it's rather impressive - not just for Cousins, but the coaching staff. As for Cousins in MIN, if he wins the Super Bowl, he's supposed to.  If they don't, he's a choker.  It's an easy route to take for an AntiKirk because they always get to be right. :rofl89:

Edited by BatteredFanSyndrome

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19 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

As for Cousins in MIN, if he wins the Super Bowl, he's supposed to.  If they don't, he's a choker.  It's an easy route to take for an AntiKirk because they always get to be right. :rofl89:

 

It is easy for detractors, I agree. But it's also unique. If he had gone to the Jets or Broncos, that wouldn't be the expectation. He and the Vikings have set him up with this narrative for all fans, not just those who feel scorned. The NFL Network just yesterday covering the Vikings referred to him as the missing piece to the Super Bowl puzzle (paraphrasing). So, it's not just Redskin fans who will put that on him. 

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On 7/28/2018 at 9:15 AM, TheGreatBuzz said:

Leaders don't wait to be given a chance to lead.  They just do it.

How Kirk reads about leadership.

 

Young Napoleon at Toulon:

"The Chief of Artillery and I don't get along, I better not step on his toes and compel requisitions of more artillery to deal with the British siege.  Oh, we lost the town, if I had been told I was in charge, it'd have gone well"

 

Napoleon at 13 Vendemiaire in Paris

"Better not give those royalists a whiff of grapeshot. I mean I was ordered to be here and Marras technically has command, so I don't have full license to do what i need to do. Guess Paris falls to the royalists insurrection."

 

Joshua Chamberlain on Little Round Top:  

 

"well gosh, Colonel Vincent is in charge, better not make him upset.  We'll just hold here."

 

Edited by Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin
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43 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

It is easy for detractors, I agree. But it's also unique. If he had gone to the Jets or Broncos, that wouldn't be the expectation. He and the Vikings have set him up with this narrative for all fans, not just those who feel scorned. The NFL Network just yesterday covering the Vikings referred to him as the missing piece to the Super Bowl puzzle (paraphrasing). So, it's not just Redskin fans who will put that on him. 

There's no doubt that they brought him in to be the missing piece to making a Super Bowl run.  There's no other explanation for letting the QB who almost got them there go and paying more for Kirk.  I'm not arguing that at all. 

 

I fully believe though that the 'move on' crowd who never actually moves on, who in most cases tend to have historically been Kirk's biggest detractors, have paved an easy way to make sure they are never wrong about him.  You get a huge margin for error with the 'Super Bowl or bust' mantra.

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7 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

There's no doubt that they brought him in to be the missing piece to making a Super Bowl run.  There's no other explanation for letting the QB who almost got them there go and paying more for Kirk.  I'm not arguing that at all. 

 

I fully believe though that the 'move on' crowd who never actually moves on, who in most cases tend to have historically been Kirk's biggest detractors, have paved an easy way to make sure they are never wrong about him.  You get a huge margin for error with the 'Super Bowl or bust' mantra.

 

You're correct...my only point was that this wasn't some multi-step narrative that required creativity. The entire league seems poised to judge Cousins based on the Vikings' playoff runs over the next couple years. If they don't make it back to the NFC title game, he will be held responsible in the minds of many fans. 

 

Not for nothing, but you're completely right that it's unfair. Look at how difficult it is to repeat like that. Not only is it tough to do, but the Vikings were a miracle away from not even winning a playoff game...

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39 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

Not for nothing, but you're completely right that it's unfair. Look at how difficult it is to repeat like that. Not only is it tough to do, but the Vikings were a miracle away from not even winning a playoff game...

 

 

Which, to me, is why you don't sink $84M fully guaranteed into a QB not named Rodgers, whether you're the Vikings or the Redskins.

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1 minute ago, Califan007 said:

 

Which, to me, is why you don't sink $84M fully guaranteed into a QB not named Rodgers, whether you're the Vikings or the Redskins.

 

Agreed. In some ways, it's not the money but the duration that irks me most about the deal (if I cared about the Vikings). 

 

It's a very short-term window for Minnesota to pull it all together. As we've seen, it doesn't take much for something external to derail a single season. Through no fault of Cousins, the Vikings could have injury issues, degradation at positions that seem set, or any other number of "bad breaks" to keep them from the 12-win threshold we all seem to think they are at. 

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2 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

Agreed. In some ways, it's not the money but the duration that irks me most about the deal (if I cared about the Vikings). 

 

It's a very short-term window for Minnesota to pull it all together. As we've seen, it doesn't take much for something external to derail a single season. Through no fault of Cousins, the Vikings could have injury issues, degradation at positions that seem set, or any other number of "bad breaks" to keep them from the 12-win threshold we all seem to think they are at. 

 

True, it's the amount AND the timespan that amount covers.

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2 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

True, it's the amount AND the timespan that amount covers.

Well yes, it's a lot of money. But in some ways, they either had it to spend or they didn't. If they didn't have any other big holes, I don't really care that they paid what they needed to in order to get the guy. 

 

I just think it would have been better if they could have locked Cousins in for more than 3 years. Maybe they WANTED the rip cord, but I doubt it. 

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3 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

Well yes, it's a lot of money. But in some ways, they either had it to spend or they didn't. If they didn't have any other big holes, I don't really care that they paid what they needed to in order to get the guy. 

 

I just think it would have been better if they could have locked Cousins in for more than 3 years. Maybe they WANTED the rip cord, but I doubt it. 

 

it's usually a trade-off with the player...we'll give you an earlier out but we'll guarantee less up front in return (or the opposite). Only way I'd have done the contract is if the team had just a ****load of cap space...

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But how long is a window in professional football if you're not the Pats?  Not that long.

 

Seems rather simple to me that the Vikings believe a QB like Cousins given the way they are currently setup provides them the best chance to win a Super Bowl in the next 3 seasons.  Obviously they can talk about an extension after the 2nd of the 3 year deal if things are working out.  If not - they can move on.

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16 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

But how long is a window in professional football if you're not the Pats?  Not that long.

 

Seems rather simple to me that the Vikings believe a QB like Cousins given the way they are currently setup provides them the best chance to win a Super Bowl in the next 3 seasons.  Obviously they can talk about an extension after the 2nd of the 3 year deal if things are working out.  If not - they can move on.

 

No, that's a good point. Teams seem to change every 3-4 years, so you're probably right about the window of opportunity for Minnesota. 

 

I just feel like many people (myself included) have bought into their season last year a little too strongly. They were fantastic, but needed the second most dramatic play in NFL post-season history to keep them from losing at home to the Saints (and blowing a huge lead in doing so). In fact, even with that win, their last 6 quarters of the season were disgusting. 

 

My point is, they might not be that NFC heir apparent that the on-paper results would make you think they are. 

 

Green Bay could take that division...

Edited by TD_washingtonredskins
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7 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

My point is, they might not be that NFC heir apparent that the on-paper results would make you think they are. 

 

Green Bay could take that division...

Rodgers being healthy changes things up immensely for them.  So I don't disagree that they can't just be counted on to repeat the same level of success they had last season.  At the same time, I do like the offseason they had and on paper - appear to be a better team.

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